'22 NJ QB Steven Angeli (Notre Dame Signee)

[ulukinatme]

When has Pyne consistently showed he is a capable QB? Not in a controlled scrimmage that is the spring game or in an actual game. It’s time to move on from the fantasy that Pyne will be an improvement.

Highest QBR in the two games he played in last year. Probably would have won that Cinci game if he played the entire time.

Also, for what it's worth, Pyne scored 1 TD against Marshall in 2 series while Buchner scored 2 TDs playing 11 series. Buchner also threw a pick 6 though, so he effectively took one of those TDs off the board. In the end TB played almost the entire game and put us up by the same number of points as Pyne.

Buchner may give the offense another "dimension" but he's certainly not shown any consistency yet either and Drew has been the better pocket passer. For all TB's wheels it hasn't produced a lot of points. Just 24 points this year, 17 failed drives with one being a pick 6. Pyne averages a score (Usually a TD) almost every 2nd possession between the Wisconsin, Cinci, and Marshall games.

But he played crummy in a Spring Game, so...he's garbage because Spring Games with their weird rules and mixed up rosters mean everything

 

[BilboBaggins]

Way I see it:

-Start Angeli
-Pull Lugg and Correll, move Patterson back to center, start Kristofic and Spindler at guard.
-Have Tyree split time at receiver as a slot.
-Reduce Lenzy's reps, start Merriweather.
-Increase Cross' and Smith's reps to send a message to Jayson.
-Reduce Bertrand and Bauer's reps, play more Kollie, Sneed and Junior.

I'm ND is going to roll with a true freshman QB, I want all of the veterans I can muster playing with him. It'd be a desperation move to bench Lugg for a first-time starter.

 

[Crazy Balki]

I'm ND is going to roll with a true freshman QB, I want all of the veterans I can muster playing with him. It'd be a desperation move to bench Lugg for a first-time starter.

We're 0-2 and just lost to Marshall.

EVERY move right now is a desperation move, because this is a desperate situation.

I don't care if Spindler is a 1st time starter, because Lugg has like 20 starts under his belt and continues to play like shit. Experience means jack if the guy is physically incapable of doing what he needs to. He and Correll were awful against Ohio State and they were somehow worse against Marshall. What's the point of going with the more experienced player if he's going to make rookie mistakes while also being physically subpar?

 

[PigtownIrish]

I'm ND is going to roll with a true freshman QB, I want all of the veterans I can muster playing with him. It'd be a desperation move to bench Lugg for a first-time starter.

All the more critical to move Patterson to center to call protections.

 

[Luckylucci]

Rees tried to recruit over Angeli twice, just sayin.

 

[TNUtoNotreDame]

Rees tried to recruit over Angeli twice, just sayin.

Sounds like a recipe for success!

 

[BilboBaggins]

We're 0-2 and just lost to Marshall.

EVERY move right now is a desperation move, because this is a desperate situation.

I don't care if Spindler is a 1st time starter, because Lugg has like 20 starts under his belt and continues to play like shit. Experience means jack if the guy is physically incapable of doing what he needs to. He and Correll were awful against Ohio State and they were somehow worse against Marshall. What's the point of going with the more experienced player if he's going to make rookie mistakes while also being physically subpar?

Yeah but the season isn't a complete loss, so it's premature to just accept a 2007 outcome that we'd get from trotting out a lineup of freshmen.

Correll can definitely go, but I think the argument is that Alt/Kristolfic managed in 2021 and ND should go back to that, so slide Patterson over and call it a day.

It would simply be a disservice to a freshman QB to surround him with other rookies. We have no idea if Merriweather can run routes. He is probably objectively worse than the guy is isn't starting over.

 

[SeekNDestroy]

The last QB ND got from Bergen Catholic had a pretty good freshman year.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Yeah but the season isn't a complete loss, so it's premature to just accept a 2007 outcome that we'd get from trotting out a lineup of freshmen.

Correll can definitely go, but I think the argument is that Alt/Kristolfic managed in 2021 and ND should go back to that, so slide Patterson over and call it a day.

It would simply be a disservice to a freshman QB to surround him with other rookies. We have no idea if Merriweather can run routes. He is probably objectively worse than the guy is isn't starting over.

It would be a disservice to Angeli to have him play behind Lugg.

This isn't about playing for the future, this is about accountability and trying to get your best players out there. We want to have our best 5 on the OL and it's CLEAR that Lugg is not one of those 5, he CAN'T be.

Lugg has consistently shown to be a complete liability in pass protection. It was the case last year when he was at tackle and it's even more apparent now that he's at guard, which he is worse at. He is frankly, one of the worst pass protecting linemen I have EVER seen play for ND. I think you'd have to go back to later Weis years to find somebody as bad as him. The only thing he's really good at is one-on-ones in run blocking. That's it. Any stunts and he's useless, he can't pull, he's just the epitome of a one-trick pony which makes for a subpar guard.

