Terror Attacks in Paris

[JughedJones]

Mark Steyn: "The barbarians are inside, and there are no gates."

Jobs, wages, drugs, poverty, crime, and mass murder. Yeah, I'd say those are good reasons to have a restrictive immigration policy. Otherwise America (or France) becomes the same dump as the shithole these people are fleeing. It's a wonderful rainbow-and-unicorn ideal to admit every poor person in the world into a developed nation, but at some point the infrastructure just can't sustain it.[/QUOTE


So winners and losers, huh? I'm sure you believe in the idea of a global market. Capitalism.

You think we exist in a vacuum? Capitalism and free markets can't exist without folks getting shit on. The richer we get, the more the ones we shit on want to move into the house.

It's ridiculous to think that we should go on, getting richer and richer, and be left alone.

 

[Domina Nostra]

How many?

Terrorist attacks have been occurring in Europe before the refugee crisis, this isn't anything new. To pin this attack on the refugees is weak.

You do realize that you play into ISIS's gameplan when you ostracize moderate Muslims? Or who was the clown moaning about Obama not saying "Islamic extremists," that'd play into their hand too. ISIS wants a war, that helps their cause.

I'm with everyone saying the Arabs, Turks, etc need to show up anytime now. Maybe Qatar doesn't deserve the World Cup if people there are going to support ISIS.

Turkey is the biggest problem of all. A once-secular country and example to the world of a moderate Islamic country, but Ergodan or however you spell it is a bona-fide fuckhead. But how do you deal with a NATO member who knows it's crucially important and knows it can support ISIS nonchalantly without fear of retribution from the West?

Turkey was secular by military force. It is now allowing its people to have more say, and its not working out.

I'm not sure I'd want a country that looked anything like any of the supposedly "moderate" regimes. Most of them are either anything but moderate, or simply martial law.

The problem is no one believes that (1) the Europeans or Americans have any effective way of weeding out the extremists, or (2) the moderate muslims are assimilating. So you are basically conceding that you are allowing Muslim extremists to settle as you are changing the face of your country.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Quote:
Originally Posted by JughedJones View Post
I'm not a Christian, nor do I believe in a God in any form... It's strange that the most 'godly' among us feel this way.

Why would a good group of people 'AKA a society' turn away poor people that need a better life?

If we have it, why would we tell others not to share in it?

Is it yer jerb? They take it?

Jobs, wages, drugs, poverty, crime, and mass murder. Yeah, I'd say those are good reasons to have a restrictive immigration policy. Otherwise America (or France) becomes the same dump as the shithole these people are fleeing. It's a wonderful rainbow-and-unicorn ideal to admit every poor person in the world into a developed nation,
but at some point the infrastructure just can't sustain it.

And because it just doesn't work that way. its like wondering why families don't invite poor people to live in their houses, vs. supporting charities.

 

[JughedJones]

Turkey was secular by military force. It is now allowing its people to have more say, and its not working out.

I'm not sure I'd want a country that looked anything like any of the supposedly "moderate" regimes. Most of them are either anything but moderate, or simply martial law.

The problem is no one believes that (1) the Europeans or Americans have any effective way of weeding out the extremists, or (2) the moderate muslims are assimilating. So you are basically conceding that you are allowing Muslim extremists to settle as you are changing the face of your country.

Holy crap.

Is this how you go about your life? This sounds terrifying.

Any reasonable intelligence agency puts ISIS, at most, in the 10s of thousands.

Al-Qaeda? They're barely in the 10s... we've done a number on them.

They're trying to start a movement, and after all this time and after all those horrible things they did, they've got... at most... 10-20 thousand folks.

That's not much of a social movement. Nazis had millions and we kicked their ass.

 

[JughedJones]

Quote:
Originally Posted by JughedJones View Post
I'm not a Christian, nor do I believe in a God in any form... It's strange that the most 'godly' among us feel this way.

Why would a good group of people 'AKA a society' turn away poor people that need a better life?

If we have it, why would we tell others not to share in it?

Is it yer jerb? They take it?




And because it just doesn't work that way. its like wondering why families don't invite poor people to live in their houses, vs. supporting charities.

I have no idea what kind of family you were brought up in.

I've brought quite a few poor people into my house.

 

[Grahambo]

I'm not a Christian, nor do I believe in a God in any form... It's strange that the most 'godly' among us feel this way.

Why would a good group of people 'AKA a society' turn away poor people that need a better life?

If we have it, why would we tell others not to share in it?

