NorthDakota
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Holy shit you just shot him on 5th Ave. The man has a family!!!
Everything Soccer
- Thread starter IHateMarkMay
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Holy shit you just shot him on 5th Ave. The man has a family!!!
notredomer23
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CTIDANDREW
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This is good for the sport though, in my opinion.
In the early 10's City was chasing United and toppled them, and then got complacent in my opinion. Just look at the transfers they made the summer after that first title they won.
Jack Rodwell 12m
Scott Sinclair 6.2m
Javi Garcia 17m
They allowed SAF to ride out into the sunset with one last title, by letting United get Robin Van Persie, because of contract demands City did not want to meet.
Liverpool should learn from our mistake. They toppled City, now they should be trying to stick a fork in them...not haggling over a few million for Thiago. Great teams always need reinforcements to stay great, it is the nature of the sport.
NorthDakota
Grandson of Loomis
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Klopp has his own way of doing things. I'm curious to see what he identifies as areas we need help and who can provide that help.
He's went back-to-back before in a league containing FC f'ing Bayern so I'm confident he understands how it all works.
It'll be fun. I'm really interested to see how Liverpool work as a club now over the next several years. They got the monkey off their back, and hopefully that provides some freedom. In the past, its always been a bit like being a Notre Dame fan, "how am I going to recover from this devastating loss that hasn't even happened yet?"
Hopefully this year is an exciting title race again.
P.S. Premier League is gonna be lit now that Leeds is back. If anyone hasn't watched "The Damned United" I'd strongly recommend it.
CTIDANDREW
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Fair enough, and I have great respect for Klopp.
Two things I will say.
Liverpool have been very fortunate with injuries the past two seasons. You and other Liverpool fans know better then me, but I am not aware of many of their big time players missing any big chunks of the season other then Allison (still played 29 PL games) & Matip. If say Van Dijk, Salah, Henderson, or Mane miss say three-four months next season it could be difficult for them.
Manchester City greatly missed Laporte (15 PL games), Sane (1 PL game), and Aguero (24 PL games) this season. I get they are the most expensive team in the world, but some injuries expose cracks that no amount of money could fix.
Lastly, it is always easier to be the one chasing, then the one being chased. There is a reason it is one of the hardest leagues in the world to win back to back...and I am excited to see how Liverpool deal with the challenge.
Rogue219
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Liverpool have invested in the back room staff. They have great physio people and nutrionists, which might be why the players have remained fit overall. The Fenway Sports Group do things a certain way and so does Klopp. They're not just going to spend for the sake of doing it or throw money at a weak spot. Klopp is a gifted sales person. A massive reason why Van Dijk and Allison came was because of Klopp. I'm sure there are better tactical managers, but his players LOVE him everywhere he has been. Boot Room harmony is key to his structure.
I think Messi wants Bartomeu out and if that happens, he'll pull a 180 and stay. Bartomeu either gets sacked or resigns.
This all depends on if Messi can walk or Barca is due a fee. He had until June 10 to opt out of his contract but due to Covid that never happened due to the season going into summer. If this drags out long enough, it would have to go to court and he could wind up leaving on a free.
Don't underestimate Inter Milan if he leaves on a free. He has family connections there and his family tree plays a role in it too. They obviously can't afford the transfer fee, but if he has a chance to walk on a free it might be there.
Way too many moving parts right now.
I think Messi wants Bartomeu out and if that happens, he'll pull a 180 and stay. Bartomeu either gets sacked or resigns.
This all depends on if Messi can walk or Barca is due a fee. He had until June 10 to opt out of his contract but due to Covid that never happened due to the season going into summer. If this drags out long enough, it would have to go to court and he could wind up leaving on a free.
Don't underestimate Inter Milan if he leaves on a free. He has family connections there and his family tree plays a role in it too. They obviously can't afford the transfer fee, but if he has a chance to walk on a free it might be there.
