2016-2017 Notre Dame Men's Basketball

arrowryan

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Not very many 6'10+ guys who can ball their brains out and the one's that can are at Kentucky, Kansas, UCLA, North Carolina, Duke, etc.

But can we get a guy with just a little bit of athletic ability? Jesus Christ, it looks like Geben has to think and tell himself which foot goes in front of the other foot when he's running down the court.

This team has a lot of growing up to do before they can even think about the NCAA tournament. Right now they have 0 quality wins and I'd be surprised if they finish in the top 8 in the ACC standings
 

irishfan

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Put Auguste on this team and we're easy top ten. No clue why he can't land a decent 5.
 

phillyirish

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Put Auguste on this team and we're easy top ten. No clue why he can't land a decent 5.

There aren't too many decent 5's in college as a whole. There's a reason why being 7 feet tall automatically gives you a 17% chance to make the NBA.
 

arrowryan

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Put Auguste on this team and we're easy top ten. No clue why he can't land a decent 5.

Because he never offers a big that has a realistic chance of going to ND. He'll offer the bigs that are getting attention from the big time schools but he never seems to have a back up plan.

Brey needs to do a better job preventing these 2ms half shit shows and start recruiting big guys so he doesn't have to rely on a 6'5" to guard a 6'10" guy all game long
 

phillyirish

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Because he never offers a big that has a realistic chance of going to ND. He'll offer the bigs that are getting attention from the big time schools but he never seems to have a back up plan.

Brey needs to do a better job preventing these 2ms half shit shows and start recruiting big guys so he doesn't have to rely on a 6'5" to guard a 6'10" guy all game long

Interestingly Brey has always relied on that undersized bruiser to play the post: Harongody, Cooley and now Colson. The one time he had a true 5 in Auguste, he was finally able to have success in the tourney.
 

NDgradstudent

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The lack of bigs seems to be a systematic problem; hopefully it can be fixed in the future.

This game was eerily similar to the Crossroads game vs. IU last year, where we also blew a 15+ point lead. However, I don't recall last year's team being so bad in the second half consistently (I might go back and look at the stats on that)- in other words, the IU game last year was the exception rather than the rule. This year, we've played 5 P5 teams and been outscored in the second half against 4 of them.

So what needs to change? I only have two ideas.

Certainly in this game and the Villanova game we've had massive FT disadvantages (~3x vs. Villanova and ~2x today). That needs to change going forward.

The other thing is more strategic use of the bench. Our players seem tired in the second half.

Blowing a 7 point halftime lead vs. Villanova is annoying but understandable. Blowing a 14 point halftime lead vs. a mediocre Purdue team is indefensible. The good news is I have confidence Brey will figure things out.
 

Woneone

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The Farrell critics (and I was one) were not "wrong" about Matt Farrell. He flat out was bad last year. Did not look like he belonged on a D-I team. Anyone who thought he would be this good this year was basing it off nothing but homerism.

The kid has been balling out and I'm glad he turned things around so much.

I only start with this post because I've avoided the ND Basketball thread since the Nova game (took me some time to recover).

I could go player by player through the Mike Brey era and point out players like Farrell who have thrived in Junior/Red Shirt Senior year, but I think you know, which sort of disappoints me in this type of response. Sorry, they were flat out wrong. There are no two ways about that. Saying someone doesn't belong, not even be on the team, and then watching them be the best offensive player on a top 25 team the next year is, well, exactly the definition of being wrong. You can call it "homerism" if it makes you feel better about being so down on a player, that's fine, but don't act as if this hasn't been the norm in Brey's tenure. No one said he was great, or even good last year, but the blatant attacks were pretty brutal. Again, saying it's "homerism" is just trying to make people feel better about being so wrong.

It's one thing to say "Hey, he shouldn't be playing right now" and "Hey, he shouldn't even be on the team". He played instrumental minutes in the tourney last year, and has balled out this year. There is a whole hell of a lot of room between "Not a DI player" and what he's doing now. Thinking he was going to be this good? No, no one thought that. But people did think he should be removed from the team. Again, there is a right and wrong answer, and that was wrong.

