'24 MI QB CJ Carr (Notre Dame Signee)

[CanadalovesND]

I don't think another year at high school is going to help his development. Sure, he will have his QB coaches train him outside of the seasonysy and whatnot, but he's reach his potential in high school. Another year beating the crap out of subpar talented Michigan high school teams wont do much.

Big fish in a small pond. If he wants to be the biggest fish, he needs a bigger pond.

Even if he comes in and just redshirts, or plays within the redshirt minimum of games, it's overall better for hm. Getting into the strength and conditioning, getting acclimated with the system, throwing and practicing with better receivers and better cornerbacks, and furthermore, learning how to be a ND student without the pressure of maybe having to also be the true freshman starting quarterback.

If Pyne solidifies himself as the starter this season, and it carries over into 2023, there is not a huge force to get Carr ready to be the starter as soon as he arrives.

 

[stlnd01]

I don't think another year at high school is going to help his development. Sure, he will have his QB coaches train him outside of the seasonysy and whatnot, but he's reach his potential in high school. Another year beating the crap out of subpar talented Michigan high school teams wont do much.

Big fish in a small pond. If he wants to be the biggest fish, he needs a bigger pond.

Even if he comes in and just redshirts, or plays within the redshirt minimum of games, it's overall better for hm. Getting into the strength and conditioning, getting acclimated with the system, throwing and practicing with better receivers and better cornerbacks, and furthermore, learning how to be a ND student without the pressure of maybe having to also be the true freshman starting quarterback.

If Pyne solidifies himself as the starter this season, and it carries over into 2023, there is not a huge force to get Carr ready to be the starter as soon as he arrives.

Can we just stop with this.
We absolutely do not want a true freshman walking in and starting, regardless of how many stars he has on 247. It is a recipe for disaster. When all-world recruit Jimmy Clausen did it we had our worst season in how long?
No matter when Carr shows up our 2023 starting QB is either Pyne, Buchner or a grad transfer. Our 2024 starting QB is probably the same (maybe add Angeli to the mix). Carr's time will come but it really shouldn't be next September.

 

[NDRock]

I’m in favor of whatever route gets CJ on the field for ND the fastest. Which is reclassifying.

I’m for whatever makes him successful at ND. Maybe it’s staying and coming in a year older, maybe it’s reclassifying. We’ll see.

 

[Reaper97]

CJ repeated a grade to improve his chances of being a successful HS senior athlete aka the Clausen Family method

That’s not true at all.
He never repeated a grade.
CJ and his family decided he should study abroad for a year to get more life experience. Had nothing to do with football. The two countries he studied in didn’t have football so he didn’t play that year. It was between his 8th & 9th grades, so he never repeated a grade and actually missed a year of playing football.
And he actually earned HS credits while doing so, that’s why he technically can graduate this year.

 

[CanadalovesND]

Can we just stop with this.
We absolutely do not want a true freshman walking in and starting, regardless of how many stars he has on 247. It is a recipe for disaster. When all-world recruit Jimmy Clausen did it we had our worst season in how long?
No matter when Carr shows up our 2023 starting QB is either Pyne, Buchner or a grad transfer. Our 2024 starting QB is probably the same (maybe add Angeli to the mix). Carr's time will come but it really shouldn't be next September.

I didn’t say he should start, or needs to start.

 

[T-Boone]

That’s not true at all.
He never repeated a grade.
CJ and his family decided he should study abroad for a year to get more life experience. Had nothing to do with football. The two countries he studied in didn’t have football so he didn’t play that year. It was between his 8th & 9th grades, so he never repeated a grade and actually missed a year of playing football.
And he actually earned HS credits while doing so, that’s why he technically can graduate this year.

he definitely should reclassify then.

 

[stlnd01]

I didn’t say he should start, or needs to start.

I know. And sorry if I came off a little extra there. Didn't mean to jump down your throat. But there's this idea that's been floating around a lot lately that Carr will arrive and immediately save our QB room, and it's a terrible idea. At least if we want to win more than, say, six games.

 

[IrishLion]

That’s not true at all.
He never repeated a grade.
CJ and his family decided he should study abroad for a year to get more life experience. Had nothing to do with football. The two countries he studied in didn’t have football so he didn’t play that year. It was between his 8th & 9th grades, so he never repeated a grade and actually missed a year of playing football.
And he actually earned HS credits while doing so, that’s why he technically can graduate this year.

