George Zimmerman Trial

[anarin]

So let me get this right... Some of you think GZ is a murderer because he was suspicious of a person in his or his sisters neighborhood. As an active member or volunteer of a neighborhood watch he chose to follow the person of suspicion. The person attacked him and he shot them?

Jesus Christ People.

And people wonder what is happening to our country...

I blame Lane Kiffin

 

[ACamp1900]

I blame Lane Kiffin

Finaly something I am sure we can all agree on...

 

[drayer54]

Lane Kiffin is a Creepy *** Cracker!

 

[jmurphy75]

So let me get this right... Some of you think GZ is a murderer because he was suspicious of a person in his or his sisters neighborhood. As an active member or volunteer of a neighborhood watch he chose to follow the person of suspicion. The person attacked him and he shot them?

Jesus Christ People.

And people wonder what is happening to our country...

Amen!

 

[NDohio]

So let me get this right... Some of you think GZ is a murderer because he was suspicious of a person in his or his sisters neighborhood. As an active member or volunteer of a neighborhood watch he chose to follow the person of suspicion. The person attacked him and he shot them?

Jesus Christ People.

And people wonder what is happening to our country...

Just getting finished witha crazy day at work. Did testimony come out today that showed who instigated the attack? I am way behind .......

 

[Bogtrotter07]

So let me get this right... Some of you think GZ is a murderer because he was suspicious of a person in his or his sisters neighborhood. As an active member or volunteer of a neighborhood watch he chose to follow the person of suspicion. The person attacked him and he shot them?

Jesus Christ People.

And people wonder what is happening to our country...

No, some of us think that he is a murderer because he was obsessed with carrying a gun, and shooting someone. He obviously had an attitude because of the break-ins in his neighborhood, and he let his emotions overcome his good judgment. He continued on and caused his own person to be so closed to TM that a physical confrontation occurred. And he has lied repeatedly about details and circumstances with the case and otherwise since. Also, his story is inconsistent with all of the physical evidence.

What is wrong with this country? Other than people taking the Lord's name in vain and wonder what is happening with this country.

 

[Bluto]

Lane Kiffin is a Creepy *** Cracker!

I think he's a goofy azz pendejo. Potato, Puhtato I suppose.

 

[Bluto]

It's funny that they accused Zimmerman of being the racist one and that was his "motive" for murder... yet it's totally cool for Martin to have called him a "crazy *** cracker"...

I would classify someone of the Caucasian persuasion (half or otherwise) as a crazy azz cracker if they thought it necessary to creep around the neighborhood with a loaded gun playing caped crusader. The whole situation could have been avoided if this idiot Zimermann had just let the cops do their job.

 

[connect the dots]

Just getting finished witha crazy day at work. Did testimony come out today that showed who instigated the attack? I am way behind .......

This is not the place to receive reliable information on the Zimmerman trial. There are far too many crazy *** crackers(Catholics raised in the suburbs of major cities) on this board. To catch up on the trial, I suggest you go to the internet or your local newspaper. Be mindful of the fact, that obtaining an academic degree from Notre Dame, can turn you into someone with obnoxious and self serving opinions about the world we share with others. I suppose exceptions can be found for the few students in Philosophy/Theology. They have no interest in toting a gun. They do not require a gun to stand their ground!

 

[RyCo1983]

This is not the place to receive reliable information on the Zimmerman trial. There are far too many crazy *** crackers(Catholics raised in the suburbs of major cities) on this board. To catch up on the trial, I suggest you go to the internet or your local newspaper. Be mindful of the fact, that obtaining an academic degree from Notre Dame, can turn you into someone with obnoxious and self serving opinions about the world we share with others. I suppose exceptions can be found for the few students in Philosophy/Theology. They have no interest in toting a gun. They do not require a gun to stand their ground!

I'm going to recommend the BBC. There's no such thing as a balanced American news outlet.
I did hear quite a bit of audio on NPR on the way home from work today.

 

[FLDomer]

This is not the place to receive reliable information on the Zimmerman trial. There are far too many crazy *** crackers(Catholics raised in the suburbs of major cities) on this board. To catch up on the trial, I suggest you go to the internet or your local newspaper. Be mindful of the fact, that obtaining an academic degree from Notre Dame, can turn you into someone with obnoxious and self serving opinions about the world we share with others. I suppose exceptions can be found for the few students in Philosophy/Theology. They have no interest in toting a gun. They do not require a gun to stand their ground!

Cracker is a term used also for "true" Floridians, people born here. Called this for the settlers that settled the state and arrived with their oxen charts, cracking their whips to drive the beast.

