One Stop Rumors Thread?

[ulukinatme]

Would note that with the exception perhaps of Dexter Williams, all those examples largely proved BK's approach to be correct.

Truth. Kelly gave younger guys chances, but they often dropped the ball in areas until they were ready or were uncoachable. Case in point GA III (RIP). They tried to get him to run low, work on the little things, but he was always a track star and couldn't/wouldn't change. He left early because he thought he knew better, or at least his dad made him think that.

Kelly wasn't wrong about Dexter either. Dexter struggled heavily in pass protection. It was something he did improve upon his last year and that's why he finally saw the field. Unfortunately he struggled with that in the NFL too, and that's one reason he never caught on. Great runner, but not always a complete back and it held him back.

 

[Luckylucci]

To be fair, "Kelly never plays young talent" didn't suddenly get created after he left. That was a long standing criticism of his tenure while he was here and was the source of as much constant bitching as his supposed nepotism hires. Dexter, Greg Bryant, the "5*" WR from Missouri, every hyped QB recruit, etc.

I disagreed with it then and still do, but it's not some post-BK pro-Freeman phenomenon.

Well, it is if you are using it to compare the two, right?

The criticism isn’t new but the comparison is, it has to be.

 

[WilliamWallace]

I feel like we’re finally starting to get somewhere.

 

[greyhammer90]

Well, it is if you are using it to compare the two, right?

The criticism isn’t new but the comparison is, it has to be.

Weird distinction but if we're playing the semantics game you said the criticism that BK only played vets was "rewriting history" to benefit Freeman. I was simply pointing out that this criticism was a topic on the board before anyone knew Freeman existed. The criticism might be untrue, and it might be being used to compare with Freeman favorably now (because that always happens with new coaches), but the criticism absolutely existed and isn't some new Gug propaganda (like the recent "passes" are)

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Mid is an awful strange way to describe a guy that had 20 yards less from scrimmage compared to Estime and played less games. Don't get me wrong, I think Payne will be better. Just seems like more sour grapes.

I mean, to each their own, but nothing I saw from where i was gave off the impression he was mediocre. He had the injury and battled back from that. Made some big plays and seemed like a pretty complete back. I was most disappointed about him leaving than anybody else, than any other recruiting "miss", etc.

As for Rees, he was an ND player and student himself. He was QB1 and lived the fishbowl life that these guys now live. It had to be easy for everyone to relate to each other with that being said. For as much as being an alum is not a requirement of being on the coaching staff, it really doesn't hurt in most respects.

 

[Katzenboyer]

Mid is an awful strange way to describe a guy that had 20 yards less from scrimmage compared to Estime and played less games. Don't get me wrong, I think Payne will be better. Just seems like more sour grapes.

Not sure about "playing less games" but Estime had 100 more yards rushing with 10 fewer carries than Diggs got last year.

Estime is the better player.

 

[IrishLax]

Mid is an awful strange way to describe a guy that had 20 yards less from scrimmage compared to Estime and played less games. Don't get me wrong, I think Payne will be better. Just seems like more sour grapes.

I am doing my best to present it without commentary or my own opinion, but I will say that players aren't always the best judge of talent. Then again, other times they have insights and perspectives that we don't since they see so much outside of Saturdays.

 

[stlnd01]

Not sure about "playing less games" but Estime had 100 more yards rushing with 10 fewer carries than Diggs got last year.

Estime is the better player.

Estime may be the better player but Diggs was also quite good. Our team would’ve been better with him than without him, IMO. But, it is what it is, and fortunately we have other options.

 

[Southside Sully]

I am doing my best to present it without commentary or my own opinion, but I will say that players aren't always the best judge of talent. Then again, other times they have insights and perspectives that we don't since they see so much outside of Saturdays.

Seems like exactly what you set out to accomplish in post 1 of the thread!

 

[Katzenboyer]

Estime may be the better player but Diggs was also quite good. Our team would’ve been better with him than without him, IMO. But, it is what it is, and fortunately we have other options.

Fair enough. But if what Lax posted is true, and he was also a bit of a diva, then I can see why the "mid" label would be applied.

 

[Lberry]

What does mid mean? I assume mid-talent? Assume this is common language for kids of a certain age but I've never heard it used and it seems like many here get it.

 

[zelezo vlk]

With all this talk about mid, y'all are starting to sound like Koon

 

[StPaul_Irish]

With all this talk about mid drifts, y'all are starting to sound like Koon

FIXED

 

[ThePiombino]

What does mid mean? I assume mid-talent? Assume this is common language for kids of a certain age but I've never heard it used and it seems like many here get it.

In short, mid means average or nothing special. Like Diggs.

 

[NDdomer2]

Urban Dictionary: mid

 

[NDBoiler]

FIXED

It’s midriff lol.

 

[stlnd01]

What does mid mean? I assume mid-talent? Assume this is common language for kids of a certain age but I've never heard it used and it seems like many here get it.

My kids - 13 and 9 - use it all the time. It just means mediocre.

 

[PutuporShutup]

Estime may be the better player but Diggs was also quite good. Our team would’ve been better with him than without him, IMO. But, it is what it is, and fortunately we have other options.

With him here wanting and 100% bought in to being at ND.

 

[ulukinatme]

I am doing my best to present it without commentary or my own opinion, but I will say that players aren't always the best judge of talent. Then again, other times they have insights and perspectives that we don't since they see so much outside of Saturdays.

Word. The comment was obviously targeted toward the player, not the messenger! I'm curious who said it, but it's best if we not know of course. I will say I thought he did have a bit of an ego, but at the same time he backed it up on the field by doing everything fairly well as a complete back: good vision, good hands, good in space, good blocking, etc. Not elite at any one thing, but he was an every down back and did his job.

 

[ulukinatme]

Not sure about "playing less games" but Estime had 100 more yards rushing with 10 fewer carries than Diggs got last year.

Estime is the better player.

Again, context is important. Diggs was often trusted to close out games because the coaches trusted his hands more. I use the example of 19 straight carries in that awful UNLV game. UNLV knew he was getting the ball each snap, and they still couldn't stop it. That'll hurt the average though. It's also worth remembering that he missed a couple games and was rusty coming back from injury. He performed well, his stats were comparable to Estime, both guys were 1000+ yards from scrimmage.

 

[PutuporShutup]

Again, context is important. Diggs was often trusted to close out games because the coaches trusted his hands more. I use the example of 19 straight carries in that awful UNLV game. UNLV knew he was getting the ball each snap, and they still couldn't stop it. That'll hurt the average though. It's also worth remembering that he missed a couple games and was rusty coming back from injury. He performed well, his stats were comparable to Estime, both guys were 1000+ yards from scrimmage.

He missed or had limited snaps our first 3 games vs OSU, Marshall, Cal...... the 3 games when our oline was at its worst. By far Audric's 3 lowest YPC games. So i'd argue Diggs YPC would have gone down a bit. You take out those 3 games and Estime ran for 6.6 YPC. So his YPC went down .7YPC per game due to those 3. Diggs only decreased by .2YPC due to his limited snaps in those games. estime vs fully healthy Diggs was 6.6YPC vs 5.2YPC in the same games (last 10 games). That's a really big difference. For giggles, Tyree was 4.5ypc over those 10 games.

A lot of people's eyes told them Estime was clearly the better runner of the football, stats clearly back that up. His fumbles definitely hurt the team and his year though.

 

[FDNYIrish1]

I really wish we got a glimpse of what TB was able to display in practice. In hindsight it was definitely not a great idea to pull a portal QB, but he must have shown a ton in practice that made everyone comfortable with riding with him. Thanks for sharing that intel Lax.