As for Merriweather and whether he can run routes. LENZY CAN'T RUN ROUTES! Dude is consistently running horrible routes, taking himself out of plays and not coming back, that is if he's not dropping passes and being overall inconsistent.

Merriweather may not have proven himself in practice yet, but at this point, you need to send a message. The way Lenzy is playing, he isn't going to be of any help to our QB. He needs to get his head out of his ass and start playing with some consistency that we should expect from a 5th year. His play so far has just been flat out unacceptable for a guy who should be LEADING this unit.

 

[ulukinatme]

 

[IrishLax]

I think Pyne will start but that they will move on to Angeli at some point in the near-ish future if Pyne struggles as expected.

Regardless of all of that, you have to bench both Lugg and Correll at this point. Lugg is out of eligibility and Correll has proven that he will never be the answer. You need to use the remaining 10 games to build for next year, and that means getting reps for Spindler and Schrauth if possible.

I would also go ahead and move on to Jr. at ILB and maybe look at ways to get Kollie/Sneed some reps. Get your best athletes on the field, who cares if they blow assignments this year. And then I would maybe consider getting some fresh blood in at DT but I dunno if any of the guys sitting can do any better. Holy cow do we miss MTA and Hinish up front... super surprising.

 

[stlnd01]

I think Pyne will start but that they will move on to Angeli at some point in the near-ish future if Pyne struggles as expected.

Regardless of all of that, you have to bench both Lugg and Correll at this point. Lugg is out of eligibility and Correll has proven that he will never be the answer. You need to use the remaining 10 games to build for next year, and that means getting reps for Spindler and Schrauth if possible.

I would also go ahead and move on to Jr. at ILB and maybe look at ways to get Kollie/Sneed some reps. Get your best athletes on the field, who cares if they blow assignments this year. And then I would maybe consider getting some fresh blood in at DT but I dunno if any of the guys sitting can do any better. Holy cow do we miss MTA and Hinish up front... super surprising.

Perhaps we shouldn't have taken the loss of multi-year starters in the middle of our defense for granted but kind of all did, didn't we? Neither was flashy but they played good football.

 

[IrishLax]

Perhaps we shouldn't have taken the loss of multi-year starters in the middle of our defense for granted but kind of all did, didn't we? Neither was flashy but they played good football.

I think I did because we had so many veteran 4* guys to fill their shoes and neither Hinish nor MTA was a home run NFL talent. They were *very good* but not like "how shit how can we possible replace this top 10 pick." We are really soft on both sides of the ball right now and it's jarring.

 

[stlnd01]

Highest QBR in the two games he played in last year. Probably would have won that Cinci game if he played the entire time.

Also, for what it's worth, Pyne scored 1 TD against Marshall in 2 series while Buchner scored 2 TDs playing 11 series. Buchner also threw a pick 6 though, so he effectively took one of those TDs off the board. In the end TB played almost the entire game and put us up by the same number of points as Pyne.

Pyne's TD "drive" was 32 yards, aided by a penalty. Every time he dropped back he looked indecisive and started dancing around back there, at a moment in the game when every second mattered and probably he should have been throwing as quickly as possible to keep the chains moving. He also threw a pick.

It was a really difficult spot for anyone to walk into, for sure. And I'll trust the staff here. But haven't seen much out of Pyne that inspires confidence, TBH, especially not with this OL and receiving corps. If it's Angeli they play I'm fine with that.

 

[stlnd01]

I think I did because we had so many veteran 4* guys to fill their shoes and neither Hinish nor MTA was a home run NFL talent. They were *very good* but not like "how shit how can we possible replace this top 10 pick." We are really soft on both sides of the ball right now and it's jarring.

Same. A reminder that there's a difference between "home run NFL talent" and "very effective college football player."

 

[Riddickulous]

Rees tried to recruit over Angeli twice, just sayin.

Given how poorly Rees evaluates QBs, if he thought someone was better, he was probably wrong.

 

[dad4aa]

Pyne's TD "drive" was 32 yards, aided by a penalty. Every time he dropped back he looked indecisive and started dancing around back there, at a moment in the game when every second mattered and probably he should have been throwing as quickly as possible to keep the chains moving. He also threw a pick.

It was a really difficult spot for anyone to walk into, for sure. And I'll trust the staff here. But haven't seen much out of Pyne that inspires confidence, TBH, especially not with this OL and receiving corps. If it's Angeli they play I'm fine with that.

He threw two picks but one was negated due to a Marshall penalty. I agree it was a very tough situation to be forced into but he definitely looked totally lost out there.

 

[stlnd01]

He threw two picks but one was negated due to a Marshall penalty. I agree it was a very tough situation to be forced into but he definitely looked totally lost out there.

Oh right I'd blocked that out. To be fair Marshall had 12 guys on the field. Still a bad pass tho.

 

[Irish#1]

We're 0-2 and just lost to Marshall.

EVERY move right now is a desperation move, because this is a desperate situation.

