2014 Fall Camp Thread

[arrowryan]

II Summer Defense Notes

-Trumbetti and Cage have impressed. Sampson expects him to challenge for a lead pass rushing role (3rd and long scenarios). Cage being able to challenge for 5-10 snaps per game would benefit the DL depth a lot. We know what we have in Sheldon and Jarron. Jarron seems to have matured quite a bit. Everything is fine with Hayes as he's just getting used to censoring his social media habits a bit.

- Joe Schmidt is more than just a place holder and leader. They expect him to surprise people. The staff expect Grace to contribute this fall. In what fashion remains to be seen but positive vibe coming from program. Not a prediction but will interesting if Elijah Shumate gets a look at SAM LB. (I've thought for some time that Elijah seems to fit the hybrid LB that BVG likes in his sytem)

-Not much on CB he'll be adding to this but Watkins seems to be the real deal. Riggs is comfortable within the program and feels good about being here.

Anything on Redfield?

 

[Luckylucci]

Anything on Redfield?

No, Sampson definitely over promised and under delivered on this segment. He was saying how he was going to have this mega post with a lot of goods on summer workouts/training and this is what he put out. He did say he was waiting on other sources so he should have more soon. Which I'll add at that time.

 

[arrowryan]

No, Sampson definitely over promised and under delivered on this segment. He was saying how he was going to have this mega post with a lot of goods on summer workouts/training and this is what he put out. He did say he was waiting on other sources so he should have more soon. Which I'll add at that time.

Well TIFWIW but there is someone that I play softball with and he was able to talk with one of the coaches and he said that Redfield is going to be a stud. I'm waiting on someone like Loy or Sampson to say the same thing so I can get really excited, but that's what I was told.

He said that he will be a Taylor Mays with a higher football IQ

 

[Luckylucci]

Well TIFWIW but there is someone that I play softball with and he was able to talk with one of the coaches and he said that Redfield is going to be a stud. I'm waiting on someone like Loy or Sampson to say the same thing so I can get really excited, but that's what I was told.

He said that he will be a Taylor Mays with a higher football IQ

Thanks for sharing. It wouldn't surprise me, in fact I'd be surprised if he didn't produce like that over his career.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I'm not sure if the offensive line will be better at run blocking. Heistand is a great coach but he's more of a technician than a drive block your defender kind of coach. I've never watched him coach and I'm basing my opinion solely on the way his linemen play - they are neutral in their stance as opposed to slight forward lean, they have great feet and utilize body position to screen defenders from the play rather than driving defenders out. I realize the system dictates blocking scheme but every scheme in football is better when your hogs can drive block someone down the field. Spread, power spread, whatever...some things never change.

You're likely far more knowledgeable on this subject than I, 19, but aren't there different "types" of OL recruits? Zone-blocking schemes put a premium on tall, long, athletic guys with good footwork. Man-blocking schemes seem to place a higher value on strength and aggression. We've obviously been targeting the former, and a program like Michigan targets the latter. As a result, their OL is (theoretically) better at blowing opposing DL off the ball consistently, but our OL is (again, theoretically) better at other things.

If my line can kick the shit out of your line, I'm going to run the ball effectively and probably win the game. I'm being overly critical, but I'd like to see a line with a healthy mix of technique and aggression.

It would definitely be nice to have an OL that could "do it all", but for any team not named 'Bama, that hardly seems like a reasonable goal these days.

Golson will help keep a defense honest provided he hits his target consistently. A nasty offensive line and a running back committed to gaining positive yardage is more important, in my opinion.

That's the MANBALL mindset that MGOBlah is always circle-jerking about. Seems like the football equivalent of those who complain that the world is going to shit simply because the US isn't showing enough "leadership." If our President would just lead, everything would be rainbows and sunshine; If Kelly would just commit to the run, we'd win all our games!

You either run to pass, or pass to run. Kelly does the latter. 'Bama's the only team that can conceivably commit to "3-yards and a cloud of dust" anymore, and even they can't do it reliably enough for Saban's tastes.

Great teams can run against an eight man box. It's not impossible.

I don't think that's realistic, especially with the caliber of defense ND is regularly facing.

 

[pkt77242]

You're likely far more knowledgeable on this subject than I, 19, but aren't there different "types" of OL recruits? Zone-blocking schemes put a premium on tall, long, athletic guys with good footwork. Man-blocking schemes seem to place a higher value on strength and aggression. We've obviously been targeting the former, and a program like Michigan targets the latter. As a result, their OL is (theoretically) better at blowing opposing DL off the ball consistently, but our OL is (again, theoretically) better at other things.



It would definitely be nice to have an OL that could "do it all", but for any team not named 'Bama, that hardly seems like a reasonable goal these days.



That's the MANBALL mindset that MGOBlah is always circle-jerking about. Seems like the football equivalent of those who complain that the world is going to shit simply because the US isn't showing enough "leadership." If our President would just lead, everything would be rainbows and sunshine; If Kelly would just commit to the run, we'd win all our games!

