All Things SkunkBear

[Old Man Mike]

WildMan: yes.

 

[adm1n]

Went through Michigan's commitments and made list of who I would have liked ND to have gotten.

Jarrod Wilson- nice frame for a Safety and would have topped of our DB class very well
Tom Strobel- 6'6" DE that seems like if he has the athleticism would be a perfect fit as a OLB in our 3-4
James Ross- undersized MLB (5'11") that reminds me of Greg Jones from MSU
Erik Magnuson- Top 100 OL that any team would want
Kyle Kalis- top 50 OL that would probably be a guard with how we like our OT very athletic
Royce Jenkins-Stone - very athletic OLB that reminds me of David Perkins
Pharaoh Brown- another 6'6" DE that would fit well into our 3-4 as a OLB
Joe Bolden- our staff didnt offer him because he didnt match the 6'4" frame he wanted for LB but has solid offers
Blake Bars- OL with offers from LSU and Florida

We stopped recruiting Ross, Wilson, and Bolden, translation we offered then passed. These guys don't have impressive offers. Kalis, Jenkins-Stone, and Magnuson are the best. i also like the Funchess kid, he might be their best recruit, he will play in the NFL. Other than that they have a bunch of projects and filler type guys. Also, out top 5 guys are better than their top 5 guys. They just have more commits so they have more recruiting points.

 

[koonja]

According to scout.com, Michigan has a 5-star, 10 4-stars, and 8 3-stars... If our class had a 5-star paired with 10 4-stars, we'd be estatic. And let's be honest, for all 8 3-stars we'd say "Oh they're flying under the radar", or "They'll get more stars by the end of the year", etc, etc. I'll call a spade a spade, they're loaded. I'm not saying I'd take them over ours, I'm just saying that if we had exactly what they have, we'd be estatic.

 

[Cali_domer]

According to scout.com, Michigan has a 5-star, 10 4-stars, and 8 3-stars... If our class had a 5-star paired with 10 4-stars, we'd be estatic. And let's be honest, for all 8 3-stars we'd say "Oh they're flying under the radar", or "They'll get more stars by the end of the year", etc, etc. I'll call a spade a spade, they're loaded. I'm not saying I'd take them over ours, I'm just saying that if we had exactly what they have, we'd be estatic.

Wow, I didn't even realize it was that good.

 

[johnnykillz]

Meat Chicken is rollin'.

 

[phork]

It all shakes out to what they make of their talent. We can only hope that Hoke is a failure. At this point doesnt seem likely.

 

[johnnykillz]

It all shakes out to what they make of their talent. We can only hope that Hoke is a failure. At this point doesnt seem likely.

With this class, I would have a winning record in four years with Meat Chicken.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

According to scout.com, Michigan has a 5-star, 10 4-stars, and 8 3-stars... If our class had a 5-star paired with 10 4-stars, we'd be estatic. And let's be honest, for all 8 3-stars we'd say "Oh they're flying under the radar", or "They'll get more stars by the end of the year", etc, etc. I'll call a spade a spade, they're loaded. I'm not saying I'd take them over ours, I'm just saying that if we had exactly what they have, we'd be estatic.

First, pointing to Scout is like citing Wikipedia in a doctoral thesis.

Second, according to Scout (ugh), we currently have two 5s, four 4s, four 3s, and two unrated; and Scout still considers Ferguson and Harrell as 3, which is frankly indefensible.

I understand your point about the irrational optimism most fan bases feel toward their recruiting class, but I can promise you that if our classes and needs were switched, there'd be plenty of people on this board freaking out about our lack of skill players and how crappy our impact recruits played at The Opening.

 

[IrishLax]

First, pointing to Scout is like citing Wikipedia in a doctoral thesis.

Second, according to Scout (ugh), we currently have two 5s, four 4s, four 3s, and two unrated; and Scout still considers Ferguson and Harrell as 3, which is frankly indefensible.

I understand your point about the irrational optimism most fan bases feel toward their recruiting class, but I can promise you that if our classes and needs were switched, there'd be plenty of people on this board freaking out about our lack of skill players and how crappy our impact recruits played at The Opening.

Truth!

And to OMM's original post (didn't realize how far off-topic we got) I think it makes sense for these reasons:
1. Michigan's defense was epic levels of fail. And unless they add a ton of depth and good pieces in this class they won't be any good until '14. As it stands, they have a chance of being good in '13 if they bring in tons of depth here.
2. Mattison can live off Ray Lewis' and Ed Reed's coattails for maybe a season or two... so he is going out right now and selling that hard and pushing kids to commit (as evidenced by Armani Reeves cutting Michigan because he felt pressured).
3. In OSU's decline, you've got to grab as many kids from Ohio as possible. And most of the good ones appear to be on the defensive side of the ball on first glance.

