COVID-19

[notredomer23]

Europeans got 3+ months of living normal life by having a short, strict lockdown in the spring. They got to travel, vacation, and resume other normal activities. Now they're having a spike and going to shut down again... look for them to have cases back under control by the start of the new year.

The only "inevitable" thing is that trying to pretend the problem doesn't exist and/or having an uncoordinated effort leads to being stuck in a morass of failure with normal societal function permanently disrupted.

You and I have said this before in this thread, but without a national lockdown strategy, how effective can a lockdown even be at this point in the US? Not all states are going to comply. People in complying states will not comply. The first time around people stopped getting together socially. That's not gonna happen this time. I just got back from Clearwater, FL. It was 100% open or at least felt that way. We know Florida isn't gonna do anything. Most the South won't.

I am either for China style lockdown or the opposite. The European style lockdowns or the piecemeal USA lockdowns are just prolonging this thing.

 

[Sea Turtle]

Europeans got 3+ months of living normal life by having a short, strict lockdown in the spring. They got to travel, vacation, and resume other normal activities. Now they're having a spike and going to shut down again... look for them to have cases back under control by the start of the new year.

The only "inevitable" thing is that trying to pretend the problem doesn't exist and/or having an uncoordinated effort leads to being stuck in a morass of failure with normal societal function permanently disrupted.

We all know the problem exists. I had this and know it's real. This whole thing sucks.

I think at a national level, we are just trying to hang on until the vaccines come through. You could kick the can down the road with a three week lockdown. Then you are talking about people losing jobs, businesses going under and riots in the streets.

Even when Biden takes office, I understand democrats are pretty split on the idea of a lockdown.
I'm all for protecting the sick and elderly and masks being mandatory.

 

[phork]

You and I have said this before in this thread, but without a national lockdown strategy, how effective can a lockdown even be at this point in the US? Not all states are going to comply. People in complying states will not comply. The first time around people stopped getting together socially. That's not gonna happen this time. I just got back from Clearwater, FL. It was 100% open or at least felt that way. We know Florida isn't gonna do anything. Most the South won't.

I am either for China style lockdown or the opposite. The European style lockdowns or the piecemeal USA lockdowns are just prolonging this thing.

I don't know what the answer is now. The time for a full out lockdown was in the spring. Should have taken a month and locked everything down. My nephew is in New Zealand and they had cops on every other corner asking where you were going and sending you home if you weren't getting groceries in your own zone. I realize NZ is an island but still..

 

[arahop]

TWO WEEKS to flatten the curve!

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...h-toll-could-double-winter-world-war-n1247726

 

[IrishLax]

We all know the problem exists. I had this and know it's real. This whole thing sucks.

I think at a national level, we are just trying to hang on until the vaccines come through. You could kick the can down the road with a three week lockdown. Then you are talking about people losing jobs, businesses going under and riots in the streets.

Even when Biden takes office, I understand democrats are pretty split on the idea of a lockdown.
I'm all for protecting the sick and elderly and masks being mandatory.

In my opinion, one of the biggest issues is Congress failing to pass meaningful stimulus for 4+ months now when it was clear it was needed going all the way back to the summer. People are losing their houses, businesses, jobs, etc. because the government isn't stepping in to bail out the American people.

 

[Irish#1]

I don't know what the answer is now. The time for a full out lockdown was in the spring. Should have taken a month and locked everything down. My nephew is in New Zealand and they had cops on every other corner asking where you were going and sending you home if you weren't getting groceries in your own zone. I realize NZ is an island but still..

Nobody does.

 

[IrishLax]

You and I have said this before in this thread, but without a national lockdown strategy, how effective can a lockdown even be at this point in the US? Not all states are going to comply. People in complying states will not comply. The first time around people stopped getting together socially. That's not gonna happen this time. I just got back from Clearwater, FL. It was 100% open or at least felt that way. We know Florida isn't gonna do anything. Most the South won't.

I am either for China style lockdown or the opposite. The European style lockdowns or the piecemeal USA lockdowns are just prolonging this thing.

Yeah, it's all become politicized to the point that I don't even know if it's possible to build consensus much less put in a strategy that the bulk of America will adhere to.