Hat's off to Matt Painter. He adjusted perfectly to our game plan. Now, it helped that Vasturia was awful, and VJ decided since things weren't going his way, he'd throw in the towel on defense, but that's the first time in a while I think I've seen Brey get out coached.

Geben was good today at what we asked him to do. Problem was, Painter countered our line-up and created mismatches. He played Swanigan and Edwards (the good one, not the out of control guard (Sorry NDGrad, couldn't help it)). Bonize had to guard another undersized 4 that could blow by him. Geben couldn't guard Swanigan on the outside (he played him pretty well in the post).

I don't agree with NDGrad that Purdue is a bad team, that's silly (no, they aren't the defending champ, but did they play in the Fiesta Bowl last year? You'd be hard pressed to find any respectable person who says Purdue isn't a good team). But to have them play our game and get beat, that's tough to swallow.

We need a second big, and stat. Give Mooney a shot. Give Burns a shot. Torres is pretty bad, and basically removes one option on offense. We can't count on downshifting all the time. Sometimes, it just isn't gonna work.

EDIT: If anything, I would have loved to see us play 4 around 1 with the 1 being Geben.

EDIT2: Was the foul situation in the second half actually 17-6? That is literally mind-blowing if true. I even made the comment that Swanigan would have to literally punch someone to pick up number 4.
 
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Irish#1

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So blowing huge leads against mediocre teams is now becoming our m.o. in the Crossroads Classic. Sad!

If you think Purdue is a mediocre team, then we must be a pathetic team. Purdue is a very good team this year and Swanigan is as good as most anyone in the country. He was recruited by Kentucky, Duke, IU, Sparty and several other big programs. Purdue will probably have three players make All B1G Ten.

Bottom line, we lack size inside and it will hurt against good teams.
 

irishtrain

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Student athletes vs pro prospects sound familiar. Really enjoy watching these guys play basketball- great example of team ball and college guys giving it their best. Brey is a stud coach and it would be nice for them to have just one pro prospect to complement their other very good parts.
 

Irish#1

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Student athletes vs pro prospects sound familiar. Really enjoy watching these guys play basketball- great example of team ball and college guys giving it their best. Brey is a stud coach and it would be nice for them to have just one pro prospect to complement their other very good parts.

That's his shortcoming. If he could consistently have one NBA prospect each year, he would tear it up.
 

irishff1014

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If you think Purdue is a mediocre team, then we must be a pathetic team. Purdue is a very good team this year and Swanigan is as good as most anyone in the country. He was recruited by Kentucky, Duke, IU, Sparty and several other big programs. Purdue will probably have three players make All B1G Ten.

Bottom line, we lack size inside and it will hurt against good teams.

Against good teams the 2nd half ND team doesn't play like the first half.
 

Ndaccountant

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Vb is a major disappointment. He has been playing solid but no where near what I think he could be. SV needs to stop forcing things too. If Breyer wasn't so loyal to seniors and benched those two for the last 10 minutes ND might have won. I am legitimately concerned that Jan will cost ND a decent seed .
 

RDU Irish

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Frustrating to fade late in two big games vs. top level teams. But this is December and we have the best conference in the country to play in. Better to lose these now and peak in March than be on top of the world now with nowhere to go but down. Those games will play dividends - March level intensity in early/mid December is pretty uncommon.

Brey is giving meaningful minutes to 8-9 guys versus 6-7 normally. Matt Ryan, Rex and TJ add real threats and Torres's 5 fouls will be valuable over the course of the season. Geben keeps looking like more of an asset and less of a placeholder. Steve, VJ and Bonzi add up to enough size to handle most lineups and Geben brings the extra muscle they need to compete with the rest.

Fun team - really excited to get into ACC play and see how we shake out. Playing the ACC Tourney in NYC is garbage though. Bring it back to Carolina where it belongs (so I can watch in person).
 

BabyIrish

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Irish beat Colgate tonight. After the game, Matt Farrell and his parents were surprised by his big brother bo serving in Afghanistan with the US Army. Really cool moment.
 

