'12 FL WR Justin Ferguson (Western Michigan Transfer)

[IrishSteelhead]

It was Mr. Brown, and I remember it a bit differently. He basically told me he didn't appreciate the overt racial aspects of the data. Not Football ROI's proudest day.

But I like your version better. Let's go with that one.

Hahaha. I remember that now.

Back to Ferg: is he a contender for UF or FSU? Or is he looking more at the FAU type schools?

 

[koonja]

It was Mr. Brown, and I remember it a bit differently. He basically told me he didn't appreciate the overt racial aspects of the data. Not Football ROI's proudest day.

But I like your version better. Let's go with that one.

What overt racial aspects? PM me if that's best.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

What overt racial aspects? PM me if that's best.

Most people today want to know the motivation behind splitting things out [whether on a spreadsheet or otherwise] by racial group.

You and I know Whiskey, but someone else might not. Generally people who look at things differently like that do not have Whiskey's good intentions. There I said it. Did I do it right?

 

[Rack Em]

It was Mr. Brown, and I remember it a bit differently. He basically told me he didn't appreciate the overt racial aspects of the data. Not Football ROI's proudest day.

But I like your version better. Let's go with that one.

 

[Irish YJ]

Whiskey's intentions, we all know are beyond reproach. I'd also like to add that I shared Whiskey's data with some friends of mine (a couple with a son being recruited by mid majors). They acted like it was the best thing since pockets and pants, and set off with focus to compare all the schools they were hearing from. The couple is African American. I guess it goes to show that the same data, and how/why it's split, can be interpreted differently. My friends obviously know me, and understand my motivation is pure, and in the best interests of their son. Mr. Brown obviously doesn't know Whiskey. I'd wager though, if he sat down and had a beer with him, the interpretation, and motivation would be preceived in a different way.

Racism is certainly still alive today in the US. It's unfortunate however that those who are color blind, are mistrusted still today because of those of who are not.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

What overt racial aspects? PM me if that's best.

Here's the post in question.

In retrospect, I should have used "African-American" instead of "black". Or (as I do now) just omitted any reference to race at all. For instance, if we're discussing an African-American recruit, I simply say "ND's GSR is 100%".

Live and learn. No one wants to come off as raycess.

 

[tadman95]

Here's the post in question.

In retrospect, I should have used "African-American" instead of "black". Or (as I do now) just omitted any reference to race at all. For instance, if we're discussing an African-American recruit, I simply say "ND's GSR is 100%".

Live and learn. No one wants to come off as raycess.

Don't know how you could have known differently until someone objected. You handled it properly IMO.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Don't know how you could have known differently until someone objected. You handled it properly IMO.

I agree Whiskey has always been downright upright.

I don't really want to risk the ire of someone who doesn't read the post in it's entirety. I do not hold anything against someone of color for having hard feelings with the way they and their ancestors were treated in this country. But I have noticed an interesting disparity over the last 20 years. Some people of (multiple racial and ethnic groups) want to break things out to insure equality, or point out disparity. They have a social justice orientation. Their motivations are very admirable.

Others want to do the opposite, so that everyone is perceived on the same footing. They want everybody to compete equally, regardless of disparity, because among other things they don't want to handicap their offspring. They come from a personal self-actualization perspective. Their motivations are very admirable.

In this case I think we have two very honorable men, looking at the same goal from the opposite sides of the same words.

 

[koonja]

Here's the post in question.

In retrospect, I should have used "African-American" instead of "black". Or (as I do now) just omitted any reference to race at all. For instance, if we're discussing an African-American recruit, I simply say "ND's GSR is 100%".

Live and learn. No one wants to come off as raycess.

Meh. You should have said African American, but don't omit reference to race. It's something ND is great at (graduating African American football players); it's worth pointing out.

 

[Bluto]

Here's the post in question.

In retrospect, I should have used "African-American" instead of "black". Or (as I do now) just omitted any reference to race at all. For instance, if we're discussing an African-American recruit, I simply say "ND's GSR is 100%".

Live and learn. No one wants to come off as raycess.

Actually the reference to race is pretty important to me. Schools like South Carolina are perpetuating a form of institutional racism by failing to graduate their African American players at high levels and in most cases levels below their white counterparts. The graduation rate among minority athletes is one if the big reasons I root for old Notre Dame.

 

[Redbar]

Actually the reference to race is pretty important to me. Schools like South Carolina are perpetuating a form of institutional racism by failing to graduate their African American players at high levels and in most cases levels below their white counterparts. The graduation rate among minority athletes is one if the big reasons I root for old Notre Dame.

Been arguing this point with my LSU Tiger fans for years, reps your way sir!

 

[Rhode Irish]

Meh. You should have said African American, but don't omit reference to race. It's something ND is great at (graduating African American football players); it's worth pointing out.

Yeah, I agree. It's a big part of the point. I'm not as familiar with the numbers as whiskey is, but I'd bet a few dollars that the gap between ND Caucasian players vs. Other School Caucasian players is not as wide as ND minority player vs. Other School minority player. It has nothing to do with racism, at least on our part. One of the biggest things I love about those numbers is that it takes away the patently racist argument that minorities are less capable than whites. To whatever extent there is a difference in acheivement, I'm willing to bet there is a gap in opportunity. The opportunity gap was created by centuries of social policy that clearly wasn't favorable to any minority. It has nothing to do with aptitude.

 

[Grahambo]

Yeah Whiskey, nothing wrong with what you said. Its something I believe should be promoted. When my kids go to school I absolutely will want to know what the Caucasian GSR rate will be at the time.

 

[Ultimate Penn St. Hater]

Here's the post in question.