You've got people like this who are literally a decision making part of the government --
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Our first session of New Member Orientation covered COVID in Congress.<br><br>Masks, masks, masks....<br><br>I proudly told my freshman class that masks are oppressive.<br><br>In GA, we work out, shop, go to restaurants, go to work, and school without masks. <br><br>My body, my choice.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/FreeYourFace?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#FreeYourFace</a></p>— Marjorie Taylor Greene &#55356;&#56826;&#55356;&#56824; (@mtgreenee) <a href="https://twitter.com/mtgreenee/status/1327299859804729345?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 13, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

So realistically, besides trying to take care of yourself the best you can and hoping your local government does everything in their power to get things under control, I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel until 2021.

 

[NDRock]

Yeah, it's all become politicized to the point that I don't even know if it's possible to build consensus much less put in a strategy that the bulk of America will adhere to.

You've got people like this who are literally a decision making part of the government --
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Our first session of New Member Orientation covered COVID in Congress.<br><br>Masks, masks, masks....<br><br>I proudly told my freshman class that masks are oppressive.<br><br>In GA, we work out, shop, go to restaurants, go to work, and school without masks. <br><br>My body, my choice.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/FreeYourFace?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#FreeYourFace</a></p>— Marjorie Taylor Greene ���� (@mtgreenee) <a href="https://twitter.com/mtgreenee/status/1327299859804729345?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 13, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

So realistically, besides trying to take care of yourself the best you can and hoping your local government does everything in their power to get things under control, I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel until 2021.

Ha, that woman won? Living close to Georgia, I would see her commercials on TV. Mostly shooting guns and talking about stopping socialism and Nancy Pelosi. Would have been a SNL skit 20 years ago, today it's mainstream politics.

 

[yankeehater]

Europeans got 3+ months of living normal life by having a short, strict lockdown in the spring. They got to travel, vacation, and resume other normal activities. Now they're having a spike and going to shut down again... look for them to have cases back under control by the start of the new year.

The only "inevitable" thing is that trying to pretend the problem doesn't exist and/or having an uncoordinated effort leads to being stuck in a morass of failure with normal societal function permanently disrupted.

WOW! A lockdown does not accomplish anything in regards to stopping the virus and will only decimate a fragile economy beyond repair. Whether 3 weeks, 4 weeks or 6 weeks the virus will still be there once we return to "normal life." Even the left's golden boy, Dr. Fauci, has even spoken out against any further complete lockdowns.

 

[yankeehater]

We just need to protect the most vulnerable not lockdown the country. The average age for covid deaths is over 82 and the average life expectancy is 81.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12886370/average-age-covid-death-82-4-years-shield-vulnerable/

Fatalities are also declining (roughly 30%) from the outset of the pandemic due to better treatments and cases now hitting younger, healthier population groups.

https://www.firstpost.com/health/ne...0-decline-in-october-says-centre-8972231.html

 

[GoldenToTheGrave]

Yeah, it's all become politicized to the point that I don't even know if it's possible to build consensus much less put in a strategy that the bulk of America will adhere to.

You've got people like this who are literally a decision making part of the government --
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Our first session of New Member Orientation covered COVID in Congress.<br><br>Masks, masks, masks....<br><br>I proudly told my freshman class that masks are oppressive.<br><br>In GA, we work out, shop, go to restaurants, go to work, and school without masks. <br><br>My body, my choice.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/FreeYourFace?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#FreeYourFace</a></p>— Marjorie Taylor Greene ���� (@mtgreenee) <a href="https://twitter.com/mtgreenee/status/1327299859804729345?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 13, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

So realistically, besides trying to take care of yourself the best you can and hoping your local government does everything in their power to get things under control, I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel until 2021.

You have people like that who can't be inconvenienced with a mask despite 1000+ people dying every day. Yet because some guy who attempted a terrorist attack 20 years ago and didn't even kill anyone I still have to take my shoes off at the airport. TSA doesn't take "my body my choice" as a valid argument.

 

[Irish#1]

We just need to protect the most vulnerable not lockdown the country. The average age for covid deaths is over 82 and the average life expectancy is 81.

I think this is where I'm at.

 

[IrishLax]

WOW! A lockdown does not accomplish anything in regards to stopping the virus and will only decimate a fragile economy beyond repair. Whether 3 weeks, 4 weeks or 6 weeks the virus will still be there once we return to "normal life." Even the left's golden boy, Dr. Fauci, has even spoken out against any further complete lockdowns.

