Who do you want to replace Brian Kelly?

[ScooterIrish]

Yea...I'll buy that.

I don't buy the comparison to Tyrone. The guy recruited for shit, and it was clear to everyone he was trending down rapidly without much in the cupboard. Brian Kelly has more talented classes. He has failed to deliver the Ws we'd expect, but his recruiting classes are ok.

Brian Kelly hasn't delivered in recruiting the last few years and it will show next year, especially on defense. We can blame BVG, but Kelly could have done something about that sooner.

 

[PANDFAN]

I think you may be reading that wrong? The .72% is the historical average.

Wewps.

i fail at the internet....multitasking at work and trying to make a point don't mix

 

[Irish#1]

ALSO in Jack Swarbrick's 6 years at ND:

- Membership for Notre Dame's athletic teams (other than football and hockey) in the Atlantic Coast Conference beginning with the 2013-14 athletic seasons. In football, Notre Dame will play five games per year against ACC opponents beginning in 2014 and also have full access to the league's list of postseason bowl options. Notre Dame hockey now plays in Hockey East.

- An extension of the University's relationship with NBC Sports through the 2025 football season.

- The 2014 announcement of an unmatched 10-year relationship with Under Armour to provide performance footwear, apparel and equipment for Irish athletic programs. In addition to being a shareholder in Under Armour, Notre Dame will collaborate with Under Armour in the areas of sport technology, product development, and athlete performance.

- Creation by the Bowl Championship Series of the four-team College Football Playoff to begin with the 2014 season, with Notre Dame maintaining viable access into that system.
Swarbrick's first six years combined featured a variety of on-and off-the-field Notre Dame athletics successes:

- The best across-the-board athletic season in Notre Dame history in 2013-14 as Irish men's programs claimed the Capital One Cup and 22 of 26 sports overall advanced to postseason play, enabling Notre Dame to finish a best-ever third in the National Association of Collegiate Directors of Athletics all-sports standings.

- Number-one rankings for Notre Dame (among Football Bowl Subdivision schools) in the seven most recent NCAA Graduation Success Rate (GSR) surveys -- in 2013 at 99 for all-student-athletes. The Irish football program has ranked number one in those listings four of the last five years.

- An appearance in the Bowl Championship Series football title game following the 2012 season -- in an unprecedented year in which the Irish finished the regular season 12-0 to rank number one in the final BCS poll while also ranking number one in the GSR standings.

- NCAA championships in 2013 in men's soccer, 2011 in fencing (a men's and women's combined championship) and 2010 in women's soccer.

- NCAA runner-up team finishes in 2014, 2012 and 2011 in women's basketball, 2014 and 2010 in men's lacrosse, 2013 and 2009 in fencing and 2008 in women's soccer.

- NCAA semifinal appearances in women's basketball in 2013, men's lacrosse in 2012, hockey in 2011, women's tennis in 2009 and 2010 and women's soccer in 2009, plus 2010 and 2012 third-place fencing finishes.

- Construction of the 5,022-seat Compton Family Ice Arena that opened for the 2011-12 season and features two sheets of ice (one Olympic sized). The 2009-10 school year also featured dedications of new facilities for soccer and lacrosse -- as well as opening of the new Purcell Pavilion within the south dome of the Joyce Center.

- 193 All-America selections and 36 Academic All-America honorees over those six combined years.

But hey, yeah............ let's can the guy because what was UNIVERSALLY hailed as a great head football coach hire ended up not working out.

None of that matters. Our team sucked this year, so heads gotta role.

 

[NDdomer2]

wtf is a silent majority? never heard of such a thing

 

[Armyirish47]

The extension only looks bad, retroactively. The team won 10 games in the season before his extension. The floor, previous to the extension, was 8-5. On it's own, that certainly doesn't merit an extension. But we know that ND football has finished #1 in GSR in 4 of the last 5 years. Also, what we can't quantify, but Jack Swarbrick probably can, is a reasonable estimate of the fundraising that Kelly facilitates and/or accomplishes. Plus, maybe Kelly is seen as a good ambassador to the rest of the faculty? Those are all factors that Swarbrick has to take into account, that most fans get to completely ignore.

