'20 CT QB Drew Pyne (ND->ASU->MO->BGSU Transfer)

[Irish#1]

Good article. Kid's got a good head on his shoulders.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

https://n.rivals.com/news/rivals-camp-series-top-five-quarterbacks-of-the-2019-tour

Our boy sitting at the top.

 

[Crazy Balki]

https://n.rivals.com/news/rivals-camp-series-top-five-quarterbacks-of-the-2019-tour

Our boy sitting at the top.

And yet, Rivals saw it necessary to drop him 10 spots. Now 82nd overall.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Was he the top regional performer at the last Rivals challenge?

That is great--great--but they are projecting college (sometimes pro) value. It's good to see him filling out, but he still has some physical limitations that are going to keep him from rising above a solid 4-star unless he's just truly flawless at the national camps. If he stays in the Top 100, that is an excellent sign.

And just to be clear, I am not one who thinks you need to, or even should, build a roster on 5-star kids. At QB, I think you try to take a scare-off the competition 5-star QB ever other year, and take a high floor kid like Pyne on the off years, to make sure the competition is fierce and you have a quality kid (like Book) if the high talent kid (like Wimbush) doesn't pan out or gets hurt.

With Pyne's putting on some weight and Clark's great passing year, sandwhiched between Jurcovec and Buchner, the staff is pretty close to the mark.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Was he the top regional performer at the last Rivals challenge?

That is great--great--but they are projecting college (sometimes pro) value. It's good to see him filling out, but he still has some physical limitations that are going to keep him from rising above a solid 4-star unless he's just truly flawless at the national camps. If he stays in the Top 100, that is an excellent sign.

And just to be clear, I am not one who thinks you need to, or even should, build a roster on 5-star kids. At QB, I think you try to take a scare-off the competition 5-star QB ever other year, and take a high floor kid like Pyne on the off years, to make sure the competition is fierce and you have a quality kid (like Book) if the high talent kid (like Wimbush) doesn't pan out or gets hurt.

With Pyne's putting on some weight and Clark's great passing year, sandwhiched between Jurcovec and Buchner, the staff is pretty close to the mark.

Pyne is considered one of the top 2, maybe 3 pro QBs in his class. Not exactly a low-talent kid. Sure, he's not 6'4" but he's still considered a gunslinger and he's been the top QB at the Rivals camp thus far.

He won't be playing 2nd fiddle to anyone on our roster. He'll show up ready to compete.

 

[NDMIA]

Pyne is considered one of the top 2, maybe 3 pro QBs in his class. Not exactly a low-talent kid. Sure, he's not 6'4" but he's still considered a gunslinger and he's been the top QB at the Rivals camp thus far.

He won't be playing 2nd fiddle to anyone on our roster. He'll show up ready to compete.

The Elite 11 will give ND fans a good clue into how he rates vs his competition in this class. They do such a comprehensive study on those QB’s for 3-4 days. Should be fun to see the highlights, rankings, and the report on how he did. I know Brendon Clark didn’t blow anyone away at that camp last year but this year I think Pyne will impress the Elite 11 staff.

 

[benneboy]

Kinda of odd the sites haven't adjusted their evaluation standards a bit on QBs given the last two overall picks in the draft were under 6'.

 

[ab2cmiller]

Kinda of odd the sites haven't adjusted their evaluation standards a bit on QBs given the last two overall picks in the draft were under 6'.

How much do you think they need to adjust? They had Kyler Murray ranked Composite #33 as a 5'10" Dual Threat QB.

 

[BobbyMac]

Kinda of odd the sites haven't adjusted their evaluation standards a bit on QBs given the last two overall picks in the draft were under 6'.

I think they did. Spencer Rattler's right at 6-0 and was #1 on both.

 

[benneboy]

How much do you think they need to adjust? They had Kyler Murray ranked Composite #33 as a 5'10" Dual Threat QB.

Apparently 32 spots.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

People not getting super hyped because he's a 4 star and small.

Meanwhile 3 star Ian Book is taking us to the playoffs.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

 

[Domina Nostra]

Pyne is considered one of the top 2, maybe 3 pro QBs in his class. Not exactly a low-talent kid. Sure, he's not 6'4" but he's still considered a gunslinger and he's been the top QB at the Rivals camp thus far.

He won't be playing 2nd fiddle to anyone on our roster. He'll show up ready to compete.

