Notre Dame to the B1G Conference?

[ulukinatme]

Top tier College Football has been the minor leagues for the NFL for a long time, but this basically seals the deal and puts it over the top. Eventually, it's a complete semi pro league that uses school logos and stadiums while the lower level schools in college football will move forward and play actual amateur football. I guess it will be better than leagues like the USFL because fan bases are already in place and names like USC Trojans and Alabama Crimson Tide sound better than the Philadelphia Stars and the Birmingham Stallions.

More and more I don't even care, but that's me. However, the USC v. Rutgers rivalry should be lit.

Well, Jack did say a few years ago that if the NCAA split into a football factory group and an academic group that ND would be in the later...maybe were creating our own NCAA with Stanford, Northwestern, and Vandy now?

 

[Dale]

This Braden Keith works for swimswam.com, a swimming website.

 

[Dale]

I heard this yesterday on Cover 3, the only way I see the schools like Clemson get out of the ACC is if the B1G & SEC both take a piece. If B1G takes some and SEC takes some at the same time, the conference would crumble and the GOR could essentially be nullified how I understood it because there would be no conference left to have to pay the fee to. In that coordinated attack though no shot the SEC gets those 4. B1G would need to be assured North Carolina it’d think.

It’d be something like

SEC: Clemson, FSU
B1G: North Carolina, Georgia Tech

Someone take Virginia. Figure out the rest. Maybe Duke or Pitt hits the B1G lottery. Va Tech the SEC jackpot.

 

[MacIrish75]

Silence is golden.

 

[Domina Nostra]

SEC: Clemson, FSU, North Carolina State, Virginia Tech . . . Louisville
B1G: North Carolina, Georgia Tech, Virginia, Duke . . . Miami

 

[GATTACA!]

I heard this yesterday on Cover 3, the only way I see the schools like Clemson get out of the ACC is if the B1G & SEC both take a piece. If B1G takes some and SEC takes some at the same time, the conference would crumble and the GOR could essentially be nullified how I understood it because there would be no conference left to have to pay the fee to. In that coordinated attack though no shot the SEC gets those 4. B1G would need to be assured North Carolina it’d think.

It’d be something like

SEC: Clemson, FSU
B1G: North Carolina, Georgia Tech

Someone take Virginia. Figure out the rest. Maybe Duke or Pitt hits the B1G lottery. Va Tech the SEC jackpot.

Duke and UNC should be a package deal.

 

[NDPhilly]

Anyone else feel like Va Tech is significantly underrated in these alignment discussions due to their recent mediocrity? They have 30,000 undergrads and generally are top 25 for football attendance. is UVA really more attractive than them because of Academics and Basketball?

 

[MacIrish75]

I can’t imagine Carolina going to any conference without any of their Tobacco Road brethren with them—specifically Duke.

 

[Dale]

Anyone else feel like Va Tech is significantly underrated in these alignment discussions due to their recent mediocrity? They have 30,000 undergrads and generally are top 25 for football attendance. is UVA really more attractive than them because of Academics and Basketball?

It’d think more valuable to the SEC than Virginia but not necessarily a value add. B1G would value Virginia more.

 

[Sea Turtle]

I can’t imagine Carolina going to any conference without any of their Tobacco Road brethren with them—specifically Duke.

Their sad devotion to all things basketball is what has gotten the ACC in this predicament.

 

[InKellyWeTrust]

Anyone think Jack is just using this leverage to get a big pay raise from NBC? Something like, "Hey NBC, Fox wants to give us $100 mil a year to join the B1G, we need at least half that number."

 

[OSU_Buckeyes]

Anyone think Jack is just using this leverage to get a big pay raise from NBC? Something like, "Hey NBC, Fox wants to give us $100 mil a year to join the B1G, we need at least half that number."

If Notre Dame were in contract negotiations with NBC, I would say this could be a possibility - but it’s still a few years out. By the time Notre Dame enters their next negotiation window with NBC, my guess is all the dominos will have fallen by then.

What I do think is being negotiated with NBC right now is how many Irish games air on NBC with the Irish as members of the B1G? Remember, NBC wanted a part of the B1G media rights even before the recent realignment wave started up last week. NBC wanted a Notre Dame/B1G double header on Saturdays. What will that look like if the Irish join the B1G? That’s one of the things being negotiated right now if I had to guess.

CBS lost their SEC Game of the Week and will be desperate to replace that with a B1G game.

I would be shocked if ESPN/ABC didn’t have at least some presence in this next contract. Too many brands and markets for ESPN to ignore.

