Quarterback Situation

[IrishLax]

He's going to do an enormous sales job for an elite QB to come to South Bend and *potentially* sit behind Crist, Hendrix, Golson, Rees and Co.

I know, I know...great quarterbacks aren't afraid of competition (I really hate this saying BTW). But if a stud QB comes here and sees Golson is awesome, he's SOL and so is Notre Dame if he transfers.

That said, I think Kelly is going to reel in a great QB for '12...because that's just how he rolls.

True, but with that being said, USC currently has FOUR top 5 QB prospects on their team. It might be hard, but it's certainly doable. Mostly kids just want to see that they will be in a good offense with good talent and be able to start for 2 years.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Well if this was the NFL, we could just package Rees, Montana, and Massa to the Browns for an extra scholarship in 2013 or something.

I think Rees is the one contender who gets left out in the cold, and will transfer to a MAC or BE school after or during the 2011 season.

Crist seems like a level-headed kid who realizes his own mortality now, and I bet will be content just earning a degree. He simply doesn't seem as hungry to me on the field as the other guys (although I'd never say he isn't as good). I think he will win back his job, but is one more injury away from never getting it back, and would happily ride out his college career as a back-up if the need be.

Golson needs to red-shirt. I don't see any advantage in having him play this year, that's worth burning a year of eligibility. He needs to bulk up anyways.

Hendrix is the wild-card supreme. Will he start? Will he be third string? The honest answer is NOBODY knows.

My projected depth chart after it all shakes out:

Crist (if he's ready to go)
Hendrix (beats out Rees)
Rees (decides to transfer after being relegated to 3rd)
Montana (along for ride, as stated by many earlier)
Massa(converts to WR)
Golson (RS)


*Of course this is all my humble opinion, and I've been called stupid many times.....

 

[Veer option]

Also, Golson will get a package of plays to run ala Tim Tebow. I think Kelly see's Golson as his QB, and the QB of the future. He's going to slowly introduce him to the college game by experience, and put him into situations that can build the kids confidence. I doubt he plays all 12 game this year. I think we'll see him against certain defenses to throw curve balls.

Not to be too argumentative, but Golson only playing in a few games would be a waste of a year of eligibility. There are others on the team who could fulfill the proverbial wrinkle in the offense than he could. Even though I would like to see more of an effective Wild Leprechaun burning the kid's redshirt to do so would be a mistake. I am quite often wrong so it is anyone's guess what Kelly has in store.

 

[Mr. McGibblets]

What I am gathering from these posts is that people seem to think the competition will be between Hendrix and Crist for the starting position.

Or will it be between Hendrix and Rees for the backup? or do you think Hendrix and Rees are pretty even?





.

 

[Ironman8]

What I am gathering from these posts is that people seem to think the competition will be between Hendrix and Crist for the starting position.

Or will it be between Hendrix and Rees for the backup? or do you think Hendrix and Rees are pretty even?





.

Let's see if people put their money where their mouth is......

 

[Mr. McGibblets]

Let's see if people put their money where their mouth is......

Wow, that sounds like a great idea, Ironman8!

 

[ND101]

Rees

Rees

All I do is win b******!!! I wouldnt count this kid out at all.

 

[Veer option]

Let's see if people put their money where their mouth is......

Vbuck betting woot!

 

[Mirer3Powlus]

What I am gathering from these posts is that people seem to think the competition will be between Hendrix and Crist for the starting position.

Or will it be between Hendrix and Rees for the backup? or do you think Hendrix and Rees are pretty even?

If Crist is healthy, then I don't think there will even be a competition. He played very well last year before the injury and looked to be adjusting well to Kelly's system.

I'm sure Tommy is a fine young man, but I still have my doubts about whether he can be Notre Dame's starting quarterback for a 12 (and hopefully 13!) game season. He showed a lot last season, but my gut tells me that Hendrix's upside is much higher.

 

[InKellyITrust]

If Crist is healthy, then I don't think there will even be a competition. He played very well last year before the injury and looked to be adjusting well to Kelly's system.

I'm sure Tommy is a fine young man, but I still have my doubts about whether he can be Notre Dame's starting quarterback for a 12 (and hopefully 13!) game season. He showed a lot last season, but my gut tells me that Hendrix's upside is much higher.

