2012 Fall Camp Thread

[IrishLion]

Yes it was scheduled way ahead of the Lo stuff but no, we aren't in game week. Still 11 days until Dublin. I wouldn't expect a QB announcement yet but if you have been watching or listening over the past month, you know the starter.

I'm too pumped for Golson to get his shot, it just doesn't feel right until BK makes it official with an announcement. I know all signs point to Golson, but still...

 

[DillonHall]

I would venture a guess that the press conference was scheduled before this happened to Lo. Probably just a state of team address...with a qb being named...since we are in game week now.

What peoria said... I wish we were in a game week.

 

[tdbaum1]

What peoria said... I wish we were in a game week.

I know it's not game "week". What I meant by that is that we are no longer in camp, but instead practicing for Navy. It seems to me that you would want to name a starter at this point and not wait.

 

[Grimm]

Lo Wood done with an Achilles injury. Damn!

Brutal. Poor kid. He must be devastated. Achilles can be difficult to recover from. Hope he can make it back next year.

I was thinking Russell and Shumate would play roles even without injuries. But this could mean more substantial playing. You also have to figure one or two more guys will be dinged up at some points during the season. I hope if we get real leads in Navy and Purdue that Kelly plays young guys to build some game experience. I would rather win by less and build some depth.

Also, if we get another injury, do you start thinking about playing Neal on D for parts of the season? Going with guys that are not only young but with limited or no experience at CB seems like a tough call when playing USC and OK. There is alot of skill and speed on our offense, and you could still give him a few plays on offense even if he moved over. Neal is the most highly rated DB on the team coming out of HS (I think) and hard to argue this isnt the bigger need.

 

[IrishFaninTX]

Yeah, i think Kelly probably will have to consider moving Neal to CB or maybe having him train for both offense and defense like McDaniel is supposedly doing just in case. I think between Toma, Riddick, and Carlisle, they can handle slot and Neal may be needed much more on D now.

 

[IrishLion]

Brutal. Poor kid. He must be devastated. Achilles can be difficult to recover from. Hope he can make it back next year.

I was thinking Russell and Shumate would play roles even without injuries. But this could mean more substantial playing. You also have to figure one or two more guys will be dinged up at some points during the season. I hope if we get real leads in Navy and Purdue that Kelly plays young guys to build some game experience. I would rather win by less and build some depth.

Also, if we get another injury, do you start thinking about playing Neal on D for parts of the season? Going with guys that are not only young but with limited or no experience at CB seems like a tough call when playing USC and OK. There is alot of skill and speed on our offense, and you could still give him a few plays on offense even if he moved over. Neal is the most highly rated DB on the team coming out of HS (I think) and hard to argue this isnt the bigger need.

Just playing Devil's advocate, but with the question marks in the secondary as it is, it can also be argued that the talent should stay on the offensive side, since we may need to just outscore everyone to win anyway.

And before everyone jumps on me, I know that the front seven is good enough to erase some of those questions, and that Defense Wins Championships!!!, etc.

However, BK was one second away from taking UC to a Natl Championship, and the defense was a question mark that whole season. How did he do it? His offense simply outscored everyone. He didn't move DJ Woods, his stud freshman receiver, to corner just because he had two new starters. He kept the most electric athletes on offense and let his D-coordinator win with scheme and strategy.

Davonte Neal needs the ball in his hands, Bob Diaco has great hair, he'll figure out a way to get quality out of whoever is the next CB to step in.

EDIT: I also realize that UC doesn't play nearly as difficult a schedule as ND, but even so, putting up 40 ppg and going 12-0 is mighty impressive. And there were a few decent offenses in the Big East that year as well, so it wasn't a cakewalk for UC.

 

[Riddickulous]

So who starts at corner? Jalen Brown?

 

[TerryTate]

We'll find out tomorrow at the presser

Jalen Brown or Josh Atkinson most likely

Maybe Slaughter slides down and McCarthy / Farley steps in at Safety.