As for not firing him........... The old maxim is that you never quit a job until you have a new job to go to. Maybe Swarbrick put feelers out and got negative feedback from everyone he targeted? You can't just fire a coach without a plan. You'll end up with Gerry Faust or Gary Moeller.

It looks bad retroactively, and it's also a bit revisionist to ignore the larger trends in college football for coaches. Bottom line tends to be, you go to a big bowl game, you get extended for 6 years. Consider the following (all google searches done hastily and with poor spelling, results may vary):

Iowa goes to good bowl, hello 6 year extension.
Iowa Hawkeyes reward coach Kirk Ferentz with extension through 2025

Urban Meyer does Urban Meyer stuff. 6 year extension? Yes Please!
Ohio State football: Urban Meyer’s new deal has raise, goes to 2020 | Buckeye Xtra Sports

Mark Dantonio goes big bowling, guess what? (spoiler alert, 6 year extension)
Michigan State's Mark Dantonio signs new contract worth $4.3 million per year | MLive.com

Big Game Bob Stoops you might ask? Hello college football playoffs and an extension.
Bob Stoops’ contract extended; Sooners assistants get raises |

Nick Saban? ALL THE MONIES
Nick Saban to make $6.9 million as part of new contract

Dabo Swinney? Runner up to....a 7 year contract, has to settle for 6 year extension.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...th-contract-extension/?utm_term=.09716ce35da0

Hugh Feeze? Straight cash homey! Got longest extension allowed by law, and a little pay bump.
Mississippi's Freeze earns raise, 1-year contract extension

Mike Gundy is a man. He is 40 years old after all. And received contract extension through 2021.
http://www.cowboysrideforfree.com/2...ad-coach-mike-gundy-2-year-contract-extension

Jimbo Fischer gets extended in 2015 until........2022. Free shoes for everybody!
http://www.tomahawknation.com/2015/...r-contract-extension-florida-state-fsu-salary

 

[Free Manera]

I actually like this idea. But the University will never do it. Football is not bigger than life at ND. It might be to fans like us, who are passionate about it. But football will not "take over" at ND, and I think that most faculty would see this move as the beginning of placing football above the University. It may sound quaint and outdated, and maybe even naïve; but it is one of the things that most fans cherish about the University.

I don't understand why football success and academic success have to be mutually exclusive. ND would be Marquette if it weren't for football. Football put ND on the map. Why not celebrate that tradition? Having a good football program has no bearing on academics other than limiting the selection of recruits (which Stanford does to an even greater degree than ND).

 

[Irish#1]

I don't understand why football success and academic success have to be mutually exclusive. ND would be Marquette if it weren't for football. Football put ND on the map. Why not celebrate that tradition? Having a good football program has no bearing on academics other than limiting the selection of recruits (which Stanford does to an even greater degree than ND).

I agree. You can have success without compromising the academic integrity. I think the problem is perception. The University doesn't want to give the perception that football is bigger or at least equal to academics. To me I think it would be a great marketing tool. Yes, We'll kick your ass in the brain game and when we're done there, we'll kick your ass on the football field.

 

[GowerND11]

wtf is a silent majority? never heard of such a thing

Italics?

 

[Free Manera]

I agree. You can have success without compromising the academic integrity. I think the problem is perception. The University doesn't want to give the perception that football is bigger or at least equal to academics. To me I think it would be a great marketing tool. Yes, We'll kick your ass in the brain game and when we're done there, we'll kick your ass on the football field.

Practically speaking it just seems like football requires a point man. A basketball team has 12 players. How many fencing athletes are there? Tennis? There are probably as many athletes on the football team as there are all other male athletes combined.

Hire a football guy that knows the challenges of playing and/or coaching college football to manage the program, and have him report to the AD.