100% agree w/ THIS

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

I agree that there won't be much of a competition as long as Crist is here and healthy. We all have to remember that Crist was in his first season as a starter last year. He was playing in a new system as well. Has anyone looked at college QB statistics throughout their careers? the change from year to year is amazing! Look at Brady Quinn for instance:
2004: 17 TDs 10 INTs 54% completion 2586 yards
2005: 32 TDs 7 INTs 64.9% completion 3919 yards

What were the knocks on Quinn? He isnt accurate enough, he is just a big strong QB. Good thing people didn't give up on him after his first 2 seasons...(P.S. his first year stats as a starter are much worse: 9TDs 15INTs 47.3% 1831 yards)

Now Dayne. He is a big strong QB with accuracy concerns, right? Well in his very first year starting:
2010: 15 TDs 7INTs 59.2% completion 2033 yards

I think one full year with Kelly turns him into a monster. Who was Andrew Luck before last season? In his first year starting (as a sophomore in the same system he started in as a freshman):
2009: 13 TDs 4 INTs 56.3% completion 2575 yards
2010: 32 TDs 8 INTs 70.7% completion 3338 yards

It's just my opinion, but I believe Dayne is the starter 100%. One more question to ask to all of you: What were your expectations for Dayne on day one of the season, and what were your expectations for Tommy when he took over? For me, Dayne was expected to be great, so falling short of national passing numbers is a let down. For Tommy, I expected nothing. So winning 4 was heroic. But the letdown of Dayne really was nothing to be concerned with...IMO

 

[Old Man Mike]

I thought that this situation was muddy enough until I read Kelly's comments at his post-signing day "film-review" press conference. In his semi-prepared remarks about Golson, he praises him, of course, like he did every recruit, but spent as much or more time on him as anyone. He reiterated a whole litany of things that he felt Everett did at an exceptional level [he didn't just make stuff up to extend other recruit's commentary, so I see some significance in the extent of this rave]. And he specifically said that he is "a great fit for what we want to do offensively".

OK. Take that comment and glue it together with what he said later to a question about Golson. Kelly didn't direct his answer to just Golson. He discussed the whole set of quarterbacks. Mentioning "Rees and most likely Dayne Crist and the other quarterbacks" he placed them all into one category of QB, AND GOLSON IN ANOTHER. Kelly said: "Within our offensive structure, we can go full speed with Everett Golson", or he then said we can modify the system to go with other QBs strengths. Kelly then went on to say that we'll see Golson's skill set in the spring on the field.

Everyone will read these remarks as they will, but for me, it seemed like our Boss is REALLY taking Everett Golson seriously, and immediately. Unless Golson himself can't live up to Kelly's expectations, I imagine that we'll see Everett Golson playing QB for Notre Dame this coming year, even if it's in a change-of-pace role.

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

My crystal ball says...
1. Crist (if healthy)
2. Hendrix
3. Rees
4. Golson (RS)

Montana- a** slapper on the sideline
Massa- position change

I WIL PUT ALL MY VBUCKS.....oh wait nm.. i only have like 5k :\

Rees was a great game manager (ala a Kerry Collins or Trent Dilfer) but I don't think BK wants to run that type of offense. I don't know why but the only possible transfer I see is Hendrix if Rees beats him out.

 

[irish1958]

The only clue we have about Hendrix's ability is the noise from the coaching staff. If we are to believe them, he is very good to great. That said, I feel he will be our starter this fall.
The best scenario would be for Hendrix to start, Golson to red shirt and split with Hendrix for the next 3 years; Crist and Rees to backup until graduation, and a new guy to come in in one or two years to keep the pressure on the QB competition.
I remember the Lujack-Rattermann tandem.
I can't see Crist or Rees running Kelly's offense; that then defaults to Hendrix and/or Golson,
I think if the choice to Kelly is to run his offense with Hendrix or Golson or to modify it to accommodate Crist or Rees, he will go with the first choice.
Apparently Massa will be a wide receiver or will transfer, probably to the MAC.
If Crist doesn't win the starting QB job, his best bet would be to take a medical red shirt, and then transfer to a program that needs a very good pro-style QB. Crist is very good, but not for Kelly's offense.
It is fun to speculate. Remember last year? What a mess compared to this year.
I agree with IrishFBfinatic that Crist has the ability to be a very good to great pro-style QB; but if he starts it will never be the Kelly offense.
The worst mistake Lou Holtz made, I think, was recruiting Rick Mirer for quarterback and abandoning his offense, that was so successful with Tony Rice, to accommodate Mirer. Mirer was very good (in college) and earned All American status as a senior, but the teams lacked that spark of the '88 and '89 teams. With Kevin McDougal in 93 the spark was back but we were screwed out of the NC by Florida State who we beat on the field.