I doubt it's the latter, given how important the safety position is in this defense

 

[NDPhilly]

IMO you put Slaughter at CB and Start Farley at Safety. That makes CB a Strength of the team while Safety is ok with Zeke (who i anticipate makes a big jump) and Farley.

 

[phgreek]

Brutal. Poor kid. He must be devastated. Achilles can be difficult to recover from. Hope he can make it back next year.

I just did one a couple years ago (my second), and it was 6 months, and I was back to full bore hiking the back country...not the same but, I'm old. With a kid who is in that good of shape he could realistically be riding a stationary bike at 2 months, jogging on it in 4 months, be running on it in the spring, and for sure full go by fall.

My honest opinion is, the timing, type, and duration of PT are the big difference as I compare what changed between the time I did my first one and my second. Although I'm no surgeon...I'm sure thats improved as well.

He'll be back next year...I hope he has my luck and the second one doesn't go until he's 40 something...if at all.

 

[Who'saWildManNow]

I'm going to give my best attempt at assuming the players mentality about this.
Bennett Jackson

Shout outs to my boy Lowood23 Dboys goin ride for him this season!!

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

Leon Hall tore his achilles last november. He is playing this preseason and was cleared to play full go in July. Just another athlete with the same injury....could be a good point of reference

 

[polishjuice4]

Persa, Northwestern QB, tore his Achilles, came back the next year and really wasn't the same. I think he was going to play for a NFL team but it bothered him too much, and he has to sit out this year, and maybe get surgery. So, hopefully it doesn't end up like this.

 

[ChiefSecond]

Just playing Devil's advocate, but with the question marks in the secondary as it is, it can also be argued that the talent should stay on the offensive side, since we may need to just outscore everyone to win anyway.

And before everyone jumps on me, I know that the front seven is good enough to erase some of those questions, and that Defense Wins Championships!!!, etc.

However, BK was one second away from taking UC to a Natl Championship, and the defense was a question mark that whole season. How did he do it? His offense simply outscored everyone. He didn't move DJ Woods, his stud freshman receiver, to corner just because he had two new starters. He kept the most electric athletes on offense and let his D-coordinator win with scheme and strategy.

Davonte Neal needs the ball in his hands, Bob Diaco has great hair, he'll figure out a way to get quality out of whoever is the next CB to step in.

EDIT: I also realize that UC doesn't play nearly as difficult a schedule as ND, but even so, putting up 40 ppg and going 12-0 is mighty impressive. And there were a few decent offenses in the Big East that year as well, so it wasn't a cakewalk for UC.

^^THIS

I've always maintained that we'll never ever field a defense like in the SEC...and we dont have to. Not just this season, but long term, we're going to make it because of our offense lighting people up. We'll always have good linebackers and safeties, but CB's and D-lineup will never be truly elite (this yr's d-line is very solid, NOT elite).
Our offense can be the best in the nation though in a couple years..no question.
Keep davonte and our best athletes on offense and let's go.

and before you make a charlie weis crack remember that BK almost did it with far inferior talent on both sides of the ball with UC...and another kelly is using this model at oregon.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

We'll always have good linebackers and safeties, but CB's and D-lineup will never be truly elite (this yr's d-line is very solid, NOT elite).

ND was 4th nationally against the run in 2011. That's elite. If we'd gotten even mediocre pass rushing out of our OLBs last season, there wouldn't even be a shadow of doubt.

Why won't we ever have elite CBs? We were on track to land the top CB class in the nation last year until things fell apart at the end, Blanton was a 5th round draft pick, etc.

 

[IrishMoore1]

Defense wins championships. Period.

 

[Redbar]

There is no doubt that it is better to field an elite defense and manufacture offense than the other way around.

 

[IrishLion]

There is no doubt that it is better to field an elite defense and manufacture offense than the other way around.