What I said -- which is 100% true -- is that after the spring lockdowns the Europeans had open economies, travel, and other normalcy. That lasted into the fall.

I have no idea what this has to do with "the left's golden boy Fauci" or other drivel. There are lots of different strategies that can be debated on their merits. South Korea is probably what I would point to as the biggest success story, but we're way past that. Sweden took an opposite approach from lockdowns with mixed-but-generally-encouraging results. We're at a point now where it is completely out of control and the federal government won't even do their job and pass basic aid/stimulus much less attempt to get everyone on the same page.

 

[notredomer23]

Hopefully a lot of this talk is for naught and Eli Lilly's antibody actually helps stem the flow of hospitalizations. If it's effective that's the real silver bullet for any talk of lockdown. Big If.

 

[Legacy]

Five days ago due to COVID overwhelming Utah hospitals, the Rep Gove issued a mask mandate, limitation on gatherings, stay at home order with restrictions on school activities. They've sent alerts to all via cell phones.

Utah Declares Covid 19 State of Emergency (coronavirus.utah.gov)

An explanation of the state of emergency for Utah hospitals was issued by his government a couple of days before that.

Straining the System: What Does it mean to have Utah hospitals at capacity? (coronavirus.utah.gov)

The State and the Utah Hospital Association have an emergency command center for real-time figures of available beds, staff, potential transfers, etc.

One aspect is hospitals getting overwhelmed is Utah's Crisis Standards of Care (from above)

When hospital resources are maxed out, doctors must make tough choices about who gets scarce attention, drugs and supplies. Years ago, the State of Utah with the Utah Hospital Association drafted Crisis Standards of Care, which guides doctors in deciding who gets care and who doesn’t, based on who is most likely to survive. The Standards have been updated to reflect the unique issues of the pandemic.

Although no one wants to make such choices, our escalating case counts put us on a trajectory that might require it.

 

[ResLife Hero]

Hopefully a lot of this talk is for naught and Eli Lilly's antibody actually helps stem the flow of hospitalizations. If it's effective that's the real silver bullet for any talk of lockdown. Big If.

I'd caution against banking on Eli Lilly's drug. It's a biologic which makes it harder to produce and administer, and they carry additional risks "normal" pharmaceuticals don't since they can be rejected by the patient. If what I read was right, it's an hour long infusion with another hour spent in outpatient observation, plus it's only intended for cases that get caught before the symptoms get bad. That's going to be expensive and near impossible to scale nationwide.

Help is coming from pharmaceuticals, but I don't think any 1 drug is going to kill this if we don't start masking up and staying home.

 

[arahop]

We all know the problem exists. I had this and know it's real. This whole thing sucks.

I think at a national level, we are just trying to hang on until the vaccines come through. You could kick the can down the road with a three week lockdown. Then you are talking about people losing jobs, businesses going under and riots in the streets.

Even when Biden takes office, I understand democrats are pretty split on the idea of a lockdown.
I'm all for protecting the sick and elderly and masks being mandatory.

Problem is the anti maskers and anti social distancing clan.
Ain't taking my freedom. They are Patriots
No simple solutions but those types are a different kind of virus all together.

 

[SonofOahu]

Hopefully a lot of this talk is for naught and Eli Lilly's antibody actually helps stem the flow of hospitalizations. If it's effective that's the real silver bullet for any talk of lockdown. Big If.

I'd caution against banking on Eli Lilly's drug. It's a biologic which makes it harder to produce and administer, and they carry additional risks "normal" pharmaceuticals don't since they can be rejected by the patient. If what I read was right, it's an hour long infusion with another hour spent in outpatient observation, plus it's only intended for cases that get caught before the symptoms get bad. That's going to be expensive and near impossible to scale nationwide.

Help is coming from pharmaceuticals, but I don't think any 1 drug is going to kill this if we don't start masking up and staying home.

Yup. The Lilly drug is not a slam dunk. We're trying to figure out how to best operationalize it, but it's a little difficult due to its route and the fact that you have to monitor the patient closely.

 

[Legacy]

A few articles on the dire situation in North Dakota...