So I don't think Hoke is ignoring offense... I just don't think any big time skill players are really in love with Michigan right now. On the contrary, defensive players see immediate playing time potential, the Ravens DC (ooooooh... aaaaahhhh...) and pressure with the class filling up.

I think the guys on offense, similar to how we're playing the waiting game with some WRs and RBs, are waiting to see how things play out under Hoke. Michigan also has a preponderance of RBs and doesn't really need to recruit there.

 

[koonja]

First, pointing to Scout is like citing Wikipedia in a doctoral thesis.

Second, according to Scout (ugh), we currently have two 5s, four 4s, four 3s, and two unrated; and Scout still considers Ferguson and Harrell as 3, which is frankly indefensible.

I understand your point about the irrational optimism most fan bases feel toward their recruiting class, but I can promise you that if our classes and needs were switched, there'd be plenty of people on this board freaking out about our lack of skill players and how crappy our impact recruits played at The Opening.

If you don't like scout.com, go to rivals. Same story. 10 4-stars for Michigan, ND has 4 4-stars. I'm happy about our class, but let's not **** on one another's back and say it's raining. Michigan's kicking butt in recruiting.

 

[]\/[GoBlue]

Let me preface my post with this; worrying about 'star' rankings before a kid has even played his senior year is kinda silly, a lot can happen between now and signing day...and even after that, ask USC .

Rank School # Commits Rivals Avg Scout Avg ESPN Avg 24/7 Avg
1 Michigan* 18                3.50         3.56         3.33         3.56
2 Notre Dame 11                3.27         3.55         3.27         3.27

But if you're into that kinda thing the above is the average ranking for our recruits on the 4 main sites.

As for why we're going after who we are, it's just us filling needs. We don't need wide outs or RBs right now, but we do need linemen and linebackers. I also think Hoke is trying to show the Michigan fans that he 'gets it', and by that I mean raiding ohio (especially while osu is down [read:face down in the gutter with multiple knife wounds]) and taking the best instate kids Michigan has to offer.

* does not include Kalis
If you're REALLY into recruiting a poster on mgoblog did some crazy voodoo magic and math to make an aggregate of the 4 main sites rankings to turn them into one: click

 

[Old Man Mike]

...

 

[koonja]

I hate when people claim that worrying about star ratings before the kid's taken a college course is irrelevent. Really? Then why are we on this site, spending hours following recruiting? Rankings matter. We get more excited about a 5-star commit than a 4; more excited about a 4 star commit than a 3, let's just be honest. Michigan's rolling in recruiting so far. We're doing good too. It is what it is.

 

[IrishLax]

Let me preface my post with this; worrying about 'star' rankings before a kid has even played his senior year is kinda silly, a lot can happen between now and signing day...and even after that, ask USC .

Rank School # Commits Rivals Avg Scout Avg ESPN Avg 24/7 Avg
1 Michigan* 18****************3.50*********3.56*********3.33*********3.56
2 Notre Dame 11****************3.27*********3.55*********3.27*********3.27

But if you're into that kinda thing the above is the average ranking for our recruits on the 4 main sites.

As for why we're going after who we are, it's just us filling needs. We don't need wide outs or RBs right now, but we do need linemen and linebackers. I also think Hoke is trying to show the Michigan fans that he 'gets it', and by that I mean raiding ohio (especially while osu is down [read:face down in the gutter with multiple knife wounds]) and taking the best instate kids Michigan has to offer.

* does not include Kalis
If you're REALLY into recruiting a poster on mgoblog did some crazy voodoo magic and math to make an aggregate of the 4 main sites rankings to turn them into one: click

Great link. Wish it was up to date with current commits... so apologies if I make any mistakes here. Conclusions from said link:
-Michigan has one Top 50 guy (Kalis, who is barely in the top 50 and guys on ISD think is overrated and may drop). Talks to my point about no "wow" or "oh ****" guys at the moment.
-5 Top 100 guys is good. But if you extrapolated that to a full class of 25 (no idea how Michigan is going to do EEs and such and if they plan on going past that) they are only going to end up with 6 to 7. Very good. Top 10 almost definitely. #1 or world beater? Nope. Especially when 3 of those guys are in the 80s+ with 2 in the high 90s.