Way too many moving parts right now.
dublinirish
Everestt Gholstonson
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Messi forcing out the president and then Koeman (to be replaced by Xavi) would be very on brand for him right now. Barca needs to ship him out and move on
Cackalacky2.0
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I read an article recently that said that Messi was heavily involved with team decisions and he was consulted by the team as regards transfers and other important team decisions. At some point the club stopped consulting him regarding decisions and I think the Neymar to PSG was one.
Also, he attempted to force Barca to bring Neymar back. The club did try but ultimately failed and Messi said he wasnt consulted or apart of decisions the led to Neymar remaining at PSG. He also said (Neymar did too) that Barca didnt do enough to get him back. The club said they did everything they could. Then Barca fired the coach and hired Quique. They again did so without Messi's input or approval and the team pretty much quit on club after this. The article said that even the most quiet of the team got into heated arguments with Quique. They again didnt consult Messi on the Koeman hire so he is out.
Its hard to believe Messi had that much pull only to be dismissed recently. Sounds like Barthmeu is the real problem. Koeman is a terrible hire btw.
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Here's a decent article via ESPN that ranks Messi's likely landing spots.
Irish YJ
Southsida
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Given his Italian ancestry, hope it's Internazionale or Juventus. It would be cool though to see him go to a lesser Serie A team. And even cooler if he followed Maradona's path (from Barcelona to Napoli).
If not, love to see him go to Bayern, but not sure of the fit there. The section on Muller was pretty cool/interesting.
phillyirish
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Bayern is probably the last place I’d like to see him, that team might go undefeated. Him playing with Ronaldo at Juve seems too foreign to comprehend, but it might be pretty cool. Although, it is definitely poetic for him to go to another club in Italy because of the ancestral connection, as you pointed out, and to continue his career rivalry with Ronaldo.
Irish YJ
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I'd be happy anywhere in the Bundesliga or Serie A to be honest. After that, anywhere but the EPL. Won't happen, but I'd be OK with Cymru Premier, Scottish Premiership, Or Irish Premier lol.
At Juve with Ronaldo would be very interesting. I think I'd rather see him though at one of the other Italian clubs just to raise the league competition. Preferably one of the Milan teams, or Napoli. Napoli fans would be off the hook crazy like they were in the 80s when Maradona signed.
Rogue219
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Being Lionel Messi
By Rory Smith
New York Times
August 28, 2020
The road snakes up and out of Castelldefels, away from the hubbub of the town center, away from the beach, into the hills. The houses grow larger with every turn. Basketball hoops are replaced by full-sized courts. Perfectly manicured gardens roll down the slopes. Blooms of bougainvillea pour over walls. Lionel Messi’s place is the last one on the left.
It is not his only property in Catalonia — Messi also owns the house in Gava Mar where his parents live, and he has an apartment in the city’s exclusive Pedralbes district, too — but Castelldefels has long been home. It is, he has said, the “ideal” place to live: the sea, the beach, the mountains, the peace and quiet of a pretty but unassuming resort town.
It is here that he and his wife, Antonella, have raised their three children. Friends live close by: He often carpools to training or to games with his neighbor, Luis Suárez. There are shops selling Argentine groceries. A handful of favored restaurants, down near the shore, know that when a certain friend calls, it means Messi is coming. They know to ask diners not to trouble him while he eats, but that he will be happy to pose for photos on his way out.
This is what Messi was giving up on Tuesday when he and his representatives sent Barcelona official confirmation of his intention to leave the club. He is not just ending a relationship with the club that spans two decades, that has seen him transformed from a 13-year-old kid signed on a contract written on the back of a napkin into, arguably, the finest player soccer has ever seen.
He is not just breaking a bond between player and team that has come to seem symbiotic. Barcelona is not Barcelona without Messi. But would Messi be Messi without Barcelona? He lifted this team to greatness, this club to unmatched prominence, but the converse was also true for a long time: Barcelona was not just his platform, his stage, it was a character in his story.
