‘21 AL QB Riley Leonard (Duke Transfer - Notre Dame Verbal)

[Irish#1]

Ah, the TR and BK QB debate again.

Both to blame.

BK was a lazy recruiter and poor judge of QB talent as a recruiter. Some of that might have rubbed off on TR when BK was here.
But, TR got 8 wins out of Drew Pyne last year and signed Carr and Minchey after BK left.

BK got a lot of of Daniels and has an easier time recruiting now, despite being lazy. TR turned Milroe (who looked awful to start the year) into a playoff QB.

It will be interesting to see what happens with TR does at Bama with recruiting moving forward if he stays a few years.

Who is this BK you keep referring to?

 

[NDWarrior]

Which is why I am not 100% blaming/out on Parker. This was not his offense. It was what Freeman wanted to run.

If that's true and the team of GP/GG/MB/DM for the O have different ideas for 2024 (and well because, it doesn't look like there are going to be any other coaching personnel changes at this point), I'm willing to see what they come up with and be all in. Let's go Irish! TAMU week 1!

 

[Terry Jillery]

Has Porker ever ran RPO? I assume that's our new offense with Riley. Kind of a big deal that no one's talking about.

Agree. No chance he picks ND unless they told him they’re going to utilize his skill set.

 

[ulukinatme]

If it's a personnel issue, we now have Porker's ideal QB, WRs, and the running game to move everything. There is no excuse for this to not be a playoff team next season besides bad coaching and scouting. It's make or break for Freeman and his staff, point blank.

Parker had a lot of talent to work with this year, even if the WRs were banged up. You tailor your gameplan to the players you have. The issues in the big games this year had nothing to do with talent disadvantages, they were strictly coaching. Obviously we poured on the points against teams where we had a strong talent advantage. I just have no confidence Parker will show us any different next season, he'll objectively have a more inexperienced team with less talent at many positions. I don't think that's a recipe for better success.

 

[IAIrish]

Which is why I am not 100% blaming/out on Parker. This was not his offense. It was what Freeman wanted to run.

Do you think that's Freeman's rationale for keeping him? Essentially because he was a good soldier who followed instructions?

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Parker had a lot of talent to work with this year, even if the WRs were banged up. You tailor your gameplan to the players you have. The issues in the big games this year had nothing to do with talent disadvantages, they were strictly coaching. Obviously we poured on the points against teams where we had a strong talent advantage. I just have no confidence Parker will show us any different next season, he'll objectively have a more inexperienced team with less talent at many positions. I don't think that's a recipe for better success.

I think the failures were multiple and everyone likes to make overly broad statements after a year of disappointment. After 2022, we should've gotten rid of Washington and Golden was on the hot seat (according to many on this forum).

This year, it's Parker.

Parker failed to score enough points in our biggest games, it just so happens those were also the best defenses we faced.

Parker also had way less talent at wideout than you're willing to admit. Thomas, who was our projected receptions leader at the outset of the season, was injured for like 10 games. Colzie was injured and closed it down to save a year. Greathouse was injured. The top TE target, Mitchell, was injured. Didn't get Raridon back until the last couple games.

He had Flores and Tyree consistently. He had Faison at week 7 onward. Flores and Faison couldn't play multiple roles as true freshman, one being awarded a scholarship on his callup. It was an absolute mash unit that started the seasons 3 WRs below ideal numbers.

If you want to have a dynamic, high-scoring offense, you must have consistent WRs that can get separation and we didn't have that. Merriweather, who we expected to emerge, was a Ghandi-level pacifist when the ball was in the air so Hartman started ignoring him.

Now, if we want to say: He's the OC, he has to produce then I completely agree. But if we really want to look at the failures of this past year, we should honestly review the contributing factors.

Our WR room is already better in terms of numbers and proven production. I'd love to add one more transfer to the freshman class but even without that, we should be able to find a 6-7 man rotation out of: Collins, Mitchell, Greathouse, Faison, Colzie, Thomas, KK Smith, Cam W., Gilbert and Saldate.