I don't care if Spindler is a 1st time starter, because Lugg has like 20 starts under his belt and continues to play like shit. Experience means jack if the guy is physically incapable of doing what he needs to. He and Correll were awful against Ohio State and they were somehow worse against Marshall. What's the point of going with the more experienced player if he's going to make rookie mistakes while also being physically subpar?

And it shouldn't be. We shouldn't have lost to Marshall, but the quickest way to lose a team is to make a lot of changes. It tells the team you don't know what you're doing.

Want Spindler to get some time? Fine, just rotate him in and see how he does. If he does okay, you can ease Lugg out as the game goes on.

 

[Irish#1]

And in the blink of an eye, Angeli is the most popular player on the team!

 

[Free Manera]

Pyne is fine as a reliever but I don't know ND can beat anybody on the schedule besides maybe Navy and UNLV with him starting.

He is basically Tommy Rees without the benefit of Theo Riddick, TJ Jones, Michael Floyd, or Davaris Daniels. You can't just float balls out there if you don't have dudes that are going to go up and get 50-50 balls.

 

[NDFAN2008]

I’m on the Angeli bandwagon he looked good in the spring game and was accurate and he’s more of a runner than Pyne can create stuff on his feet.
Going forward I’d like to see the following.
1. Move Patterson back to center
2. Get Tobias Merriweather on the damn field
3. Running back 1 has to be Chris Tyree
4. Keep doing what we are on defense but get some more young guys out there (Tyson Ford)

 

[irish4ever]

I’m on the Angeli bandwagon he looked good in the spring game and was accurate and he’s more of a runner than Pyne can create stuff on his feet.
Going forward I’d like to see the following.
1. Move Patterson back to center
2. Get Tobias Merriweather on the damn field
3. Running back 1 has to be Chris Tyree
4. Keep doing what we are on defense but get some more young guys out there (Tyson Ford)

Yes, yes and yes!!!!! And I would even agree with #2 as well.

 

[Luckylucci]

Elston has this same exact line playing much better football. Coaching matters and as much as we wanted to believe our rockstar recruiters were equal or better coaches, they are clearly not.

 

[BeauBenken]

I think I did because we had so many veteran 4* guys to fill their shoes and neither Hinish nor MTA was a home run NFL talent. They were *very good* but not like "how shit how can we possible replace this top 10 pick." We are really soft on both sides of the ball right now and it's jarring.

What concerns me here is as you pointed out, these aren't kids that haven't been here. How do we look like we are physically outmatched in between the tackles? It's not for a lack of size. I know too that it's not the mental attitude being taught by Hiestand. Nobody in the interior of the line should get bullied around.

Maybe it should have been a small red flag when the team said Chris Smith is one of the strongest guys they've ever seen? The guy from Harvard is out lifting us? Say it ain't so Balis.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Elston has this same exact line playing much better football. Coaching matters and as much as we wanted to believe our rockstar recruiters were equal or better coaches, they are clearly not.

Elston had two "bigs" in the middle/edge with Kurt and MTA. I think that loss is hurting a lot. I am curious how Elston would compare with this roster though.

 

[pumpdog20]

Way I see it:

-Start Angeli
-Pull Lugg and Correll, move Patterson back to center, start Kristofic and Spindler at guard.
-Have Tyree split time at receiver as a slot.
-Reduce Lenzy's reps, start Merriweather.
-Increase Cross' and Smith's reps to send a message to Jayson.
-Reduce Bertrand and Bauer's reps, play more Kollie, Sneed and Junior.

This, all of this.

 

[pumpdog20]

Rees tried to recruit over Angeli twice, just sayin.

And Rees sucks at evaluation and development.

 

[Dale]

I don’t know what Washington would have “coached” for a veteran like Jayson A to suddenly not be good. It’s not like Washington is coaching him to just get pancaked 1-1. Jayson A has talked the talk and not backed it up, period.

I don’t know who is responsible for the vanilla DL calls Golden or Washington but that needs to change.

Cross we’ve always known is disruptive but undersized at NT so I’m not shocked to see the pros and cons of that choice over Lacey.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Way I see it:

-Start Angeli
-Pull Lugg and Correll, move Patterson back to center, start Kristofic and Spindler at guard.
-Have Tyree split time at receiver as a slot.
-Reduce Lenzy's reps, start Merriweather.
-Increase Cross' and Smith's reps to send a message to Jayson.
-Reduce Bertrand and Bauer's reps, play more Kollie, Sneed and Junior.

Only tweak I would make is make Tyree the feature back. Diggs can’t see the field until he can block in the backfield. Whether it’s b/c his shoulder isn’t 100% or just poor effort, he can’t expect to throw a chicken wing block and stop the LB from getting to the QB.

Get some LBs in there that can fill a gap…quit catching tackles...they remind me of our OL under Quinn when they’d catch blocks instead of firing off.

If Foskey/Patterson/Jayson can’t realize they are losing money each game, then I don’t know what else can motivate them to play better. All three have been underwhelming & have a lot of work to do if they want to sniff the first few rounds of the draft.