COVID-19

[sixstar]

Just a reminder that vax mandates occurred before any studies on vax impact on fertility. Trials excluded pregnant women.

Mandates were instituted before any long-term safety studies. Or efficacy studies, which is now why some people have had 6 doses.

The shots were approved for kids even though the VRBPAC had no studies showing a positive benefit/risk ratio or long term safety data.

These are, by all definitions, skipping things.

 

[GATTACA!]

Just a reminder that vax mandates occurred before any studies on vax impact on fertility.

Nope

Sperm Parameters Before and After COVID-19 mRNA Vaccination

To address vaccine hesitancy based on concerns about fertility, this study assesses sperm parameters before and after mRNA vaccine administration.

jamanetwork.com

Trials excluded pregnant women.

Nope

ClinicalTrials.gov

www.clinicaltrials.gov

 

[ndfanatic78]

They didn't skip anything. They ran tests concurrently instead of doing them one after another to speed up the process.

https://www.nihb.org/covid-19/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/Fact-sheet-operation-warp-speed.pdf

Ha, over seen by the NIH. An institution totally beholden to the pharmaceutical industry. Isn't that the same institution who has been linked to funding gain of function experiments at the Wuhan Institute of Virology. I really don't trust them very much at all. Why dont you listen to Dr. Malone on the subject, actual question? He is an actual virologist who pioneered the mRNA technology and believed they followed proper protocols only to find out they lied. He had nothing to gain from coming out as he has and actually lost a LOT.

 

[greyhammer90]

Ha, over seen by the NIH. An institution totally beholden to the pharmaceutical industry. Isn't that the same institution who has been linked to funding gain of function experiments at the Wuhan Institute of Virology. I really don't trust them very much at all. Why dont you listen to Dr. Malone on the subject, actual question? He is an actual virologist who pioneered the mRNA technology and believed they followed proper protocols only to find out they lied. He had nothing to gain from coming out as he has and actually lost a LOT.

We've gone from "they skipped critical testing" to "You can't trust the people who ran the tests because we live in a capitalistic society" in about 4 posts.

 

[ndfanatic78]

We've gone from "they skipped critical testing" to "You can't trust the people who ran the tests because we live in a capitalistic society" in about 4 posts.

You can believe they didn't do the accurate testing for more than just "we live in a capitalistic society". Any type of society can be controlled by the oligarchy and every type of society has at some point or another. I am saying you cant believe they did the testing because it has been admitted to in court records in Europe and actual virologists have talked about it. If you believe that the corporations are doing anything other than trying to maximize profits you don't what corporate capitalism means nor do you realize that it is just away for the oligarchs to maintain control.

 

[slick7410]

Nope

ClinicalTrials.gov

www.clinicaltrials.gov

Even if you believe all precautions were taken - don't link b*llshit like this - only 24+ weeks to start was actively recruiting until Sept. 2021. - 9 months after shots began here. Wasn't even announced until Feb 2021.

The simple fact is there wasn't enough time.

My wife was about 2 months pregnant Dec '20 - Jan '21 (son born July '21). At the time, we couldn't find record of anybody in the world that had been given a COVID shot in the first trimester and given birth when it was recommended and offered for her in Michigan. (health care worker -dental) -she didn't do it while pregnant.

There can't really be an argument that "it should be safe" was a risk deemed worthy, right or wrong.

 

[PerthDomer]

How come America had the absolute worst death rates of the entire globe. The richest country in the world with the most expensive well educated doctors and scientists in the world had the absolute worst outcomes. How come ever since the jab the death rate of the healthy has been on the rise. How come the media turned to Bill Gates to get the word out about the vaccine instead of legit virologists who actually did the work and studies. How come they pushed pharmaceutical propaganda instead of the facts about the short cuts taken in producing the jab. How come all the major media outlets lied that the jab would stop transmission. When there was either no conclusive evidence to this or were straight out lies.

We have a high death rate because our population is unhealthy and we were uniquely resistant to public health advice. Death rates/health issues took off with the pandemic and leveled off with rollout of the vaccine. The media leaned on health professionals, not Bill Gates. Bill Gates has been beating the prepare for a pandemic drum for a while because he works in Public Health and worries about big public health issues. He rwD John Barry's book (we had a pandemic preparation policy because GWB read the sane book and got freaked out).

This was a category 2 storm. I expect to see another bad pandemic in the next 30 years if we don't make further scientific progress on zoonoses.

 

[PerthDomer]

Even if you believe all precautions were taken - don't link b*llshit like this - only 24+ weeks to start was actively recruiting until Sept. 2021. - 9 months after shots began here. Wasn't even announced until Feb 2021.

