Everything Soccer

[NorthDakota]

Agree. It's the North Dakota of soccer leagues.

Sit down.

 

[NDRock]

Sit down.

Makes sense. I’ve seen the women from that state. I’d need a lot of beer also.

 

[Rocket89]

It's a top ten in the world league now dude... which considering where it was 15 years ago is astonishing...

Top 10? MLS is probably closer to 20th.

La Liga
EPL
Bundesliga
Serie A
Ligue 1
Primeira Liga
Eredivisie
Russian Premier League
Super Lig
Swiss Super League
Superliga
Brasilerao
Liga MX

I'd put all of these leagues comfortably ahead while all of the Big 5 second-tier leagues ahead, as well.

 

[Emcee77]

Indiana's place on that list kind of shocks me.

I don't know, I wouldn't be surprised to see Zlatan make a little noise in MLS. As a penalty-box-lurking #9, he can be effective even with limited mobility (unlike, for example, Stevie G ... once the legs go, you can no longer be a box-to-box midfielder, and Stevie was never really able to reinvent himself as anything else), and his finishing is absolutely lethal. Zlatan is a fitness freak who has a reputation for working harder on his conditioning than anyone. I expect to see him score some goals.

And that's not at all to trash the MLS competition level. Is it the Premier League or Bundesliga? Of course not, but I have read/heard where numerous European-based soccer commentators have recognized that it's a good league.

I've said for a long time that Italy need Giovinco in their national side and it's sad if anti-MLS bias is keeping him out.

 

[NorthDakota]

Makes sense. I’ve seen the women from that state. I’d need a lot of beer also.

We also have the reigning Miss USA.

 

[DomerInHappyValley]

I'm glad to see Ibra come to the MLS.

I'll be even happier when the MLS is no longer seen as a final large pay day for players who can't hack it in Europe anymore.

The ultimate for me would be an MLS team winning CONCACAF.

 

[ACamp1900]

I'm glad to see Ibra come to the MLS.

I'll be even happier when the MLS is no longer seen as a final large pay day for players who can't hack it in Europe anymore.

The ultimate for me would be an MLS team winning CONCACAF.

MLS was starting to dominate it... then they changed the calander to benefit liga...

 

[ACamp1900]

I am looking forward to the LA game next weekend....

 

[notredomer23]

I'm glad to see Ibra come to the MLS.

I'll be even happier when the MLS is no longer seen as a final large pay day for players who can't hack it in Europe anymore.

The ultimate for me would be an MLS team winning CONCACAF.

Likely to happen this year with Toronto just beating Tigres and Red Bull’s destroying Tijuana in the quarterfinals.

 

[notredomer23]

Top 10? MLS is probably closer to 20th.

La Liga
EPL
Bundesliga
Serie A
Ligue 1
Primeira Liga
Eredivisie
Russian Premier League
Super Lig
Swiss Super League
Superliga
Brasilerao
Liga MX

I'd put all of these leagues comfortably ahead while all of the Big 5 second-tier leagues ahead, as well.

Replace Swiss Super League with MLS and Superliga (guessing Denmark?) with Argentina and there is your top 10. 20th maybe 10 years ago. Hard to say Liga Mx is top 10 and MLS is maybe top 20 when our best MLS teams just owned the best Liga Mx teams.

English Championship is top 10 top quality too. Might be ahead of Argentina.

 

[notredomer23]

I get I have to defend MLS as a NYCFC season ticket holder, but seriously. Turn on any match that does not include the Rapids, Revs, or Minnesota and you are looking at a better, more exciting match than West Brom-Stoke.

 

[Rocket89]

Replace Swiss Super League with MLS and Superliga (guessing Denmark?) with Argentina and there is your top 10. 20th maybe 10 years ago. Hard to say Liga Mx is top 10 and MLS is maybe top 20 when our best MLS teams just owned the best Liga Mx teams.

English Championship is top 10 top quality too. Might be ahead of Argentina.

My list included the Argentinian Superliga.

MLS is not close to Top 10. In the 15th to 18th range maybe if you favor entertainment over talent. A few games against Mexican teams don't prove that much. If that was THE measuring stick let's at least see an American team win a Champions League title one time in the modern era before making a bunch of declarations.

 

[ACamp1900]

Kind of hard to take you serious when you say it isn't close... it's arguable, MAYBE, but they are usually ranked in the top ten these days when you see these lists and such... it's not some crazy statement, and it's growing/climbing faster than any league anywhere... this should be a good thing, not some idea that is met with scorn by American soccer fans.

 

[ACamp1900]

New USA kits....

https://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2018/3/23/17157312/closer-look-new-usa-uswnt-usmnt-kits

Eh, not terrible, the Where's Waldo kits should be the reg unis imo... those were so great. I'm not a fan of completely changing the look every cycle. No one will remember these anyway though with them being worn during a World Cup we aren't a part of...