He may not have repeated a grade... but let's not pretend that getting an extra year of physical development by taking a gap year between junior high and high school wasn't a factor when he decided to go seek out "life experience" lol

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

It's both not one or the other. It would be silly to argue that development at his high school would not be better the development at ND. But if we have him for three years I would rather him be a year older

You’re pulling this out of your ass lol. There is zero statistical data that indicates people just become better QBs for the simple reason that they are a year older. They are not fine wine. As dale pointed out, the indicators would be physical and mental maturity, development and learning, etc…all of which would be better on ND campus next year versus toying with low level HS talent that will not challenge his abilities.

 

[Dale]

Out of the top 10 QBs in the 2021 and 2022 classes the only one that currently starts is Caleb Williams.

???

Quinn Ewers, JJ McCarthy, Tyler Buchner, Drake Maye, Jaxon Dart all starters as RS Freshman/True Sophomores

2020 class had a ton start as sophomores.

 

[NDFAN2008]

At the end of the day CJ isn't starting if he comes next year regardless so they should take the best Grad Transfer QB available.

 

[Domina Nostra]

I already pointed out his development at ND would be higher then being in HS another year. That is a point no one can really argue against. But to say there is no statistical data that shows age has an impact is silly. Look how many starters there are in power five colleges that are freshman and sophmores. Out of the top 10 QBs in the 2021 and 2022 classes the only one that currently starts is Caleb Williams. I realize that alot of that has to do with college development but you cant deny that age is a factor in that has well. Carr should be better when he is 21 compared to 20. If we only have him for 3 year I would rather take the older three years.

I not sure how you would get a control group to "prove" this. If there is one thing that is clear from football recruiting, its that QB development is hard to predict.

I would think it would be highly dependent on the kid's (1) mental makeup, (2) physical development attitude, and (3) surpassing a minimum threshold of live reps.

For example, for Tyler Buchner, who had already missed his sophomore year of HS, I think he would have benefited much more by getting reps against better high-school competition and getting confidence with various aspects of the game without worrying about a grown 300 lb. man trying to rip his head off or a coach yelling at him.

To use an analogy, I think Tim Duncan benefitted from refining all his moves for 4 years in college against smaller slower players so he had confidence in them when he started practicing against pros and his shots were getting rejected into the 3rd row for a little while. Without those years of confidence, he might say, "well that doesn't work, no need to waste my time with it." As it was, he knew he was only missing by a bit and it come with a little refinement.

On the other hand, if you are a year older, and have played QB for three years against high-level competition, in a pass-heavy offense, then the jump is probably beneficial.

 

[Domina Nostra]

At the end of the day CJ isn't starting if he comes next year regardless so they should take the best Grad Transfer QB available.

Haha! Pyne is going to play medium well, and then go down. Angeli is going to get a 4-5 games and show flashes. The coaches will convince themselves that there is no need.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Haha! Pyne is going to play medium well, and then go down. Angeli is going to get a 4-5 games and show flashes. The coaches will convince themselves that there is no need.

A transfer quarterback is going to be looking for the starting job to be handed to them. I'm not sure ND's depth chart will look as inviting as other programs.

 

[stlnd01]

A transfer quarterback is going to be looking for the starting job to be handed to them. I'm not sure ND's depth chart will look as inviting as other programs.

OTOH if they can beat out a flabby, weak-armed three-star and an oft-injured running back we call a QB, they can lead a team good enough to make the playoffs. Maybe just come and give it a shot?

 

[Irishdrunk]

The issue is for the 2023 class. I don't mind if CJ reclassifies as long as he will likely Red Shirt. I mean expecting or pushing him to start is a problem.

We absolutely needed a Transfer QB this year and we will absolutely need a QB Transfer next year. That stated, the room will be good with:

Transfer QB
Buchner
Pyne
Angeli
RS Carr

That is getting more like LSU's QB room now with Kelly. We need a STUFFED QB Room so this kind of s-show doesn't happen again. Let the best play but expect future Freshman to RS.

 

[SoIll]

ISD says Jackson Arnold is definitely not flipping. Said same thing Loy said, been in contact with some guys that we are familiar with. Didn't say names.

Wrong thread

 

[IHateMarkMay]

ISD says Jackson Arnold is definitely not flipping. Said same thing Loy said, been in contact with some guys that we are familiar with. Didn't say names.