The simple fact is there wasn't enough time.

My wife was about 2 months pregnant Dec '20 - Jan '21 (son born July '21). At the time, we couldn't find record of anybody in the world that had been given a COVID shot in the first trimester and given birth when it was recommended and offered for her in Michigan. (health care worker -dental) -she didn't do it while pregnant.

There can't really be an argument that "it should be safe" was a risk deemed worthy, right or wrong.

In the initial rollout you had to balance risk of infection and risk of vaccine. The vaccine was offered early because of that and we have the data now to show it was the right move.

My co fellow got it 1st trimester within a week of it being rolled out. She did fine.

 

[GATTACA!]

Even if you believe all precautions were taken - don't link b*llshit like this - only 24+ weeks to start was actively recruiting until Sept. 2021. - 9 months after shots began here. Wasn't even announced until Feb 2021.

The simple fact is there wasn't enough time.

My wife was about 2 months pregnant Dec '20 - Jan '21 (son born July '21). At the time, we couldn't find record of anybody in the world that had been given a COVID shot in the first trimester and given birth when it was recommended and offered for her in Michigan. (health care worker -dental) -she didn't do it while pregnant.

There can't really be an argument that "it should be safe" was a risk deemed worthy, right or wrong.

Which is fine and was her choice. My wife and I made the same decision. The original point of this discussion was that the government mandate was put in place before testing was done on pregnant women or on fertility. Both of which aren’t true.

 

[irishog77]

We have a high death rate because our population is unhealthy and we were uniquely resistant to public health advice. Death rates/health issues took off with the pandemic and leveled off with rollout of the vaccine. The media leaned on health professionals, not Bill Gates. Bill Gates has been beating the prepare for a pandemic drum for a while because he works in Public Health and worries about big public health issues. He rwD John Barry's book (we had a pandemic preparation policy because GWB read the sane book and got freaked out).

This was a category 2 storm. I expect to see another bad pandemic in the next 30 years if we don't make further scientific progress on zoonoses.

Yeah, maybe.
But that’s already some revisionist history on your part there. In addition to “public health advice” changing, being unclear, and sometimes flat out being wrong, that same “health advice” didn’t actually follow science sometimes.

And then that same “public health advice” was often more worried about woke messaging than good messaging. Many messages were more worried about fat shaming than actually discussing the perils of obesity. When the black and hispanic populations had dismal vaccination levels, the messages were scared to address this fact, because, well, race.

Don’t try and pretend like the “public health advice” was always good, nor that it was always even about “health.”

 

[RDU Irish]

Yeah, maybe.
But that’s already some revisionist history on your part there. In addition to “public health advice” changing, being unclear, and sometimes flat out being wrong, that same “health advice” didn’t actually follow science sometimes.

And then that same “public health advice” was often more worried about woke messaging than good messaging. Many messages were more worried about fat shaming than actually discussing the perils of obesity. When the black and hispanic populations had dismal vaccination levels, the messages were scared to address this fact, because, well, race.

Don’t try and pretend like the “public health advice” was always good, nor that it was always even about “health.”

Also a significant death "with" Covid overstatement. You get what you pay for.

I still believe we will see a significant "pay it forward" element to death rates. Probably below trend the next few years as the vast majority of Covid "deaths" likely were short for this world in the first place. That assumes we can filter out all of the ODs and suicides from the mental fubar excercise thrust upon our population.

 

[irishog77]

Also a significant death "with" Covid overstatement. You get what you pay for.

I still believe we will see a significant "pay it forward" element to death rates. Probably below trend the next few years as the vast majority of Covid "deaths" likely were short for this world in the first place. That assumes we can filter out all of the ODs and suicides from the mental fubar excercise thrust upon our population.

It’s like we’re now supposed to live in a world where dudes falling off roofs and people getting in motorcycle wrecks, but died of covid, never happened.

 

[RDU Irish]

It’s like we’re now supposed to live in a world where dudes falling off roofs and people getting in motorcycle wrecks, but died of covid, never happened.

All the birthing people testing postive, often with no symptoms, who counted as Covid hospitalizations.

 

[notredomer23]

All the birthing people testing postive, often with no symptoms, who counted as Covid hospitalizations.

Can confirm, this is still happening. Idk if all hospitals are the same but it's cruel what they do to parents. Had a family member that was not able to hold her son for a few days and only got to see him for 30 minutes a day despite being symptom free and was on day 8 of COVID when giving birth. This was May 2022.

