'23 FL DE Keon Keeley (Prodigal Son)

[Some Irish Bloke]

Wouldn't want to see some of you guys after a breakup in high school.

Could you even imagine? Yikes.

 

[ThePiombino]

Yes the NIL era invented paying recruits.

Ok, whatever @Dale this is about relationships. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[stlnd01]

There is little doubt in my mind that Nick Saban and Alabama play a large role in it. He is going to play for a championship every single year and increase is draft stock.

Yep. The fact is we rarely beat Bama head-to-head for kids they want. And Keeley isn’t visiting A&M or Miami, but rather two of the very small handful of programs that are ahead of us on the field.
Was always going to be a dogfight to keep Keeley once the cycle really heated up. I’m sure the NIL is a factor here but I think we’re making too much of it to act like it’s the only factor.

 

[HouseofPain]

Hard to imagine that Bama would have more NIL money than ND.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

In one situation they are guaranteed millions no matter what happens. The other they only get the cash if they succeed. You always take the gauranteed money especially a football player. There have been so many high school players that have been called generational talent that never went on to do anything. Under ND's model they would never see anything substantial. Under the PFP model they sign a contract and are guaranteed at least some of the money if not all of it. There is not a credible financial adviser out there that would tell a kid to not take the gauranteed money. Even $100,000 at 18 can be life altering money and set up a kid for life if invested wisely and to get that before even taking the risk of getting injured is a no brainer. That is what is holding ND's NIL back, Its not the amount, it's that other school's boosters are guaranteeing it before even stepping on campus.

So you're saying that businesses that offer these kids NIL contracts aren't offering guarantees, or that it's impossible to have that language in said contract?

I really haven't been following closely to the wording of these P4P contracts or NIL deals. I really don't know the ins and outs.

 

[bkess8]

Hard to imagine that Bama would have more NIL money than ND.

I don't think it is when you have boosters focused on NIL. Bama knows what they are doing and their boosters know the school is supportive of NIL. They may not have more money but they are playing the NIL game well in comparison to ND IMO.

 

[GATTACA!]

We are fine.

Depends on your aspirations.

 

[InKellyWeTrust]

Serious question, if college football had a stat similar to WAR (wins above replacement), what sort of number would a guy like Keeley have in his Soph/Junior seasons if he turned into a Chase Young/Brian Breese type?

 

[indianamouse]

While expected, this still sucks. Even though our DL development has been pretty good, and I’m high on young guys like Gobiara, Burnham and Traore, we still need guys like this at premium positions in the program to jump into that next tier of teams.

Did he actually eliminate us? Or is freeman still recruiting him?

 

[InKellyWeTrust]

Serious question, if college football had a stat similar to WAR (wins above replacement), what sort of number would a guy like Keeley have in his Soph/Junior seasons if he turned into a Chase Young/Brian Breese type?

An Introduction to College Football Wins Above Average

Ben Brown breaks down what factors into PFF's WAA calculations and uses it to show why Heisman winner Joe Burrow is the fourth most valuable player of the PFF College era.

www.pff.com

 

[indianamouse]

Here is an article from IB today. Keeley is still considering ND and Freeman is still recruiting him

Keon Keeley De-Commits From Notre Dame

Notre Dame has lost its top recruit in the 2023 class as Keon Keeley has opened up his recruitment

www.si.com

Thank you. I trust in freeman, how could you turn that guy down? #freemanera

 

[Whiskeyjack]

NIL != P4P

Kyle Hamilton made nearly seven figures last year off 100% legal NIL deals, making him one of the highest NIL earners. Mayer will be similar this year. If you're an All- American at ND, you're not banking less than elsewhere.

But we don't do big upfront P4P because it's illegal. Other schools seem to be getting around it via boosters. We can either get with the 'gram and let our boosters do the same, or prepare to lose CJ Carr the same way as Keeley.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I get the impression that Marcus Freeman doesn't have "bad days." His mindset is completely different than that of the average ND fan. Thank goodness for that.