Wrong thread

Wait, we can't tell kids committed to Oklahoma to visit us just in case some big coaching change happens there? Get this Arnold's girlfriend a scholarship immediately.

 

[NDMD]

The issue is for the 2023 class. I don't mind if CJ reclassifies as long as he will likely Red Shirt. I mean expecting or pushing him to start is a problem.

We absolutely needed a Transfer QB this year and we will absolutely need a QB Transfer next year. That stated, the room will be good with:

Transfer QB
Buchner
Pyne
Angeli
RS Carr

That is getting more like LSU's QB room now with Kelly. We need a STUFFED QB Room so this kind of s-show doesn't happen again. Let the best play but expect future Freshman to RS.

What makes you think Pyne will stay for another year if they bring in a transfer QB to start over him?

Much less Buchner...

 

[Irish du Nord]

What makes you think Pyne will stay for another year if they bring in a transfer QB to start over him?

Much less Buchner...

Pyne alga’s already shown an abnormal commitment to the university, I wouldn’t be shocked either way he chooses

 

[irishff1014]

Maybe he just want to be a high school senior and have fun his last year of school. Enjoy hanging out with his boys and just having fun before kid really smacks him in the face.

Or Maybe he has had his fun and wants to move on in life and start his college education sooner rather than later.

As long as he stay Irish I don’t care.

 

[stlnd01]

What makes you think Pyne will stay for another year if they bring in a transfer QB to start over him?

Much less Buchner...

Pyne is not playing football after college. He also knows from experience that he'd be one injury away from a starting job and - if this year is reasonably successful - will have demonstrated the ability to step in and do it. I could certainly see him going, but could also see him staying.

Buchner would likely remain the most talented QB on our roster, competitive for the job with any grad transfer we're likely to bring in. Also an injury away from starting. He'd probably graduate if he sticks through the '23 season, that's likely valuable to him. Again I wouldn't be shocked if he left but I don't know why people assume he'd leave. He could easily wind up a very good starting QB for us in '23 and '24.

 

[indianamouse]

Pyne is not playing football after college.

Idk. If he keeps up the high completion percentage rate he may get a look.

 

[notredomer23]

Idk. If he keeps up the high completion percentage rate he may get a look.

NFL teams are dying for 5’10 QBs that can throw 40 yards.

 

[stlnd01]

NFL teams are dying for 5’10 QBs that can throw 40 yards.

Hey at least Ian Book can run a little.

 

[Irishdrunk]

Idk. If he keeps up the high completion percentage rate he may get a look.

CFL!?????

 

[Riddickulous]

Hey at least Ian Book can run a little.

Did you not see Drew's crucial scramble vs. UNC? He's like a Michael Vick/Lamar Jackson hybrid.

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

I already pointed out his development at ND would be higher then being in HS another year. That is a point no one can really argue against. But to say there is no statistical data that shows age has an impact is silly. Look how many starters there are in power five colleges that are freshman and sophmores. Out of the top 10 QBs in the 2021 and 2022 classes the only one that currently starts is Caleb Williams. I realize that alot of that has to do with college development but you cant deny that age is a factor in that has well. Carr should be better when he is 21 compared to 20. If we only have him for 3 year I would rather take the older three years.

Im trying not to be rude but this is a horrible take that makes no sense and has no factual support to it. If this were true how do you explain the LONG history and thousands of examples where somebody had a good sophomore or junior year and then regressed the following year? It happens ALL the time. There is zero evidence that just being a year older makes you a better quarterback and I cant believe anyone is seriously trying to argue that point.

 

[notredomer23]

Saline lost 7-0. Only comments I could find from Sinclair:

Frustrating watching some of CJ Carr's game, Carr delivering some good passes but his receivers are simply not coming up with the catches. And his O-Line has allowed several unavoidable sacks through midway into the second quarter.

 

[NDRock]

You’re pulling this out of your ass lol. There is zero statistical data that indicates people just become better QBs for the simple reason that they are a year older. They are not fine wine. As dale pointed out, the indicators would be physical and mental maturity, development and learning, etc…all of which would be better on ND campus next year versus toying with low level HS talent that will not challenge his abilities.

I think the more game reps you get as a qb, the better you off you are in the long run. Seems to hold true going from college to the pros. I think his long term success would benefit from another year of high school ball and then early entry to ND where he could be here for the Spring.

We wouldn’t even be having this discussion if we hadn’t dropped the ball on recruiting this year.