'21 CA QB Tyler Buchner (ND FB -> Bama FB -> ND LAX???)

[NDPhilly]

Feel really bad for the kid. Rees should have seen enough to know he needed another year to develop as a passer with a Coan-like transfer plugged in. Kid only played 2 years of HS football for fucks sake.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Feel really bad for the kid. Rees should have seen enough to know he needed another year to develop as a passer with a Coan-like transfer plugged in. Kid only played 2 years of HS football for fucks sake.

He only played 1 full year as a starter.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Feel really bad for the kid. Rees should have seen enough to know he needed another year to develop as a passer with a Coan-like transfer plugged in. Kid only played 2 years of HS football for fucks sake.

Wait, you're not saying Rees naming him starter is the reason he got injured?

 

[stlnd01]

But

Feel really bad for the kid. Rees should have seen enough to know he needed another year to develop as a passer with a Coan-like transfer plugged in. Kid only played 2 years of HS football for fucks sake.

But you also needed a Coan-like transfer willing to come in and compete w/Buchner (and Pyne) for the job. Not clear who that was supposed to be.

 

[IrishLax]

Ok I didn’t see presser but was my first info right about ligament damage in his shoulder? It’s *not* a clavicle?

First thing I heard was labrum/rotator cuff but then I was told that was wrong so I dunno. Non-throwing shoulder.

 

[Dale]

They didn’t want someone to compete with Buchner. They wanted someone who would be given the slightest chance but likely willing to take a back seat. Jack Miller transfer from OSU to Florida would be an example. He coincidentally is hurt for Florida now behind Richardson.

 

[stlnd01]

Ok I didn’t see presser but was my first info right about ligament damage in his shoulder? It’s *not* a clavicle?

First thing I heard was labrum/rotator cuff but then I was told that was wrong so I dunno. Non-throwing shoulder.

A “high grade sprain” that will require surgery? I’d guess separated with a torn labrum or rotator cuff, though I’m not an orthopedist I just busted my shoulders a few times.

 

[Sea Turtle]

What an absolute disaster.

 

[stlnd01]

They didn’t want someone to compete with Buchner. They wanted someone who would be given the slightest chance but likely willing to take a back seat. Jack Miller transfer from OSU to Florida would be an example. He coincidentally is hurt for Florida now behind Richardson.

Those guys don’t grow on trees. This was a team with CFP aspirations. I get rolling with Buchner, for his ceiling. Alas, this is the floor.

 

[NDPhilly]

Wait, you're not saying Rees naming him starter is the reason he got injured?

No, but I do think its fair to say that he wouldn't run nearly as much if he was more refined as a passer. We needed his feet to do anything on offense.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

I do think this increase the odds CJ reclassifies. Not because of the conspiracy Rees is pressuring him but it’d just be a prudent business decision by him. The job is now there for the taking. A dream 2022 where Buchner went off it wouldn’t have been.

It depends on how this season goes, but unless one of Pyne or Angeli plays well enough to be assumed as the starter in '23, then there will likely be an open competition next season. Assuming neither play that great, the competitors would be a potentially injury prone QB who has played one full season, a senior that already got beat out by a younger guy, and a lowly rated sophomore, none of whom played great when given the chance.

Compare that to '24 when one of those guys or whoever the '23 QB is has played one or two full seasons at QB and may have multiple years of eligibility remaining.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

No, but I do think its fair to say that he wouldn't run nearly as much if he was more refined as a passer. We needed his feet to do anything on offense.

So indirectly, then, this is sorta on Rees?

 

[Riddickulous]

Those guys don’t grow on trees. This was a team with CFP aspirations. I get rolling with Buchner, for his ceiling. Alas, this is the floor.

Buchner was clearly not ready and if they could've got someone like Daniels or Slovis in the portal, they should have.

 

[ThePiombino]

Pyne was very highly recruited early in the cycle. He just stopped growing. Regardless, there is no excuse for his lack of development.

Drew Pyne Timeline Events

247sports.com

Ok, so then Rees wasn't the only one off on his eval? He was still off, which is not officially a theme with the QB room.

We know almost nothing about Angeli at this point.