 

[Rocket89]

Kind of hard to take you serious when you say it isn't close... it's arguable, MAYBE, but they are usually ranked in the top ten these days when you see these lists and such... it's not some crazy statement, and it's growing/climbing faster than any league anywhere... this should be a good thing, not some idea that is met with scorn by American soccer fans.

Of course MLS is growing that is plainly obvious. I'm agnostic about the league so I don't really care either way. I'm just pointing out calling it a Top 10 league in the world really isn't based in any concrete evidence. But you're right, there are a few clickbait articles that say MLS is in the Top 10.

1) The bulk of the top scorers and all-stars are past their prime, or over 30 years old. This is arguably a larger problem for MLS today than it was 5-7 years ago.

2) Zlatan easing his way into retirement with a 95% pay cut is evidence MLS is not a top-tier league.

3) A lack of promising young talent isn't befit of a top 10 league. This is made even worse with point #1 above. The top young MLS players right now are worth ~$3 million or so on the open market. Compared to say a bottom of the Top 10 league like the Eredivisie the contrast in talented youth is enormous.

4) The league is growing within North America (attendance, especially) but arguably is expanding too quickly with more clubs and diluting its product.

5) Many of the financials surrounding MLS are terrible and will prevent it from taking the next step as a league--see Cyle Larin walking away to Besiktas for mere peanuts. Until this changes there is ceiling for the league, which I'd argue, they are fast approaching on a global competition comparison.

6) Using FiveThirtyEight's global club rankings the top MLS team, Toronto FC, comes in at #213 sandwiched between Argentinos Juniors (currently 11th in the Argentinian league) and Brentford (currently 11th in the Championship). There are only 4 MLS teams in the top 300 world rankings. For leagues in the conversation on the Top 10 fringe there are 5 Mexican, 6 Dutch, 15 Argentinian, 4 English Championship, 7 Turkish, and 10 La Liga 2 clubs all ranked ahead of Toronto.

I think most Americans who follow soccer closely know the MLS isn't a top 10 league and that it'll take more than 20 years to approach that level. It could take another 30 years and that's not a knock on the MLS as much as it is respect to the other leagues that are operating in better systems, with more history and more talent.

 

[ACamp1900]

Agree to disagree then, I’m proud of the MLS, am confident in calling it a top ten league and highly enjoy its product... I’ll just leave ut at that.

 

[notredomer23]

Of course MLS is growing that is plainly obvious. I'm agnostic about the league so I don't really care either way. I'm just pointing out calling it a Top 10 league in the world really isn't based in any concrete evidence. But you're right, there are a few clickbait articles that say MLS is in the Top 10.

1) The bulk of the top scorers and all-stars are past their prime, or over 30 years old. This is arguably a larger problem for MLS today than it was 5-7 years ago.

2) Zlatan easing his way into retirement with a 95% pay cut is evidence MLS is not a top-tier league.

3) A lack of promising young talent isn't befit of a top 10 league. This is made even worse with point #1 above. The top young MLS players right now are worth ~$3 million or so on the open market. Compared to say a bottom of the Top 10 league like the Eredivisie the contrast in talented youth is enormous.

4) The league is growing within North America (attendance, especially) but arguably is expanding too quickly with more clubs and diluting its product.

5) Many of the financials surrounding MLS are terrible and will prevent it from taking the next step as a league--see Cyle Larin walking away to Besiktas for mere peanuts. Until this changes there is ceiling for the league, which I'd argue, they are fast approaching on a global competition comparison.

6) Using FiveThirtyEight's global club rankings the top MLS team, Toronto FC, comes in at #213 sandwiched between Argentinos Juniors (currently 11th in the Argentinian league) and Brentford (currently 11th in the Championship). There are only 4 MLS teams in the top 300 world rankings. For leagues in the conversation on the Top 10 fringe there are 5 Mexican, 6 Dutch, 15 Argentinian, 4 English Championship, 7 Turkish, and 10 La Liga 2 clubs all ranked ahead of Toronto.

I think most Americans who follow soccer closely know the MLS isn't a top 10 league and that it'll take more than 20 years to approach that level. It could take another 30 years and that's not a knock on the MLS as much as it is respect to the other leagues that are operating in better systems, with more history and more talent.