Those are all sacrifices enough, of course, but it is the prospect of leaving Castelldefels that best illustrates how serious Messi is, how desperate he must feel the situation has become, how much anger he has built up. He is not just prepared to give up his employer, to trade one jersey for another. He is prepared to walk away from the life he has built.
How it has come to this is well-documented. Barcelona, a few years ago, was soccer’s gold standard: an empire that seemed destined to reign for a thousand years, or whatever elite sport’s equivalent of forever might be.
Now, it is fallen, the legacy of that great team of Messi and Andres Iniesta and Xavi Hernández shredded and squandered by dreadful recruitment, short-term vision and rampant self-interest.
When the news broke that Messi had asked to leave, his former captain Carles Puyol — a Barcelona icon — supported the player over the club. Suárez and Arturo Vidal, both already informed they were no longer required at Camp Nou, did so, too. Fans marched to the team’s headquarters and demanded the resignation of the current board, the group of executives who will now forever be marked as the people who pushed out the greatest player of all time.
Barcelona is a broken place, and the sympathy is with Messi. No wonder he has had enough. Though it is difficult to imagine him in another jersey, another set of colors, and though there might be sorrow — not just felt in Barcelona — at the thought of player and club going their separate ways, he owes it to himself to look elsewhere, to find a club where he can have the golden autumn to his career that he deserves.
That could be Manchester City, most likely, for a reunion with Pep Guardiola, the player and coach who brought out the best in each other; or Paris St.-Germain, maybe, where he could play once again with Neymar; or even Inter Milan, the club that has, more than any other, positioned itself as his first reserve, his break-glass-in-case-of-emergency option. Those teams might be able to match his ambition, to deliver him the fifth Champions League crown he craves.
It is not to delegitimize that orthodoxy to suggest it is not an entirely comprehensive picture. More than one thing can be true at once. For instance: Barcelona has, quite clearly, been appallingly run for some time; its executives merit most, if not all, of the abuse being hurled in their direction.
And yet, for all that Messi has — with reason — demanded the squad around him be strengthened, it is not quite that easy. Barcelona has the most expensive salary bill in soccer. It has boasted of being closer than any team to reaching annual revenue of 1 billion euros, but almost all of that is consumed by the salaries it pays its stars.
Messi alone accounts for a remarkable portion of that, and has, it goes without saying, provided ample value to justify it. But to overhaul the team, to revolutionize it, players would have to leave. Not fringe players or youth players, but players like Suárez and Vidal and Ivan Rakitic.
That is difficult enough, given the lack of peers who might match their salaries, but until the last week or so — and the aftermath of a humiliating defeat against Bayern Munich — the club felt it was politically impossible, too.
That could have been because it had been warned those kinds of changes would not be welcomed by Messi, or because it had intuited they would not be welcomed by Messi. It is impossible to know for sure — it is intriguing that Messi’s decision came after Suárez and Vidal had been told they would be allowed to leave — but regardless, the effect is much the same.
Barcelona has been trapped, in other words, in an impossible conundrum: How do you rebuild while keeping all of your highest-paid stars? How do you refresh a side and simultaneously retain, and play, many of the same players? To repeat: That does not mean the club’s missteps should be overlooked. But the fact that the board played it badly does not mean it did not have a poor hand.
Messi cannot, of course, be blamed for Barcelona’s demise — a take too hot to be taken seriously — but it is tempting to wonder if, to some extent, this sort of denouement was inevitable.
There is a price to be paid for the privilege of experiencing greatness: Clubs fortunate enough to have an iconic manager always spend a period in the wilderness as they try to replace them. Teams that enjoy heady days with one generation of players generally struggle to identify their successors. That is written somewhere in soccer’s hidden coding. It is part of its algorithm.
Such is Messi’s greatness that the bill arrived not when he left, but while he remained, as the lines blurred between what was in Messi’s interests and what was in the team’s, as the club became so fixated on keeping him happy that it lost sight of what needed to be done to make him happy.