Is it yer jerb? They take it?

Maybe some feel that way altogether but from the majority inside, its not that we don't want to rescue, save, etc these people. It's we want to do it the right way. As in, vet these people the proper way because we know for a FACT that ISIS et al have embedded terrorists into these mass movements to better sneak in to countries.

Holy crap.

Is this how you go about your life? This sounds terrifying.

Any reasonable intelligence agency puts ISIS, at most, in the 10s of thousands.

Al-Qaeda? They're barely in the 10s... we've done a number on them.

They're trying to start a movement, and after all this time and after all those horrible things they did, they've got... at most... 10-20 thousand folks.

That's not much of a social movement. Nazis had millions and we kicked their ass.

Think about this, look at how many military aged males are fleeing and not joining in the fight to clean up their own country. Why is it always up to other countries? Maybe if they banded together, they could do this on their own.

If we want to get technical, Soviets broke the Nazis and kicked their ass, we simply cleaned up.

 

[JughedJones]

Think about this, look at how many military aged males are fleeing and not joining in the fight to clean up their own country. Why is it always up to other countries? Maybe if they banded together, they could do this on their own.

If we want to get technical, Soviets broke the Nazis and kicked their ass, we simply cleaned up.

Wut?

Response to your first (bolded) paragraph: Who the hell are you talking about?

Second (bolded) Paragraph: I have no idea how that's relevant to my point at all.

 

[Domina Nostra]

I have no idea what kind of family you were brought up in.

I've brought quite a few poor people into my house.

No idea? So you can't even imagine families that didn't do this? It's just beyond your imagination?

And did you really have an open-door policy where anyone in need was let in, regardless of whether they were mentally ill, drugged-out, or disliked your family? If so, that puts your family members in danger. My guess is some weeding out was going on.

Once again, the problem is that no one is confident that European nations or America have any way of reliably weeding out those with bad intentions. That's why refugee camps make much more sense in this case.

Hispanic immigrants, since they come from places with more similar cultural roots/assumptions, are a different question entirely.

 

[Irish YJ]

JJ be like, come on in brother. Got some kush and oreos

 

[wizards8507]

I have no idea what kind of family you were brought up in.

I've brought quite a few poor people into my house.

Poor people that want to murder you because you're an infidel? Poor people that want to sell heroin to your children? Poor people that expect you to work two jobs to support them from cradle to grave? I suspect not.

Though I suspect in your case a solid supply of opiates is a redeeming trait.

 

[kmoose]

Poor people that want to sell heroin to your children?

Did you really just try to play the "drugs" card on Jughed?

 

[Irish YJ]

 

[MJ12666]

Holy crap.

Is this how you go about your life? This sounds terrifying.

Any reasonable intelligence agency puts ISIS, at most, in the 10s of thousands.

Al-Qaeda? They're barely in the 10s... we've done a number on them.

They're trying to start a movement, and after all this time and after all those horrible things they did, they've got... at most... 10-20 thousand folks.

That's not much of a social movement. Nazis had millions and we kicked their ass.

While this story below does not identify how many individuals actually compose "ISIS" and/or Al-Qaeda, it is a little troubling that based on polls it was estimated earlier this year that 42M Muslims have a positive view of ISIS.

Global support for ISIS includes up to 42M Muslims, group claims | Fox News

Also this poll reflects a relatively large percentage of Muslims believe that suicide bombers are "often and sometimes" justified when used against civilian targets if used to defend Islam.

Muslim Views on Suicide Bombing | Pew Research Center

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Holy crap.

Is this how you go about your life? This sounds terrifying.

Any reasonable intelligence agency puts ISIS, at most, in the 10s of thousands.

Al-Qaeda? They're barely in the 10s... we've done a number on them.

They're trying to start a movement, and after all this time and after all those horrible things they did, they've got... at most... 10-20 thousand folks.

That's not much of a social movement. Nazis had millions and we kicked their ass.

Clueless

 

[Irish YJ]

And so it begins.
France sending some nice presents to ISIS.
Bombs away.

 

[irishfanjho15]

And so it begins.
France sending some nice presents to ISIS.
Bombs away.

France just dropped 20 bombs on ISIS with help from the US

I fixed the link. Sorry guys.

 

[BGIF]

France just dropped 20 bombs on ISIS with help from the US

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[Sureal]

http://www.nato.int/terrorism/five.htm

Thoughts?

