Police State USA

[Irish#1]

Not sure whether to place this in here or the Police State, so I'll drop it in both.

Watched a great documentary on The Night Stalker Richard Ramirez. Hours upon hours put in by the police, with some evidence not published on purpose so Ramirez doesn't know they have some evidence that relates directly to him. Ramirez decides to take his killing spree to San Francisco. LA detectives notice the similarities of the crimes in SF with those in the LA area. They fly to SF to discuss with the police.

SF CoP brings then Mayor Dianne Feinstein up to date and the possibility they have a serial killer among them. Feinstein decides to hold a press conference and lays out all of the evidence both the LA and SF police have, including the evidence they wanted to keep secret so Ramirez wouldn't be tipped off.

 

[MNIrishman]

I love how the most dysfunctional state in the union inflicts its politics and politicians on the rest of the country.

 

[TorontoGold]

Not sure whether to place this in here or the Police State, so I'll drop it in both.

Watched a great documentary on The Night Stalker Richard Ramirez. Hours upon hours put in by the police, with some evidence not published on purpose so Ramirez doesn't know they have some evidence that relates directly to him. Ramirez decides to take his killing spree to San Francisco. LA detectives notice the similarities of the crimes in SF with those in the LA area. They fly to SF to discuss with the police.

SF CoP brings then Mayor Dianne Feinstein up to date and the possibility they have a serial killer among them. Feinstein decides to hold a press conference and lays out all of the evidence both the LA and SF police have, including the evidence they wanted to keep secret so Ramirez wouldn't be tipped off.

Worth watching though? Hopefully Dianne's role in limited in show...

 

[ab2cmiller]

 

[MNIrishman]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">"BLM's call for systemic change have spread around the world, forcing other countries to grapple with racism within their own societies." <br><br>The Black Lives Matter movement has been nominated for the 2021 Nobel Peace Prize. <a href="https://t.co/4a3O7s1Uy9">https://t.co/4a3O7s1Uy9</a></p>— CNN (@CNN) <a href="https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1356176731661623307?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 1, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I heard they were nominated for the fiery but mostly peaceful prize

 

[drayer54]

I heard they were nominated for the fiery but mostly peaceful prize

A woman who was pictured flipping tables at restaurants and throwing drinks while shouting in people's faces demanding tolerance will accept the award.

 

[Blazers46]

A woman who was pictured flipping tables at restaurants and throwing drinks while shouting in people's faces demanding tolerance will accept the award.

I am curious who will accept the award. Typically when someone within the BLM says something stupid they use the "BLM is not an organization, its a movement" card. Will they just restock the shelves of Foot Locker and give the movement 2 hours to collect their prize?

 

[ab2cmiller]

I am curious who will accept the award. Typically when someone within the BLM says something stupid they use the "BLM is not an organization, its a movement" card. Will they just restock the shelves of Foot Locker and give the movement 2 hours to collect their prize?

I'm guessing MSM will accept it on their behalf.

 

[Legacy]

https://theappeal.org/the-cops-at-the-capitol/

As of today, at least 26 sworn members of U.S. law enforcement agencies from at least 11 states have been identified by law enforcement agencies and local reporting as attendees of the Jan. 6 rally in support of President Trump that sparked a riot at the U.S. Capitol.

So far over 150 people have been charged and federal investigators have used 500 grand jury subpoenas and search warrants to gather information. Investigators have gathered information from social media posts and from web communications.

Here's the full list of all those arrested so far with charges, links to charging documents and press releases, and current dispositions ranging from initial appearance and release to detention in that state or transport to DC for prosecution.
INVESTIGATIONS REGARDING VIOLENCE AT THE CAPITOL (DOJ)

The above also has charging affidavits detailing the crimes including the assaults and battery on law enforcement officers. The FBI has the following on their most wanted list for the Capitol violence.
https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/capitol-violence

In the lists of all arrested in the DOJ link above, I only find one press release on actual arrests of police officers. The two are Jacob Fracker and Thomas Robertson.
Two Off-Duty Virginia Police Officers Charged in Federal Court Following Events at the U.S. Capitol

On social media, Robertson is quoted as saying, “CNN and the Left are just mad because we actually attacked the government who is the problem and not some random small business ... The right IN ONE DAY took the f***** U.S. Capitol. Keep poking us.” He also stated that he was “proud” of the photo on an Instagram post that was shared to Facebook, because he was “willing to put skin in the game.” On Facebook, Fracker posted a comment that read, “Lol to anyone who’s possibly concerned about the picture of me going around... Sorry I hate freedom? …Not like I did anything illegal…y’all do what you feel you need to.” The post has since been deleted.