That said the way TM used it is the equivalent of the "N" word for white people.

 

[Bluto]

Cracker is a term used also for "true" Floridians, people born here. Called this for the settlers that settled the state and arrived with their oxen charts, cracking their whips to drive the beast.

That said the way TM used it is the equivalent of the "N" word for white people.

No it's not. White people were never in chains having to call someone "massa", denied the vote and on and on. There is no equivalent for whites because they have always enjoyed a position of power and privalege n this country relative to people of Native, African and Meso-American descent.

 

[Irish Insanity]

No, some of us think that he is a murderer because he was obsessed with carrying a gun, and shooting someone. He obviously had an attitude because of the break-ins in his neighborhood, and he let his emotions overcome his good judgment. He continued on and caused his own person to be so closed to TM that a physical confrontation occurred. And he has lied repeatedly about details and circumstances with the case and otherwise since. Also, his story is inconsistent with all of the physical evidence.

What is wrong with this country? Other than people taking the Lord's name in vain and wonder what is happening with this country.

THIS

 

[MJ12666]

Serious question... do you see this as Zimmerman protecting HIS property? The reason I ask is that he was admittingly stalking a child (by legal definition) that was committing no crime for simply looking suspiscious. He was stalking him on a public street in which he was walking. Sure, Zimmerman lives in the neighborhood, but TM was not on his property, he wasn't breaking into his property. He was not confronting Zimmerman while in the act of committing a crime.

If anything, it has always seemed to me that TM confronted a man that was pursuing him for reasons unknown to him. For all practical purposes, it seems as though TM was the one protecting himself, and instead of taking a beating for his actions, he chose to kill another person.

I try to put myself in TM's shoes. What would I do if I realized that a strange man was stalking me as I walked home? I believe that I would confront him, and if he continued to pusue me, I would defend myself.

Not really a very smart thing to do even if you live in a state that had strict gun control laws like NY or NJ. For example, just recently in Maryland (I think) a driver was shot and killed (by an off duty policeman) after both pulled over to the shoulder after one of them cut the other off. Then you had the rookie linebacker who was arrested because he punched someone, which caused a head injury (either from the punch or he fell and hit his head) and is now in the hospital in critical condition. If this person dies murder charges could be filed. Why risk losing or destroying your life? Simply head home and call the police.

 

[Booslum31]

White guy following a white guy...no story.
Black guy following black guy....no story.
Black guy followed by half white guy...media feeding frenzy, useless ethic leadership weighing in and stirring the pot and polarizing groups instead of leading people during a difficult time. The fact that the neighborhood had a rash of break-ins sucks, the fact that we need neighborhood watch programs sucks, the fact that GZ answered the call sucks. TM not appreciating being followed sucks. just want this to go away. I agree with whoever said there is no media outlet in America worth a **** to get your news from. I'm close to taking the lords name in vain but won't go there. Any bets on when the riots start?

 

[IrishLax]

No it's not. White people were never in chains having to call someone "massa", denied the vote and on and on. There is no equivalent for whites because they have always enjoyed a position of power and privalege n this country relative to people of Native, African and Meso-American descent.

Very flawed logic... technically true because of the "relative" part for the section I bolded... no, "cracker" isn't remotely close to equivalent to the N bomb but if you think it's totally OK to run around using any kind of bigotted speech towards any group because of relative historical privilege that's pretty damn flawed. There's not an easy way to draw the line then... is kike OK? What about WOP? What about for non-black groups? Beaner? Towel head?

I mean you just really can't be subjective. Either its OK to use disparaging stuff directed at a ethnicity or its not. You can't pick and choose which are OK based on personal preference or who has it coming or whose ancestors had it the worst.

 

[connect the dots]

Cracker is a term used also for "true" Floridians, people born here. Called this for the settlers that settled the state and arrived with their oxen charts, cracking their whips to drive the beast.

That said the way TM used it is the equivalent of the "N" word for white people.

True, cracker can be used as a disparaging word. However, I often call my friend John, a Clewiston cracker, and it brings a smile to his face. It is my way of paying tribute to his father, and his family, who trapped and caught catfish and turtles for a living on Lake Okeechobee. Hard scrabble can recognize and appreciate hard scrabble!

 

[Booslum31]

Very flawed logic... technically true because of the "relative" part for the section I bolded... no, "cracker" isn't remotely close to equivalent to the N bomb but if you think it's totally OK to run around using any kind of bigotted speech towards any group because of relative historical privilege that's pretty damn flawed. There's not an easy way to draw the line then... is kike OK? What about WOP? What about for non-black groups? Beaner? Towel head?