 

[phgreek]

While this story below does not identify how many individuals actually compose "ISIS" and/or Al-Qaeda, it is a little troubling that based on polls it was estimated earlier this year that 42M Muslims have a positive view of ISIS.

Global support for ISIS includes up to 42M Muslims, group claims | Fox News

Also this poll reflects a relatively large percentage of Muslims believe that suicide bombers are "often and sometimes" justified when used against civilian targets if used to defend Islam.

Muslim Views on Suicide Bombing | Pew Research Center

Ding, Ding Ding...

Its not the extremists numbers...or even their evil doings...its how they are viewed by those most suited to discredit them, and shut them down that should have 5 alarm bells going off around the world. This is not going away by downplaying it, waiting, and hoping.

 

[NDRock]

Interesting article on ISIS' view of the refugees and how they may have used the attacks to stop them from going to Europe.

The Islamic State on Refugees Leaving Syria | JIHADOLOGY

 

[irishfanjho15]

This webpage is not available

ERR_NAME_NOT_RESOLVED

Fixed it.

 

[Irish#1]

Maybe some feel that way altogether but from the majority inside, its not that we don't want to rescue, save, etc these people. It's we want to do it the right way. As in, vet these people the proper way because we know for a FACT that ISIS et al have embedded terrorists into these mass movements to better sneak in to countries.




Think about this, look at how many military aged males are fleeing and not joining in the fight to clean up their own country. Why is it always up to other countries? Maybe if they banded together, they could do this on their own.

If we want to get technical, Soviets broke the Nazis and kicked their ass, we simply cleaned up.

On the eastern front. We were marching along quite nicely from the west.

I agree we need to band together. With the Russian plane that went down and now Paris, I'm hoping the UN gets together, goes after these murderers and wipe them to the point they can never regroup.

 

[dublinirish]

On the eastern front. We were marching along quite nicely from the west.

I agree we need to band together. With the Russian plane that went down and now Paris, I'm hoping the UN gets together, goes after these murderers and wipe them to the point they can never regroup.

if you think russia is gonna do anything but look after Assad then you are kidding yourself

 

[Cackalacky]

I unplugged this whole weekend and went camping and missed all this.... crazy.

 

[Domina Nostra]

if you think russia is gonna do anything but look after Assad then you are kidding yourself

The devil you know (Assad, Mubarik, Khadaffi, Huesein), often turns out better than the one you don't (Al Queda, Isis, Muslim Brotherhood). Not sure who is arguing that life is better in those places--especially for minorities--with those guys out of power.

Personally, I really like the idea of Assad and Putin locked in a long-term war against those guy. Better than sending our guys into a situation where there are no clear good guys and bad guys.

 

[gkIrish]

I unplugged this whole weekend and went camping and missed all this.... crazy.

Don't look at the Wake Forest score

 

[Domina Nostra]

Don't look at the Wake Forest score

LOL. Or maybe just look at the score, and just assume that it was a nice dominating performance where we were controlling the clock and playing keep-away.

 

[Irish YJ]

I unplugged this whole weekend and went camping and missed all this.... crazy.

Great weekend to unplug. ...I'm jealous. It was a beautiful weekend. Heading to Vanderbilt Beach (Naples) next week for the holidays. Looking forward to the good weather, unplugging, and fishing a bit. Outside of the ND games, CNN and the world will be turned off.

 

[dublinirish]

The devil you know (Assad, Mubarik, Khadaffi, Huesein), often turns out better than the one you don't (Al Queda, Isis, Muslim Brotherhood). Not sure who is arguing that life is better in those places--especially for minorities--with those guys out of power.

Personally, I really like the idea of Assad and Putin locked in a long-term war against those guy. Better than sending our guys into a situation where there are no clear good guys and bad guys.

Not sure Putin would ever take the fight seriously into Iraq to take on ISIS. He'd be happy enough to help Assad secure his border and leave it there.

 

[Cackalacky]

Great weekend to unplug. ...I'm jealous. It was a beautiful weekend. Heading to Vanderbilt Beach (Naples) next week for the holidays. Looking forward to the good weather, unplugging, and fishing a bit. Outside of the ND games, CNN and the world will be turned off.

Cub scout outing. I turned my phone off and left it in the truck all weekend. Very much needed. Took the boys hiking, fishing, worked on knife skills, setting up tents, and started working on the fundamentals of archery. Got down to high 30s at night. Very cold for us.


Not to bump this thread unnecessarily but if theses ISIS pricks try and take things like this away from me... they got another thing coming. Screw these guys.