These cases are being prosecuted by the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the District of Columbia and the Counterterrorism Section of the DOJ’s National Security Division and the U.S. Attorneys in the perpetrators' states.

The Counterterrorism Section of the FBI is also focusing on recognized domestic terrorist organizations, bringing charges of conspiracy against members of the Oath Keepers and the Proud Boys.
Three Individuals Affiliated With the Oath Keepers Indicted in Federal Court for Conspiracy to Obstruct Congress on Jan. 6, 2021 (DOJ)

Three individuals associated with the Oath Keepers, a paramilitary organization focused on recruitment of current and former military, law enforcement, and first responder personnel, were indicted today in federal court in the District of Columbia for conspiring to obstruct Congress, among other charges.

According to the charging documents, Watkins, Crowl, and Caldwell communicated with each another in advance of the Jan. 6, 2021, incursion on the U.S. Capitol and coordinated their attack. Watkins, Crowl, and Caldwell are all affiliated with the Oath Keepers, while Watkins and Crowl are also members of the Ohio State Regular Militia. Watkins claimed to be a commanding officer within the Ohio State Regular Militia in a social media post.

According to the indictment, the three defendants initiated their communications and coordination in November 2020 and continued through on or about Jan. 19, 2021, when Caldwell was arrested. The exchanges vary in topics from a call to action to logistics, including lodging options, coordinating calls to discuss the plan, and joining forces with other Oath Keeper chapters. On Dec. 31, 2020, Caldwell posted, “THIS IS OUR CALL TO ACTION, FREINDS! SEE YOU ON THE 6TH IN WASHINGTON, D.C. ALONG WITH 2 MILLION OTHER LIKE-MINDED PATRIOTS.” In a subsequent post on Jan. 2, 2021, Caldwell stated, “It begins for real Jan 5 and 6 on Washington D.C. when we mobilize in the streets. Let them try to certify some crud on capitol hill with a million or more patriots in the streets. This kettle is set to boil…”

Besides those three, the FBI is seeking at least seven other individuals whose presence was visually documented from the rally, then changing into tactical gear including bulletproof vests and helmets and backpacks and marching to the Capitol with entry and occupation. FBI charging documents quote a message sent to Caldwell during the Capitol attack that said “All members are in the tunnels under the capital. Seal them in turn on gas.” Other messages referred to the legislators as “traitors” and called for “night hunting".

In commenting on the arrests and building cases, Michael Sherwin, the top US prosecutor in Washington, said that sedition, among other charges, is "what we're trying to build toward."

 

[Irish#1]

Worth watching though? Hopefully Dianne's role in limited in show...

Very much so. Lots of input from the two detectives who were the leads and local news personalities that covered this story. It's a quick video clip on her.

 

[Blazers46]

Pretty insane day today. On our way with the whole family to put our dog down we just missed a DHS and State Police traffic stop that resulted a 28 year officer getting shot and killed. We didn’t see the shooting but we saw the officer laying dead on the side of the road. Link is the story and actual video of Las Cruces police stopping and killing the guy. Unreal. 3 kids, 1 on the way. Can’t unsee that.

https://www.krqe.com/news/crime/incident-closes-i-10-near-las-cruces/

 

[Irish#1]

Pretty insane day today. On our way with the whole family to put our dog down we just missed a DHS and State Police traffic stop that resulted a 28 year officer getting shot and killed. We didn’t see the shooting but we saw the officer laying dead on the side of the road. Link is the story and actual video of Las Cruces police stopping and killing the guy. Unreal. 3 kids, 1 on the way. Can’t unsee that.

https://www.krqe.com/news/crime/incident-closes-i-10-near-las-cruces/

Wow, not good. Prayers for the officer and his family and hoping your kids come through this okay.

 

[NorthDakota]

Been catching some of the Chauvin trial.

Few observations:
1. Having a nine year old testify when you have plenty of video and no shortage of older and more mature witnesses feels gross. I feel awful for her.