 

[RDU Irish]

Can confirm, this is still happening. Idk if all hospitals are the same but it's cruel what they do to parents. Had a family member that was not able to hold her son for a few days and only got to see him for 30 minutes a day despite being symptom free and was on day 8 of COVID when giving birth. This was May 2022.

Supposed to be the happiest unit in the hospital - my wife still has to wear a mask and morale is terrible three years later. Dehumanizing.

 

[ndfanatic78]

We have a high death rate because our population is unhealthy and we were uniquely resistant to public health advice. Death rates/health issues took off with the pandemic and leveled off with rollout of the vaccine. The media leaned on health professionals, not Bill Gates. Bill Gates has been beating the prepare for a pandemic drum for a while because he works in Public Health and worries about big public health issues. He rwD John Barry's book (we had a pandemic preparation policy because GWB read the sane book and got freaked out).

This was a category 2 storm. I expect to see another bad pandemic in the next 30 years if we don't make further scientific progress on zoonoses.

So Bill Gates pushing the vaccine had nothing to do with his personal investment? It's been shown that he gets the publicity he does because he gives millions to news agency to spin his tails. It has been proven that for all his supposed philanthropy he only seems to promote his own companies in which he is either personally invested in or his foundation is invested. He only seems to try to push ideas in which he and his foundation can make profits off of.

I expect a real pandemic, most do, the fact of the matter is that because of how this was handled not many are going to trust the govt when a truly deadly pandemic arrives.

There are plenty of other places in both Europe and South America that have adopted the "western" diet and lack of exercise that plagues Americans that have no where near the mortality rate of the US. Before you go off I am not saying any country is nearly as bad as America diet and exercise wise but there are areas that have increased obesity and diabetes and they don't show the mortality rate of the US. They do however show the spike in deaths, strokes, and heart disease correlating to when the jab started being rolled out.

I believe this is do the fact that other countries used other therapies to treat the disease in which the US refused to and instead waited for a roll out of an experimental "vaccine" which neither prevented people from getting it or prevented transmission which all major news media and medical professionals said it would. Instead now we are told we need to get a "booster" every couple months even though knowing that if you get COVID a natural immunity is better than any vaccine.

 

[yankeehater]

C'mon "6 feet" was rooted in so much science.

 

[GATTACA!]

So Bill Gates pushing the vaccine had nothing to do with his personal investment? It's been shown that he gets the publicity he does because he gives millions to news agency to spin his tails. It has been proven that for all his supposed philanthropy he only seems to promote his own companies in which he is either personally invested in or his foundation is invested. He only seems to try to push ideas in which he and his foundation can make profits off of.

I expect a real pandemic, most do, the fact of the matter is that because of how this was handled not many are going to trust the govt when a truly deadly pandemic arrives.

There are plenty of other places in both Europe and South America that have adopted the "western" diet and lack of exercise that plagues Americans that have no where near the mortality rate of the US. Before you go off I am not saying any country is nearly as bad as America diet and exercise wise but there are areas that have increased obesity and diabetes and they don't show the mortality rate of the US. They do however show the spike in deaths, strokes, and heart disease correlating to when the jab started being rolled out.

I believe this is do the fact that other countries used other therapies to treat the disease in which the US refused to and instead waited for a roll out of an experimental "vaccine" which neither prevented people from getting it or prevented transmission which all major news media and medical professionals said it would. Instead now we are told we need to get a "booster" every couple months even though knowing that if you get COVID a natural immunity is better than any vaccine.

I’d love to see some statistics on any of these claims.

 

[ulukinatme]

Today Colbert, a comedian, is telling the Department of Energy to "stay in their lane" regarding them linking the Wuhan lab to the COVID outbreak. He didn't have a problem when John Stewart was saying it a few years ago though.

 

[TorontoGold]

I’d love to see some statistics on any of these claims.

Just use google! All the very real stats showing the dangers! It's all right there! (Disclaimer - I will make these claims without actually posting the data because...!!)

 

[PerthDomer]

All the birthing people testing postive, often with no symptoms, who counted as Covid hospitalizations.

The best number you have is excess death/mortality. You can't screw with that. Those numbers show serious undercounting early.

In terms of trauma here's a story from Harborview (Seattle's trauma center) early in the pandemic. They separated patients by risk of COVID (clean vs dirty sections of the ED). They had a motor vehicle crash victim who was altered. No respiratory symptoms. Turns out she had a massive stroke that was caused by COVID and developed pneumonia a few days later. COVID caused non pulmonary issues.