And so, this week, we came to the end. Messi has determined that he must leave, he must go elsewhere, that he can no longer carry this team, this club, on his shoulders. He may find, too, that there is a personal cost to greatness: that wherever he goes, he will never truly escape what came to be known as Messidependencia.
Any club he signs for will shape itself around him. Any team he joins will look to him, first and foremost, to solve problems. He felt Barcelona was no longer the “winning project” he craves. Wherever he goes, he will find that he is expected to do quite a lot of the winning himself. That is the price of being Lionel Messi.
What awaits Barcelona is more daunting still. He has made a choice to find out what he can be without Barcelona; had things been different, it is a question he might never have needed to answer. Barcelona, though, knew this day would come. Perhaps not now, perhaps not like this, but eventually. It must face up to the prospect of what it can be without Messi.
No player, of course, is bigger than a club, but Messi was close. For more than a decade, he has been the team. For more than a decade, he has been a symbol of what Barcelona is, what it stands for, what it means. It was the ideal place for him. It is not any more.
By Rory Smith
New York Times
August 28, 2020
The road snakes up and out of Castelldefels, away from the hubbub of the town center, away from the beach, into the hills. The houses grow larger with every turn. Basketball hoops are replaced by full-sized courts. Perfectly manicured gardens roll down the slopes. Blooms of bougainvillea pour over walls. Lionel Messi’s place is the last one on the left.
It is not his only property in Catalonia — Messi also owns the house in Gava Mar where his parents live, and he has an apartment in the city’s exclusive Pedralbes district, too — but Castelldefels has long been home. It is, he has said, the “ideal” place to live: the sea, the beach, the mountains, the peace and quiet of a pretty but unassuming resort town.
It is here that he and his wife, Antonella, have raised their three children. Friends live close by: He often carpools to training or to games with his neighbor, Luis Suárez. There are shops selling Argentine groceries. A handful of favored restaurants, down near the shore, know that when a certain friend calls, it means Messi is coming. They know to ask diners not to trouble him while he eats, but that he will be happy to pose for photos on his way out.
This is what Messi was giving up on Tuesday when he and his representatives sent Barcelona official confirmation of his intention to leave the club. He is not just ending a relationship with the club that spans two decades, that has seen him transformed from a 13-year-old kid signed on a contract written on the back of a napkin into, arguably, the finest player soccer has ever seen.
He is not just breaking a bond between player and team that has come to seem symbiotic. Barcelona is not Barcelona without Messi. But would Messi be Messi without Barcelona? He lifted this team to greatness, this club to unmatched prominence, but the converse was also true for a long time: Barcelona was not just his platform, his stage, it was a character in his story.
Those are all sacrifices enough, of course, but it is the prospect of leaving Castelldefels that best illustrates how serious Messi is, how desperate he must feel the situation has become, how much anger he has built up. He is not just prepared to give up his employer, to trade one jersey for another. He is prepared to walk away from the life he has built.
How it has come to this is well-documented. Barcelona, a few years ago, was soccer’s gold standard: an empire that seemed destined to reign for a thousand years, or whatever elite sport’s equivalent of forever might be.
Now, it is fallen, the legacy of that great team of Messi and Andres Iniesta and Xavi Hernández shredded and squandered by dreadful recruitment, short-term vision and rampant self-interest.
When the news broke that Messi had asked to leave, his former captain Carles Puyol — a Barcelona icon — supported the player over the club. Suárez and Arturo Vidal, both already informed they were no longer required at Camp Nou, did so, too. Fans marched to the team’s headquarters and demanded the resignation of the current board, the group of executives who will now forever be marked as the people who pushed out the greatest player of all time.
Barcelona is a broken place, and the sympathy is with Messi. No wonder he has had enough. Though it is difficult to imagine him in another jersey, another set of colors, and though there might be sorrow — not just felt in Barcelona — at the thought of player and club going their separate ways, he owes it to himself to look elsewhere, to find a club where he can have the golden autumn to his career that he deserves.