2. The Firefighter/EMT/ whatever she is came across as a loser. Judge lectured her; loved to see that.

3. The friend/drug dealer refusing to testify was apparently quite a shock. The girlfriend seemed to say that he had recently OD'ed with similar symptoms.

4. The police who have testified so far seemed very bad for Chauvin. Said the force used was completely unjustified or some term of art. If I recall, also said kneeling on a neck is not a taught method.

overall, I'm much more interested in seeing what the coroner testifies. If he died from an OD or something that drug use would lead to (I'm not a science guy), gets a lot harder to make murder stick.

There are a bunch of rules with egg-shell principles, but-for causation, etc. I'm not sure which ones, if any, will come into the determination.

Also curious to see if the police lieutenant was correct about the knee/neck thing not being accepted. When this all went down I recall (perhaps incorrectly) that it was considered an acceptable use of force.

We got any prosecutors or criminal defense guys on here? Anyone else tracking the trial?

P.S. its amazing to go on twitter and see reactions. People are very entrenched.

 

[Blazers46]

Been catching some of the Chauvin trial.

Few observations:
1. Having a nine year old testify when you have plenty of video and no shortage of older and more mature witnesses feels gross. I feel awful for her.

2. The Firefighter/EMT/ whatever she is came across as a loser. Judge lectured her; loved to see that.

3. The friend/drug dealer refusing to testify was apparently quite a shock. The girlfriend seemed to say that he had recently OD'ed with similar symptoms.

4. The police who have testified so far seemed very bad for Chauvin. Said the force used was completely unjustified or some term of art. If I recall, also said kneeling on a neck is not a taught method.

overall, I'm much more interested in seeing what the coroner testifies. If he died from an OD or something that drug use would lead to (I'm not a science guy), gets a lot harder to make murder stick.

There are a bunch of rules with egg-shell principles, but-for causation, etc. I'm not sure which ones, if any, will come into the determination.

Also curious to see if the police lieutenant was correct about the knee/neck thing not being accepted. When this all went down I recall (perhaps incorrectly) that it was considered an acceptable use of force.

We got any prosecutors or criminal defense guys on here? Anyone else tracking the trial?

P.S. its amazing to go on twitter and see reactions. People are very entrenched.

I am surprised its not a topic of discussion as much as it is. I have talked to people that have forgotton who Chauvin is or that there is a trial currently happening.

 

[Irishize]

Been catching some of the Chauvin trial.

Few observations:
1. Having a nine year old testify when you have plenty of video and no shortage of older and more mature witnesses feels gross. I feel awful for her.

2. The Firefighter/EMT/ whatever she is came across as a loser. Judge lectured her; loved to see that.

3. The friend/drug dealer refusing to testify was apparently quite a shock. The girlfriend seemed to say that he had recently OD'ed with similar symptoms.

4. The police who have testified so far seemed very bad for Chauvin. Said the force used was completely unjustified or some term of art. If I recall, also said kneeling on a neck is not a taught method.

overall, I'm much more interested in seeing what the coroner testifies. If he died from an OD or something that drug use would lead to (I'm not a science guy), gets a lot harder to make murder stick.

There are a bunch of rules with egg-shell principles, but-for causation, etc. I'm not sure which ones, if any, will come into the determination.

Also curious to see if the police lieutenant was correct about the knee/neck thing not being accepted. When this all went down I recall (perhaps incorrectly) that it was considered an acceptable use of force.

We got any prosecutors or criminal defense guys on here? Anyone else tracking the trial?

P.S. its amazing to go on twitter and see reactions. People are very entrenched.

I remember reading months ago about how the prosecutor “over charged” Chauvin when it didn’t seem the evidence would warrant a conviction b/c the burden was too high. Honestly I haven’t paid much attention b/c I figured it’d be a circus. I did see the judge scold the EMT...that was good. By all accounts, Chauvin seems like a bad actor.

Fentanyl is a serious narcotic. I recently had a friend from high school OD on it. CPR didn’t work & then the EMT hit him w/ Noloxone multiple times before he finally came back. Obviously, that’s anecdotal and not every case is identical. It’s used a lot medically w/ an anesthesia for conscious-sedation.

Hopefully, justice is served.

 

[NorthDakota]

Didn't get to see the testimony, but looks like the prosecution was using a resident physician to suggest the autopsy was wrong about cause of death.