After that case they realized you need to isolate everyone. Fortunately the PPE supply ramped up and they were able to.

 

[irishtrain]

?????????

 

[irishff1014]

Today Colbert, a comedian, is telling the Department of Energy to "stay in their lane" regarding them linking the Wuhan lab to the COVID outbreak. He didn't have a problem when John Stewart was saying it a few years ago though.

He was funny before he took this job. Seems like he changed who he was. And now he seems much more political now he works for CBS. Shocker

 

[PerthDomer]

He was funny before he took this job. Seems like he changed who he was. And now he seems much more political now he works for CBS. Shocker

His humor on the Colbert Report was to mercilessly make fun of conservatives by imitating them. If anything he's toned that back to do some interviewing out of his Colbert Report persona. You'd rather he be more partisan?

 

[IRISHDODGER]

His humor on the Colbert Report was to mercilessly make fun of conservatives by imitating them. If anything he's toned that back to do some interviewing out of his Colbert Report persona. You'd rather he be more partisan?

Stewart has done great things for our veterans & 9/11 survivors. I’ll leave it at that.

 

[Irish#1]

He was funny before he took this job. Seems like he changed who he was. And now he seems much more political now he works for CBS. Shocker

That's an understatement.

 

[sixstar]

The original point of this discussion was that the government mandate was put in place before testing was done on pregnant women or on fertility. Both of which aren’t true.

To be clear: the Sperm Parameters study was conducted by the Miami Department of Urology with n=45 participants with no control group. This is what you qualify as ample fertility testing? Can you point me to the VRBPAC discussion on this study?

Point of reference: the medical community stated that Ivermectin wasn't proven against treating C-19 despite 95 studies, 45 RCTs, and n=134,500 participants.

Please answer these questions regarding the Pfizer-directed pregnancy study you linked:
1) Did you know that the Biden Admin announced the vax mandate on 9 SEP 2021, 10 months before this study completed in JUL 2022?
2) Do you see a conflict of interest in that the company that would benefit from selling the shot conducted this safety study? Yes or no?
3) Do you honestly believe that the Pfizer researchers had sufficient data in the middle of their study to confidently inform Biden admin of shot safety before the vax mandate declaration on 9 SEP?
4) Why do you believe that a study with n=350 is sufficient, robust, and clear evidence of shot safety?
5) Why do you think that only including pregnant women @ 24-34 weeks' gestation is sufficient for assessing shot safety for all pregnant women? What is the most dangerous trimester of pregnancy? (Answer: first). Were first trimester pregnancies included in the study (Answer: no)
6) I can't find where the results were posted - can you link me?

Just use google! All the very real stats showing the dangers! It's all right there! (Disclaimer - I will make these claims without actually posting the data because...!!)

Says the guy who doesn't address the data that I post in this thread.

The best number you have is excess death/mortality. You can't screw with that. Those numbers show serious undercounting early.

Excess death and mortality are exceedingly high all over the globe in 2022 and 2023. Does that concern you?

 

[RDU Irish]

The best number you have is excess death/mortality. You can't screw with that. Those numbers show serious undercounting early.

In terms of trauma here's a story from Harborview (Seattle's trauma center) early in the pandemic. They separated patients by risk of COVID (clean vs dirty sections of the ED). They had a motor vehicle crash victim who was altered. No respiratory symptoms. Turns out she had a massive stroke that was caused by COVID and developed pneumonia a few days later. COVID caused non pulmonary issues.

After that case they realized you need to isolate everyone. Fortunately the PPE supply ramped up and they were able to.

Still holding on to asymptomatic spreaders I see.

See my predictions on "paying it forward" in the death rates. No one is denying people died. We have a walking dead, pharma dependent population to begin with - why wouldn't we think a minor shock to the system wouldn't push them in to the arms of the grim reaper a few years early? I expect we will have below trend death rates for a few years - all the folks on pace to die in 2022 thru 2026 (for example) disproportionately punched out by Covid in 2020-2021. Pretty basic biology surrounding the concept of culling the herd.

I find 20 year old suicide/OD deaths and addictions far more harmful to society than 102 year olds not making it to 105 because they caught the wrong cold.

 

[RDU Irish]

How do those stats change when the enormous faded blue section gets added? Vast majority of flu data is extrapolated - none of this is. How about age and underlying health? How about in countries where any semblance of cleanliness is common?