I know most other schools don't do this, but many other football schools have an AD that rightfully focuses on football, or is a football guy (i.e. Lynn Swann, Barry Alvarez, Bill Battle at Alabama) . Or, they give their head coach wide latitude to run the program without interference.

 

[Wingman Ray]

Honestly, are there any good available coaches now for ND to get even if it wanted to replace BK? Maybe Chip Kelly but seems most on this board immediately say no way.

Looks like we are stuck no matter what with this clown for another year. If BK promotes his buddy to DC, then count ND sunk for 2017 season. welcome to 7-5 best case. By then, maybe Jack will get off his sack and get his talons into a decent coach instead of getting middle of the pack leftovers.

 

[NDdomer2]

Honestly, are there any good available coaches now for ND to get even if it wanted to replace BK? Maybe Chip Kelly but seems most on this board immediately say no way.

Looks like we are stuck no matter what with this clown for another year. If BK promotes his buddy to DC, then count ND sunk for 2017 season. welcome to 7-5 best case. By then, maybe Jack will get off his sack and get his talons into a decent coach instead of getting middle of the pack leftovers.

its been very well communicated there is no HC change this year.

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Ohio State's Mickey Marotti is more than just a strength coach -- he's the irreplaceable "second in command" <a href="https://t.co/ON7wntwaK6">https://t.co/ON7wntwaK6</a></p>— Paul Myerberg (@PaulMyerberg) <a href="https://twitter.com/PaulMyerberg/status/806558280025829376">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Pay for S&C coaches is rising dramatically. Three guys (Marotti, Iowa's Doyle, Bama's Cochrane) are paid more annually than 17 FBS HCs.</p>— Paul Myerberg (@PaulMyerberg) <a href="https://twitter.com/PaulMyerberg/status/806559674359250944">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[PANDFAN]

strong endorsement

strong endorsement

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Charlie Strong would be a great fit for defensive coordinator at Notre Dame. He brings great character and morals. <a href="https://twitter.com/NDFootball">@NDFootball</a></p>— Kory Minor (@Kmine4) <a href="https://twitter.com/Kmine4/status/806558418689327104">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[beryirish]

This is from December 2015.

*Don't know if Longo is in these ranks since ND is private.

1. Chris Doyle, Iowa, $515,000
2. Mickey Marotti, Ohio State, $431,558
3. Scott Cochran, Alabama, $420,000
4. Rob Glass, Oklahoma State, $401,166
5. Paul Jackson, Ole Miss, $375,000
6. Ben Herbert, Arkansas $340,000
7. Pat Moorer, Texas, $330,000
8. Tommy Moffitt, LSU, $315,000

These strength and conditioning coaches carry hefty price tags

Dec 30, 2015

Darren RovellESPN Senior Writer

The job of strength and conditioning coach has come a long way since the first one was hired in 1969. That's when Boyd Epley was given the position to help bulk up Nebraska players at a wage of $2 an hour.

Editor's Picks

Why Alabama's strength coach is the secret to its success

Crimson Tide players affectionately refer to Scott Cochran as 'crazy,' 'nuts' and 'insane.' But the strength coach's impact on his team goes well beyond lifting weights.

Today, some of the biggest names in the business at the top college programs are making quite the living doing their job. Just a few weeks ago, Alabama and Georgia battled for the services of popular strength coach Scott Cochran, who ultimately stayed in Tuscaloosa and is expected to get a big pay bump next year from his already-high salary.

Why is this happening? Athletic directors and head coaches have realized that strength coaches at the college level can have more impact than any other coach. They are with the players more, know them better and communicate with them on a more personal level.