North Dakota governor changes tack and issues mask mandate
(AP, November 14, 2020)

In his executive order on the mask mandate:

“Our doctors and nurses heroically working on the front lines need our help, and they need it now. Since the beginning, we’ve taken a data-driven approach to our pandemic response, focusing on saving lives and livelihoods. Right now, the data demands a higher level of mitigation efforts to reverse these dangerous trends, to slow the spread of this virus and to avoid the need for economic shutdowns. Our situation has changed, and we must change with it. Tonight, we’re announcing four measures designed to reduce the spread of infections in our communities to protect our most vulnerable and to ensure hospital capacity.”

Doctors spell out stress on hospitals: 'We North Dakotans are in crisis'

There are just 12 available intensive care beds in the whole state, according to the latest figures reported by the North Dakota Department of Health. Most of the 195 open inpatient beds in the state are in rural hospitals, which often don't have the capability to care for patients with serious ailments.

(Grand Forks Herald| Nov 4th 2020)

ND's nurses were taken aback when Republican Gov. Doug Burgum said this week that the state’s hospitals are at capacity and are so strained that the state will allow its health care workers to continue working after they test positive for the coronavirus due to the lack of nurses to care for patients admitted to the hospital.

The Dakotas have the most new daily cases per capita of any other state this week — a record they've held or been close to for many weeks. North Dakota is among the worst in the country for two other grim metrics: per capita deaths and per capita hospitalizations.

North Dakota has had three Health Officers resign with the latest as of Sept 25th when the Gov rescinded the quarantine. Critics of the quarantine mandate said a provision in the order that meant violators could face Class B misdemeanor charges was an overreach by government. After the third resignation, Rep. Rick Becker, who is a plastic surgeon in Bismarck, has said he would be the Health Officer. Becker promotes a plan for addressing COVID-19 which calls for eliminating mass testing, contact tracing, guidelines for businesses and marketing campaigns for voluntary masking and social distancing.

COVID-19 Hospitalizations Surge In Dakotas: 'It's Like We Opened Up A Spigot'
(NPR, November 14, 2020)

Dr. Doug Griffin, chief medical officer at Sanford Medical Center in Fargo, N.D. said that the "mathematics of infection are very clear... We are one of the rampant spread states. And when you have that kind of a community-wide spread with positivity rates in the high 20s and 30s, the likelihood of any of your workers falling ill and therefore unable to take care of folks is distinctly possible."

A nurse ill with Covid should not be exposing others let alone co-workers. Their first hand experience with the devastation, deaths and impacts on families undoubtedly makes them think whether it is worth risking theiirs or their families.

States like North Dakota have had months to prepare for this with refitting rooms, acquiring equipment like ventilators, stocking up on PPE, training non-ICU nurses to provide a lesser degree of the specialized care when patients have filled all available ICU beds.

Decisions on priorities for who will get care will have to be made. Should the Rep Gov's mask mandate and mitigation measures be ignored and no stay at home order be issued, the repercussions are clear. Also, North Dakotans will still need emergency care for heart attacks, strokes, bleeds, trauma, etc. People who may be suffering a heart attack but are aware the Gov has said those Covid positive nurses may continue to work would be reluctant to come to the ER.

Also, the flu season is upon us. Those who allege that flu causes more deaths than Covid should be first in line for the flu vaccine.

South Dakota is not far behind.

 

[Irish#1]

Not surprising. Sparser population dictated the rural areas wouldn't get hit at the same time as the metro areas. I posted earlier that when we went to Dale Hollow, no one in Celina, TN wore a mask and I haven't seen anyone in Clay City, IN wear a mask. Workers in businesses wear them in Clay City, but in Celina they didn't. They just used shields between the cash register and the customer.

Governor put new restrictions back in place. Looking at a map, Clay County was one of a select few to have the tightest restrictions. Funny and sad at the same time.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Yeah, it's all become politicized to the point that I don't even know if it's possible to build consensus much less put in a strategy that the bulk of America will adhere to.

You've got people like this who are literally a decision making part of the government --
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Our first session of New Member Orientation covered COVID in Congress.<br><br>Masks, masks, masks....<br><br>I proudly told my freshman class that masks are oppressive.<br><br>In GA, we work out, shop, go to restaurants, go to work, and school without masks. <br><br>My body, my choice.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/FreeYourFace?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#FreeYourFace</a></p>— Marjorie Taylor Greene ���� (@mtgreenee) <a href="https://twitter.com/mtgreenee/status/1327299859804729345?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 13, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

So realistically, besides trying to take care of yourself the best you can and hoping your local government does everything in their power to get things under control, I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel until 2021.