It'll still require at least one freshman to be ready to contribute unless all of the other WRs ahead of them pan out. We're still about 2 short of what you should have. And we're losing Estime who was an absolute monster, capable of extending drives.

Parker will have improved talent in many areas but a new set of questions to answer. Excited for the offseason as the offense should look very different.

 

[Luckylucci]

I don't think the offenses problems were personnel. The offense, at times, lacked the use of basic concepts that help create advantages for it's personnel. It's been well documented. No need to re-hash them.

Something was wrong with the entire operation. I just find it hard to believe that they're going to fix that in one off-season with a new system. If, Freeman is truly going outside his comfort zone and allowing GP to implement a new system, I'd much rather have a new, more experienced coach, putting that together.

 

[stlnd01]

Do you think that's Freeman's rationale for keeping him? Essentially because he was a good soldier who followed instructions?

I think Freeman pretty clearly stated his rationale for keeping Parker in one of the end-of-season press conferences: Freeman talked about how he struggled his first year as DC in Cincy. Fickell kept him, had faith in him, Freeman learned and the defense got better.

I’d guess he’s predicting/hoping for a similar path for Parker.

 

[pumpdog20]

Way too much blame going to Parker (and I'd like someone new as well). I think more of it goes to Hartman, or he gets to share it with Guidugli. He either came in expecting to save himself behind a good line and just sling it, or he wasn't that good.

 

[notredomer23]

Way too much blame going to Parker (and I'd like someone new as well). I think more of it goes to Hartman, or he gets to share it with Guidugli. He either came in expecting to save himself behind a good line and just sling it, or he wasn't that good.

The answer is always Del until the receiver room has healthy numbers IMO

 

[ulukinatme]

I think the failures were multiple and everyone likes to make overly broad statements after a year of disappointment. After 2022, we should've gotten rid of Washington and Golden was on the hot seat (according to many on this forum).

This year, it's Parker.

Parker failed to score enough points in our biggest games, it just so happens those were also the best defenses we faced.

Parker also had way less talent at wideout than you're willing to admit. Thomas, who was our projected receptions leader at the outset of the season, was injured for like 10 games. Colzie was injured and closed it down to save a year. Greathouse was injured. The top TE target, Mitchell, was injured. Didn't get Raridon back until the last couple games.

He had Flores and Tyree consistently. He had Faison at week 7 onward. Flores and Faison couldn't play multiple roles as true freshman, one being awarded a scholarship on his callup. It was an absolute mash unit that started the seasons 3 WRs below ideal numbers.

If you want to have a dynamic, high-scoring offense, you must have consistent WRs that can get separation and we didn't have that. Merriweather, who we expected to emerge, was a Ghandi-level pacifist when the ball was in the air so Hartman started ignoring him.

Now, if we want to say: He's the OC, he has to produce then I completely agree. But if we really want to look at the failures of this past year, we should honestly review the contributing factors.

Our WR room is already better in terms of numbers and proven production. I'd love to add one more transfer to the freshman class but even without that, we should be able to find a 6-7 man rotation out of: Collins, Mitchell, Greathouse, Faison, Colzie, Thomas, KK Smith, Cam W., Gilbert and Saldate.

It'll still require at least one freshman to be ready to contribute unless all of the other WRs ahead of them pan out. We're still about 2 short of what you should have. And we're losing Estime who was an absolute monster, capable of extending drives.

Parker will have improved talent in many areas but a new set of questions to answer. Excited for the offseason as the offense should look very different.

At no point during the season did I think this offense got better. Sure, we put up a lot of points on cupcakes, we had the talent to do it. We blew it on coaching mistakes in the OSU game, that was a winnable game. Clemson was winnable too, you can't go 6 failed drives at the end after starting with 5-6 failed ones, not to mention taking Play Action out of the playbook and leaving Estime on the sidelines. The Louisville game was what it was, we would have needed a whole different gameplan and probably more rest/healthy bodies. We probably underestimated them a bit too. We upgraded at arguably almost every position going into this year with nearly a full compliment of experienced starters except at TE (Mitch turned out pretty good though). I get that we were banged up at WR, which probably would have been a good time to lean on the running game more and feed Estime. It certainly would have opened up the Play Action. Instead we're throwing Air Raid against Clemson with a beat up WR group when Estime and Hartman combined for nearly 170 yards on the ground.