1. Wrong. The average age of the golden boot winner going back to 2012 is 28, which I suspect is about the average for any league. This year that trend will continue barring injury with Josef Martinez.
2. To me that shows the league’s progress. 5 years ago they’d give him a 20 million dollar contract.
3. This is also wrong. These are outdated narratives. In the last year alone MLS has sold young players to Barcelona and Manchester City and as you state begrudgingly to Besikitas just to name a couple. RBNY just turned down a transfer offer from Dortmund for Tyler Adams and Atlanta turned down a 25 million offer from Arsenal for Almiron. NYC turned down an offer from Sevilla for Villa.
4. I won’t argue this one. I don’t think new clubs are the problem though, I think it is old ones such as the Rapids and Revs.
5. Disagree with your first point that the financials are terrible but the overall single entity league structure holding it back I do agree with.
6. 538’s formula can’t be used for a new league like MLS and honestly it’s pretty awful for soccer as a whole.

I can see MLS being just outside the top 10 but it’s hard to accruately gauge because MLS now is a completely different stratosphere than even 4 years ago. For instance, I think MLS has surpassed Liga MX this year. I think they’ve surpassed Argentina because MLS is pillaging their league for any promising young talent. In fact Argentina’s league is in deep deep financial trouble but that’s a whole other topic in and of itself. Will those trends continue? It sure seems MLS will continue to rise.

 

[Rocket89]

1. Wrong. The average age of the golden boot winner going back to 2012 is 28, which I suspect is about the average for any league. This year that trend will continue barring injury with Josef Martinez.
2. To me that shows the league’s progress. 5 years ago they’d give him a 20 million dollar contract.
3. This is also wrong. These are outdated narratives. In the last year alone MLS has sold young players to Barcelona and Manchester City and as you state begrudgingly to Besikitas just to name a couple. RBNY just turned down a transfer offer from Dortmund for Tyler Adams and Atlanta turned down a 25 million offer from Arsenal for Almiron. NYC turned down an offer from Sevilla for Villa.
4. I won’t argue this one. I don’t think new clubs are the problem though, I think it is old ones such as the Rapids and Revs.
5. Disagree with your first point that the financials are terrible but the overall single entity league structure holding it back I do agree with.
6. 538’s formula can’t be used for a new league like MLS and honestly it’s pretty awful for soccer as a whole.

I can see MLS being just outside the top 10 but it’s hard to accruately gauge because MLS now is a completely different stratosphere than even 4 years ago. For instance, I think MLS has surpassed Liga MX this year. I think they’ve surpassed Argentina because MLS is pillaging their league for any promising young talent. In fact Argentina’s league is in deep deep financial trouble but that’s a whole other topic in and of itself. Will those trends continue? It sure seems MLS will continue to rise.

1. 16 players from the 2017 All-Star team were 30 or older. The top 3 scorers and 6 out of the top 10 scorers were 30 or older. Things are looking better this year, though. Things may be changing slowly but it isn't Top 10 good yet in this department.

2. True, if you could prove a negative ($20 million deal) but in reality it doesn't help the narrative that MLS is still the retirement home for aging Euro stars where PR > soccer.

3. Outside of Almiron--which is subject to the wild west of transfer speculation--has any MLS young player grabbed a large transfer fee and walked into a 1st division Top 5-ish league club 1st team? Sure, Man City signed Jack Harrison for $5.6 million then loaned him to Middlesbrough. If this was one of a dozen transfers and not the tip of the pyramid then it'd make MLS look more like a top 10 league.

Partly agree with your last paragraph. Although, pillaging South American talent while not doing a great job with home-grown talent has its own disadvantages when combined with the league financial structure, different calendar, etc.

 

[fightingirish26]

the narrative that MLS is still the retirement home for aging Euro stars where PR > soccer.

tbf this feels like more of an LA galaxy/NYCFC problem than an MLS problem nowadays (in general). plus, i kind of love when players like pirlo and gerrard come over here and struggle, not because i hate them, but because it will make players think twice about coming here and expecting a cakewalk. although, i won't complain if stars come over and perform like David Villa. he'd do well in every single league in the world to this day.

 

[IrishLion]

So LAFC ain’t no joke. They are very entertaining to watch.

 

[ACamp1900]

So LAFC ain’t no joke. They are very entertaining to watch.

I want to hate them, but always liked Bradley.... I'm a LAG fan tho.

 

[ACamp1900]

I super miss Arena... hasn’t been the same.

 

[ACamp1900]

Lletget needs to step up....

 

[ACamp1900]

Screw this noise, on to the Angels game... the wheels fell off LAG so quickly there and they can't seem to get back up... I'm not a Sigi fan, at all.

 

[ACamp1900]

I lied, I kept watching.... lolololol


Go LAG!!! Lol

 

[IrishLion]

I hope you stuck it out ACamp...

Holy shit Zlatan.

 

[ACamp1900]

Irba's first goal....

Wow

 

[IrishLion]

That shit cray.

Kind of reminded me of that Bradley goal vs Mexico

 

[ACamp1900]

I hope you stuck it out ACamp...

Holy shit Zlatan.

Yeah I kept flipping back n forth, saw two of the three goals...

 

[IrishLion]

This game has gone full HAM