Improper Benefits in the SEC

[BGIF]

Don't get me wrong, I think Alabama is guilty as all get-out, but I don't think you can base assumptions on this particular set of vocabulary. ND said a lot of similar things regarding the Te'o family and their attorneys during the catfish incident.

What is that supposed to mean?

How about some substance instead of a drive by glittering generality.

 

[Irish Insanity]

The only control some of these programs lack is the control to keep it from the NCAA and the public. These administrators and coaches aren't stupid. They know whats going on.

 

[wizards8507]

What is that supposed to mean?

How about some substance instead of a drive by glittering generality.

I'm saying "ND said similar things about 'managing relationships' between student-athletes and agents/attorneys during the Manti Te'o incident and they weren't doing anything wrong. Therefore, you can't pin things on Alabama just because they've used similar words in the past."

Again, I think they're guilty but NOT because they've talked to players about how to deal with agents. The evidence needs to come from somewhere else, and there's plenty of it.

I didn't think it was that complicated. Sorry you didn't understand my "drive by glittering generality."

 

[Kak7304]

I've realized two things from reading this SI series:

1. Les Miles is a big time D-bag.

2. I'm proud to be ND. How many schools would suspend their starting QB for a semester for an academic issue? Or sit a starter (Tuitt) because he missed class? A felony won't keep you off the field if you play for Les Miles.

 

[domerfreak]

The only control some of these programs lack is the control to keep it from the NCAA and the public. These administrators and coaches aren't stupid. They know whats going on.

Thank You!!! I don’t know why but got caught up in an argument with bama fans on sportshoopla last night about this very topic. I pretty much said that saban or schools officials had to have some form of knowledge about 13 k exchanging hands. Yeah I was pretty much told I was an idiotic and had no idea about football yada yada yada….sabans zero tolerance policy was the model for college football and he has suspended players for less. Saban has a track record of pulling shenanigans I just don’t understand why it’s so hard to believe he had knowledge or possible involvement.

 

[BGIF]

...

I have been very consistent in my stance when it comes to issues regarding compliance and if Bama has done anything wrong then I would support any appropriate action taken by the NCAA to address it. And contrary to some of the Bama haters on this board - that is the overwhelming consensus among most Bama fans.

Bama fans overwhelmingly ... support any appropriate action by the NCAA.


Right, and Phil Fulmer will be the next Director of Tide Pride.

Hillary will select Alabama as the base for her 2016 Presidential Campaign.

Got any more fair tales to spin, Tommy?


In 4 decades living here, I've never heard any Tide fan support the actions of the NCAA except when they were investigating Auburn that includes doctors, lawyers, judges, faculty, and fast food workers. My neighbors and two UA grad relatives loathe the NCAA for the "constant persecution of a noble football program".

On 9/11/01 (yes,I know it's Bear's birthday, Happy 100 Bear.) I heard a Tide Fan co-worker comment,"Why can't those A-rabs hijack a plane and hit NCAA headquarters and do the world some good!" She was serious.

 

[BGIF]

Thank You!!! I don’t know why but got caught up in an argument with bama fans on sportshoopla last night about this very topic. I pretty much said that saban or schools officials had to have some form of knowledge about 13 k exchanging hands. Yeah I was pretty much told I was an idiotic and had no idea about football yada yada yada….sabans zero tolerance policy was the model for college football and he has suspended players for less. Saban has a track record of pulling shenanigans I just don’t understand why it’s so hard to believe he had knowledge or possible involvement.

It's called benign ignorance.

It was the same defense Gene Stallings tried to spin about the Antonio Langham agent deal.

 

[Irish Insanity]

My parents and all my teachers and **** lied too. They all said cheaters never win. Seems that how you win in the NCAA

 

[Cackalacky]

Ok, but this type of behavior is exactly what goes in to the NCAA's analysis of a "lack of institutional control."

http://compliance.pac-12.org/thetools/instctl.pdf



I'm not saying that there was a lack of institutional control here. Not at all. But my point is just because a head coach insulates himself from the day-to-day activities of his players does not mean he can insulate himself from liability.