 

[ab2cmiller]

I was willing to give Parker the benefit of the doubt
I did give Parker the benefit of the doubt.
I reached a breaking point after his "explanation" on why we only ran 2 play actions against Clemson. I would've had more respect for him if he would've simply ignored the question. If he would've ignored the question, I would've feared the worst, instead he confirmed the worst.

 

[irishff1014]

I have been critical of Freeman for some things he has done, I am not a fan of Parker but I will 100% give anyone credit that had anything to do with getting Riley here. This is an absolute great effort. Outstanding job coaches and recruiting staff.

 

[ThePiombino]

...but I will 100% give anyone credit that had anything to do with getting Riley here.

F.U.N.D.

Sent from my Pixel 8 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[irish4ever]

I still can't get over that he could have been an NFL draft pick

But ND injured him, and now got him...
Oh the irony
Devine intervention

Run the table next year with him under the helm and ND gets another Heisman trophy recipient along with another natty. 2 yrs. later, another one in CJ Carr and another natty. Things are coming together for the Irish!!!

 

[IRISHDODGER]

At no point during the season did I think this offense got better. Sure, we put up a lot of points on cupcakes, we had the talent to do it. We blew it on coaching mistakes in the OSU game, that was a winnable game. Clemson was winnable too, you can't go 6 failed drives at the end after starting with 5-6 failed ones, not to mention taking Play Action out of the playbook and leaving Estime on the sidelines. The Louisville game was what it was, we would have needed a whole different gameplan and probably more rest/healthy bodies. We probably underestimated them a bit too. We upgraded at arguably almost every position going into this year with nearly a full compliment of experienced starters except at TE (Mitch turned out pretty good though). I get that we were banged up at WR, which probably would have been a good time to lean on the running game more and feed Estime. It certainly would have opened up the Play Action. Instead we're throwing Air Raid against Clemson with a beat up WR group when Estime and Hartman combined for nearly 170 yards on the ground.

I think both VDP & you make compelling cases on both sides. I think OC GP is top of the list but agree that it wasn’t all on him. You’re spot on regarding Clemson. Still can’t fathom the thought process in that game.

 

[rtrn2glory]

Just watched his highlights on YouTube. I got Ian Book vibes. And despite the unpopularity of that to some people around here, I for one love it

 

[IRISHDODGER]

 

[TheRealLynch51]

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Just watched his highlights on YouTube. I got Ian Book vibes. And despite the unpopularity of that to some people around here, I for one love it

I think he’s more Deshone Kizer. Book could run but he wasn’t good at read-option. Kizer was too & has similar stature (isn’t Leonard ~6’5”, 225 lbs?).

Kizer’s ability to keep & hurt defenses w/ his legs helped out Josh Adams & CJ Prosise tremendously. I’m hoping Leonard’s run threat does the same for Love & Price

 

[INLaw]

Solidly mediocre. I would rather us go 8-3 with Angelli or Carr than go 9-2 with Leonard. Develop our recruited players...they want to be here for 3-4 years and a small cheque rather than 1 year and a big cheque. We have landed decent QB's from average programs...not good.

OK Boomer there are now 12 games in the regular season

 

[bumpdaddy]

I don't think the offenses problems were personnel. The offense, at times, lacked the use of basic concepts that help create advantages for it's personnel. It's been well documented. No need to re-hash them.

Something was wrong with the entire operation. I just find it hard to believe that they're going to fix that in one off-season with a new system. If, Freeman is truly going outside his comfort zone and allowing GP to implement a new system, I'd much rather have a new, more experienced coach, putting that together.