As for Alabama, think about where football rates on their priority scale. When Saban started taking shots at Deion and Jimbo, anyone who has been paying attention to that guy for more than five minutes knew he was going to adjust to the situation. Saban makes his environment a product of him, not vice versa. They're paying him an incredible amount of money to coach there, they have helped him with debt when a lot of his investments took a dump at the Great Recession and they've dumped millions into their facilities including Nick's office which looks like the lobby of a country club.

So does ND need to adjust to the current landscape? I believe they do, but even with that, where does it end? NIL or not, the kids who want to come to ND are going to do it and the ones that can easily have their heads turned won't.

 

[T Town Tommy]

I think for ND to be competitive they have to rethink NIL. The FUND as I understand it is to assist players with promoting charitable organizations whereas most every other school’s collective is geared to maximizing a player’s ability to market themselves for profit and marrying them up with companies that are willing to contract for player NIL. Since the collectives aren’t affiliated with the university then ND’s BOT wouldn’t really have a say so in what the collective does to secure opportunities for players. Am I missing something here?

 

[NorthDakota]

Did he actually eliminate us? Or is freeman still recruiting him?

The way it is ND may be chosen if he can obtain adequate financing. Which ND won't unless our "rednecks" (as Whiskey affectionately named them) cut the kid a check.

 

[indianamouse]

The way it is ND may be chosen if he can obtain adequate financing. Which ND won't unless our "rednecks" (as Whiskey affectionately named them) cut the kid a check.

Sounds like if family is the deciding factor, yes. If it's his personal decision, ND may still really be in it.

 

[NorthDakota]

I get the impression that Marcus Freeman doesn't have "bad days." His mindset is completely different than that of the average ND fan. Thank goodness for that.

As for Alabama, think about where football rates on their priority scale. When Saban started taking shots at Deion and Jimbo, anyone who has been paying attention to that guy for more than five minutes knew he was going to adjust to the situation. Saban makes his environment a product of him, not vice versa. They're paying him an incredible amount of money to coach there, they have helped him with debt when a lot of his investments took a dump at the Great Recession and they've dumped millions into their facilities including Nick's office which looks like the lobby of a country club.

So does ND need to adjust to the current landscape? I believe they do, but even with that, where does it end? NIL or not, the kids who want to come to ND are going to do it and the ones that can easily have their heads turned won't.

I dont have a problem with Alabama treating Saban like he's the King. He's added more value to that university than he can possibly get in return.

Football makes Alabama who they are. Sounds a bit like another university...

 

[GATTACA!]

We’ll be lucky to be a hat on the table at this point.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

I think for ND to be competitive they have to rethink NIL. The FUND as I understand it is to assist players with promoting charitable organizations whereas most every other school’s collective is geared to maximizing a player’s ability to market themselves for profit and marrying them up with companies that are willing to contract for player NIL. Since the collectives aren’t affiliated with the university then ND’s BOT wouldn’t really have a say so in what the collective does to secure opportunities for players. Am I missing something here?

I think you are missing the gray area, wherein millions of dollars are promised, we understand the black and white.

Just being honest in a moment of vulnerability, I really hope the worst for Alabama football moving forward. When someone sits on top for so long and then is able to seamlessly glide into the new era of P4P, you can't help but hope for lots of injuries, philandering coaches, and a loss of control at the administrative level.

TTT, the team success you've been able to enjoy has been enough for multiple lifetimes. My envy consumes me. It's about time for things to turn south. I'd like to call on all the good Catholics on this board to light a candle for this request. If you're protestant, then sola fide shall give us this. If you're Mormon, I don't know something about magic glasses and revelation and underwear and elders. If you're a Scientologist, then may L Ron shoot a bolt of space lightning up your ass.

I'm incredibly tired of watching the rich get richer in CFB.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I'm incredibly tired of watching the rich get richer in CFB.

That was ND during the Vinnie Cerrato era. Our rivals had to get the NCAA to change the rules just to stop us.