Here's a look at why the eight highest-paid strength and conditioning coaches in college football are so valuable to their programs (ranked by 2015 base salary):

1. Chris Doyle, Iowa, $515,000
Chris Doyle will see his salary approach $600,000 if Iowa can beat Stanford in the Rose Bowl. AP Photo/Brian Ray

The highest-paid strength and conditioning coach in the nation makes the same in salary as the school's offensive and defensive coordinators. Doyle's program centers on "Break The Rock," which takes its inspiration from the famous Jacob Riis quote about the stonecutter who sees no progress after delivering 100 blows but breaks the rock on the 101st. The Hawkeyes' new football performance center includes 23,000 square feet that Doyle, who has been at Iowa since 1999, presides over. An Iowa win against Stanford in the Rose Bowl would trigger a 16 percent raise for Doyle, upping his 2016 base pay to $597,400.

2. Mickey Marotti, Ohio State, $431,558

Counting bonuses in Ohio State's rise to the top of the college football world last season, Marotti pulled in a total of $524,750. Marotti helped Urban Meyer win two titles at Florida before re-joining the coach at Ohio State. When Meyer was hired at Ohio State in 2012, he called Marotti -- who now controls the Buckeyes' 13,000-square-foot weight room and holds the title of assistant athletic director for football sports performance -- his most important hire. Marotti doesn't do only the meathead stuff. He has also made himself responsible for synthesizing data on all the players that is shared with other parts of the Buckeyes' support staff.

3. Scott Cochran, Alabama, $420,000

Given Nick Saban's success at Alabama, it's no surprise that Cochran is high on this list. Saban brought Cochran, who worked for the coach at LSU, to Alabama in 2007 after Cochran's three-year stint with the NBA's New Orleans Hornets. Cochran runs Alabama's "Fourth Quarter" program, a nod to finishing games strong, and oversees the school's 37,000-square-foot weight room. Cochran is expected to make even more in 2016, thanks to a battle for his services after Alabama defensive coordinator Kirby Smart was hired as Georgia's head coach and wanted to bring Cochran with him. Cochran has somewhat of a celebrity status at Alabama. His Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah 5K through downtown Tuscaloosa raises money for cystic fibrosis.

4. Rob Glass, Oklahoma State, $401,166
Oklahoma State strength coach Rob Glass adds some pounds to a machine for booster Boone Pickens, who bankrolled the program's weight room. AP Photo/Sue Ogrocki

Glass, whose nickname is "Body By Glass," was a student at Oklahoma State and rose to strength coach during the Barry Sanders' era (1986-88) at the school. Glass went to Florida for 10 years before coming back to the Cowboys when former Oklahoma State quarterback Mike Gundy took over the program in 2005. Glass' return to Stillwater was a lot different than his beginnings there. Thanks to a huge donation from booster Boone Pickens, Glass could build the ultimate workout room. That's a far cry from when he would spray paint the weights to make them look new.

5. Paul Jackson, Ole Miss, $375,000

Jackson is getting a $75,000 raise come Jan. 1, boosting him past his mentor Tommy Moffitt, whom he worked for at LSU from 2007 to 2010. Having graduated college in 2006, Jackson is the youngest coach on this list and one of the most active in sharing his workouts and thoughts on social media. Under the handle of @CoachPJackson, he has more than 11,000 followers on Twitter.

6. Ben Herbert, Arkansas $340,000

A four-year player on Wisconsin's defensive line during the Barry Alvarez days, Herbert became the man behind the weights for the Badgers, whose huge offensive lines are a trademark. He then went with Bret Bielema to Arkansas, where the 2014 team claimed to have the largest offensive line in college or pro football with an average weight for starters of 328 pounds. Players who have trained under him say he's a master motivator, and his strength comes by finding what motivates each player instead of forcing an ideal on all of them.

7. Pat Moorer, Texas, $330,000

If you want to learn about Moorer's program at Texas, you're not going to find out about it from him. Moorer, who traveled to Texas with head coach Charlie Strong after spending four years with him at Louisville, doesn't like to do interviews. Moorer is said to get the most out of his players, and the fact that three Louisville players were drafted in the first round of the 2014 draft -- Calvin Pryor, Marcus Smith and Teddy Bridgewater -- is partly due to him. As a player, Moorer went to Florida as a walk-on linebacker, was the SEC defensive freshman of the year in 1986 and eventually became a team captain.