NDgradstudent

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<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ARo8HsW6apU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

Sherm Sticky

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2016-2017 Notre Dame Men's Basketball

Irish beat Colgate tonight. After the game, Matt Farrell and his parents were surprised by his big brother bo serving in Afghanistan with the US Army. Really cool moment.


.


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Sherm Sticky

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Frustrating to fade late in two big games vs. top level teams. But this is December and we have the best conference in the country to play in. Better to lose these now and peak in March than be on top of the world now with nowhere to go but down. Those games will play dividends - March level intensity in early/mid December is pretty uncommon.



Brey is giving meaningful minutes to 8-9 guys versus 6-7 normally. Matt Ryan, Rex and TJ add real threats and Torres's 5 fouls will be valuable over the course of the season. Geben keeps looking like more of an asset and less of a placeholder. Steve, VJ and Bonzi add up to enough size to handle most lineups and Geben brings the extra muscle they need to compete with the rest.



Fun team - really excited to get into ACC play and see how we shake out. Playing the ACC Tourney in NYC is garbage though. Bring it back to Carolina where it belongs (so I can watch in person).



Well North Carolina has to change their law. Until then no post season ACC games no matter what sport will be played there.


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Woneone

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Not sure where else to put this, but since we really only have one college basketball thread:

Grayson Allen is just dirty. I said it last year after his trips, not to mention how many times he undercut guys on layups that people didn't focus on, but he did it again tonight, then cried. He needs to sit.
 

Woneone

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Game day!

Vs. Pitt

We should win.

Why?

- Pitt isn't very good defensively. This isn't a Jamie Dixon team of the past. They score more, and play less defense. Against Maryland (The only Pitt game I've watched), they basically leaned on Maryland missing shots while keying on one offensive weapon (Trimble in this case). Maryland hit their first few outside shots, and then missed literally everything else. We won't do that.

- Kevin Stallings - This is a bit of point A. Stallings is a good coach with mediocre talent, but unfortunately, when he has good talent, they seem to perform the exact same as a team with lesser talent. I don't believe this was an ACC upgrade for Pitt, and I think it will show in league play. You have to have an identity in the ACC (Virginia, Duke, UNC, ND, Louisville). What was Stallings teams identity at Vandy? Underperforming?

Keys to the game:

1.) Keep them off the foul line - Pitt's guards aren't very good. You have to pressure them into making mistakes and keep the ball from being entered into the post. As a team, Pitt averages nearly 28 FT per game, 15 of those being between Artis and Young.

2.) Geben's first test - This is the first game we actually need a post performance from Geben. Micheal Young is good - top 5 post good in the ACC. He needs to play solid D and rebound against a team that is big across the board.

3.) Who can create off the dribble? - Farrell is the only player so far that has proven they can create off the dribble. Since we can't play through the post (Micheal Young won't be calling for a double against Colson when we go small), how do we create open looks? Our offense can't just be swinging the ball from side to side.

4.) How do our bigs off the bench respond? Torres, Burns, Mooney... We're going to need one to play, and play well.

5.) And on that note - Points in the paint. Force tough shots from players that aren't used to having to create on their own. We do a good job of pinching off the post (sometimes), but Vasturia and VJ need to keep the next pass out of the paint, which we've been awful at.

This is perfect start for ACC play to see how we're going to respond. They aren't as good defensively as they used to be, as big as some of the teams we will play, or as talented, but they should give us a glimpse into our ACC future.

90-82 ND.
 

phillyirish

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Crazy game, great win. Surprised nobody was posting during the game. Great to grind out a tough win in OT, for our best win on the year.

ESPN box score doesnt show minutes, but little concerning that our bench combined for 10 points, 3 rebounds and 3 assists. Gonna need more production from that going forward especially in an overtime game like tonight.

On to Louisville next week!!
 

clashmore_mike

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Pretty pretty good comeback win in OT to open up ACC play. Vasturia hit a 3 with 2.5 left in OT for the 78-77 win.
 
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