He has said this is an administrative issue and all he is concerned with is coaching. I am not saying he does not know. I am not saying has not fostered it. I am saying without evidence he can claim he did not know. I think that is what Tressel said prior to the email came out. Will it be bad for him? Probably. They can claim any number of things to instill reasonable doubt. Remind me what has happened to Miami to date?

 

[Irishbounty28]

Seems to me Saban is a little cranky this is being talked about...I guess he is always cranky though.

VIDEO: Nick Saban responds (huffily) to questions about Yahoo! investigation - SBNation.com

 

[ARALOU]

Nothing new. I have heard of "Hometown" appreciation day that Bear organized to "pay homage" for players. When they're done with their career, of course.

 

[ACamp1900]

Bama fans overwhelmingly ... support any appropriate action by the NCAA.


Right, and Phil Fulmer will be the next Director of Tide Pride.

Hillary will select Alabama as the base for her 2016 Presidential Campaign.

Got any more fair tales to spin, Tommy?


In 4 decades living here, I've never heard any Tide fan support the actions of the NCAA except when they were investigating Auburn that includes doctors, lawyers, judges, faculty, and fast food workers. My neighbors and two UA grad relatives loathe the NCAA for the "constant persecution of a noble football program".

On 9/11/01 (yes,I know it's Bear's birthday, Happy 100 Bear.) I heard a Tide Fan co-worker comment,"Why can't those A-rabs hijack a plane and hit NCAA headquarters and do the world some good!" She was serious.

Driving to work today every sports radio station was inundated with absolute caricatures of ‘bama fans’ calling in , thick accents and all, just whining about how unfair this all is and how bama won those titles 'fair and square'… it was seriously ground hog day call after call…

 

[T Town Tommy]

I pretty much disagree with this entire analysis. Willful blindness in a court of law rarely is a successful defense.

Fortunately for 'bama and the other teams involved, this claim has worked on the NCAA before. Cam Newton, Renardo Sidney cases illustrate NCAA flaws - Andy Staples - SI.com

In my personal opinion, it seems that the longer a player receives improper benefits over a period of time, and if that player was more central to the team as a whole when compared to another player, a claim for lack of compliance, oversight, and willful blindness against the team by the NCAA should be stronger.

If the NCAA has "clear and convincing" evidence that Bama did anything wrong then they should do what they fell they need to. I have long held the view that if a school is caught violating NCAA rules then they should face the consequences. Pretty simple to me.

 

[nd_fan]

its nothing new that those SEC crooks are cheaters

 

[T Town Tommy]

Bama fans overwhelmingly ... support any appropriate action by the NCAA.


Right, and Phil Fulmer will be the next Director of Tide Pride.

Hillary will select Alabama as the base for her 2016 Presidential Campaign.

Got any more fair tales to spin, Tommy?


In 4 decades living here, I've never heard any Tide fan support the actions of the NCAA except when they were investigating Auburn that includes doctors, lawyers, judges, faculty, and fast food workers. My neighbors and two UA grad relatives loathe the NCAA for the "constant persecution of a noble football program".


On 9/11/01 (yes,I know it's Bear's birthday, Happy 100 Bear.) I heard a Tide Fan co-worker comment,"Why can't those A-rabs hijack a plane and hit NCAA headquarters and do the world some good!" She was serious.

I would have agreed 10 years ago. However, since Saban has been there the overwhelming majority of Bama fans believe you can win by playing within the rules. Also, an overwhelming majority of Bama fans expect Saban to discipline his players harshly when messing up. Every school has a certain percentage of fans that have that "win at all cost" mentality and Bama is no different. Notre Dame either for that fact. But now, most Bama fans expect the integrity of the program to be upheld and no one player is above the program.

Throwing out general accusations and blanket statements are dangerous at best. As I recall, there were blanket statements being thrown out about Notre Dame when it came to the schools involvment in the death of the student at practice as well as the young lady who committed suicide. As well, may outside of Notre Dame believe that the school covers up much of the issues they have when dealing with their student athletes. I don't believe that to be true but that is the perception some individuals have. To make such blanket statements are reckless and serve no purpose.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Driving to work today every sports radio station was inundated with absolute caricatures of ‘bama fans’ calling in , thick accents and all, just whining about how unfair this all is and how bama won those titles 'fair and square'… it was seriously ground hog day call after call…

As was the calls for a proper investigation into the young lady's suicide. And the fact that Notre Dame allegedly edited film of the young man's death at practice.