#45, #70, #83, #96, #97. Nothing to be terrified about. For reference, our class last year had #6, #38, #45, #63, #66, #83, #97 for an aggregate 7 kids at #47 and came in ~#8/#10 overall... so what does that mean for putting this Michigan class in perspective?
If their class stays on pace for 6.5 kids at ~#78 that's somewhere in the #10-15 overall range.

Very good. Just not the super amazing class a lot of people would like you to believe they have.

DISCLAIMER: all of this is pure conjecture. If Michigan adds 5 more top 100 guys grabbing players like Day and Washington and others I can't think of right now... and somehow finishes with 10+ guys in the top 100 it will be a whole difference ball game. The only point is the class they are assembling right now is great in depth and quantity but needs to finish strong if it wants to stay in the top 10.

 

[phork]

I hate when people claim that worrying about star ratings before the kid's taken a college course is irrelevent. Really? Then why are we on this site, spending hours following recruiting? Rankings matter. We get more excited about a 5-star commit than a 4; more excited about a 4 star commit than a 3, let's just be honest. Michigan's rolling in recruiting so far. We're doing good too. It is what it is.

I am not on this site to debate star ratings. They are meaningless with out proper development. I'll look to the following year or 2 to see how these kids pan out.

Frankly I am here for all the laughs. And drugs. And chicks.

 

[dshans]

Frankly I am here for all the laughs. And drugs. And chicks.

Wait, wait, wait ... where do I go on this board to get laughs?


vLaughs don't really count. vDrugs either. vChicks? I'm evaluating and will get back to you.

 

[TerryTate]

I will be happy when Michigan and Notre Dame both field top class teams, and our games actually mean something. This rivalry needs to live up to the reputation again.

I still think we curb stomp you this year.

 

[BGIF]

Correct.

Michigan's last championship season (1997) featured an excellent defense and an utterly anemic offense.

Yes, it was an excellent defense but an "utterly anemic offense", no. You may want to recalibrate your way back machine.

They weren't an offensive juggernaut but they averaged 27 pts/game, hardly anemic. They only score 30 pts or more 2 or 3 times but they never scored less than 20. Their running backs averaged better than 4 yds/carry while Griese set passing records for the school.

 

[D-BOE34]

Hoke is getting the recruits he needs, DEFENSE! High caliber best of the best? NO. He is, however, landing the key points of what is needed to start building a solid team. Depth on both defense and the lines. Hole is most likely just as confident in himself and staff that they can develop a team just as BK and Co. We may disagree but I damn well bet he doesn't!! Good for him. What does he have to lose!!? (Only his greatest opportunity to be at the highest level he could ever dream) Hoke, IMHO, will field a team that will keep it more dramatic than I hope for. I also feel Hoke will field a team that will make us look damn good for winning in 2-3 years! I hate Michigan but I also hate going into a game where we are hands down projected to win.

 

[Rocket89]

Should we be scared of a confident Hole?

 

[ndcoltsfan2010]

I will be happy when Michigan and Notre Dame both field top class teams, and our games actually mean something. This rivalry needs to live up to the reputation again.

I still think we curb stomp you this year.

I'm with you on this TT. Remember when the ND-Michigan was widely considered the game of the year almost on a regular basis? Both programs have really not been in their top form as of late and I really sense the tide is changing. I think Hoke is doing what he needs to do and is doing a splendid job up there thus far. Michigan's defense was horrible last year, I mean horrible, and it looks as though he has addressed that need so far in this recruiting class. I want Notre Dame and Michigan to rise back to the top. To do this both schools have to win it first on the recruiting front, then by coaching and winning games on the field. Looking forward to the next several years as hopefully this rivalry will get to where it belongs.

 

[Gencdaddy]

1. They can pitch the "We can get you into the NFL" card with Greg Mattison, who inherited an already loaded Ravens defense that actually slipped in every statistical ranking after his hiring.
2. Most of these kids are from Michigan or Ohio. It was probably their dream school from the start.
3. Hoke shows them tape from 2010 and says, "Look, our defense blows. You could probably start right away."


We have every reason to worry. As someone stated above, we've lost four of the last five. Two of them were utterly humiliating.

"We have better talent" doesn't work here. We've been the far better team the last two seasons and lost both games.

Fortunately, this great Michigan recruiting class will not be experienced players until 2014/2015, which is what Michigan fans overlook.

However, I trust in this staff.

^2 words: Charlie Weis. Not to mention that their defense's cardio was so out of shape it will take a while for them to get firing on all cylinders. Weis at least had a veteran in Quinn where Mattison has seemingly no one on that defense.