This is an upper respiratory virus very similar to the flu and when it is all said and done I would bet the mortality is similar to those who catch the flu. Coronavirus has been around forever, we haven't even tried to make a vaccine b/c it is traditionally a mild affliction. Common sense theory out there that kids are not impacted by this thing b/c they have built corona immunity from years of exposure - the older and more removed from cesspools known as schools and daycares the less your body's ability to deal. Just like flu vaccines are never spot on but the exposure to the "cousin" if you will reduces the severity when faced with the real deal.

IMO - Normal healthy folks need to grow a sack and go about their lives while older and compromised health folks need to take normal flu season precautions. My folks should do what they always do and isolate from the world, me and my family don't need to change squat. We have an enormous population of walking dead that is only increasing - now we can't even play sports outside like golf b/c boomers gotta be "safe". Elite athletes need to run and hide from a mild illness (to them)? These folks have virtually no chance of anything but feeling crappy for a bit before back to 100%. Won't see the media follow up with a single person who tests positive with mild to no symptoms - only focus on the ICU cases and scare the crap out of everyone.

I mean - Fred Hoiberg YEAH HE HAS THE FLU!!!! WHAT A RELIEF. You dumbFs - he spread the flu to an entire arena and put tons of people at risk with a disease that kills TENS OF THOUSANDS IN THE US PER YEAR OF ALL AGES. Half a million people die of the flu around the world every damn year. Why is that a risk to be celebrated but this thing gets red carpet treatment? Snowflakes + Boomers = WE ARE ALL GOING TO DIE

March 13, 2020 - my second post in this thread. My first one was asking where to go get exposed on my schedule so I could get on with my life. The "we didn't know" crowd can kick rocks.

 

[GATTACA!]

To be clear: the Sperm Parameters study was conducted by the Miami Department of Urology with n=45 participants with no control group. This is what you qualify as ample fertility testing? Can you point me to the VRBPAC discussion on this study?

Why would that study require a control group? They would just be tracking the variability in mens sperm counts, which I'm sure is data that's already available.

Both of these studies I quoted were just the first results I grabbed for the time frame before the mandate. There are several others for both. Here's a different fertility one.

A Prospective Cohort Study of COVID-19 Vaccination, SARS-CoV-2 Infection, and Fertility

Abstract. Some reproductive-aged individuals remain unvaccinated against coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) because of concerns about potential adverse ef

academic.oup.com

Over 2,100 participants. This studied the impact of fertility after receiving the covid vaccine and also contracting covid in both males and females. The only association was a temporary drop in fertility amongst men who caught covid.

Point of reference: the medical community stated that Ivermectin wasn't proven against treating C-19 despite 95 studies, 45 RCTs, and n=134,500 participants.

Ivermectin was never banned. If you wanted it and your doctor thought it might be effective or didn't care that it wouldn't be, you were free to use it.

Please answer these questions regarding the Pfizer-directed pregnancy study you linked:
1) Did you know that the Biden Admin announced the vax mandate on 9 SEP 2021, 10 months before this study completed in JUL 2022?
2) Do you see a conflict of interest in that the company that would benefit from selling the shot conducted this safety study? Yes or no?
3) Do you honestly believe that the Pfizer researchers had sufficient data in the middle of their study to confidently inform Biden admin of shot safety before the vax mandate declaration on 9 SEP?
4) Why do you believe that a study with n=350 is sufficient, robust, and clear evidence of shot safety?
5) Why do you think that only including pregnant women @ 24-34 weeks' gestation is sufficient for assessing shot safety for all pregnant women? What is the most dangerous trimester of pregnancy? (Answer: first). Were first trimester pregnancies included in the study (Answer: no)
6) I can't find where the results were posted - can you link me?

1) Here's a different one that was completed in February of 2021. 35,000+ pregnant women studied. Split between Pfizer and Moderna. 14% of the total being vaccinated before even becoming pregnant.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2104983

2) No. Do you think drug companies just develop drugs and then wait for the FDA to test them before they figure out if they're safe? Pfizer developed their vaccine then tested it to make sure it was safe. They made their data and methodology publicly available just like with any other drug they take to market.
3) Yes. The FDA approved the vaccines. It's not up to Pfizer to give Biden the go ahead.
4) I'm not a statistician. I don't have the knowledge to critique that aspect either way.
5) I believe that's actually because of the study I linked in point 1). That study didn't have enough pregnancies carried to completion yet because 13.5% were pre pregnancy, 30% first trimester, and 43% in second trimester meant only ≈800 had actually given birth so far. So they supplemented it with this Pfizer study that was mostly late term pregnancies so they could study the babies sooner too.
6) It's still listed as ongoing. Maybe they're checking back in with the infants? The required reporting deadline isn't until 7/15/2023.