He's currently the composite #6 pro QB on 247, and #11 overall QB. Maybe he'll move up, but that would be based on camps and 7 on 7s, where smaller, accurate pocket passers have the least disadvantage relative to other style-QBs.

I didn't say he's low-talent, I said he's low-floor. That means you know you are going to get a high quality player that is ready to compete. He's low risk.

Kinda of odd the sites haven't adjusted their evaluation standards a bit on QBs given the last two overall picks in the draft were under 6'.

Like others say, they have. You just have to be freakishly athletic to be a 5'10" 5-star QB. Pyne is a shifty pocket passer. So height matters more.

People not getting super hyped because he's a 4 star and small.

Meanwhile 3 star Ian Book is taking us to the playoffs.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

He does remind me of Ian Book--just a little less shifty, and maybe he throws a touch cleaner.

I think Ian Book is a great QB, but look back at every NC for the past 20 years. You either have either a total physical stud QB (Lawrence, Watson, Jones, Winston, Newton, Tebow, Young) , or you are LSU/Alabama and have an overwhelmingly dominant defense with a traditional 6'2" or taller QB (Alabama and LSU)--sometimes both (Tagovailoa, Russell).

So I am glad to have Pyne, but I don't see him as an elite QB.

 

[NDdomer2]

Wouldn't a low floor indicate at his worst he is really bad? High floor is at his worst he's still productive?

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Wouldn't a low floor indicate at his worst he is really bad? High floor is at his worst he's still productive?

Yes. I think he worded it poorly. I believe he views Pyne as a high floor/low ceiling, whereas other QBs are lower floor but higher ceiling (boom or bust).

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Isn't Trevor Lawerence - yawn

 

[Domina Nostra]

Wouldn't a low floor indicate at his worst he is really bad? High floor is at his worst he's still productive?

Yes. I think he worded it poorly. I believe he views Pyne as a high floor/low ceiling, whereas other QBs are lower floor but higher ceiling (boom or bust).

You are both 100% right. I absolutely meant high-floor. Drew Pyne is a very high floor prospect IMO.

Apologies!

Isn't Trevor Lawerence - yawn

Haha. This would be a better quip if Mr. Lawrence didn't just win the NC.

But even Trevor Lawrence isn't TL without Justyn Ross. IMO, Ross was a HUGE part of his success as a freshman (obviously TL will continue to develop).

In any event, it's very, very helpful that Mr. Pyne will have Jordan Johnson to throw to.

 

[GBdomer]

Isn't Trevor Lawerence - yawn

I still remember people arguing with me that they would take Phil over Lawrence.

 

[Domina Nostra]

I still remember people arguing with me that they would take Phil over Lawrence.

Would you take:

1) Trevor Lawrence + Kevin Austin
2) Phil Jurkovec + Justyn Ross

 

[GBdomer]

Would you take:

1) Trevor Lawrence + Kevin Austin
2) Phil Jurkovec + Justyn Ross

Trevor Lawrence by himself. You can have Phil and Austin and Ross. Trevor Lawrence might leave college with a couple Heismans, couple national championships, first overall pick in the draft last year, this year, the next year, maybe when he was a senior in HS. I just think the dude is that special and he's only gonna get better. Best QB prospect I've ever seen and he's started in like 10 college games and threw 33 TD's and 4 picks.

I created a twitter poll yesterday for the next 15 years would you take Trevor Lawrence or Patrick Mahomes. Out of like 28 votes Lawrence got like 43% of them. If you want a good read go read Phil Jurkovec thread.

 

[Southside Sully]

I still remember people arguing with me that they would take Phil over Lawrence.

GBSully, has never backed off how much he loves TL. Guys an absolute stud and will be fun to watch in 2 years in the NFL.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Trevor Lawrence by himself. You can have Phil and Austin and Ross. Trevor Lawrence might leave college with a couple Heismans, couple national championships, first overall pick in the draft last year, this year, the next year, maybe when he was a senior in HS. I just think the dude is that special and he's only gonna get better. Best QB prospect I've ever seen and he's started in like 10 college games and threw 33 TD's and 4 picks.

I created a twitter poll yesterday for the next 15 years would you take Trevor Lawrence or Patrick Mahomes. Out of like 28 votes Lawrence got like 43% of them. If you want a good read go read Phil Jurkovec thread.