 

[Old Man Mike]

And a P.S. about the "other" QBs: Taking easy things first---1]. Montana will stay on the team and send in the plays;

2]. Massa may well shift to WR. He is 6'4" and over 200 lbs, and can easily add the strength. Longo's program might even increase his 4.8 forty time. We whiffed on our third receiver in this last class, so Kelly probably sees that as a hole to be filled;

3]. Rees & Hendrix get the spring reps at the "modified spread package" while Golson gets the reps at the "full speed" package. Rees beats Hendrix or vice versa. Coming out of spring it is one "modified QB" and Golson looking like they'll get the playing time;

4]. If Crist is healthy fully by summer, he gets a full chance to unseat the Rees/Hendrix winner. Predict what you will about that. Golson still sits alone with his "packages" and playing time.

5]. Depending on who wins the "modified" offense situation, someone might transfer. If Rees, then Hendrix goes; If Hendrix MAYBE Rees, maybe not.

Crist is the wildcard as to where he adjusts in the system. And whether he stays or not. I honestly haven't even an intuition on Dayne's cause. He could be Brady Quinn under Charlie Weis, or he could be Ryan Mallett under Rich Rodriguez.

 

[Mirer3Powlus]

The worst mistake Lou Holtz made, I think, was recruiting Rick Mirer for quarterback and abandoning his offense, that was so successful with Tony Rice, to accommodate Mirer. Mirer was very good (in college) and earned All American status as a senior, but the teams lacked that spark of the '88 and '89 teams. With Kevin McDougal in 93 the spark was back but we were screwed out of the NC by Florida State who we beat on the field.

Nah, the worst mistake Lou made was trying to make Ron Powlus of all people an option quarterback. He had the right idea with Mirer.

And excuse me for asking, but am I missing something here? Crist put up a 15/7 TD:INT ratio with over 2,000 yards while completing 60% of his passes in nine games last season. He can't run Kelly's offense? He may not be the ideal fit, but Dayne's talent can put him in any pass - oriented attack and let him at least marginally succeed.

 

[alohagoirish]

This thread underestimates Rees so much it's shameful. The point is made over and over not to count on golson because starting as a frosh is a "loosers game " and you can't expect hardly anything positive from a frosh. But need i remind everyone that a frosh is just what rees was, he came in not taking reps with the first team all year, he came in with the team in a complete nosedive and ready to tank for the season, he came in with after tragedy both on and off the field with the liklihood of a strong perfromance near zero.

Rees then promptly went on to beat the first ranked team we had beaten in 5 years, to beat USC for the first time in a decade, to look very sharp in our impressive dismantling of miami that nobody expected. Rees has a quick release, see's the field very well , has good pocket presence, and is calm and cool under pressure. All that from a freshman , yet he isnt' BCS material unlike our other QBs that have done nothing yet !

Rees will get bigger and stonger over the off-season, his confidence will just grow, and his experience in kelly's system will give him a great chance to excel finding the open man and hitting him quickly and accurately.

Rees will start against South Florida, there is little doubt IMO.

On Crist-- dayne is a good kid that is fragile as glass, the idea we will invest our future completely in the hands of a QB , Injured with a bad concussion in his senior year of HS, Injured with a major knee surgery in his sophmore year. Injured with some kind of Double vision during the biggest game of the opening 3 last year. Injured with a major operation to the other knee in his junior year. These facts are not promising at all. Forget the fact that dayne is very stiff and sluggish in the pocket, has a tendency to throw into the dirt or just go on a bad throwing spree in every game that delivers several 3 and outs. When dayne runs he is upright and stiff looking alot like a LB on the move. Dayne is not a spread Qb from the get go but a drop back pro-style. Dayne will NOT be 100% for spring even without considering all those other factors.

On Hendrix-- Other then knowing from kelly he has a very big arm , hendrix is a complete unknown. As kelly points out hendrix has very little experience as QB yet alone as a spread QB. hendiz threw for 19 touchdowns and 11 picks in his entire HS career at a running school like moellar, plus he only started for a year and a half. Golson for example has more then TWICE as many TD's in just his freshman year of HS! His mobility is ok but hendix is far from a dual threat QB, his 40 times vary from a good 4.7 to a not so good 4.9.In other words this thread has alot of PROJECTING about andrew that has very little substance behind it.

Rees will start
Golson will be the future star and kelly may or may not burn the redshirt for a change of pace threat

Crist and Hendrix will battle it out for the back-up role.

