'25 MO OT Jack Lange (Mizzou Verbal)

[INLaw]

It's a numbers situation. Can't take everyone they want, but I would hope for it to be like last years' class. The goal was three, unless they could get the guy they had at the top of their board. And they did.

I'm not sure what the staff has planned in terms of numbers for each position group this recruiting class, but if bypassing a fourth OL means another pure DT (not a projectable guy like Reiff, or another pure nose like Dixon), a seventh DB (assuming Blair, Zackery & Golden come aboard - the seventh being Devin Williams), or a fourth wide receiver, I'm all for it.

I disagree.

 

[IrishLax]

The whole idea of "limiting spots" in the era of the portal + insta eligiblity is beyond dumb. You should take every single guy that you reasonably believe could be an NFL player and let underperforming upperclassmen head elsewhere as they naturally will.

 

[NDFAN2008]

The whole idea of "limiting spots" in the era of the portal + insta eligiblity is beyond dumb. You should take every single guy that you reasonably believe could be an NFL player and let underperforming upperclassmen head elsewhere as they naturally will.

Couldn't agree more this past year drew the straw with me who would have thought we would lose Freshman who got tons of playing time. The days of only worrying about guys not playing transfering are over.

 

[PutuporShutup]

It's a numbers situation. Can't take everyone they want, but I would hope for it to be like last years' class. The goal was three, unless they could get the guy they had at the top of their board. And they did.

I'm not sure what the staff has planned in terms of numbers for each position group this recruiting class, but if bypassing a fourth OL means another pure DT (not a projectable guy like Reiff, or another pure nose like Dixon), a seventh DB (assuming Blair, Zackery & Golden come aboard - the seventh being Devin Williams), or a fourth wide receiver, I'm all for it.

Or taking a wr due to name over potential very good linemen?

 

[KPENN]

Or taking a wr due to name over potential very good linemen?

You just can’t stop, huh?

 

[irishnd31]

You just can’t stop, huh?

Keep waiting for the inevitable "turning down linemen" take in the Soccer thread too. Hell, let's go for broke and toss the same take into the "Movies You Just Saw" thread.
The worst...

 

[notredomer23]

It's a numbers situation. Can't take everyone they want, but I would hope for it to be like last years' class. The goal was three, unless they could get the guy they had at the top of their board. And they did.

I'm not sure what the staff has planned in terms of numbers for each position group this recruiting class, but if bypassing a fourth OL means another pure DT (not a projectable guy like Reiff, or another pure nose like Dixon), a seventh DB (assuming Blair, Zackery & Golden come aboard - the seventh being Devin Williams), or a fourth wide receiver, I'm all for it.

Tom Loy disagrees. He says Lange has a spot if he wants it, and that ND still leads.

 

[zelezo vlk]

I'm never really a fan of 3 man OL classes, especially if there are other good prospects available. I could be wrong on the data, but it seems like OL has more injury attrition than nearly any other position.

 

[Armyirish47]

I'm never really a fan of 3 man OL classes, especially if there are other good prospects available. I could be wrong on the data, but it seems like OL has more injury attrition than nearly any other position.

I think that is balanced by what seems to be these big sammich eaters that do survive sticking around/developing longer than other positions as well. We signed a 5 man class, then a 4 man class, so a 3 man this year would put us at 12 in a 3 year cycle which feels about right because it looks like we could possibly only lose Baker next year? Adding one more likely won't hurt in this new era but that's why general managers are getting the moderate bucks.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I'm with Lax. Take the guys who are your takes and the numbers sort out.

 

[zelezo vlk]

I think that is balanced by what seems to be these big sammich eaters that do survive sticking around/developing longer than other positions as well. We signed a 5 man class, then a 4 man class, so a 3 man this year would put us at 12 in a 3 year cycle which feels about right because it looks like we could possibly only lose Baker next year? Adding one more likely won't hurt in this new era but that's why general managers are getting the moderate bucks.

Averaging 4 is what I would ideally go for too, so this doesn't sound too bad. But I'd always caution that it's best to take more numbers due to attrition and the fact that if you miss you feel it 3 years later and it'll impact up to 5 years later. It's a big reason why IMO 2018 and 2021 were big steps back for OL. The 3 man class in 2015 almost immediately became a 1 man class due to Tillery switching to DT and Hoge lasting what, 1 year? And it was followed up with a 3 man class in which Boudreaux left after I think a single season too. I just don't want to see this kinda stuff happening again due to only taking 3 guys.