In retrospect, I should have used "African-American" instead of "black". Or (as I do now) just omitted any reference to race at all. For instance, if we're discussing an African-American recruit, I simply say "ND's GSR is 100%".

Live and learn. No one wants to come off as raycess.

The word "black" is racist now? My morning newspaper has an article about the death of "One of the first black TV newsmen."The word black is used all the time on TV as well. I never heard that the word was offensive before.

 

[irishpat183]

Here's the post in question.

In retrospect, I should have used "African-American" instead of "black". Or (as I do now) just omitted any reference to race at all. For instance, if we're discussing an African-American recruit, I simply say "ND's GSR is 100%".

Live and learn. No one wants to come off as raycess.

LOL...Why? That doesn't make you a racist.

Hell, My Wife who is actually FROM AFRICA is technically a "African American" but she's white.

What would you call her (besides stupid for marrying me)?

There is nothing wrong with "black"...just as there is nothing wrong with "white"

 

[FLDomer]

LOL...Why? That doesn't make you a racist.

Hell, My Wife who is actually FROM AFRICA is technically a "African American" but she's white.

What would you call her (besides stupid for marrying me)?

There is nothing wrong with "black"...just as there is nothing wrong with "white"

A great man once said "It don't matter if you're black or white!" Michael Jackson

 

[Old Man Mike]

C'mon guys; we all know from painful experience that Whiskey is a complete socially-obtuse jerk, so why belabor the discussion?


{Readers needing italics on this one need more help than just that.}

 

[NDhoosier]

The word "black" is not racist... Half of the blacks/African Americans I know hate being called African American because they say they have nothing to do with Africa, they have never been there, they dont know anyone there, etc. Some people just like to jump on little **** that really isnt that important. I just had a discussion on this in a race/bias lecture (in-service training)

 

[irish1958]

A great man once said "It don't matter if you're black or white!" Michael Jackson

But it does if you are a little boy.
Calling this monster "a great man" is offensive to me.
Even tho the great man referred to is MLK.
When I first read this I assumed it referred to Michael Jackson and on closer reading I see it does not.
I am a pediatrician and have had extensive experience with the effects of child sexual abuse so this is a hot button issue with me.
I also participated in civil rights demonstrations in the 60's and accompanied a black person on a bus ride in the South, so I have great respect for MLK.
Since this is so far off subject and my post was the result of a misinterpretation, I request the moderator delete this post..

 

[Kak7304]

The word "black" is not racist... Half of the blacks/African Americans I know hate being called African American because they say they have nothing to do with Africa, they have never been there, they dont know anyone there, etc. Some people just like to jump on little **** that really isnt that important. I just had a discussion on this in a race/bias lecture (in-service training)

I know several black people from the Caribbean and South America and are black but not African-American.

 

[Irish Insanity]

I guess maybe someone being shown the ROI chart that is specifically tailored to their race could have felt it a bit racial. Considering most other schools ROIs, especially of specific races, are pathetic compared to ours, possible this is the first one they've seen with their race as a factor. They may have seen that as an issue when the original intention was to show the benefit. I can't imagine other teams bragging about graduation rate and ROI and such of a specific race when it's much lower than the graduation rate and ROI as a whole.

 

[stlnd01]

Well I don't much appreciate being called Caucasian, as my ancestors never in their British Isles-dwelling-lives got within four time zones of the Caucuses. And while I'm certainly pale, I'm not quite "white" either. Certainly not my tan and freckled arms. I insist on being referred to as Mostly-Irish-partly-Scottish-by-way-of-Canada-with-a-little-French-mixed-in.

Whatever.
I'm not going to begrudge another man's ethnic/grammatical preferences, but it's all going to be irrelevant in another generation or two anyway.

 

[FLDomer]

But it does if you are a little boy.
Calling this monster "a great man" is offensive to me.
Even tho the great man referred to is MLK.
When I first read this I assumed it referred to Michael Jackson and on closer reading I see it does not.
I am a pediatrician and have had extensive experience with the effects of child sexual abuse so this is a hot button issue with me.
I also participated in civil rights demonstrations in the 60's and accompanied a black person on a bus ride in the South, so I have great respect for MLK.
Since this is so far off subject and my post was the result of a misinterpretation, I request the moderator delete this post..

I apologize you are so offended, it was ment in total sarcasm. I agree with your belief of Jackson being a creep and monster. I should have used italics. I am a father of two children so there is no way in **** I was being serious when I made this post, I assumed most people on this board that have seen my post would know the sarcasm that was intended. I apoligize for offending you and i apologize to the mods for clogging the thread, back Justin.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

You guys have too much time on your hands.

 

[Grahambo]

LOL...Why? That doesn't make you a racist.

Hell, My Wife who is actually FROM AFRICA is technically a "African American" but she's white.

What would you call her (besides stupid for marrying me)?

There is nothing wrong with "black"...just as there is nothing wrong with "white"

Charlize Theron?

 

[ThePiombino]

Charlize Theron?

Yes please.

 

[CanadalovesND]

Mods should really clean this thread up

 

[irish1958]

You guys have too much time on your hands.

Exactly..I am retired and am now on vacation in Arizona (86 today). Eat your heart out.

 

[BGIF]

Mods should really clean this thread up

Perhaps move the race comments to it's own thread as I found many of the comments intersting but they don't seem to pertain neither to the Ferguson family nor a transfer.

The NCAA and The Feds were the ones that developed GSR, etc, by race not the whiskey man. Like MLK I dream of the day that people will be judged for their character (and performance) and without regard to the color of their skin.

 

[Junkhead]

You guys have too much time on your hands.

What this guy said...