This is all true and I'd like to add that consistency from game to game, especially on the road, was a big problem. Think about the games that featured dumb penalties at inopportune times like NC St. and Duke. Think about the games where the OL inexplicably struggled like against Duke and especially against Louisville when the coaches thought it was a good idea to experiment with a weird rotation at every OL position except LT. And, of course, think about the inconsistencies Hartman had, starting with the UL game.

That all speaks to poor preparation in some weeks and good preparation in other weeks. MF needs to figure out how to get Parker and the offense to perform at a much more consistent level each week and throughout the season. We can't keep asking why the team didn't seem ready to play some weeks.

 

[ulukinatme]

I think he’s more Deshone Kizer. Book could run but he wasn’t good at read-option. Kizer was too & has similar stature (isn’t Leonard ~6’5”, 225 lbs?).

Kizer’s ability to keep & hurt defenses w/ his legs helped out Josh Adams & CJ Prosise tremendously. I’m hoping Leonard’s run threat does the same for Love & Price

I agree, but I don't think Kizer was really good at the read option either, he struggled like Hendrix and Book with whether to keep it or give it. That's why Mike Sanford changed the offense up in 2015 when Zaire went down, he got away from it. While it was a limited sample size, Zaire when healthy was probably the best I've seen at the Read Option. Kizer would just beat teams with his legs when plays broke down, he'd have all kinds of open field when DBs were deep trying to cover Fuller.

 

[Jimmy3Putt]

Just watched his highlights on YouTube. I got Ian Book vibes. And despite the unpopularity of that to some people around here, I for one love it

Ian Book with NFL measurable sounds like a pretty good player.

 

[NDWarrior]

A lot of truth here and in line with what we're all saying... Can Notre Dame reinvent its offense with Riley Leonard? A lot is riding on Duke transfer QB

 

[NDWarrior]

A lot of truth here and in line with what we're all saying... Can Notre Dame reinvent its offense with Riley Leonard? A lot is riding on Duke transfer QB

From the article: But when the Duke transfer arrives at Notre Dame, the hard work required to bring all of that out will begin. And not just for Leonard. Offensive coordinator Gerad Parker and quarterbacks coach Gino Guidugli will be charged with maximizing Notre Dame’s investment in Leonard in a way they did not with Hartman. And they’ll have to microwave installing a new offense that may return just two starters from the set-up that faced Navy in August.

 

[Irish#1]

Ian Book with NFL measurable sounds like a pretty good player.

I hope he has a better arm than Book.

 

[NDpendent]

So at this point last year the Hartman Thread wasn't even started yet and Riley Leonard already has more posts in this thread then the Sam Hartman Thread.

 

[Circa]

I really don't understand the view point of all the people that are complaining about ND going to portal to get a QB. I've seen dozens of people in chats and forums say that going to the portal will cause guys to leave. So say we didn't go to the portal and Angeli was named the starter...he's a guy who is perceived not to have NFL talent so he would be at ND for 3 years. Do people really think that Carr or Minchey will transfer sitting behind Leonard for a year but wait it out for 3 years behind Angeli? Would Angeli stay if Minchey was named the starter? And if it was Carr, you risk both Minchey and Angeli leaving because they're not waiting 3 years to start. Bringing Leonard for one year was the right move. Next year you let Minchey and Carr compete because you'll have Deuce at least if one of Carr or Minchey leave. You don't want a 3 year starter at QB with the portal because talented QBs aren't waiting that long and it could hurt depth and recruiting. I think that's what happened with Ian Book.

Well Said Sir. Very understood and true.

To add a bit... BK just had his Manti Teo moment...without the Netflix doc. (never Know tho)
QB's are a dime a dozen until the right mix of men, and wr's get together and play ball...

#BelieveMF

Go Irish!

 

[ndfanatic78]

Just watched his highlights on YouTube. I got Ian Book vibes. And despite the unpopularity of that to some people around here, I for one love it

Dude is taller and bigger than Ian Book and has a much bigger arm.