I wholeheartedly agree with you, but moving Davonte Neal to corner is not going to make the entire secondary (or defense) elite. Even if he were to move to corner, and earn All American honors as a freshman with 9 interceptions and a few defensive scores, there still isn't enough (proven) depth behind him to say that the secondary would be elite because of his addition. And depth across the board on defense wins championships.

And I still think he simply has too much potential as an offensive weapon to move to defense. Because of an overall lack of proven depth in the secondary, I say let him develop on offense where he will eventually aid in simply outscoring everyone, and hence taking pressure off of the defense as a whole.

I understand it's easier to manufacture offense with "mediocre" players, especially when it's BK, and especially when he has a good QB, but my opinion is heavily weighted by the fact that BK has never had such a talented offensive weapon to develop from day one. He got Floyd as a junior, and Mardy Gilyard at UC was a sophmore. Isaiah Pead may be the exception, but still not quite the same because he wasn't a five star athlete with nearly unlimited potential. I think BK drools over the thought of what he can do with the offense if Golson turns into a star and Neal is everything he is supposed to be. There will literally be too much talent for any defense to hope to stop.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Defense wins championships. Period.

Except for the last runs by Texas and Auburn.

 

[Domina Nostra]

IMO you put Slaughter at CB and Start Farley at Safety. That makes CB a Strength of the team while Safety is ok with Zeke (who i anticipate makes a big jump) and Farley.

I'd rather have an inexperienced CB with good safety help, than a converted CB with questionable safety help.

 

[BGIF]

I wholeheartedly agree with you, but moving Davonte Neal to corner is not going to make the entire secondary (or defense) elite. Even if he were to move to corner, and earn All American honors as a freshman with 9 interceptions and a few defensive scores, there still isn't enough (proven) depth behind him to say that the secondary would be elite because of his addition. And depth across the board on defense wins championships.

...

9 INTS! One more than ND's entire team last year? "... with a few defensive scores?

And you wouldn't move him?

I'd move Wood, Eifert, Riddick, Golson, or ANYBODY on Offense IF they were All American Defensive Caliber with the ability to more than double last year's TEAM Interception Total. That would take ND from #93 to a Top 5 Defensive Pass Unit. Alabama only had 13 INTs as a Team.

Jeff Burris was a prime time HS RB and Holtz turned him into an All-American DB who also was a prime time scoring maching for ND in the Full House Backfield.

Vontez Duff ???

An AA CB makes ND's defensive squad elite. Take the current team and add Shane Walton. USC's passing game would get cut in half. Denard's popfly TDs passes would be Pick 6's.


Unfortunately Neal isn't a AA DB nor is he an AA WR.

You might want to rephrase your hyperbole.




BTW, Walton's "Depth" at CB was Jason Beckstrom and Duff's was Clifford Jefferson and ND had no where near the Front 7 in front of them like today's Front 7.

 

[TheChosen1]

IMO you put Slaughter at CB and Start Farley at Safety. That makes CB a Strength of the team while Safety is ok with Zeke (who i anticipate makes a big jump) and Farley.

Said the same thing in Lo's thread

 

[BGIF]

ISD Freebie

ISD Freebie

Lo Wood Out For The Season

Monday, 20 August 2012 20:11 Sean Stires

...

Irish Sports Daily has confirmed that field cornerback Lo Wood has suffered an Achilles injury that will require him to miss the entire season.

...

Wood was regarded by most as a liability for his play last year, mostly because of the crucial touchdown pass to Robert Woods he gave up in the USC game. However, the junior had been able to put that behind him in just a little more than two weeks of fall camp. Head coach Brian Kelly recently singled him out for his drastically improved play.

“If you asked me after the first five days who the guy that has impressed the staff the most, it’s Lo Wood,” Kelly said of Wood early in camp. “He’s 192 pounds, up from 178, breaking on the ball, tackling (and) communicating.”

...