That could be Manchester City, most likely, for a reunion with Pep Guardiola, the player and coach who brought out the best in each other; or Paris St.-Germain, maybe, where he could play once again with Neymar; or even Inter Milan, the club that has, more than any other, positioned itself as his first reserve, his break-glass-in-case-of-emergency option. Those teams might be able to match his ambition, to deliver him the fifth Champions League crown he craves.
It is not to delegitimize that orthodoxy to suggest it is not an entirely comprehensive picture. More than one thing can be true at once. For instance: Barcelona has, quite clearly, been appallingly run for some time; its executives merit most, if not all, of the abuse being hurled in their direction.
And yet, for all that Messi has — with reason — demanded the squad around him be strengthened, it is not quite that easy. Barcelona has the most expensive salary bill in soccer. It has boasted of being closer than any team to reaching annual revenue of 1 billion euros, but almost all of that is consumed by the salaries it pays its stars.
Messi alone accounts for a remarkable portion of that, and has, it goes without saying, provided ample value to justify it. But to overhaul the team, to revolutionize it, players would have to leave. Not fringe players or youth players, but players like Suárez and Vidal and Ivan Rakitic.
That is difficult enough, given the lack of peers who might match their salaries, but until the last week or so — and the aftermath of a humiliating defeat against Bayern Munich — the club felt it was politically impossible, too.
That could have been because it had been warned those kinds of changes would not be welcomed by Messi, or because it had intuited they would not be welcomed by Messi. It is impossible to know for sure — it is intriguing that Messi’s decision came after Suárez and Vidal had been told they would be allowed to leave — but regardless, the effect is much the same.
Barcelona has been trapped, in other words, in an impossible conundrum: How do you rebuild while keeping all of your highest-paid stars? How do you refresh a side and simultaneously retain, and play, many of the same players? To repeat: That does not mean the club’s missteps should be overlooked. But the fact that the board played it badly does not mean it did not have a poor hand.
Messi cannot, of course, be blamed for Barcelona’s demise — a take too hot to be taken seriously — but it is tempting to wonder if, to some extent, this sort of denouement was inevitable.
There is a price to be paid for the privilege of experiencing greatness: Clubs fortunate enough to have an iconic manager always spend a period in the wilderness as they try to replace them. Teams that enjoy heady days with one generation of players generally struggle to identify their successors. That is written somewhere in soccer’s hidden coding. It is part of its algorithm.
Such is Messi’s greatness that the bill arrived not when he left, but while he remained, as the lines blurred between what was in Messi’s interests and what was in the team’s, as the club became so fixated on keeping him happy that it lost sight of what needed to be done to make him happy.
And so, this week, we came to the end. Messi has determined that he must leave, he must go elsewhere, that he can no longer carry this team, this club, on his shoulders. He may find, too, that there is a personal cost to greatness: that wherever he goes, he will never truly escape what came to be known as Messidependencia.
Any club he signs for will shape itself around him. Any team he joins will look to him, first and foremost, to solve problems. He felt Barcelona was no longer the “winning project” he craves. Wherever he goes, he will find that he is expected to do quite a lot of the winning himself. That is the price of being Lionel Messi.
What awaits Barcelona is more daunting still. He has made a choice to find out what he can be without Barcelona; had things been different, it is a question he might never have needed to answer. Barcelona, though, knew this day would come. Perhaps not now, perhaps not like this, but eventually. It must face up to the prospect of what it can be without Messi.
No player, of course, is bigger than a club, but Messi was close. For more than a decade, he has been the team. For more than a decade, he has been a symbol of what Barcelona is, what it stands for, what it means. It was the ideal place for him. It is not any more.
Rogue219
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Wouldn't laugh at the thought of Messi joining Inter Milan. Seems more plausible than we gave it credit for at the start fo the week.
I get a Rory Smith email every Friday. Great morning reading each week. Free and worth the time.
I get a Rory Smith email every Friday. Great morning reading each week. Free and worth the time.