 

[SoIll]

I have not dabbled into watching film (nor am I an expert) but whos the consensus better player? Jack or Matty?

 

[CanadalovesND]

Tom Loy disagrees. He says Lange has a spot if he wants it, and that ND still leads.

Noice.

 

[PutuporShutup]

You just can’t stop, huh?

I didn't say anyone's name!

But please, we're on a thread talking about having enough scholarships to take a high potential linemen in this class.

Whether the info is true or not, he's a take or not, it's still a valid conversation. I'm happy to let it go if it wasn't so frichan relevant.

I couldn't have timed it better to the point i was making.

 

[a mike]

I have not dabbled into watching film (nor am I an expert) but whos the consensus better player? Jack or Matty?

Lange and its not really that close

Pecking order was --

Sanders
Petty
Black
Lange

Streibeg
Augustine

But Augustine would still be considered a good get--probably along the lines of Styles Prescott

Its just that Black and Lange are considered really really good potentially top 50 prospects. Jamie U expects Black to really blow up

 

[T-Boone]

I’d take the good OL recruits as it seems like OL isn’t a good position as far as shopping in the transfer market goes. Most other positions seems good for that.

 

[PutuporShutup]

I’d take the good OL recruits as it seems like OL isn’t a good position as far as shopping in the transfer market goes. Most other positions seems good for that.

Weird saying this, but also it's typically (maybe after QB) your best academic position group (non ST). You have to be a little careful numbers wise as they typically won't transfer early and will stay for your degree. I think that's part of the point you're making on the transfer market for oline not being great.

 

[notredomer23]

Weird saying this, but also it's typically (maybe after QB) your best academic position group (non ST). You have to be a little careful numbers wise as they typically won't transfer and will stay for your degree.

Agree with you, and it's backed up by the NFL combine numbers. OL was the second least transferred group behind LBs with 17 out of 70. Tosh Baker and Kristofic are perfect examples.

 

[KPENN]

I didn't say anyone's name!

But please, we're on a thread talking about having enough scholarships to take a high potential linemen in this class.

Whether the info is true or not, he's a take or not, it's still a valid conversation. I'm happy to let it go if it wasn't so frichan relevant.

I couldn't have timed it better to the point i was making.

JBJR has nothing to do with this. He’s not even a part of the class yet, and with how long it’s taking I’m thinking it’s not as much of a slam dunk as you think it is. I doubt the coaching staff isn’t gonna take a OL because of JBJR. But please, keep telling us about how much smarter you are than the rest of us. 🙇

 

[PutuporShutup]

JBJR has nothing to do with this. He’s not even a part of the class yet, and with how long it’s taking I’m thinking it’s not as much of a slam dunk as you think it is. I doubt the coaching staff isn’t gonna take a OL because of JBJR. But please, keep telling us about how much smarter you are than the rest of us. 🙇

I don't see any italics on your last sentence, so ok, i'm smarter than you.......... IMO


Nd is still playing the numbers game more than most/all other top teams, i trust you agree with that at least? What has freeman shown his best ability is, recruiting (IMO)....What is his biggest weakness, probably how nice he is to the team and a little bit of that softness many modern coaches have (IMO). Excepting a recruit that's not at the caliber he's recruiting to would fall under the softeness/nice IMO.

 

[irishnd31]

I don't see any italics on your last sentence, so ok, i'm smarter than you.......... IMO


Nd is still playing the numbers game more than most/all other top teams, i trust you agree with that at least? What has freeman shown his best ability is, recruiting (IMO)....What is his biggest weakness, probably how nice he is to the team and a little bit of that softness many modern coaches have (IMO). Excepting a recruit that's not at the caliber he's recruiting to would fall under the softeness/nice IMO

 

[Irish du Nord]

The whole idea of "limiting spots" in the era of the portal + insta eligiblity is beyond dumb. You should take every single guy that you reasonably believe could be an NFL player and let underperforming upperclassmen head elsewhere as they naturally will.

Especially at the position least likely to have a transfer starter

 

[Giddyup]

Poop dick burned putup

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

IMO, you endlessly picking at a point to flex on being “right” is about as insecure as it gets, so critiquing the “softness” of Notre Dame’s head coach is sorely lacking in sincerity. IMO.

The interesting part is thevlast teo years Freeman’s teams have shown incredible resiliency and toughness. Not something that is usually the result of a soft coach.

It would have been easy to cash in their season after the Marshall loss, or again after Stanford. They didnt.

Last year it would been easy to let things go off the rails after how bad Louisville was, but they didnt.