^Pretty much all of this!

 

[NDMIA]

I think Trevor Lawrence is a generational talent and he’ll probably win the next two national championships lol. However, last season according to S&P+ and the Joe Moore Award, Lawrence had either the best or 2nd best offensive line in the entire country. At RB, I think there’s an argument to be made that Travis Etienne was the best RB in college football last season. I wouldn’t be against taking Josh Jacobs, Jonathan Taylor or Darrell Henderson but Etienne is right up there with the best RB’s in college football. Also, he had one of the best 1-2 punches at WR in college football with Tee Higgins & Justyn Ross. Also Hunter Renfroe will have a long career in the NFL I’d bet. The point is, it is really hard to judge how good Trevor Lawrence actually is because of the fact that he’s in charge of perhaps the greatest offense ever assembled. Now he loses his LT & C but returns pretty much everything else so I’d bet he’ll put together another dynamite season. It’ll be interesting when he gets drafted by the worst organization in the NFL and plays with that talent how good he really is. I think he’ll end up being a stud but some people don’t understand just how good the talent is around him.

 

[GBdomer]

I think Trevor Lawrence is a generational talent and he’ll probably win the next two national championships lol. However, last season according to S&P+ and the Joe Moore Award, Lawrence had either the best or 2nd best offensive line in the entire country. At RB, I think there’s an argument to be made that Travis Etienne was the best RB in college football last season. I wouldn’t be against taking Josh Jacobs, Jonathan Taylor or Darrell Henderson but Etienne is right up there with the best RB’s in college football. Also, he had one of the best 1-2 punches at WR in college football with Tee Higgins & Justyn Ross. Also Hunter Renfroe will have a long career in the NFL I’d bet. The point is, it is really hard to judge how good Trevor Lawrence actually is because of the fact that he’s in charge of perhaps the greatest offense ever assembled. Now he loses his LT & C but returns pretty much everything else so I’d bet he’ll put together another dynamite season. It’ll be interesting when he gets drafted by the worst organization in the NFL and plays with that talent how good he really is. I think he’ll end up being a stud but some people don’t understand just how good the talent is around him.

You just don't understand how good Trevor Lawrence is. He lost 1 game in HS and won 3 state titles. Dominated every camp he ever went too, He dismantled, absolutely trashed a Nick Saban led football team that will have every starter play in the NFL and he threw for 347 yards, 3 TD's, no picks and had no turnovers. He started every game at Clemson and he just was silly good. Did they even play in a close game? Sure he's got a lot of talent that's his fault? He has literally dominated every single thing he's ever done on the footballl field.

You mean that LT that didn't even get drafted? I'm not saying having Ross and Higgins doesn't help but Tua has 3-4 WR's that will be early picks on his team and shit son it's not even close when you watch them. My man is 6'6 rocket for an arm, IQ beyond his years. Nick Saban had a month to prepare for a TRUE freshman QB and halfway through that game you could just tell he had no answers. You just need to understand that he is just that special.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Trevor Lawrence by himself. You can have Phil and Austin and Ross. Trevor Lawrence might leave college with a couple Heismans, couple national championships, first overall pick in the draft last year, this year, the next year, maybe when he was a senior in HS. I just think the dude is that special and he's only gonna get better. Best QB prospect I've ever seen and he's started in like 10 college games and threw 33 TD's and 4 picks.

I created a twitter poll yesterday for the next 15 years would you take Trevor Lawrence or Patrick Mahomes. Out of like 28 votes Lawrence got like 43% of them. If you want a good read go read Phil Jurkovec thread.

College football is all about whoever is currently winning, so I know I'm in for it. But I just don't see that.

I just re-watched the first 31 points of the NC, and there was not a single play that I thought, "that was all Trevor Lawrence." He made a few nice throws, and couple of really nice throws, but nothing remarkable. He made a couple of bad throws too. What stood out was the playmakers around him and the game plan. His WRs were wide open and that they, his line, and his RBs were making BIG plays. To say that Trevor Lawrence, rather than Clemson and their coaching staff, dismantled Alabama is pure hyperbole. Watson's performance a few years earlier was much, much more impressive.

It is no doubt remarkable for a kid to stay within the game plan and execute like he did as a freshman in the NC. That amazes me. You'd have to go all the way back to 2018 to find another kid who did that: Tua Tagovailoa. That was also amazing. He was touted as the next big thing after that, and he was good, but...