My body, my choice....

 

[Irishize]

Hopefully, we will have multiple vaccines available by year end or early 2021:

Moderna says mRNA COVID-19 vaccine 94.5% effective
(Ref: HHS, MarketWatch, Fidelity, NIH, Moderna, This is Money)
November 16th, 2020
By: Anna Bratulic
Tags: Top Story mRNA-1273 Moderna COVID-19 Immunisation Clinical Research (R&D)

Moderna announced Monday that in the first interim analysis of the Phase III COVE study, its experimental COVID-19 vaccine mRNA-1273 demonstrated efficacy of 94.5%. The company noted that the analysis was based on 95 cases of coronavirus infection, of which 90 cases were observed in the placebo group versus five in the mRNA-1273 group.

Stéphane Bancel, CEO of Moderna, called the results a "pivotal moment," adding that "this positive interim analysis…has given us the first clinical validation that our vaccine can prevent COVID-19 disease, including severe disease." The drugmaker indicated that it plans to seek emergency-use authorisation from the FDA in the coming weeks, with the filing set to be based on the final analysis of 151 cases and a median follow-up of more than 2 months.

The study is testing mRNA-1273 at the 100 mcg dose level in 30,000 participants in the US, ages 18 and older, who are at risk of severe COVID-19 disease, with subjects receiving two doses 28 days apart. The trial's primary endpoint is the prevention of symptomatic COVID-19 disease, while key secondary goals include prevention of severe COVID-19 disease and prevention of infection by SARS-CoV-2.

Prevents severe disease

Moderna noted that the independent data safety monitoring board informed it that the trial has met the statistical criteria pre-specified in the study protocol for efficacy. The company added that for one of the secondary goals, 11 cases of severe COVID-19 were seen at the first interim analysis, all of which occurred in the placebo group. The drugmaker added that a review of available safety data "did not report any significant…concerns."

The data come shortly after Moderna disclosed that mRNA-1273 is stable in a normal fridge at temperatures of between 2 and 8 degrees Celsius for 30 days, and can be stored for up to six months at -20 degrees Celsius. In contrast, Pfizer and BioNTech's mRNA vaccine BNT162b2, which has also produced promising early data from a Phase III study, must be kept at ultra-low temperatures, posing a number of logistical challenges.

Ready to ship

Moderna, which is developing mRNA-1273 as part of the US government's Operation Warp Speed programme, expects to produce about 20 million doses for the country this year, with millions of these doses already manufactured. "Assuming we get an emergency-use authorisation, we'll be ready to ship through Warp Speed almost in hours," Moderna president Stephen Hoge said, adding "so it could start being distributed instantly."

More to come.

 

[dublinirish]

Hopefully, we will have multiple vaccines available by year end or early 2021:

gonna be lots of fun when the "my body, my choice" clowns turn their noses up at these vaccines

 

[NorthDakota]

gonna be lots of fun when the "my body, my choice" clowns turn their noses up at these vaccines

I know a grand total of one anti-vaxxer. Weird crowd. Do you folks know many?

I love vaccines. Straight into my veins. Most people I know who have had the rona didn't get very sick but I would rather avoid getting sick altogether if that is an option.

Still pretty sure I have already had it. Dad had it. Most of my friends have had it. Most of my dad's friends have had it.

 

[ab2cmiller]

No mRNA vaccine or drug has EVER won approval. These mRNA vaccine trials are showing promise, but forgive me if I'm skeptical, especially the warp speed that this process is using.

I don't know if I will ever take an mRNA vaccine, but I certainly won't be on the front end. It may make perfect sense to have people in high risk categories take an mRNA vaccine, but given the extremely low mortality rates for most age groups, it certainly seems not worth the risk using a technology that hasn't been fully vetted.

 

[Legacy]

I am only speculating but I would imagine North Dakota and others may not have the Crisis Standards of Care Guidelines that Utah set up years ago in preparation for a pandemic that could overwhelm hospitals.

Hospital closure a ‘complete abandonment’ by Indian Health Service (Indian Country News)
This is the second IHS hospital to be shut down emergency room and in-patient services for non-COVID-19 patients. The closure at the Phoenix Indian Medical Center non-Covid emergency and hospitalization services also drew uproar but OB patients who needeed to delivery or were high risk drew criticism, but was in Phoenix where they would not have to drive far.