It seems tommy will have to rip off another 4 or 5 stright wins before he wins the respect of the fan base as a quality QB. Mayock and I and i think kelly have already been convinced, it's up to tommy to convince the rest of the fan base. I expect him to do just that!

 

[UmphreakDomer]

this is pretty close....

1/2. Crist/Hendrix
3. Rees (back up)
4. Golson (will play this year in certain game situations)
5. Massa (position change or transfer)
6. Montana (will not transfer again...sentimental scholly)

 

[ND_HAS_RISEN]

I agree that there won't be much of a competition as long as Crist is here and healthy. We all have to remember that Crist was in his first season as a starter last year. He was playing in a new system as well. Has anyone looked at college QB statistics throughout their careers? the change from year to year is amazing! Look at Brady Quinn for instance:
2004: 17 TDs 10 INTs 54% completion 2586 yards
2005: 32 TDs 7 INTs 64.9% completion 3919 yards

What were the knocks on Quinn? He isnt accurate enough, he is just a big strong QB. Good thing people didn't give up on him after his first 2 seasons...(P.S. his first year stats as a starter are much worse: 9TDs 15INTs 47.3% 1831 yards)

Now Dayne. He is a big strong QB with accuracy concerns, right? Well in his very first year starting:
2010: 15 TDs 7INTs 59.2% completion 2033 yards

I think one full year with Kelly turns him into a monster. Who was Andrew Luck before last season? In his first year starting (as a sophomore in the same system he started in as a freshman):
2009: 13 TDs 4 INTs 56.3% completion 2575 yards
2010: 32 TDs 8 INTs 70.7% completion 3338 yards

It's just my opinion, but I believe Dayne is the starter 100%. One more question to ask to all of you: What were your expectations for Dayne on day one of the season, and what were your expectations for Tommy when he took over? For me, Dayne was expected to be great, so falling short of national passing numbers is a let down. For Tommy, I expected nothing. So winning 4 was heroic. But the letdown of Dayne really was nothing to be concerned with...IMO

Very nice post!! REPS

 

[irishtrain]

He's going to do an enormous sales job for an elite QB to come to South Bend and *potentially* sit behind Crist, Hendrix, Golson, Rees and Co.

I know, I know...great quarterbacks aren't afraid of competition (I really hate this saying BTW). But if a stud QB comes here and sees Golson is awesome, he's SOL and so is Notre Dame if he transfers.

That said, I think Kelly is going to reel in a great QB for '12...because that's just how he rolls.

Rocket I agree with all this but IMO this offense doesnt need a great QB-just a guy who can run the machine. He's going to have plenty of help.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Rees will start against South Florida, there is little doubt IMO.

Rees will start. Crist and Hendrix will battle it out for the back-up role.

It seems tommy will have to rip off another 4 or 5 stright wins before he wins the respect of the fan base as a quality QB. Mayock and I and i think kelly have already been convinced, it's up to tommy to convince the rest of the fan base. I expect him to do just that!

I don't think Rees can convince me, honestly. He did a fine job not losing the games for us when he was forced into action last year, but ND will not be a BCS-level team with Rees as the QB. He just does not have the physical tools. Crist, Hendrix and Golson are all more physically gifted than Rees.

I give Rees a ton of credit for his moxy and his guts, but I see him as the 4th best option heading into the season. Playing a "game-manager" type of QB in Kelly's offense with a weapon like Floyd would be a waste.

I really like Rees as a backup; he is safe and reliable and you know he won't soil himself if he is called on in an emergency next year, but I am hoping that we make it through the season without seeing him, as it will mean that Crist and/or Hendrix will be healthy throughout the whole year.

 

[Veer option]

He's going to have plenty of help.

Yes. Whoever the QB is, will have lots of experienced players to either hand off or throw the ball to.

 

[phork]

I don't think Rees can convince me, honestly. He did a fine job not losing the games for us when he was forced into action last year, but ND will not be a BCS-level team with Rees as the QB. He just does not have the physical tools. Crist, Hendrix and Golson are all more physically gifted than Rees.

I give Rees a ton of credit for his moxy and his guts, but I see him as the 4th best option heading into the season. Playing a "game-manager" type of QB in Kelly's offense with a weapon like Floyd would be a waste.

I really like Rees as a backup; he is safe and reliable and you know he won't soil himself if he is called on in an emergency next year, but I am hoping that we make it through the season without seeing him, as it will mean that Crist and/or Hendrix will be healthy throughout the whole year.