Bennett Jackson remains in place at Notre Dame’s boundary cornerback position, but the injury to Wood makes an already thin secondary even thinner before the season has even kicked off.

Freshman KeiVarae Russell, a converted running back, and sophomore Jalen Brown, who saw no game action last year, are now the next players in line to start at field corner.

...

Josh Atkinson has been working hard at the position all fall as well, but has appeared to slip a little on the depth chart in recent days. The Irish have used an expanded 11 on 11 format in practice this fall. Turns out, it was a pretty good idea.

 

[ab2cmiller]

Given the crazy thin depth chart, I would not be surprised if Neal flips to CB. He was rated as the #5 CB by scout last year and his High School coach said if he were his college coach, he would put him at CB. I believe he would excel at CB, it could be his best position.

However, part of me wants him to stay at WR because we all believe he will be dynamic on offense. But if Kelly were to announce that Neal is staying at WR, despite zero depth at CB, it would confirm all of our dreams on how good coach thinks Neal will be on offense.

I'm ok with either offense or defense, but I can almost guarantee you that even if Neal stays at WR, he will start to do some moonlighting at CB, in case his services are needed on an emergency basis. We already have no depth, and we haven't played a single game. What are the chances that we will go the entire season with the all of the remaining players staying healthy in the secondary?

 

[Grahambo]

Given the crazy thin depth chart, I would not be surprised if Neal flips to CB. He was rated as the #5 CB by scout last year and his High School coach said if he were his college coach, he would put him at CB. I believe he would excel at CB, it could be his best position.

However, part of me wants him to stay at WR because we all believe he will be dynamic on offense. But if Kelly were to announce that Neal is staying at WR, despite zero depth at CB, it would confirm all of our dreams on how good coach thinks Neal will be on offense.

I'm ok with either offense or defense, but I can almost guarantee you that even if Neal stays at WR, he will start to do some moonlighting at CB, in case his services are needed on an emergency basis. We already have no depth, and we haven't played a single game. What are the chances that we will go the entire season with the all of the remaining players staying healthy in the secondary?

Both. I think he can play mostly offense and dabble on defense with getting more reps on defense later on in the season if the offense can afford to not need him.

 

[BGIF]

... What are the chances that we will go the entire season with the all of the remaining players staying healthy in the secondary?

What are the chances we get through the next two weeks without additional injuries.


Unless there is a better prospect, I'd cross train him now at CB and use him on offense like Golden Tate was used as a freshman. If the other CBs show they can handle the load, then increase his offensive level of the playbook.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

We will see at noon, but I am thinking Neal stays on offense. It will tell us a lot about what Kelly really thinks of this team. If he thinks a lot of it he will let a player grow up; Next man in. If not, he will panic and do what many of you are suggesting.

But remember. This staff has never talked about that kind of vassilation in recruiting players or playing them when they got her. Kelly said Neal is all offense; Russel moved because they didn't know where he best fit in.

 

[ab2cmiller]

We will see at noon, but I am thinking Neal stays on offense. It will tell us a lot about what Kelly really thinks of this team. If he thinks a lot of it he will let a player grow up; Next man in. If not, he will panic and do what many of you are suggesting.

So moving Neal to CB would mean the following?

Tells us Kelly doesn't think much of this team
Tells us Kelly is not willing to let a player grow up
Tells us Kelly is panicking

SMH

I'm ok with whatever Kelly decides wether it's offense or defense, but to imply the above items because of a potential change in direction isn't fair at all. Kelly considered Neal and Russel for the switch earlier this summer and elected to have Neal on offense. That was based upon one set of circumstances. Now those circumstances have changed, coach will once again make the best decision for the team based upon the current situation.

 

[Grahambo]

Sigh..

 

[Veer option]

What are the chances that we will go the entire season with the all of the remaining players staying healthy in the secondary?

Snowballs chance in Hades.

The Irish got lucky last season with the durability of Gray and Blanton.