Also sounds like the defense countered him by getting him to admit his theory of the cause of death could also happen as a result of OD on the drugs in his system.

The theory I'm seeing as to why his friend/dealer/witness won't testify is that if it was indeed the drugs that killed or contributed to killing Mr. Floyd, then he could be facing charges. I'm not sure how that shit works at all.

Courtroom drama.

 

[Rogue219]

Coming up on the anniversary of the Boston Marathon Bombing, when for the first time I truly realized the resources American law enforcement had. Seeing those images on TV, of a police force in suburban Boston and the equipement/vehicles they had while searching for that suspect is something I'll remember the rest of my life. This wasn't Federal law enforcement, this was Watertown, MA's police force. A few months later at our village Fourth of July parade, similar vehicles were on display in my midwestern town. Has stuck with me ever since.

Was also the first time an police department announced an arrest via Twitter if I recall correctly.

It was another example of how people came together amid crisis and tragedy. Something I think we do quite well in this country when the chips are down.

 

[drayer54]

Coming up on the anniversary of the Boston Marathon Bombing, when for the first time I truly realized the resources American law enforcement had. Seeing those images on TV, of a police force in suburban Boston and the equipement/vehicles they had while searching for that suspect is something I'll remember the rest of my life. This wasn't Federal law enforcement, this was Watertown, MA's police force. A few months later at our village Fourth of July parade, similar vehicles were on display in my midwestern town. Has stuck with me ever since.

Was also the first time an police department announced an arrest via Twitter if I recall correctly.

It was another example of how people came together amid crisis and tragedy. Something I think we do quite well in this country when the chips are down.

I had a similar but opposite reaction to Boston. I remember thinking it was insane that this guy could lockdown millions of people and that the city of Boston was seeimingly so helpless against him. Reading about how the government tracked down Jan 6th Capitol protestors with license plate tracking, social media monitoring, and more was insane to me. If the gub’ment wants you, they’ll find you.

 

[Irish#1]

I had a similar but opposite reaction to Boston. I remember thinking it was insane that this guy could lockdown millions of people and that the city of Boston was seeimingly so helpless against him. Reading about how the government tracked down Jan 6th Capitol protestors with license plate tracking, social media monitoring, and more was insane to me. If the gub’ment wants you, they’ll find you.

Just a matter of time.

Can't remember the name of the show that was on several years ago, maybe "Man Hunters"? Pairs were to act like criminals and avoid being captured. They could go anywhere they wanted. The trackers were former law enforcement that used license plate readers, social media, cell phones, credit cards, spoke to relatives, friends, etc. Rarely did a couple win.

 

[Blazers46]

Anyone keeping up with the Chauvin Trial. I don't think the proesecution is doing a good job. One of thier witnesses testified Chauvins knee was on Floyds back, not neck. Add him having enough drugs in his system to a horse, his own recent overdose history and Floyd complaining he could not breath even before being on the ground just seems to leave a lot open for reasonable doubt. I am not sure buildings will be safe once a verdict comes out.

 

[NorthDakota]

Anyone keeping up with the Chauvin Trial. I don't think the proesecution is doing a good job. One of thier witnesses testified Chauvins knee was on Floyds back, not neck. Add him having enough drugs in his system to a horse, his own recent overdose history and Floyd complaining he could not breath even before being on the ground just seems to leave a lot open for reasonable doubt. I am not sure buildings will be safe once a verdict comes out.

The medical examiner just said he died from the police.

He could still be found not guilty but thats pretty tough for the defense.

Then again, he also said from the video, blood flow would have been fine. Dude had nearly 4x the amount of drugs in his system of some of his OD autopsies. Dude had an exceptionally large heart and pretty bad heart disease.

Seemed to suggest to me that the average bear wouldn't have died from this. But he did die from the police actions.

 

[Blazers46]

The medical examiner just said he died from the police.

He could still be found not guilty but thats pretty tough for the defense.

Then again, he also said from the video, blood flow would have been fine. Dude had nearly 4x the amount of drugs in his system of some of his OD autopsies. Dude had an exceptionally large heart and pretty bad heart disease.

Seemed to suggest to me that the average bear wouldn't have died from this. But he did die from the police actions.

Sounds like reasonable doubt...