I mean you just really can't be subjective. Either its OK to use disparaging stuff directed at a ethnicity or its not. You can't pick and choose which are OK based on personal preference or who has it coming or whose ancestors had it the worst.

This

 

[MJ12666]

Watching the girls testimony, I did not get the impression that Martin was using the term "cracker" in a colloquial, complimentary or endearing manner.

 

[jmurphy75]

No, some of us think that he is a murderer because he was obsessed with carrying a gun, and shooting someone. He obviously had an attitude because of the break-ins in his neighborhood, and he let his emotions overcome his good judgment. He continued on and caused his own person to be so closed to TM that a physical confrontation occurred. And he has lied repeatedly about details and circumstances with the case and otherwise since. Also, his story is inconsistent with all of the physical evidence.

What is wrong with this country? Other than people taking the Lord's name in vain and wonder what is happening with this country.

Bogs this seems like an awful lot of assumption, where do you get all of your info?

 

[jmurphy75]

[/B][/B]

Not really a very smart thing to do even if you live in a state that had strict gun control laws like NY or NJ. For example, just recently in Maryland (I think) a driver was shot and killed (by an off duty policeman) after both pulled over to the shoulder after one of them cut the other off. Then you had the rookie linebacker who was arrested because he punched someone, which caused a head injury (either from the punch or he fell and hit his head) and is now in the hospital in critical condition. If this person dies murder charges could be filed. Why risk losing or destroying your life? Simply head home and call the police.

Holy crap...now this is finally some reasonable logic, when someone is following you you have a choice confront, confront physically or head home or somewhere safe. A person following you not chasing you is not attacking or threatening.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Bogs this seems like an awful lot of assumption, where do you get all of your info?

What info? That on GZ? It is all pretty much out there in the record. And there is some logic involved. The Travon Martin killing was an "Oh-shiit!" moment for the homeowner association and the police department. Here is why.

I have tried to keep it simple. Successful homeowner, block watch programs have one model that works. They train as many people as possible to do the job. Ask how many people were on the block watch in this neighborhood; I did.

Determine their level of training. The one thing that can be determined by inference is this block-watchman was not properly trained to approach a subject. If done properly, nothing should happen. If you list all the things that can go wrong, the worst did. Either an armed man in a car totally lost his edge to a 5'11", 158 lbs., seventeen year old, or he murdered him without adequate provocation. There is no middle ground. It is one or the other. So any testimony by police or professionals who trained Mr. Zimmerman is tainted, too suspect to be trusted. Mr. Zimmerman got himself in over his head, and since proper training is repetition, there was not enough or adequate training. Which brings up the problem hinted at by several users. The problem Wooly so astutely brought up, the attitude that you can pass a law putting more guns into the average idiot's hands, with little or no training and expect not to have murder and misery.

Which brings up the next point. Why wasn't there a patrol of two? The best way to keep an individual from getting in trouble is the buddy system. He is less likely to panic, and an individual in opposition is less likely to cause a ruckus when confronted by two, especially when done correctly. And by the way, for any of you 'cowboys' out there who would have taught that 'punk' a 'thing or two,' the first thing a Marine learns on guard duty when having to confront someone is to find something to hide behind. The second is to shout, "Who is there?" Any ex-Marine will be laughing by now because this is exactly the way a Marine is and has been taught in basic training for the last 100 years.

So now in addition to the watchman, his police and civilian trainers all having some liability in this situation, determinable just by the facts of the situation, there is more.

I have listened to law enforcement, attorneys, gun advocates, the man who held my concealed carry class and the president of my own neighborhood association (HOA) who is a former city attorney, all state unequivocally that a watchman should never carry a gun. If the neighborhood is so dangerous that armed guards are necessary, then the association is better off hiring off duty policemen. Otherwise, a link between block watch and the police through 9-1-1 with photographs of criminal activity is good enough. Everybody has a huge liability in this case with GZ claiming he was on patrol officially representing the homeowners association with a gun. Expect a lot to go into the question of why someone so meek and unable to defend himself had a gun and killed a seventeen year old walking through the neighborhood.

The guy that did our CCP classes talked about the woman that shot the intruder that broke into her house and attempted to rape her before she killed him with her service weapon. She was a police officer. Here is her problem. She had her targets showing her good range scores framed and hung on her walls. I think her conviction was later overturned, but if it wasn't so easy to establish her state of mind was shoot first and ask questions later, she would have never been charged.