Rees is a career backup. Sorry folks. I would not have any confidence if he was the QB for the entire year. Golson will get snaps with the first team, per Kelly, he will play in some games and because the plan is to attract a top Calibre QB, I would expect that he will be close if not the starter in 2012. I think that quote from Kelly sums it all up, the other 2 are modified spread QBs, Golson is a full out spread QB.

 

[WaveDomer]

The thing about Rees is, not only is he 4 and 0 as a starter, but he did that when ND's season was on the brink and packing it in was probably looking good. He did it as a freshman. There is nothing but upside to this kid. He may not end up as the starter, but I think the team is probably his until he gives it up or it's taken from him. You can't teach that stuff. You can teach technique and build physically, but a winner is a winner.

I do think Kelly is salivating thinking about what Golson can do in his offense.

 

[Rocket89]

Rocket I agree with all this but IMO this offense doesnt need a great QB-just a guy who can run the machine. He's going to have plenty of help.

True, but he's going to be recruiting high-level/elite QB's 90% of the time he's at Notre Dame. He might fall in love with 3-star guy once in a while or pick up a vastly underrated 3-star/4-star guy like Golson, but he'll go after the big fish in most years.

 

[Mirer3Powlus]

Kelly was able to have guys like Mauk and Pike post monster numbers in his system, and they were three stars at best coming out of high school. It's always nice to have a dependable guy like Rees in the hole, but the coaching staff should absolutely still be trying to find the next Clausen or Powlus. You can put up great numbers and stats with a guy like Pike as your quarterback in BK's offense, but a talent like Jimmy Clausen would make you a national title contender (if you've got a defense backing you). That's the difference in my eyes.

 

[Rocket89]

Some thoughts on Rees:

A. Intangibles are hard to define. Everyone is calling him a winner but what does that really mean? How will the coaches rate something like that during spring and fall practice? When I think about someone "being a winner" I think about guys who somehow make the big throw in the crucial moment in a game or lead their team to down the field for the game winning score with multiple clutch first down passes. There's an element in there that even though the player might not be the most physically gifted, he just MAKES PLAYS and has this supernatural wow factor that can't be explained.

As far as I'm concerned Rees did not display any of these characteristics. It would be different if the ball was in his hand and he was driven out of the pocket and tossed an amazing game-winning TD against USC, but that didn't happen. He only completed 12 passes against Utah (the offense looked horrendous in the first quarter), his play against Army wasn't anything special, the USC game was close to awful in most cases, but he did play very well against Miami.

Still, when someone says he is a winner and has all these intangibles and leadership qualities I want to see the ball in his hands and making plays. Is that too much to ask for a freshman in his position? Yeah I think it is, but if so I also think it means we can't go around acting like he's got this Mojo that just breeds winning and that'll be enough for the next 3 years.

B. Kelly's comments have been VERY restrained when he talks about Rees. There is some praise in there from time to time, but for a freshman who has started 4-0, you would think Kelly would be all over him and he'd talk him up, but he's not.

C. His lack of mobility is a HUGE strike against him. Seriously, there is no way this offense will be able to run the ball effectively against very good defenses with no threat of Rees taking off on option reads. He better be going 13 of 15 with 2 TD's in every scrimmage this year if the coaching staff is going to put up with taking away that running aspect from the QB position.

I also wonder how many kids improve their arm strength throwing the ball from 18 to 19 or 19 to 20. I guess you could gain a little bit more zip on your throws with increased leg power and such, but I don't think we're going to see Rees' arm strength getting even moderately improved. It is what it is for quarterbacks.

 

[HoosierIrish]

Just thought I'd put this out there. Dayne and Rees' APG's throughout their first four starts
173.25 yards
2.0 TD
1.0 INT

Dayne first 4 starts were
APG
288.75 yards
2.0 TD
.75 INT
and 1 rushing TD

and also I hate the "well he's 4-0 as a starter" what about the tulsa game, dayne threw the ball twice and ran for 29 yards, the rest was Rees.

 

[rtrn2glory]

I'm a Dayne backer...not fair to think we couldn't have finished similarly with him at the helm, plus he seems to be level headed and very supportive of his teammates especially Rees and I gotta lot of respect for him for that reason.

 

[ACamp1900]

Well, I'm coming into this one three pages late but I just don't see how anyone can really make a case that Crist should not be the starter if he is healthy enough to do so... period.

Tommy certainly made a statement and made some great throws in the Bowl game and against Army, but overall the offense clearly ran better with Crist back there...

and to me it's a two horse race with MAYBE a spread option package put together for EG if he is even ready for that this year...

just my two cents.