In both cases they battled and finished strong and got better. I dont think Freeman is soft or soft on the players as much as he is able to get his message across in ways other than beating them down.

Some great coaches beat the table and sound like they are 30 seconds from physically assaulting a player, but there have been other great coaches who demand excellence while still being able to be a players coach. Bill Belicheck pisses vinegar, Andy Reid does not.

 

[a mike]

Tom Loy disagrees. He says Lange has a spot if he wants it, and that ND still leads.

I think the staff cleverly/correctly leveraged Strebig and Augustine into committing by talking about spots running out

Probably why Strebig couldn't build up his all-time record of visits without committing. He seemed pretty laid back about the process in his post-Jr Day visit interviews and then immediately abrupted face and committed

Augustine too all of a sudden got on an accelerated time schedule

Lange will probably have a spot regardless and if Strebig or Augustine get mad if he eventually commits down the line they'll just tell them sorry or feed them some line about more space opening up, situation changed, blah blah

ISD guys must've just latched onto the limited spots narrative

I tend to think Loy has better intel than the ISD guys--especially Greg and Jamie, although I'm guessing they just get all their intel from Matt and Christian anyways

 

[allenm5333]

I think the staff cleverly/correctly leveraged Strebig and Augustine into committing by talking about spots running out

Probably why Strebig couldn't build up his all-time record of visits without committing. He seemed pretty laid back about the process in his post-Jr Day visit interviews and then immediately abrupted face and committed

Augustine too all of a sudden got on an accelerated time schedule

Lange will probably have a spot regardless and if Strebig or Augustine get mad if he eventually commits down the line they'll just tell them sorry or feed them some line about more space opening up, situation changed, blah blah

ISD guys must've just latched onto the limited spots narrative

I tend to think Loy has better intel than the ISD guys--especially Greg and Jamie, although I'm guessing they just get all their intel from Matt and Christian anyways

Ryan Roberts saying they are only taking 3...

 

[PutuporShutup]

IMO, you endlessly picking at a point to flex on being “right” is about as insecure as it gets, so critiquing the “softness” of Notre Dame’s head coach is sorely lacking in sincerity. IMO.

The team has played soft, without fire in some big road games. That's been a knock on the team by many on here. To me that's a reflection of the coaches personality. Jon Scheyer for Duke is very similar. Duke's bball team plays soft at times and is a big criticism by the fan base coming off coach K. Both freeman and scheyer really don't get on officials too much, don't seem to get on players too much. I get it, it's the modern approach with young coaches to the way players want to be treated. It probably helps with recruiting, but I think it hurts with winning consistently.

 

[NDMD]

I tend to think Loy has better intel than the ISD guys--especially Greg and Jamie, although I'm guessing they just get all their intel from Matt and Christian anyways

ISD has been very consistent about intel being a 2 way street, and they will cooperate with staff/recruits to maintain connections. It would not surprise me if they are reporting that 3 spot narrative because thats what staff wants out there. Especially if you read between the lines, they drop stuff like "now that might change in the future, but stuff needs to work itself out."

 

[PutuporShutup]

The interesting part is thevlast teo years Freeman’s teams have shown incredible resiliency and toughness. Not something that is usually the result of a soft coach.

It would have been easy to cash in their season after the Marshall loss, or again after Stanford. They didnt.

Last year it would been easy to let things go off the rails after how bad Louisville was, but they didnt.

In both cases they battled and finished strong and got better. I dont think Freeman is soft or soft on the players as much as he is able to get his message across in ways other than beating them down.

Some great coaches beat the table and sound like they are 30 seconds from physically assaulting a player, but there have been other great coaches who demand excellence while still being able to be a players coach. Bill Belicheck pisses vinegar, Andy Reid does not.

You must not have been at the stanford game in 2022 or at the clemson game in 2023. I admit, i'll take 8-4 in 2022 after the start we had so for sure i'll give him credit for that.

There's no doubt freeman has the team very well prepared for big games at home to not be intimidated, but man if you don't think we played soft in 2022 vs stanford and USC or in 2023 at Louisville or at Clemson, not sure what to say. The lack of intensity at clemson was really embarrassing on a beautiful day with a great opposing full house crowd.

 

[a mike]

Ryan Roberts saying they are only taking 3...

Probably just what Strebig mom told him

No shade--because I think he's pretty solid with evals, etc--but I'd find it hard to believe that he has a plug at ND

Lives all the way on east coast and has only been working the beat for a minute