An alternative for Acoma-Laguna hospital may have been to send Covid patients to Albuquerque, who are still admitting non-Covid patients. But hospitals there are beginning to run short of beds. Albuquerque has the only Level 1 hospital in the state for admission of the most complicated trauma patients. Large cities that have the alternative are contracting for former hospitals that have closed for less critical Covid patients or flu patients that need hospitalization and which rhave the capability to delivery high pressure oxygen and all the services and equipment as those patients worsen. Whether they have the staff for the beds is another consideration. NM like other states are in need for nurses and pursuing any retired nurses or contracting for available travel nurses.

North Dakota has a population density of 11 people per square mile. New Mexico's is 17 people per square mile. The Governor of the Navajo Nation has returned to shutting down, but have not restricted non-Covid services. NM has a mask mandate for all businesses and has been shutting down businesses that do not comply for periods.

One of the factors affecting the increase in Covid patients in their southern city, Las Cruces, is that people who live there travel to El Paso for work, family, shopping, etc.

.

 

[Legacy]

CureVac is developing a mRNA vaccine whose advantage over the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines is that it can be stored in a refrigerator at 41 degrees. They are in Phase 2 and are partnering with Tesla.

The company would make 100 million doses by the end of 2020 and hoped to gain approval some time in 2021. CureVac has collaborated with Elon Musk’s company Tesla on creating mRNA “micro-factories,” which could potentially be deployed around the world to make billions of doses of the vaccine.

The EU is signing deals with all the major vaccine makers. For CureVac's the EU has signed for 400 million doses. CureVac is German company. Their vaccine is also stable at room temperature for 24 hours.

CureVac's COVID-19 Vaccine Candidate Shows Positive Results in Phase I
Nov 10, 2020

Excerpt:

The two companies had begun working in 2019 prior to the COVID-19 pandemic. Tesla has filed a joint patent with CureVac for a “bioreactor for RNA.”

The printers are portable, automated mRNA production units. They are being designed for use in remote locations. They would manufacture the vaccine candidate and other potential mRNA-based therapies using whatever recipe is programmed into them.

CureVac is also building a more traditional manufacturing facility to increase its production of the vaccine tenfold to billions of doses.

The printers are being built at Tesla Grohmann Automation in Germany. Tesla acquired the company in 2016, which develops automated manufacturing systems for batteries and fuel cells.

In a tweet, Musk said, “Tesla makes the RNA Bioreactor that can make vaccines/cures. CureVac has Version 2 in use. Version 3 is under development. I do expect this to become an important product for the world, but probably not financially for Tesla.”

CureVac intends to make billions of doses from their "bioreactors" throughout the world.

 

[NorthDakota]

I wouldnt bother comparing ND/SD to NM or other rural states.

Culturally they have nothing in common. Demographically they arent similar. Politically we arent very similar.

There is probably two people that could get people to comply with any substantial restrictions willingly, John Hoeven in ND and John Thune in SD, and I doubt that'll happen.

 

[Irishize]

No mRNA vaccine or drug has EVER won approval. These mRNA vaccine trials are showing promise, but forgive me if I'm skeptical, especially the warp speed that this process is using.

I don't know if I will ever take an mRNA vaccine, but I certainly won't be on the front end. It may make perfect sense to have people in high risk categories take an mRNA vaccine, but given the extremely low mortality rates for most age groups, it certainly seems not worth the risk using a technology that hasn't been fully vetted.

This is a great podcast that touches on the history of scientists studying & discovering mRNA viruses. It’s called “The Obscure Virus Club” and I believe this was launched pre-Covid. It’s not very long & really interesting.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/revisionist-history/id1119389968?i=1000447509972

 

[Legacy]

I wouldnt bother comparing ND/SD to NM or other rural states.

Culturally they have nothing in common. Demographically they arent similar. Politically we arent very similar.

There is probably two people that could get people to comply with any substantial restrictions willingly, John Hoeven in ND and John Thune in SD, and I doubt that'll happen.

I meant to emphasize their differences. ND has a much higher Covid positive infection rate, less ICU beds available, and a Gov who institutes measures to reduce the transmission - as you pointed out. ND doesn't have medical advisory boards and experts with their heads quitting.