8. Tommy Moffitt, LSU, $315,000
Tommy Moffitt is in his 16th season as LSU's strength and conditioning coach. Steve Franz/Louisiana State University/Collegiate Images/Getty Images

Sure, Les Miles can recruit with the best of them, but Moffitt can also develop players. Much of the public's focus on strength and conditioning programs is on the weights, and LSU has 30,000 pounds of weights and equipment. But Moffitt's program also focuses on movement skills, aiming to help give players explosive bursts. The record speaks for itself. In the past 10 years, LSU has produced 13 first-round draft picks, and Moffitt has developed NFL-ready speedsters such as Odell Beckham Jr., Tyrann Mathieu and Patrick Peterson.

Check out the difference since 2010:

With such a long list of responsibilities, strength coordinators now are paid like topflight assistants at most power programs. That includes Notre Dame, where Kelly says Longo's compensation is comparable to his coordinators. (As a private school, Notre Dame doesn't have to make salaries public.) According to media reports, that's the case at most national championship contenders, whether it's Jerry Schmidt at Oklahoma ($244,000), Mickey Marotti at Florida ($240,000), Scott Cochran at Alabama ($210,000) or Jeff "Mad Dog" Madden at Texas ($209,803). They've come a long way since Boyd Epley, considered the godfather of modern strength training, was being paid $3.50 an hour at Nebraska in the early 1970s.

Even at schools that lack the budget of the top powers, strength coaches are commanding big dollars. Louisville, which is coming off three straight seasons without playing in a bowl game and hired Charlie Strong to remedy that, is paying new strength coach Pat Moorer $180,000 this season.

 

[BobbyMac]

I don't understand why football success and academic success have to be mutually exclusive. ND would be Marquette if it weren't for football. Football put ND on the map. Why not celebrate that tradition? Having a good football program has no bearing on academics other than limiting the selection of recruits (which Stanford does to an even greater degree than ND).

First off... I know two very active grads, both extremely wealthy and connected who have the exact same response when asked if ND should be great at playing football or playing school. They simple say, "Both." ND has produced a lot of successful people who became successful by not settling for either/or expectations or results.

Secondly... Football didn't put ND on the map like basketball put Georgetown or Nova on the map. Football built ND. Without football, ND is another Loyola, St Louis, Dayton or maybe even St Joe (IN)... just with a nicer admin building. Some really unique factors came together that allowed football at ND to become a significant outreach of the church, this created financial involvement with it's proud alumni and a world class educational institution sprang from that generosity. All of this had to do with ND's Catholicism and its football program. Since ND owes the genesis of its position to the football program, it should place special stewardship on it to protect the gains it has made for the church and it's scholastic advancement. These facets of ND are simply indivisible. To me, it is as much of a religious mandate to strive for greatness, as it is an athletic one. The community fellowship ND football provides for it's fans is done in Christ's name at a level that is unique in all of sports. That's worth fighting to maintain.

 

[beryirish]

To me, I thought what made ND football what it is today is due in part thanks to the Big 10 and Michigan blackballing them and not wanting to play them and telling other teams not to schedule them.

So that's why ND went to USC because they pretty much had to in order to get games on their schedule. That created the one of the best rivalries in football. That's how they were getting national attention and eventually prestige.

Correct me here if my history equates to the world being flat.

 

[dublinirish]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Charlie Strong would be a great fit for defensive coordinator at Notre Dame. He brings great character and morals. <a href="https://twitter.com/NDFootball">@NDFootball</a></p>— Kory Minor (@Kmine4) <a href="https://twitter.com/Kmine4/status/806558418689327104">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[beryirish]

.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Charlie Strong would be a great fit for defensive coordinator at Notre Dame. He brings great character and morals. <a href="https://twitter.com/NDFootball">@NDFootball</a></p>— Kory Minor (@Kmine4) <a href="https://twitter.com/Kmine4/status/806558418689327104">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Charlie Strong would be a great fit for defensive coordinator at Notre Dame. He brings great character and morals. <a href="https://twitter.com/NDFootball">@NDFootball</a></p>— Kory Minor (@Kmine4) <a href="https://twitter.com/Kmine4/status/806558418689327104">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Irish YJ]

Venables wins Broyles Award for top assistant coach - Clemson Football Update | TigerNet

 

[NDdomer2]

Do morals keep opponents under 20 points per game? if so sign me up.