We know he's not the one to bring ND to the next level.

It needs to be said... Pyne was Tommy's guy. The rest of the CFB world realized it and moved on. Very similar story with Angeli.

Even if Tommy is a brilliant X's and O's guy... he is a flaming failure when it comes to the Jimmy's and Joe's.

He belongs in the NFL. I'm almost certain that is where he will end up next year.

Looking forward to it.

I want my bad news,… and I want it now!!!!

Ask and ye shall receive.

To be fair, Buchner ain’t it either

IT isn't currently on the roster...

What exactly do they do for a sprained shoulder in the surgery world?

Depends on the grade -- basically anything above grade 1 and shit's fucked.

Feel really bad for the kid. Rees should have seen enough to know he needed another year to develop as a passer with a Coan-like transfer plugged in. Kid only played 2 years of HS football for fucks sake.

100%

I think he'll hit the portal but even if he doesn't we need a QB from the portal who is better than him, or at the very least isn't injury prone.

Buchner was clearly not ready and if they could've got someone like Daniels or Slovis in the portal, they should have.

 

[ThePiombino]

Buchner was clearly not ready and if they could've got someone like Daniels or Slovis in the portal, they should have.

Yep, still trying to figure out how the shit they turned Daniels away...

 

[NDMatt91]

Yep, still trying to figure out how the shit they turned Daniels away...

Did we really turn him away? Woof.

 

[FDNYIrish1]

I feel bad for this kid. He hung in tough for us. I really believe the staff overestimated the OLine and ability to run. I’m not sure they thought he would have to try to carry the team under constant duress. I really like Tyler and wish him to heal quickly.

 

[GATTACA!]

Someone get into he phone with Myles Brennan yesterday. What are the rules on mid season transfers?

What a fucking disaster. Thanks Tommy! Fucking bum.

 

[ThePiombino]

Did we really turn him away? Woof.

According to LAX, yep.

 

[Irish_Mickey]

I feel bad for this kid. He hung in tough for us. I really believe the staff overestimated the OLine and ability to run. I’m not sure they thought he would have to try to carry the team under constant duress. I really like Tyler and wish him to heal quickly.

Agreed. This board likes to bash players and immediately pine for the "next best thing" whenever adversity hits. He obviously did not play up to his potential, but his hands were tied with a soft O-line, mediocre OC, and an inexperienced WR corps that can't get separation. Hope to see him shine as QB1 next year.

 

[rtrn2glory]

I just hope we can get bowl eligible now. What a MF disaster for MFMF.

 

[yankeehater]

According to LAX, yep.

If true, those are job losing decisions.

 

[NDMatt91]

Agreed. This board likes to bash players and immediately pine for the "next best thing" whenever adversity hits. He obviously did not play up to his potential, but his hands were tied with a soft O-line, mediocre OC, and an inexperienced WR corps that can't get separation. Hope to see him shine as QB1 next year.

The thing is we can't be complacent at any position. Freeman has said that "talent acquisition" is vital for the success of this program. No one is promised anything. Buchner didn't light the world on fire in either of these 2 games and he is injury prone. You bring in a quality grad transfer QB to compete for the job. Maybe Buchner heals up and improves and wins the job. I can't predict the future. But it then becomes survival of the fittest where only the strong survive. That's what we see with Bama, OSU, UGA, etc.

 

[Luckylucci]

Buchner was clearly not ready and if they could've got someone like Daniels or Slovis in the portal, they should have.

My biggest gripe in all of this is this. Tommy seems consistently blindsided by things that are seemingly obvious once the games start. We obviously can't see much of Spring and Fall Camp, even less so now than before, but how in the world is this guy so clearly not able to discern the abilities of this offense and it's players over literal years of practice.

This is the 2nd year in a row that our offensive line was not even remotely close to playing competitive football to start the season. Rees has been watching every one of these OL, everyday, since they got here. And, if that's not bad enough. Tommy has been watching Buch throw for almost 2 full years, on campus, now. Like, I'm just dumbfounded as to why this offense, for the 2nd consecutive year is caught off guard by all this. And, it's not like we're talking about the difference being marginal. We're talking about being completely assfunctional.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

I feel bad for this kid. He hung in tough for us. I really believe the staff overestimated the OLine and ability to run. I’m not sure they thought he would have to try to carry the team under constant duress. I really like Tyler and wish him to heal quickly.