Anyway, TL is great, and may turn out to be the next big thing. HE CLEARLY HAS ALL THE TOOLS. But like all the Alabama and USC QBs before him, it will be interesting to see him play without the #1 defense keeping all pressure off him.

 

[SoIll]

I still remember people arguing with me that they would take Phil over Lawrence.

those were the days. I think it was this whole board against you and I..

 

[Luckylucci]

Clearly an elite talent and should be one of the best in a long time. But a few details to nipick.

Saban did not have 1 month to prepare for just Clemson/Lawrence. Probably spent most of that on Oklahoma and Kyler Murray.

Also, while Lawrence clearly progressed throughout the year and was playing his best football in the CFP, 2 of his last 3 regular season games were "meh". Against Pitt he had a 50% comp pct. and had a yds/att of 4.91. Those are the types of numbers we crucified Wimbush for. Two weeks before that against Duke, he had a comp pct. of 55% and a yds/att of 6.6. Better than against Pitt but still very underwhelming.

 

[ACamp1900]

I still remember people arguing with me that they would take Phil over Lawrence.

I'll take Phil over Lawrence... just so you can stop bringing it up in past tense.

 

[Crazy Balki]

College football is all about whoever is currently winning, so I know I'm in for it. But I just don't see that.

I just re-watched the first 31 points of the NC, and there was not a single play that I thought, "that was all Trevor Lawrence." He made a few nice throws, and couple of really nice throws, but nothing remarkable. He made a couple of bad throws too. What stood out was the playmakers around him and the game plan. His WRs were wide open and that they, his line, and his RBs were making BIG plays. To say that Trevor Lawrence, rather than Clemson and their coaching staff, dismantled Alabama is pure hyperbole. Watson's performance a few years earlier was much, much more impressive.

It is no doubt remarkable for a kid to stay within the game plan and execute like he did as a freshman in the NC. That amazes me. You'd have to go all the way back to 2018 to find another kid who did that: Tua Tagovailoa. That was also amazing. He was touted as the next big thing after that, and he was good, but...

Anyway, TL is great, and may turn out to be the next big thing. HE CLEARLY HAS ALL THE TOOLS. But like all the Alabama and USC QBs before him, it will be interesting to see him play without the #1 defense keeping all pressure off him.

This.

Lawrence had some remarkable games in the playoffs, and he has an elite skillset, but let's be real here. Justyn Ross and Tee Higgins is the best receiver tandem in college football, and the only one that really compares to that is Jerry Jeudy and Henry Ruggs. Rodgers and Renfrow behind them were two very good backup options. Travis Etienne was easily one of the top backs in CFB. In terms of skill position talent, to say Lawrence had a ton of firepower at his disposal is a massive understatement. That offense was absolutely loaded. The line was also quite good.

Then you combine it with a defense boasting arguably the best defensive line CFB has seen in a decade and a very good back 7 behind it.

Clemson's all around performance vs. Alabama last year was more impressive, but Watson literally willed Clemson to a win over an overall stronger Alabama team in 2016 (one that practically everyone had chalked up as the future champs even before a game was played).

 

[NDMIA]

You just don't understand how good Trevor Lawrence is. He lost 1 game in HS and won 3 state titles. Dominated every camp he ever went too, He dismantled, absolutely trashed a Nick Saban led football team that will have every starter play in the NFL and he threw for 347 yards, 3 TD's, no picks and had no turnovers. He started every game at Clemson and he just was silly good. Did they even play in a close game? Sure he's got a lot of talent that's his fault? He has literally dominated every single thing he's ever done on the footballl field.

You mean that LT that didn't even get drafted? I'm not saying having Ross and Higgins doesn't help but Tua has 3-4 WR's that will be early picks on his team and shit son it's not even close when you watch them. My man is 6'6 rocket for an arm, IQ beyond his years. Nick Saban had a month to prepare for a TRUE freshman QB and halfway through that game you could just tell he had no answers. You just need to understand that he is just that special.