You either run to pass, or pass to run. Kelly does the latter. 'Bama's the only team that can conceivably commit to "3-yards and a cloud of dust" anymore, and even they can't do it reliably enough for Saban's tastes.



I don't think that's realistic, especially with the caliber of defense ND is regularly facing.

Stanford? Wisconsin, though they don't really go for the 3 yards and a cloud of dust.

 

[NCND]

Well TIFWIW but there is someone that I play softball with and he was able to talk with one of the coaches and he said that Redfield is going to be a stud. I'm waiting on someone like Loy or Sampson to say the same thing so I can get really excited, but that's what I was told.

He said that he will be a Taylor Mays with a higher football IQ

If u look at his high school video, u can tell it's only gonna be a matter of time.

 

[ulukinatme]

He said that he will be a Taylor Mays with a higher football IQ

I hope he ends up being better than Taylor Mays. Mays hit like a girl

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/hA5bpJU2eJQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[GoldenDomer]

What even happened to Mays in the league? Was he just hyped up because he was an athletic freak?

 

[arrowryan]

What even happened to Mays in the league? Was he just hyped up because he was an athletic freak?

I looked him up yesterday and he plays for the Bengals. Idk if he starts but he gets some PT

 

[irishog77]

I think Mays was critical, right after the draft, of Petey not drafting him to the Seahwaks, instead opting for some dude named Earl Thomas.

 

[Irishman77]

Earl Thomas is a top 3 safety in the nfl. Mayes is a physical specimen that lacks coverage skills big time.

 

[GoldenDomer]

I don't think the Legion of Boom needs Mays

 

[CraigKrenzel]

I hope he ends up being better than Taylor Mays. Mays hit like a girl

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/hA5bpJU2eJQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I was sitting next to Mays and Maualuga at a bar one night in downtown Cincy. Didn't realize who Mays was, asked Maualuga, who told me. I literally referenced this video. Had just watched it earlier that afternoon. "Oh, funny, I was just watching this video of him getting worked by Golden Tate earlier today." Maualuga turns to Mays, asks, "Did Golden Tate work you?" Without hesitation, "Yeah." Explains a couple plays to him. Was amazing.

I've probably told that story on here before.

Mays found a pretty good niche last year in Zimmer's defense as a sort of safety/linebacker. Not sure if he'll be on the squad this year or not (injury knocked him out last season). I'm rooting for him.

 

[ulukinatme]

I was sitting next to Mays and Maualuga at a bar one night in downtown Cincy. Didn't realize who Mays was, asked Maualuga, who told me. I literally referenced this video. Had just watched it earlier that afternoon. "Oh, funny, I was just watching this video of him getting worked by Golden Tate earlier today." Maualuga turns to Mays, asks, "Did Golden Tate work you?" Without hesitation, "Yeah." Explains a couple plays to him. Was amazing.

I've probably told that story on here before.

Mays found a pretty good niche last year in Zimmer's defense as a sort of safety/linebacker. Not sure if he'll be on the squad this year or not (injury knocked him out last season). I'm rooting for him.

Okay, Mays is okay with me since he was man enough to admit he was schooled and not be bitter about it. They did win the game after all.

 

[JughedJones]

I was sitting next to Mays and Maualuga at a bar one night in downtown Cincy. Didn't realize who Mays was, asked Maualuga, who told me. I literally referenced this video. Had just watched it earlier that afternoon. "Oh, funny, I was just watching this video of him getting worked by Golden Tate earlier today." Maualuga turns to Mays, asks, "Did Golden Tate work you?" Without hesitation, "Yeah." Explains a couple plays to him. Was amazing.

I've probably told that story on here before.

Mays found a pretty good niche last year in Zimmer's defense as a sort of safety/linebacker. Not sure if he'll be on the squad this year or not (injury knocked him out last season). I'm rooting for him.

That's so awesome.

Dreamlike stuff. Well... for ND nerds, it's dreamlike anyway!

 

[arrowryan]

TIFWIW, but O'Malley ranks Tranquill as the top freshman going into camp. If all of the talk about him impressing the staff in summer workouts, I'm really happy the staff finally offered him.

 

[Wild Bill]

TIFWIW, but O'Malley ranks Tranquill as the top freshman going into camp. If all of the talk about him impressing the staff in summer workouts, I'm really happy the staff finally offered him.

The freshman most ready to contribute or the most talented freshmen?

 

[arrowryan]

The freshman most ready to contribute or the most talented freshmen?

He didn't really specify. He just said that he could be in rotation in the front 7 and potentially start a few games.

 

[Ironman8]

He didn't really specify. He just said that he could be in rotation in the front 7 and potentially start a few games.

He could be great in the SAM linebacker role. Hopefully Turner or Onwaulu are good enough Drue isn't forced into action before he is ready this year, but I think eventually that role is his.

 

[arrowryan]

He could be great in the SAM linebacker role. Hopefully Turner or Onwaulu are good enough Drue isn't forced into action before he is ready this year, but I think eventually that role is his.