My guess - FOX gets 50% of games, NBC gets 25% of games - including a guaranteed number of Notre Dame games, and the last 25% will go to ESPN/ABC and the CBS Game of the Week.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Anyone think Jack is just using this leverage to get a big pay raise from NBC? Something like, "Hey NBC, Fox wants to give us $100 mil a year to join the B1G, we need at least half that number."

Well, not JUST for leverage but I’m sure NBC is being roped in to sell ND on a future beyond their current deal which ends in 2025.

 

[stlnd01]

If Notre Dame were in contract negotiations with NBC, I would say this could be a possibility - but it’s still a few years out. By the time Notre Dame enters their next negotiation window with NBC, my guess is all the dominos will have fallen by then.

What I do think is being negotiated with NBC right now is how many Irish games air on NBC with the Irish as members of the B1G? Remember, NBC wanted a part of the B1G media rights even before the recent realignment wave started up last week. NBC wanted a Notre Dame/B1G double header on Saturdays. What will that look like if the Irish join the B1G? That’s one of the things being negotiated right now if I had to guess.

CBS lost their SEC Game of the Week and will be desperate to replace that with a B1G game.

I would be shocked if ESPN/ABC didn’t have at least some presence in this next contract. Too many brands and markets for ESPN to ignore.

My guess - FOX gets 50% of games, NBC gets 25% of games - including a guaranteed number of Notre Dame games, and the last 25% will go to ESPN/ABC and the CBS Game of the Week.

It's an interesting question as to whether NBC is a force pushing Notre Dame and the B1G together, or pulling them apart.
How much upside/ how much are they willing to spend to be part of the future superconference, vs. how much are they going to hold Notre Dame to terms of their existing contract?

 

[Huntr]

Anyone think Jack is just using this leverage to get a big pay raise from NBC? Something like, "Hey NBC, Fox wants to give us $100 mil a year to join the B1G, we need at least half that number."

No, because they won't get that much from NBC on their own.

However, prior to this blowing up last week, there was talk about NBC bidding to get part of the B1G package and showing B1G games in conjunction with ND home games

So, I wouldn't be surprised if they are working to keep NBC as home game broadcast partner as part of the larger whole.

 

[irishfan]

What I do think is being negotiated with NBC right now is how many Irish games air on NBC with the Irish as members of the B1G? Remember, NBC wanted a part of the B1G media rights even before the recent realignment wave started up last week. NBC wanted a Notre Dame/B1G double header on Saturdays. What will that look like if the Irish join the B1G? That’s one of the things being negotiated right now if I had to

Big thing here is this opens up a scenario where ND is demanding preferential treatment in having a dedicated and guaranteed broadcast partner for their homes games. That’s a huge concession for B1G schools as it’s essentially a recruiting advantage for ND to be playing less games on the BTN or FS1 (or espn2 or something if espn joins in on the media bid). There’s no way OSU, Michigan, USC, PSU will agree to something that like and not want a similar deal. I assume we would also want to continue to control kickoff times.

 

[stlnd01]

Big thing here is this opens up a scenario where ND is demanding preferential treatment in having a dedicated and guaranteed broadcast partner for their homes games. That’s a huge concession for B1G schools as it’s essentially a recruiting advantage for ND to be playing less games on the BTN or FS1 (or espn2 or something if espn joins in on the media bid). There’s no way OSU, Michigan, USC, PSU will agree to something that like and not want a similar deal.

What if it just lasted through the end of Notre Dame's deal with NBC (which is like three or four more seasons right?). Then we're part of whatever setup the conference as a whole has. (which may include NBC). Is it worth it to the Big Ten for NBC to block Notre Dame from joining entirely? Because it feels like they could if they put their foot down and insisted on broadcast rights to ND home games.

 

[OSU_Buckeyes]

What if it just lasted through the end of Notre Dame's deal with NBC (which is like three or four more seasons right?). Then we're part of whatever setup the conference as a whole has. (which may include NBC). Is it worth it to the Big Ten for NBC to block Notre Dame from joining entirely? Because it feels like they could if they put their foot down and insisted on broadcast rights to ND home games.

That’s what I was thinking. The NBC arrangement would be for the duration of the current NBC contract.

 

[choo choo]

We're disagreeing a lot, but that's okay. If they decide not to join at this time I don't think it hurts their position in the future. ND will always be wanted. I can see a scenario where most of the dominos have fallen and one of the last is the cherry on top. Could turn into an epic battle between the B1G & SEC to see who can propose the best offer.


Personally I think the B1G would prefer Clemson over Oregon if they fit the criteria, whatever that is today. More fertile recruiting ground and establishes a foothold in the south even if SC isn't a hotbed like FL or GA.