This I think is a big thing with what is going wrong right now. The staff came into the season with a fundamental misunderstanding of the strengths and weaknesses of this team based on faulty assumptions during the offseason.

I think the two underlying assumptions were that the DL was good and that the OL was coming along after the strong finish to last season.

Based on that, when the DL is beating the OL early in camp, it means that the DL is going to be great. And when the OL starts winning some later, it means they are reaching a really good level.

So if our OL is really good and our receivers are bad, we need to run the ball a lot.

If we are running the ball a lot and controlling games, our defense just needs to not give up big plays.

To not give up big plays, we need to rely on our great DL to control the line in the run game and put pressure on the pass game.

Cross and Lacey were able to beat the interior of our OL, so they should be able to disrupt the offense enough to draw double teams and free up Foskey.

That should allow us to use our LBs to react instead of attack, which will allow them to cover more area in the passing game.

This will allow the weakest part of our team, the secondary, to play relatively safe, using a mix of coverages to confuse QBs and create turnovers instead of risking jumping routes.

Because we aren't training jumping routes or fighting for the ball, our QBs and WRs aren't used to defenders doing that, and can't get open or risk throwing a 50/50 ball.

So, yeah, a couple faulty assumptions probably led the coaching staff to completely misunderstanding their team.

 

[Irish#1]

Those guys don’t grow on trees. This was a team with CFP aspirations. I get rolling with Buchner, for his ceiling. Alas, this is the floor.

I think the ceiling and floor have officially met.

 

[NDdomer2]

This I think is a big thing with what is going wrong right now. The staff came into the season with a fundamental misunderstanding of the strengths and weaknesses of this team based on faulty assumptions during the offseason.

I think the two underlying assumptions were that the DL was good and that the OL was coming along after the strong finish to last season.

Based on that, when the DL is beating the OL early in camp, it means that the DL is going to be great. And when the OL starts winning some later, it means they are reaching a really good level.

So if our OL is really good and our receivers are bad, we need to run the ball a lot.

If we are running the ball a lot and controlling games, our defense just needs to not give up big plays.

To not give up big plays, we need to rely on our great DL to control the line in the run game and put pressure on the pass game.

Cross and Lacey were able to beat the interior of our OL, so they should be able to disrupt the offense enough to draw double teams and free up Foskey.

That should allow us to use our LBs to react instead of attack, which will allow them to cover more area in the passing game.

This will allow the weakest part of our team, the secondary, to play relatively safe, using a mix of coverages to confuse QBs and create turnovers instead of risking jumping routes.

Because we aren't training jumping routes or fighting for the ball, our QBs and WRs aren't used to defenders doing that, and can't get open or risk throwing a 50/50 ball.

So, yeah, a couple faulty assumptions probably led the coaching staff to completely misunderstanding their team.

except out DL cant control the LOS or put pressure on the pass game, our LBs are generally free to roam but arent capable of filling gaps/making tackles/or covering in space, and our secondary does play it safe/doesnt confuse QBs/and doesnt jump routes.

Like literally none of those things are happening right now.

 

[T Town Tommy]

Really hate this for Buchner. Hopefully he heals up and gets back at it. Can’t stand to see any player get injured.

 

[Irish#1]

I think the two underlying assumptions were that the DL was good and that the OL was coming along after the strong finish to last season.

If you really stop and analyze it, they should have improved, but by how much? Alt is starting just his second year and Fisher is essentially starting his first. You move Patterson who is learning a new position and missed practice. Add in two backups in Lugg and Correll and you really don't have that great of a line. They need to move Patterson back to center IMO.

 

[ThePiombino]

If you really stop and analyze it, they should have improved, but by how much? Alt is starting just his second year and Fisher is essentially starting his first. You move Patterson who is learning a new position and missed practice. Add in two backups in Lugg and Correll and you really don't have that great of a line. They need to move Patterson back to center IMO.

Not happening according to Freeman.