Montana's got company

[Irish YJ]

fvck Meatchicken

 

[Circa]

I think Joe Montana was one of the greatest athletes in pro sports ever because he was a WINNER. He won a National Championship at Notre Dame. He played better in the clutch. His teammates had absolute confidence he would get the job done when the game was on the line.

I think Joe Montana, Michael Jordan and Bill Russell are among the greatest pro athletes not because of statistics but because they had a fierce desire to win, they won and they inspired their teams and carried their teams to victory.

If you google "collinsworth montana god" and read you might see what I am getting at.

"Joe Montana is not human," said Bengals wide receiver Cris Collinsworth. "I don't want to call him a god, but he's definitely somewhere in between." Yes!

 

[Irish#1]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en data-scribe-reduced-action-queue="><p>Source at Gillette Stadium said QB Tom Brady was first player in building at 7 am today for the start of the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Patriots?src=hash">#Patriots</a> offseason program.</p>— Christopher Price (@cpriceNFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/cpriceNFL/status/590156855441289216">April 20, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Gunning for Super Bowl #5 to completely end this argument.

What's the big deal. I'm in at 7 every day.

 

[dshans]

What's the big deal. I'm in at 7 every day.

A testament to your long-suffering wife???








Forgive me, for I know not what I do ...

 

[Irish Storm]

It's amazing to me how little respect Noll and Bradshaw get.

 

[NDRock]

fvck Meatchicken

Something we can all agree on.

 

[phgreek]

What's the big deal. I'm in at 7 every day.

...and if I made Brady's money for playing a game...I'd be bangin' on the glass at 5:30

 

[GowerND11]

It's amazing to me how little respect Noll and Bradshaw get.

Bradshaw was a winner no doubt. But he really wasn't that great of a QB. He benefited from a great defense, a strong running game and two very good and acrobatic WRs. He has a career TD-INT ratio of nearly 1:1 which even in his days is not very good by any stretch.

 

[irishfan]

...and if I made Brady's money for playing a game...I'd be bangin' on the glass at 5:30

I would too. It's easy for us to say that though. Once most of these guys get millions and are famous (I apologize to all the celebrity millionaires on IE), they tend to get complacent. Just sets a good example when the oldest/highest paid/most succesful guy on the team is the first one in and the last one out.

You would figure the backups would be arriving early and staying late, but, every year, there are stories like this about how Brady is always at the facilities for longer than anyone else. After the draft, NFL teams can have 90 guys on the roster. Brady will still be the first one in and the last one to leave. Not saying a lot of other QBs aren't doing the same, but there are certainly guys who aren't.

 

[Irish Storm]

Bradshaw was a winner no doubt. But he really wasn't that great of a QB. He benefited from a great defense, a strong running game and two very good and acrobatic WRs. He has a career TD-INT ratio of nearly 1:1 which even in his days is not very good by any stretch.

Is Belichick really any better than Noll, Lombardi? Or LA dry and Shula who did it with multiple Qb's?

I get that Belichick is great but he really is the only GREAT coach of his generation and was doing nothing until Brady fell into his lap.

 

[irishfan]

Is Belichick really any better than Noll, Lombardi? Or LA dry and Shula who did it with multiple Qb's?

I get that Belichick is great but he really is the only GREAT coach of his generation and was doing nothing until Brady fell into his lap.

We may never know what BB can really do without Brady (I hesitate to take much from his Browns years...just 20 years is an eternity in NFL time and the game is so different). He is 63 years old and has said he doesn't want to be coaching at 70. Brady has 3 years left on his deal, but recently said he wants to play 6-7 more years (and has been on unique training/diet program the last few years to prolong his career as long as possible). I hope they go out with another Super Bowl in a couple years and retire together.

 

[irishfan]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">We asked:
Is <a href="https://twitter.com/Patriots">@Patriots</a> QB Tom Brady the best QB of all time?

You answered:
76% said he's the GOAT. <a href="https://t.co/mtbYGES1wv">pic.twitter.com/mtbYGES1wv</a></p>— NFL Network (@nflnetwork) <a href="https://twitter.com/nflnetwork/status/659542693115240448">October 29, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[koonja]

Not a lot of players, QBs even less, are considered elite at both college and NFL. I feel like no one will ever touch Joe in that category, but I think Brady has got him in the NFL.

 

[ACamp1900]

Not a lot of players, QBs even less, are considered elite at both college and NFL. I feel like no one will ever touch Joe in that category, but I think Brady has got him in the NFL.

I don't, at all... he plays in a prefect era/system for stat whore QBs, I seriously doubt he'd have been all that good at all in the 1980s... and he's a skunkbear... fvk him and his tainted ass legacy.

 

[koonja]

I don't, at all... he plays a a prefect era/system for stat whore QBs, I seriously doubt he'd have been all that good at all in the 1980s... and he's a skunkbear... fvk him and his tainted ass legacy.