Cackalacky2.0
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The more I think of it why would a 33 yo GOAT go to the most physically demanding league in the world. Serie A seems more of a fit IMO
Rogue219
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Spanish lawyer Francisco Dominguez.
Multiple law experts and attorneys from Spain have weighed in on this. Getting out on a free is going to be difficult for Messi to accomplish.
Barca could sue him along with whatever club signs him, and they that shall not be named already won one big court case this year, if that winds up being his desination. (My apologies, but that's just a fucking fact I can't help).
Could be a big legal battle or Messi is using this as leverage to get people to resign.
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CTIDANDREW
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I would be very surprised if City and Messi find a way to do this for free.
Mainly being, Pep still loves Barca more then all...and the last thing he would want to do as well as Txiki (Director of Football) & Soriano (CEO) is screw them over and ruin the relationship forever.
In the scenario that Messi goes to City, City will likely sell a few players to help pay for 100m fee that is being floated around.
(Stones, Angelino, Eric Garcia,) would probably collectively get them close to 80m
That is just a guess, I have only seen rumors on Angelino & Eric Garcia as of now.
Regardless, with FFP rules being restricted for the season because of COVID, it is really this season or never for Messi to move because his wages will be massive...so we shall see in the coming days if he really wants this or not. It is going to be high drama, no matter what happens.
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dublinirish
Everestt Gholstonson
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Matt Doherty to Spurs for 15 mil is so cheap.
NDohio
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Yep - that's a great deal. Should make it easier to let Aurier go for a smaller fee - except for Levy being a cheapskate...
Cackalacky2.0
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The current scenes from Bayern/Barca/LFC offices waiting for the first move...<br><br>Brilliant ��<br><br> <a href="https://t.co/jf9RaY6kPE">pic.twitter.com/jf9RaY6kPE</a></p>— Watch LFC (@Watch_LFC) <a href="https://twitter.com/Watch_LFC/status/1300769457900589057?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 1, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Wait for it
Wait for it
Rogue219
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Watched the first two episodes of Amazon All or Nothing Tottenham.
If this keeps up, I may wind up liking Jose Mourinho. Wonder if he's different in front of these cameras compared to when he speaks to the media.
To Dele Ali: "Maybe inside yourself, you tell me to fuck off."
If this keeps up, I may wind up liking Jose Mourinho. Wonder if he's different in front of these cameras compared to when he speaks to the media.
To Dele Ali: "Maybe inside yourself, you tell me to fuck off."
NorthDakota
Grandson of Loomis
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I really enjoyed Jose as an analyst. He didn't seem to say much but he was amusing.
Huntr
24 Karat Shamrock
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As with all things from that guy, there are more details that clarify the situation.
From 23JUL:
China’s State TV Demotes English Soccer Amid Spat With U.K.
That article says they got demoted from the main broadcast channel in China and only speculates as to why.
But then there is today's news:
Premier League cancels £564m Chinese TV contract in blow to clubs' finances
So, no, it's not because of "human rights violations," it's money. The EPL was demoted from the main channel due to a pissing match over Huawei. When play was suspended in March due to the pandemic, PPTV withheld payment of the fees. so the EPL said screw it and left.
Travis is a liar. Never forget that.
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GowerND11
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Good on them
Irish YJ
Southsida
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To be fair, the UK has taken one of the hardest lines with China in the last year of any nation. They're pissed about HK (China is violating the 97 agreement to hand it back), Huawei, and the Uighurs. It's not just Huawei, and it's not just money. The EPL might be caught up in the back and forth, but there's a lot of UK folks that are unhappy. There have been several anti-China protests at EPL games. The UK even launched their very own Magnitsky-like act to sanction Chinese individuals and companies.
<iframe width="500" height="300" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/KcNzs7oQHDY" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
dublinirish
Everestt Gholstonson
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love how the american right is all up in arms about the plight of the Uighur, but Muslims drowning in the Mediterranean?? Yeah fuck em 2000 more