Just have a gut feeling the SEC would love to take on the Irish to keep them out of the Big if nothing else

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Duke and UNC should be a package deal.

Right. You essentially cut the largest eyeball market next to Atlanta in half if they split up.

 

[ShamrockOnHelmet]

Right. You essentially cut the largest eyeball market next to Atlanta in half if they split up.

Not so sure about that. And, I’d want Atlanta, Texas and Florida markets before I have any concern about the Carolinas…

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Not so sure about that. And, I’d want Atlanta, Texas and Florida markets before I have any concern about the Carolinas…

I am.
Atalanta is mostly UGA. Only partly GT
Texas most important markets will be fully SEC soon.

Floridas markets are already covered in SEC so you aren’t adding many new eyeballs from Miami or Tallahassee.

All of those markets are or will be represented in the SEC. North Carolina is exclusively ACC, is the 9th most populated state and rising, has two huge sports markets in Charlotte and RaleighDurham. If you are looking to add a fast growing and valuable market that you currently don’t have, it’s ND and North Carolina.

 

[OSU_Buckeyes]

If ND joined the SEC, that would essentially eliminate playing all former rivals. I think we are going to see a ten game conference schedule in these super conferences just to help maintain a somewhat consistent schedule of playing all conference opponents on a somewhat regular basis. Remember, the B1G originally wanted a non conference scheduling agreement with the ACC and PAC 12, but when the numbers were ran, the B1G found out that ratings wise, it was better to play another B1G game.

If USC, for example, plays 10 B1G games, that leaves two OOC games. One will be a cupcake game. Assuming that last game goes to ND, that is already guaranteeing that USC never plays any of their former PAC rivals again outside of a bowl game or playoff game.

If ND played 10 SEC games and the one cupcake game, that leaves one game to play vs anyone the Irish considers a rival.

To maintain any sort of traditional rivalries, ND should not be in the SEC.

 

[Irish#1]

I am.
Atalanta is mostly UGA. Only partly GT
Texas most important markets will be fully SEC soon.

Floridas markets are already covered in SEC so you aren’t adding many new eyeballs from Miami or Tallahassee.

All of those markets are or will be represented in the SEC. North Carolina is exclusively ACC, is the 9th most populated state and rising, has two huge sports markets in Charlotte and RaleighDurham. If you are looking to add a fast growing and valuable market that you currently don’t have, it’s ND and North Carolina.

North Carolina sports market is growing for sure, but isn't most of that in pro sports? With Georgia such a hot bed, if I had my choice, I'd take Atlanta over Charlotte or Raleigh/Durham for the recruiting alone. Looks like Atlanta is ranked 10th in TV audiences and Charlotte is 22nd. Raleigh/Durham is right behind Charlotte at 24.

Latest Nielsen DMA Rankings | Lyons Broadcast PR

Nielsen DMA Rankings - 2017 Television Season: Below is a complete list of Designated Market Areas (DMAs) and their rankings for the 2016-2017 television season. Markets are ranked by population. Advertising campaigns benefit from analysis of TV households by region.

www.lyonspr.com

 

[OSU_Buckeyes]

I saw this posted on another website. I’m not sure how valid it is, as I wonder how the poster knows the value of the new B1G contract at this time? Or, how much a new ND NBC contract would pay out? Still, it does make the case we are talking about hundreds of millions of dollars over time.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

If ND joined the SEC, that would essentially eliminate playing all former rivals. I think we are going to see a ten game conference schedule in these super conferences just to help maintain a somewhat consistent schedule of playing all conference opponents on a somewhat regular basis. Remember, the B1G originally wanted a non conference scheduling agreement with the ACC and PAC 12, but when the numbers were ran, the B1G found out that ratings wise, it was better to play another B1G game.

If USC, for example, plays 10 B1G games, that leaves two OOC games. One will be a cupcake game. Assuming that last game goes to ND, that is already guaranteeing that USC never plays any of their former PAC rivals again outside of a bowl game or playoff game.

If ND played 10 SEC games and the one cupcake game, that leaves one game to play vs anyone the Irish considers a rival.

To maintain any sort of traditional rivalries, ND should not be in the SEC.

I think it's highly unlikely they consolidate into best-of-the-best conferences and play 10 game conference schedules. Teams that are used to winning 8-9 games every season aren't going to be happy with being .500 every year.

 

[Dale]

“One interesting nugget is that if Notre Dame does eventually go to the Big Ten -- and with consolidation all the rage, that day may come at some point -- it would need to do so with a partner. Notre Dame would prefer that partner be Stanford, which it has scheduled an annual game with since 1997. They are synchronized in educational missions and Stanford poses less of a recruiting threat to the Los Angeles schools than Oregon or Washington.”