That's fair and I barely remember Montana as a NFL QB. But seriously, who can trump Montana if both CFB and NFL 'greatness' are both equally weighted?

Maybe Greg Bryant when all is said and done.

 

[Irish#1]

That's fair and I barely remember Montana as a NFL QB. But seriously, who can trump Montana if both CFB and NFL 'greatness' are both equally weighted?

Maybe Greg Bryant when all is said and done.

Joe languished as the third string QB until injuries allowed him to pull a couple of rabbits out of his hat. It was then the light bulb finally went off for the coaches.

 

[kmoose]

So Belichick ended the discussion of greatest coach ever but now we've got a serious debate about greatest football player ever.

Montana or Brady: Who do you got?

Neither. Since you specified "football player", my vote goes to Rocky Bleier, who played almost his entire NFL career, as a running back, with about half of one foot missing.

After his 1968 rookie season with the Pittsburgh Steelers, Bleier was drafted into the U.S. Army in December 1968.[3] He volunteered for duty in the Vietnam War and shipped out in May 1969, serving with the 196th Light Infantry Brigade. On August 20, while on patrol in Heip Duc, Bleier was wounded in the left thigh by a rifle bullet when his platoon was ambushed in a rice paddy. While down, an enemy grenade landed nearby after bouncing off a fellow soldier, sending shrapnel into his lower right leg. He lost part of his right foot in the blast as well.

After all of that, he went on to win 4 Super Bowl rings with the Steelers. And, for those who don't know who Terry Hanratty was.......... Bleier is a 1968 graduate of the University of Notre Dame.

 

[wizards8507]

I don't, at all... he plays in a prefect era/system for stat whore QBs, I seriously doubt he'd have been all that good at all in the 1980s... and he's a skunkbear... fvk him and his tainted ass legacy.

I'm sure the last part is trolling, but are you serious about the first part? Modern passing stats might be inflated, but that has nothing to do with championships. Opposing quarterbacks also benefit from the modern game, so it's no easier to win even though it might be easier to throw for yardage.

 

[kmoose]

That's fair and I barely remember Montana as a NFL QB. But seriously, who can trump Montana if both CFB and NFL 'greatness' are both equally weighted?

Maybe Greg Bryant when all is said and done.

Herschel Walker, Barry Sanders, Jerome Bettis, Dick Butkus, Alan Page, Orlando Pace............. I would put every one of those guys in the same class as Montana. It would be hard to say which one was BEST, but all of those guy compare favorably with Montana.

 

[ACamp1900]

I'm sure the last part is trolling, but are you serious about the first part? Modern passing stats might be inflated, but that has nothing to do with championships. Opposing quarterbacks also benefit from the modern game, so it's no easier to win even though it might be easier to throw for yardage.

rings factor into an individual players' overall greatness almost not at all in teams sports...

 

[wizards8507]

rings factor into an individual players' overall greatness almost not at all in teams sports...

...except for a quarterback. It's the most individual position in modern team sports.

 

[ACamp1900]

disagree, pitchers, catchers, goalies all say hi. Honestly though, I really have no desire to debate 'patriots fan' in regards to their cherished cheater, so think what you want.

 

[wizards8507]

disagree, pitchers, catchers, goalies all say hi.

Yes, those are very individual and goalie might be the closest comparable. A pitcher would be, but they only pitch once every five days and even then for about seven innings or so. A pitcher has the ball for 50% of each inning, 78% of each game's innings, 20% of the games. So a good starting pitcher has the ball about 8% of his team's plays. A quarterback has the ball for 50% of his team's plays (every offensive play). Even if you only want to say 50% of those plays are passes, that's still 25% of the game.

 

[kmoose]

Yes, those are very individual and goalie might be the closest comparable. A pitcher would be, but they only pitch once every five days and even then for about seven innings or so. A pitcher has the ball for 50% of each inning, 78% of each game's innings, 20% of the games. So a good starting pitcher has the ball about 8% of his team's plays. A quarterback has the ball for 50% of his team's plays (every offensive play). Even if you only want to say 50% of those plays are passes, that's still 25% of the game.

I don't disagree, however:

No one in the NFL goes into the playoffs and sees a game against a specific QB and just pencils it in as a loss. MLB teams do.

 

[wizards8507]

I don't disagree, however:

No one in the NFL goes into the playoffs and sees a game against a specific QB and just pencils it in as a loss. MLB teams do.

I don't think that's right. Unless the opponent swept their series and had the opportunity to get their rotation in order and you were coming out of a short-rest situation, playoff series are usually ace versus ace, number two versus number two, etc. Plus, you have a lot of makeup opportunity in a seven-game series. I'd say facing Tom Brady in a single elimination game in January is worth at least 1/7 of a chalked up loss.

 

[ulukinatme]

Slightly unrelated, is Autry Denson no longer banned?