A lot conflicting testimony. The coroner once reported if they found him dead with no context they would have labeled it a clear drug overdose. I’m not lawyer but I have been on many courtrooms for situations like these and they can either way, depending on how the jury interprets reasonable doubt and the case as a whole.

 

[Irish#1]

Anyone see the incident in Virginia where police pulled over a military officer? He had a paper license plate in the rear window the police couldn’t see so they pulled him over. The guy was fully cooperating yet the officers drew guns and pepper sprayed him. The primary officer in the incident has been fired.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Anyone see the incident in Virginia where police pulled over a military officer? He had a paper license plate in the rear window the police couldn’t see so they pulled him over. The guy was fully cooperating yet the officers drew guns and pepper sprayed him. The primary officer in the incident has been fired.

Missed that one. Had my eyes on Minnesota, where the locals are pissed about another police officer shooting another black man. In order to get justice, they're torching the city they live in and grabbing as many Nike's as they can from Foot Locker.

 

[Rocket89]

Then again, he also said from the video, blood flow would have been fine. Dude had nearly 4x the amount of drugs in his system of some of his OD autopsies. Dude had an exceptionally large heart and pretty bad heart disease.

Do you have any citation for this claim?

 

[TP81989]

The medical examiner just said he died from the police.

He could still be found not guilty but thats pretty tough for the defense.

Then again, he also said from the video, blood flow would have been fine. Dude had nearly 4x the amount of drugs in his system of some of his OD autopsies. Dude had an exceptionally large heart and pretty bad heart disease.

Seemed to suggest to me that the average bear wouldn't have died from this. But he did die from the police actions.

lol yes they would

You should try letting someone with 30 to 40 pounds of equipment kneel on your neck for almost 9 minutes to see if you would survive.

 

[IrishRazor82]

Missed that one. Had my eyes on Minnesota, where the locals are pissed about another police officer shooting another black man. In order to get justice, they're torching the city they live in and grabbing as many Nike's as they can from Foot Locker.

And the MN governor immediately and with no facts whatsoever, tweeted out something along the lines of "another Black life taken by officers". How has this guy not learned? Everyone in that state deserves what's coming for voting for it, a vote for a Dem is a vote against police support.

What a terrible move. Soak it all up, you asked for it.

 

[TorontoGold]

Anyone see the incident in Virginia where police pulled over a military officer? He had a paper license plate in the rear window the police couldn’t see so they pulled him over. The guy was fully cooperating yet the officers drew guns and pepper sprayed him. The primary officer in the incident has been fired.

So crazy man, was talking with my buddy who has the exact same name as Daniel Shaver about that incident over the weekend. Just horrifying to watch that video.

 

[IrishLion]

Anyone see the incident in Virginia where police pulled over a military officer? He had a paper license plate in the rear window the police couldn’t see so they pulled him over. The guy was fully cooperating yet the officers drew guns and pepper sprayed him. The primary officer in the incident has been fired.

So crazy man, was talking with my buddy who has the exact same name as Daniel Shaver about that incident over the weekend. Just horrifying to watch that video.

I assume they had guns drawn and were juiced up because he didn't stop right away. He drove less than a mile with his flashers on and pulled over into a well-lit area.

The cops assumed he was up to no good or buying himself time for something, I'm sure, so they had guns drawn in the event of what they perceived as a potential threat.

The problem is that they left themselves zero room for de-escalation at that point. Once they realized he was complying and showing that he was not a threat, they should've chilled. But not all cops are emotionally equipped to settle down once the adrenaline gets going... and that's a major problem in policing that appears to be pretty pervasive.

You could argue that the Lieutenant was not complying with their commands, but their commands were unlawful in the first place, I would think. That would explain the cops trying to talk him down after medics showed up and asking him if he'd "be cool" if they didn't give him any citations.

 

[NorthDakota]

lol yes they would

You should try letting someone with 30 to 40 pounds of equipment kneel on your neck for almost 9 minutes to see if you would survive.

Lol the cop isn't wearing 30-40 pounds of gear, and I believe Mr. Chauvin is a particularly scrawny man. Regardless, the medical examiner seemed to suggest it. If you got a problem with that, show us where it is wrong.

Seems like the prosecution also has had a problem showing if the knee was on the neck vs. the shoulder blade or back.

I'll let a guy kneel on my neck right after you pump that amount of drugs in your system.