Might want to read my first sentence again. I said he’s a generational talent and will win the next 2 national titles. Idk what other praise to put on him. I’m just adding a devils advocate to see both sides of Trevor Lawrence. Does the good outweigh the bad? Yes, by a country mile. But, an interesting article I read by Bill Connelly mentioned that Clemson’s schedule was closer to UCF’s than Alabama’s schedule when rated by S&P+ and Sagarin and other metrics. They also never flew further than 2 hours on a plane except for the national championship game. They played an extremely weak ACC last year and beat up on them with the greatest offense probably ever assembled (yes I’ve said that already). Saban also had 6 days between games to finalize a game plan for Clemson. Yes he probably had 100 analysts pouring over Clemson material for weeks before the matchup but there’s just zero possibility of that much disrespect towards Notre Dame that he was gameplanning for an opponent before they played their semifinal game and before Bama even played their game.

Also, Lawrence played against 3 Top 25 or fringe top 25 teams during the regular season which was at home to NC State and Syracuse and on the road to Texas A&M. His worst game of the season came against Syracuse (he was knocked out with an injury) and he left down 13-6. Another issue is that Lawrence has never faced adversity in a game yet. Yes he was down 6-0 or something a few times in the 1st quarter to the likes of Duke I think and maybe one other school but he’s never trailed in the 4th quarter. Now that also could be seen as he’s so dominant that he’s needed to face adversity but also could be interesting to look out for in the future. Lastly, no need to rag on Mitch Hyatt. He was 1 of 2 tackles in power 5 football in 2017 to allow zero sacks according to PFF. This past season he wasn’t as good, but he’s still a damn good left tackle and part of easily one of the best lines in college football.

For the 2019 season, I fully expect a bunch of 60-70 point games for Clemson again because they simply have one of the worst schedules in power 5 football. They ranked 59 out of 66 Power 5 teams in schedule according to SouthernPigSkin.com. They essentially play 4 fringe top 25 teams with Syracuse and NC State on the road but both replacing their QB’s, South Carolina on the road and Texas A&M at home. The bottom line is I agree with you that Trevor Lawrence is Uber talented and a generational talent, but I just wanted to highlight the fact that the kid hasn’t faced too many bumps on the road and has probably the most talented offensive roster in college football.

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Might want to read my first sentence again. I said he’s a generational talent and will win the next 2 national titles. Idk what other praise to put on him. I’m just adding a devils advocate to see both sides of Trevor Lawrence. Does the good outweigh the bad? Yes, by a country mile. But, an interesting article I read by Bill Connelly mentioned that Clemson’s schedule was closer to UCF’s than Alabama’s schedule when rated by S&P+ and Sagarin and other metrics. They also never flew further than 2 hours on a plane except for the national championship game. They played an extremely weak ACC last year and beat up on them with the greatest offense probably ever assembled (yes I’ve said that already). Saban also had 6 days between games to finalize a game plan for Clemson. Yes he probably had 100 analysts pouring over Clemson material for weeks before the matchup but there’s just zero possibility of that much disrespect towards Notre Dame that he was gameplanning for an opponent before they played their semifinal game and before Bama even played their game.

Also, Lawrence played against 3 Top 25 or fringe top 25 teams during the regular season which was at home to NC State and Syracuse and on the road to Texas A&M. His worst game of the season came against Syracuse (he was knocked out with an injury) and he left down 13-6. Another issue is that Lawrence has never faced adversity in a game yet. Yes he was down 6-0 or something a few times in the 1st quarter to the likes of Duke I think and maybe one other school but he’s never trailed in the 4th quarter. Now that also could be seen as he’s so dominant that he’s needed to face adversity but also could be interesting to look out for in the future. Lastly, no need to rag on Mitch Hyatt. He was 1 of 2 tackles in power 5 football in 2017 to allow zero sacks according to PFF. This past season he wasn’t as good, but he’s still a damn good left tackle and part of easily one of the best lines in college football.

For the 2019 season, I fully expect a bunch of 60-70 point games for Clemson again because they simply have one of the worst schedules in power 5 football. They ranked 59 out of 66 Power 5 teams in schedule according to SouthernPigSkin.com. They essentially play 4 fringe top 25 teams with Syracuse and NC State on the road but both replacing their QB’s, South Carolina on the road and Texas A&M at home. The bottom line is I agree with you that Trevor Lawrence is Uber talented and a generational talent, but I just wanted to highlight the fact that the kid hasn’t faced too many bumps on the road and has probably the most talented offensive roster in college football.

Word. Now can we get back to Pyne and maybe carry on Lawrence convo elsewhere?