Is that the strong side linebacker? That's where he said he could be a potential starter

 

[irishog77]

Personally, I hope Councell is the Sam this year.

 

[Ironman8]

Is that the strong side linebacker? That's where he said he could be a potential starter

Yes. See Coach Thiel's breakdown of each of the front 7 positions and their responsibilities in the thread on IE or on TurningPoint's website. Great read to familiarize yourself with the positions in BVG's defense and what is expected of each.

I think Drue could be very good there, factoring in how heady he is and his physical abilities in considering what he would be asked to do.

 

[Ironman8]

Personally, I hope Councell is the Sam this year.

I just don't know how great he could be in coverage this year coming off his injury. If the current guys eyed at that spot are smaller, quicker / faster guys like Onwaulu, Turner and Tranquil, hard for me to imagine the much bigger Councell being a perfect fit there especially coming off his injury.

I personally would like to see Councell as a pass rusher / blitzer, or as a MIKE. But that's just my opinion.

*Caveat - this is against normal pass heavy or spread teams. Against teams like Navy, Stanford or Michigan State, I would rather see Councell used there as a Jumbo extra run defender - like Coach Thiel's example of Jake Ryan in Michigan's D the past couple of years.

 

[Wild Bill]

Yes. See Coach Thiel's breakdown of each of the front 7 positions and their responsibilities in the thread on IE or on TurningPoint's website. Great read to familiarize yourself with the positions in BVG's defense and what is expected of each.

I think Drue could be very good there, factoring in how heady he is and his physical abilities in considering what he would be asked to do.

It was a good read and really hammered the importance of the SAM position in BVG's defense. I agree, Drue could grow into a really good SAM. I just think he's going to have a hard time shedding blocks from long, athletic, powerful blockers. It's going to take some time to develop that skill.

 

[irishog77]

I just don't know how great he could be in coverage this year coming off his injury. If the current guys eyed at that spot are smaller, quicker / faster guys like Onwaulu, Turner and Tranquil, hard for me to imagine the much bigger Councell being a perfect fit there especially coming off his injury.

I personally would like to see Councell as a pass rusher / blitzer, or as a MIKE. But that's just my opinion.

*Caveat - this is against normal pass heavy or spread teams. Against teams like Navy, Stanford or Michigan State, I would rather see Councell used there as a Jumbo extra run defender - like Coach Thiel's example of Jake Ryan in Michigan's D the past couple of years.

Yeah, I don't know how he'll be either, post-injury. But assuming he's healthy, I'd prefer him. If he's not, then yeah, that's a different matter.

As far as a smaller LB playing against run-heavy teams, didn't BK and Diaco receive praise for bringing in a smaller guy like Slaughter as an extra LB? On the surface, I tend to agree with you, but perhaps BK does not. Or maybe Diaco did not, but BVG will.

 

[Wild Bill]

Personally, I hope Councell is the Sam this year.

I agree with you. Councell is never getting hooked if he's coached properly. He's too long and athletic. He's good enough in coverage and his height will help him cover taller tight ends. I think he could struggle against a down hill run game but no worse than anyone else on the depth chart. I really hope he's healthy and ready to play.

 

[Luckylucci]

I agree with you. Councell is never getting hooked if he's coached properly. He's too long and athletic. He's good enough in coverage and his height will help him cover taller tight ends. I think he could struggle against a down hill run game but no worse than anyone else on the depth chart. I really hope he's healthy and ready to play.

So thats kind of opposite from conventional thinking. Most think, like Ironman stated, that he'd be better suited for power run teams than guys like Turner, Tranquill, etc. And it seems pretty obvious him being quite a bit bigger and stronger than the others in that group.

 

[Wild Bill]

So thats kind of opposite from conventional thinking. Most think, like Ironman stated, that he'd be better suited for power run teams than guys like Turner, Tranquill, etc. And it seems pretty obvious him being quite a bit bigger and stronger than the others in that group.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think he's a bad run defender. I think he is absolutely the best option at SAM. Staying low, engaging and shedding blocks does not appear to be his strong suit. He looks more natural when he's in space and free to use his athleticism. If he's on the line playing over the tight end, his athleticism is neutralized b/c there is no space. If someone is trying to run down hill on us, he's going to be engaging blockers at the snap to set the edge and squeeze the line.

Given the athleticism of modern tight ends, I'd prefer a guy like Counsel over a stout SAM backer. It's just really tough to set the edge against a team that is trying to run downhill, especially for a long, lean, athletic backer.

 

[ResLife Hero]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>RT <a href="https://twitter.com/BGI_DanMurphy">@BGI_DanMurphy</a>: Brian Kelly will meet with the media to open the 2014 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> football season at noon this Friday (Aug. 1).</p>— Andrew Owens (@BGI_AndrewOwens) <a href="https://twitter.com/BGI_AndrewOwens/statuses/494560399384006657">July 30, 2014</a></blockquote>
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