Since most people are listening to the bull shiit about TM being a hulking gang banger, drug addict, all of which are lies designed to play upon the public's prejudices and you look for what is important, what did GZ do before and immediately after this incident it is pretty easy to see the truth.

As far as people wondering incredulously what this country is coming to, I was a child in the early 1960's when on vacation in the deep south and assaulted by a local woman (white) for drinking out of an 'others' drinking fountain. I mean this woman was going to smack me until my dad came to my rescue. That is what this country is coming to. And if that is not enough, 60 years before that, my great uncles risked beatings on the streets of some neighborhoods of Detroit just because they were Irish.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

What info? That on GZ? It is all pretty much out there in the record...

FYI, very, very little of what you claim above is in the record yet. Maybe it will be by today (or later), we'll just have to wait and see what's presented into evidence.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

FYI, very, very little of what you claim above is in the record yet. Maybe it will be by today (or later), we'll just have to wait and see what's presented into evidence.

Exactly! The fact that many tried to defame this TM with another TM, on the record. The fact that all the drug problems claimed that TM had wasn't true, on the record, (small amount of THC in blood at autopsy, on the record.) GZ carrying a gun while on patrol, on the record. The fact that there is not one forensic indication that TM was in the fight of his life, on the record. Most of what I have said comes from affidavits, sworn statements on the record.

The trick is, paying attention to what is important. This poor girl yesterday, she had nothing, and you knew she was going to lie and already had. She became hamburger. The police person in charge of block watch training that talked in vague generalities, also had nothing to offer. And so on.

 

[GoIrish41]

As of yesterday, three separate witnesses have claimed that they saw Zimmerman on top of Martin -- not really in sync with the Zimmerman account. Apparently, he told police that he did not know he hit Martin when he shot, climbed on top of Martin's chest, spread his arms out and held them down until he realized Martin wasn't moving. The problem with that account is that when police arrived Martin was face down.

The fact that the police did not arrest Zimmerman the night of the shooting is a **** poor police work at best. The fact that they did nothing for more than 40 days is insane.

Listen to the 9-1-1 call on which screaming can be heard in the background. After some time, you can hear the gunshots and then the screaming stops. Who does that indicate was screaming?

For those of you who think this would not be in the news if the race card wasn't played by MSNBC, I say bunk. I can't understand where your outrage is.

 

[ulukinatme]

Listen to the 9-1-1 call on which screaming can be heard in the background. After some time, you can hear the gunshots and then the screaming stops. Who does that indicate was screaming?

Could be either guy really. Could have been TM screaming and then was silenced, or it could be Zimmerman realizing the situation is over. I'm not defending either case here, just playing devil's advocate.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

...Listen to the 9-1-1 call on which screaming can be heard in the background. After some time, you can hear the gunshots and then the screaming stops. Who does that indicate was screaming?...

^ Agree with ulukinatme. The prosecution keeps saying this, but if this is their strongest argument, it's going to be a tough row to hoe.

It cuts both ways -- you would probably stop screaming if you got shot (although not necessarily), but you would also stop screaming if you shot your attacker and they just slumped over on you.

I think most of the Prosecution's case centers around the claim that the screaming on the 911 call is Martin, and without their "experts" they have to keep repeating this argument as if it's air-tight. But it's not -- I mean, it's not a bad argument, but there's certainly reasonable doubt.

 

[Wild Bill]

No it's not. White people were never in chains having to call someone "massa", denied the vote and on and on. There is no equivalent for whites because they have always enjoyed a position of power and privalege n this country relative to people of Native, African and Meso-American descent.

I'm white and I've never enjoyed a position of power or privilege. I must have been skipped at the hospital when they were passing out bags of gold to the white babies.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

I'm white and I've never enjoyed a position of power or privilege. I must have been skipped at the hospital when they were passing out bags of gold to the white babies.

The "White Privilege" you enjoy is supposedly an abstract benefit that can't be quantified or measured. It's positioned that way so it can't ever be disproven, regardless of how poor or disadvantaged a particular white person is.

Thus, it's at best unscientific, and at worst dogma.

Falsifiability - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[FLDomer]

An attorney for Martin’s family, meanwhile, suddenly declared Thursday that the high-profile case was not about race.
“It’s not about racial profiling,” Daryl Parks told reporters. “He was profiled (criminally). George Zimmerman profiled him.”
Parks made the comments after prosecutors spent several days arguing that Zimmerman profiled the 17-year-old specifically because he was black. Asked why he changed his take on the matter, Parks replied: “We never claimed this was about race.”


Witness to Zimmerman-Martin confrontation says person on bottom had "lighter skin color" | Fox News