- Pete Thamel

Answering the latest college football realignment questions

A potential partnership between the ACC and Pac-12? An aggressive Big 12 looking to expand? And what about Notre Dame? Here are answers to the biggest realignment questions, one week after USC and UCLA's big move.

t.co

 

[stlnd01]

I

To maintain any sort of traditional rivalries, ND should not be in the SEC.

There are like 15 reasons why Notre Dame should not be in the SEC, and never will be. It's Big Ten or stay independent. This isn't that complicated.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

North Carolina sports market is growing for sure, but isn't most of that in pro sports? With Georgia such a hot bed, if I had my choice, I'd take Atlanta over Charlotte or Raleigh/Durham for the recruiting alone. Looks like Atlanta is ranked 10th in TV audiences and Charlotte is 22nd. Raleigh/Durham is right behind Charlotte at 24.

Latest Nielsen DMA Rankings | Lyons Broadcast PR

Nielsen DMA Rankings - 2017 Television Season: Below is a complete list of Designated Market Areas (DMAs) and their rankings for the 2016-2017 television season. Markets are ranked by population. Advertising campaigns benefit from analysis of TV households by region.

www.lyonspr.com

Im not sure why this isnt clear... maybe Im doing a poor job explaining my self. All of those markets are already spoken for pretty much by at least the BIG or the SEC. Im looking at it like if I was an exec in the BIG or the SEC. What markets are available to me to pickup that I dont already have a foot in or i am able to get into during realignment?

If Im the BIG, Im not going to be able to take UGA out of the SEC and GT just doesnt generate the same eyballs as UGA does. If Im the SEC, I already got the Atalnta market. GT isnt adding anything.

IF im the BIG exec looking at Florida, sure maybe bring in FSU or Miami is a good move but still not a huge movement in eyeballs to my product. If Im SEC I already got Florida and Im not gaining much by adding either or both those teams.

If Ima BIG exec and I want a presence in the southeast that I dont already have interest in and I want new eyeballs... North Carolina is the target. Clemson plus the two largest markets in CLT-RD is a no brainer. Im also chasing ND for its national brand and national eyeball generation.

If Im the SEC exec... this scenario is the exact same thing. I'd be dumb not to grab Clemson, UNC/DUKE as these are growing markets Im not already in at all. Same for ND as well. If the goal is to grab new eyeballs and a large tv market, ND is the top dawg of available CFB teams. Hence why the SEC exec said a few months ago, they weren't looking to expand anymore but if they did they said ND would be the team because of these very reasons.

I'd follow that up with either VT or UVA as the next desirable markets. Miami isnt a CFB city. Tallahassee isnt big enough.

My big board is:
ND
Clemson
UNC and DUKE
VT or UVA
UCF (Orlando/Tampa markets)
FSU or Miami

Just my 10 cents. We will see how it shakes out lol

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

“One interesting nugget is that if Notre Dame does eventually go to the Big Ten -- and with consolidation all the rage, that day may come at some point -- it would need to do so with a partner. Notre Dame would prefer that partner be Stanford, which it has scheduled an annual game with since 1997. They are synchronized in educational missions and Stanford poses less of a recruiting threat to the Los Angeles schools than Oregon or Washington.”

- Pete Thamel

Answering the latest college football realignment questions

A potential partnership between the ACC and Pac-12? An aggressive Big 12 looking to expand? And what about Notre Dame? Here are answers to the biggest realignment questions, one week after USC and UCLA's big move.

t.co

To me, that was nowhere near the most interesting part of the article.

"Notre Dame still has a chance at a blockbuster television deal on its own when its NBC deal expires in 2025, as the Irish are attractive to streaming services because they offer a boutique product without all the bulbous inventory that comes with conference packages. In other words, a nimble streaming service could park a truck in South Bend for six home games instead of being saddled with a lot of Oregon State vs. Utah basketball games on a Tuesday night. (Also, NBC/Peacock could get a piece of the Big Ten and package that with Notre Dame for a day of strong football.)

"'They don't need them,' said an industry source of Notre Dame and the courtship by the Big Ten. 'The market is going to be very vibrant for Notre Dame. They're going to do very well or extremely well.'"

I wonder what "very well or extremely well" actually means. How much of the gap can we close?

Thamel goes on to say that he thinks the thing that might force us to join a conference is playoff access, but we have already talked about why its unlikely for the SEC to go along with forcing us to join a conference. The only way I can see them doing that is if there is a true breakaway league and the Big Ten and SEC do like the NFL and work together to sell their rights. In that case, they would benefit even if we were in the other conference.