I really like you acamp but your hatred of all things Bama seem to dictate your thoughts. I don't hate any school. I don't think every school is dirty. I don't think there is an NCAA conspiracy to protect the SEC. I don't think Bama does everything wrong and Notre Dame does everything right. That's me. You are entitled to your opinions and I respect that. All I ask is that if you put it out there then have some factual basis for your opinions. That's not too hard.

 

[WakeUpEchoes]

As was the calls for a proper investigation into the young lady's suicide. And the fact that Notre Dame allegedly edited film of the young man's death at practice.

I really like you acamp but your hatred of all things Bama seem to dictate your thoughts. I don't hate any school. I don't think every school is dirty. I don't think there is an NCAA conspiracy to protect the SEC. I don't think Bama does everything wrong and Notre Dame does everything right. That's me. You are entitled to your opinions and I respect that. All I ask is that if you put it out there then have some factual basis for your opinions. That's not too hard.

Your opinions are appreciated. Just FYI, I would stay away from those two subjects around here.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Your opinions are appreciated. Just FYI, I would stay away from those two subjects around here.

Thanks. I agree about those two subjects. However, let's not throw blanket statements out about Bama either. Facts are appreciated. I have, and will continue to be very vocal in my calls to punish Bama if they did anything wrong. That won't change today or in the future.

 

[BGIF]

I would have agreed 10 years ago. However, since Saban has been there the overwhelming majority of Bama fans believe you can win by playing within the rules. Also, an overwhelming majority of Bama fans expect Saban to discipline his players harshly when messing up. Every school has a certain percentage of fans that have that "win at all cost" mentality and Bama is no different. Notre Dame either for that fact. But now, most Bama fans expect the integrity of the program to be upheld and no one player is above the program.

Throwing out general accusations and blanket statements are dangerous at best. As I recall, there were blanket statements being thrown out about Notre Dame when it came to the schools involvment in the death of the student at practice as well as the young lady who committed suicide. As well, may outside of Notre Dame believe that the school covers up much of the issues they have when dealing with their student athletes. I don't believe that to be true but that is the perception some individuals have. To make such blanket statements are reckless and serve no purpose.

I responded in context to your blatant lie and you respond with a drive by smear about two tragedies?

I'll repeat, in 4 decades living here, I have never heard a single Tide fan, graduate or redneck, say anything favorable about an NCAA ruling on UA and there have been a bunch of those rulings, hasn't there?

 

[T Town Tommy]

I responded in context to your blatant lie and you respond with a drive by smear about two tragedies?

I'll repeat, in 4 decades living here, I have never heard a single Tide fan, graduate or redneck, say anything favorable about an NCAA ruling on UA and there have been a bunch of those rulings, hasn't there?

Your entitled to your opinion and I respect that. But your blanket statements are a two way street fella. Sometimes if the shoe fits....

Thanks for calling me a troll and negative repping me.

If anything, I have been a fair and open minded poster on this board.

 

[Bishop2b5]

Bama fans overwhelmingly ... support any appropriate action by the NCAA.


Right, and Phil Fulmer will be the next Director of Tide Pride.

Hillary will select Alabama as the base for her 2016 Presidential Campaign.

Got any more fair tales to spin, Tommy?


In 4 decades living here, I've never heard any Tide fan support the actions of the NCAA except when they were investigating Auburn that includes doctors, lawyers, judges, faculty, and fast food workers. My neighbors and two UA grad relatives loathe the NCAA for the "constant persecution of a noble football program".

On 9/11/01 (yes,I know it's Bear's birthday, Happy 100 Bear.) I heard a Tide Fan co-worker comment,"Why can't those A-rabs hijack a plane and hit NCAA headquarters and do the world some good!" She was serious.