I still think that though right now Michigan looks good on paper, they might be screwed later this year if have a mediocre/negative end to the season. With this many kids in a class it seems imperative to pin point specific players you want to tie up your class which also means rescinding offers from other 'under-the-radar' kids who would really like to play there.

What's to say that you don't see some of Michigan's top prospects like Kalis get the Bob Diaco special as per another school and woo them somewhere else? Then do you climb back to the other players whose offers you took back? I mean what's Michigan looking for now (and correct me if I'm out of line)? 1 QB, 3 defensive backs, a defensive tackle and 1 wide out would be my guess.

Also, though based on ratings I envy Michigan's recruiting success especially with all the buzz in Michigan country, I think we're in a prime spot because we can keep offers out there to Romeo Okwara and (maybe) others but still be close to the top of the elite player's college wishlist.

 

[Rhode Irish]

He'll probably convert a couple of the DBs to WRs down the line. That would take care of the apparent hole in the WR recruiting. Can't get all the DBs on the field at the same time anyway.

Agreed. This is the take. I'm just reading this thread now, but I was reading the first page wondering how long it would take for someone to make this point.

Especially considering how we've seen our staff recruit "skill", "big skill" and "power" and move incoming recruits and current players to new positions, I would say that this is clearly the answer to OMM's original question.

Time will tell if this is an approach that will work for them. If you go all-in with the "we'll let the DB's we recruit that don't work out play offense" approach, you're certainly taking a risk that those guys won't be any better at offense.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Michgan's class is rock solid. If their class was ours, we'd be calling every guy the 'RKG' and raving about our class. If you don't think it's solid, you're in denial and having a hard time taking off the bias shades. The only question is if they keep it together.

I don't think whether they can keep it together is the major problem. I think everyone would concede the class is very solid, but the question is whether they will be able to round out their class with elite talent. Their class is definitely a respectable class, but, even assuming they keep it together, it is not in the same league as ND's 2011 class, and presently is not appreciably better than ND's 2012 class and it is almost full. ND's is probably half full.

I like what Michigan is doing, but I'm not worried about them. I want them to be good. If we're going to be the #1 program in the country, I hope Michigan and USC are #2 and #3.

 

[koonja]

I don't think whether they can keep it together is the major problem. I think everyone would concede the class is very solid, but the question is whether they will be able to round out their class with elite talent. Their class is definitely a respectable class, but, even assuming they keep it together, it is not in the same league as ND's 2011 class, and presently is not appreciably better than ND's 2012 class and it is almost full. ND's is probably half full.

How isn't it? Michigan currently has 10 players committed that are 4-star or greater. Our total, according to both scout and rivals for 2011 was 10.

 

[IrishLax]

I don't think whether they can keep it together is the major problem. I think everyone would concede the class is very solid, but the question is whether they will be able to round out their class with elite talent. Their class is definitely a respectable class, but, even assuming they keep it together, it is not in the same league as ND's 2011 class, and presently is not appreciably better than ND's 2012 class and it is almost full. ND's is probably half full.

How isn't it? Michigan currently has 10 players committed that are 4-star or greater. Our total, according to both scout and rivals for 2011 was 10.

See post #44. Their class is on pace to finish in the #10 to #15 range (assuming they're not taking something like 30 kids) and ours finished in the #8-#10 range (if you include Prestwood we're solidly a top 10 class). They're about comparable to ours from last year but just a touch behind because they really don't have any top 50 style players committed right now whereas we had some true blue chips in Lynch, Ishaq Williams and Tuitt.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Right. It isn't in the same league because of the lack of elite prospects.

 

[Ironman8]

Terry_Rich Terry Richardson

Me n Royce both still taking visits are recruitment process not over till feb 2 we solid but still looking nothing personal

Terry_Rich Terry Richardson

We Got too many offers to not take some visits

SWiltfong247 Steve Wiltfong

Top247 Michigan commits Terry Richardson and Royce Jenkins-Stone are not completely done with recruiting. 247sports.com/Article/Michig… via @247Sports

 

[Rocket89]

Terry_Rich Terry Richardson


Terry_Rich Terry Richardson


SWiltfong247 Steve Wiltfong

/Mr. Burns "Excellent" jpeg

 

[Blaise]

It's Michigan.... They have prestige, and when you can offer top kids playing time right out of the gate.... They are hooked.... I want to see if he can keep them, or 2013 class when he can;t promise all this playing time