At some point this has to stop being what others are doing and start being about what ND is failing to do in order to compete. A million bucks is life-changing money for a family like the Keeleys. Our boosters could easily match whatever he's being offered. If we lose him based on our refusal to do so, that's an entirely self-inflicted wound.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

NIL != P4P

Kyle Hamilton made nearly seven figures last year off 100% legal NIL deals, making him one of the highest NIL earners. Mayer will be similar this year. If you're an All- American at ND, you're not banking less than elsewhere.

But we don't do big upfront P4P because it's illegal. Other schools seem to be getting around it via boosters. We can either get with the 'gram and let our boosters do the same, or prepare to lose CJ Carr the same way as Keeley.

What is a law without any punishment? Its a suggestion.

That is the state of the NIL rules. There is no punishment for going against the intent of the law. John Ruiz is flaunting his rule-breaking and lawyers are salivating over the opportunity to sue the NCAA if they ever try to punish anyone. But we continue to follow the suggestion instead of living in reality.

 

[INLaw]

Wouldn't want to see some of you guys after a breakup in high school.

You would if you were a fan if heavy intoxicant usage

 

[FDNYIrish1]

I’ve said it before. Notre Dame is an elite academic institution. There is no way the alumni don’t have the intellect to figure out how to cheat better than our southern counterparts. As long as the checkbooks aren’t in their back pockets that won’t leave their seats at the stadium. Let’s Goooo!!!

 

[Irish du Nord]

These are kids at the end of the day.

Children is more like it for some of them

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

I’ve said it before. Notre Dame is an elite academic institution. There is no way the alumni don’t have the intellect to figure out how to cheat better than our southern counterparts. As long as the checkbooks aren’t in their back pockets that won’t leave their seats at the stadium. Let’s Goooo!!!

Umm, who wants to tell this guy about NDs ethical stance on rules....

 

[FDNYIrish1]

Umm, who wants to tell this guy about NDs ethical stance on rules....

You want to win or bitch about ethics on a message board? Let’s Gooooo!!!

 

[T Town Tommy]

I think you are missing the gray area, wherein millions of dollars are promised, we understand the black and white.

Just being honest in a moment of vulnerability, I really hope the worst for Alabama football moving forward. When someone sits on top for so long and then is able to seamlessly glide into the new era of P4P, you can't help but hope for lots of injuries, philandering coaches, and a loss of control at the administrative level.

TTT, the team success you've been able to enjoy has been enough for multiple lifetimes. My envy consumes me. It's about time for things to turn south. I'd like to call on all the good Catholics on this board to light a candle for this request. If you're protestant, then sola fide shall give us this. If you're Mormon, I don't know something about magic glasses and revelation and underwear and elders. If you're a Scientologist, then may L Ron shoot a bolt of space lightning up your ass.

I'm incredibly tired of watching the rich get richer in CFB.

When Freeman has a recruit on a visit, he should have the ability to pull out a presentation with a list of companies a mile long that have shown the willingness to work with current and former players involving NIL. I don’t buy into the upfront P4P argument. Coaches have everything they need in order to show a recruit what they can expect to make under NIL and are free to make those deals themselves. ND should be leading the pack with this and if they aren’t, then they better adjust or risk falling further behind. No way Bama or 99% of other schools could keep up.
As far as Bama, they will eventually go through another 20+ years of purgatory soon enough. Enjoy the ride while you can and realize it doesn’t last forever.

 

[Irishdrunk]

Isn't Bowen also looking at his options as well?

 

[Gold1]

Umm, who wants to tell this guy about NDs ethical stance on rules....

Who cares about one or two 18 year olds. Tired of all the KK and PB drama. Buh-bye!

ND has a couple likely first round NFL draft prospects on the dline and likely one at safety this year. That combined with a dynamic surprise passing in Tyler Buchner and ND will be the talk of the college football this fall. Other recruits will take notice and will fill out 2023 recruiting in excellent form. And 2024 will likely be even better. Go Irish!

 

[NDpendent]

Isn't Bowen also looking at his options as well?

Bowen will end up signing with Notre Dame