 

[Irish YJ]

Do morals keep opponents under 20 points per game? if so sign me up.

Probably better than BVG's D

 

[BobbyMac]

To me, I thought what made ND football what it is today is due in part thanks to the Big 10 and Michigan blackballing them and not wanting to play them and telling other teams not to schedule them.

So that's why ND went to USC because they pretty much had to in order to get games on their schedule. That created the one of the best rivalries in football. That's how they were getting national attention and eventually prestige.

Correct me here if my history equates to the world being flat.

That's true. Yost's anti-Catholic stance forced ND out onto the road so it's ND's Catholicism that gave rise to the football teams national brand in the age of Life magazine, barnstorming and whistle stop tours.

 

[Rocket89]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Ohio State's Mickey Marotti is more than just a strength coach -- he's the irreplaceable "second in command" <a href="https://t.co/ON7wntwaK6">https://t.co/ON7wntwaK6</a></p>— Paul Myerberg (@PaulMyerberg) <a href="https://twitter.com/PaulMyerberg/status/806558280025829376">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Pay for S&C coaches is rising dramatically. Three guys (Marotti, Iowa's Doyle, Bama's Cochrane) are paid more annually than 17 FBS HCs.</p>— Paul Myerberg (@PaulMyerberg) <a href="https://twitter.com/PaulMyerberg/status/806559674359250944">December 7, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I miss the good old days when Marotti was despised at ND. Whoops! Just another swing and miss from the S&C criticism.

 

[NDdomer2]

Probably better than BVG's D

man, sounds thrilling. if thats all were after, we can just keep as is....

 

[Irish YJ]

man, sounds thrilling. if thats all were after, we can just keep as is....

I'd take CS in a heartbeat as DC.

 

[IrishLax]

I miss the good old days when Marotti was despised at ND. Whoops! Just another swing and miss from the S&C criticism.

Mhmm.

So much criticism of Longo... and maybe some of it is justified, who knows... but we saw OBVIOUS improvement when he took over from Mendoza in terms of conditioning. And there was anecdotal development of players into better athletes... namely guys like Will Fuller, Harrison Smith, etc.

But you go 4-8 and it's time to blame everyone.

 

[NDdomer2]

I'd take CS in a heartbeat as DC.

I never said I wouldn't take him. But if a past players best reason for hiring him is good morals then maybe not ya know?

Who said BVG had bad morals? I don't think that was the issue why he lost his job.

I would think good morals is just first box to check out of many in becoming NDs coach at anything.

 

[Irish#1]

But you go 4-8 and it's time to blame everyone.

Isn't that how it's supposed to work?

 

[greyhammer90]

its been very well communicated there is no HC change this year.

Period.

 

[IrishLax]

Isn't that how it's supposed to work?

I mean, I started a thread in the middle of Michigan State titled "Fire Everyone"... so yeah, I'm not unsympathetic to the idea that massive staff overhaul is necessary.

But people should be very careful not to misplace blame with bad arguments, because that's how you end up with good coaches working at other places and making us pay for it. There is an established history of ND fans getting fed up with Coach X... and then years later, Coach X is working for a rival, doing an awesome job, and making us look like buffoons.

Best example this year is the repeated criticism of Hiestand which is just beyond stupid and shows utter ignorance by many people about OL play and football in general. Criticism of Longo might be more legitimate and a change could help, but the arguments against him are generally anecdotal or otherwise tenuous. Only a few points (player complaints, injuries, weight of players in the trenches, etc.) stand up to scrutiny at all.