I'm going to have to disagree with you here, BGIF. Most of the Bama fans I know, including myself, want clean programs and the NCAA rules enforced as long as they're enforced consistently and fairly. If we did something wrong, I'll be the first one calling for heads to roll. I thought the NCAA was right to have hammered us in the 90's when a player signed with an agent and our coaching staff and admin let him keep playing and tried to cover it up. I agreed with them hitting us hard over a booster attempting to buy Albert Means a dozen years ago. Right now, it looks like this was a case of an agent funneling money to a couple of players, not anything the school or football program was involved in or had any reasonable expectation to have known about. If that changes though, I'll be for the NCAA punishing us for it.

 

[Cackalacky]

I find most people are happy with blissful ignorance.

 

[BGIF]

I'm going to have to disagree with you here, BGIF. Most of the Bama fans I know, including myself, want clean programs and the NCAA rules enforced as long as they're enforced consistently and fairly. If we did something wrong, I'll be the first one calling for heads to roll. I thought the NCAA should have hammered us in the 90's when a player signed with an agent and our coaching staff and admin tried to cover it up and let him keep playing. I agreed with them hitting us hard over a booster attempting to buy Albert Means a dozen years ago. Right now, it looks like this was a case of an agent funneling money to a couple of players, not anything the school or football program was involved in or had any reasonable expectation to have known about. If that changes though, I'll be for the NCAA punishing us for it.

Bama fans don't give a damn about playing by the rules and that's the tone that comes from the Adminstration.

You can fool some of these people but I live here.

 

[Bishop2b5]

It's called benign ignorance.

It was the same defense Gene Stallings tried to spin about the Antonio Langham agent deal.

Stallings did know about Langham back in '93. What Langham did wasn't that big of a deal. Covering it up was. If we'd simply reported it to the NCAA and sat Langham for a couple of games, that would've been the end of it. We got hammered for the cover up.

Saban and staff have done a very good job of educating players about agents and not getting involved with them in impermissible ways. Still, no matter how much you warn players about something, a few of them will still screw up. He has a track record of dealing pretty harshly with violators though. When it was learned that Outland Trophy winner Andre Smith had possibly violated the rule about agents just before the '09 Sugar Bowl, Saban suspended him immediately. Smith was probably our most valuable, or at least most critical, player and his suspension for that game almost certainly cost us the game. You can't say Saban turns a blind eye and won't punish players for such things.

 

[Irish Insanity]

What's the reasoning for bringing a suicide and the death of a student into this thread or discussion? Odd to draw a parallel of any kind from those situations to the one currently surrounding your university. On that note, get the **** out. Your an idiot.

 

[Bishop2b5]

Bama fans don't give a damn about playing by the rules and that's the tone that comes from the Adminstration.

You can fool some of these people but I live here.

BGIF, you're entitled to your opinion, but you're letting hatred for a school blind you and cause you to make outlandish blanket statements that simply aren't true, and see or interpret everything about Bama or the SEC in the most negative light, regardless of the actual facts. Think about some of the erroneous negative blanket statements made by ND haters or those who are anti-Catholic and how ridiculous and inaccurate they usually are. You're doing the same thing here.

 

[RDU Irish]

Sure. I'm sure he's like most college kids, trying to decide whether it's better to do a traditional IRA or a Roth.

Can't do either without reportable income. Quite the dilemma...

 

[ACamp1900]

All I ask is that if you put it out there then have some factual basis for your opinions. That's not too hard.

excuse me... I stated a bunch of radio stations were overwhelmed with Bama fans this morning... they were...

the rest of your post was the exact opposite of what you claim to expect from me...

 

[T Town Tommy]

What's the reasoning for bringing a suicide and the death of a student into this thread or discussion? Odd to draw a parallel of any kind from those situations to the one currently surrounding your university. On that note, get the **** out. Your an idiot.

It was solely meant to draw the comparison to blanket statements... neither of which adds to the discussion at hand.

As far as being an idiot... I have taken the backhanded comments and some personal attacks with a tremendous amount of patience. It is an Irish board and some should be expected. If anyone has a problem or issue with me, please PM me and we can discuss. If the majority want me to leave the board for good then I will respect those wishes as well. I don't like conflict nor do I want to participate in name calling and ignorant fan talk. Thanks.

 

[dshans]

... Plausible deniability is wonderful.

It worked so well for Nixon ...