The Optimal Notre Dame Scheduling Model

[Irish YJ]

I second that brother!!!!

I never miss an Egg Bowl if I can help it... the football is usually awful but the eye candy more than makes up for it...

Love me some Bama girls, but you have to watch out. Might be a bit worn out if they come from a large family with lots of brothers, cousins, uncles, etc..

I keed 3T

 

[Irish YJ]

I never miss an Egg Bowl if I can help it... the football is usually awful but the eye candy more than makes up for it...

On my bucket list. Where you at ACamp?

 

[ulukinatme]

BK is much more forgiving than me

Notre Dame’s Brian Kelly Rightfully Ends Navy Cut-Blocking Controversy - RantSports

I tend to agree with BK when it comes to Navy. If we drop Navy there will be plenty of cries of foul, bigger than the hilarious chicken comments from Hoke that caused him to get his ass handed to him. It kind of sucks, but BK is right here. We should continue to play Navy for as long as they want to play us.

To alleviate that problem I think we need to look at a different strategy when we play them. I think we should utilize some of our lesser used talent and younger players rather than our starters. Yes, the defense won't be as tough, but the starters also won't be beat up the following week. That really only applies to the DL and maybe OLBs that play close to the line. It would be a good opportunity for our younger DL guys to get experience in one game, rather than getting experience in several games because a starter is injured. This may also warrant stocking the DL roster one or two guys heavier to allow for possible depth injuries.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

There isn't a single ND fan who would like this, but what coaches are wanting ND to do is sell out and play the "gauntlet" that is the ACC schedule AND play for a conference championship to be eligible for the playoffs. It'd look like this:

Wofford
Appalachian State
Louisville
BYE
Clemson
GA Tech
Boston College
Miami
NC State
FSU
Syracuse
Wake Forrest
Middle of the road Power 5 team (South Carolina?)
ACC Championship game

Then and only then would they be eligible for the playoffs. I'm sorry but that's a fucking joke of a schedule and ND would laughed off the planet after they released that. That's Clemson's schedule for 2015 btw.

ND is in a damned if they do, damned if they don't situation. Therefore I saw screw em all and keep doing what you're doing Jack.

 

[Irish YJ]

I tend to agree with BK when it comes to Navy. If we drop Navy there will be plenty of cries of foul, bigger than the hilarious chicken comments from Hoke that caused him to get his ass handed to him. It kind of sucks, but BK is right here. We should continue to play Navy for as long as they want to play us.

To alleviate that problem I think we need to look at a different strategy when we play them. I think we should utilize some of our lesser used talent and younger players rather than our starters. Yes, the defense won't be as tough, but the starters also won't be beat up the following week. That really only applies to the DL and maybe OLBs that play close to the line. It would be a good opportunity for our younger DL guys to get experience in one game, rather than getting experience in several games because a starter is injured. This may also warrant stocking the DL roster one or two guys heavier to allow for possible depth injuries.

I don't necessarily agree with the bold, but I think you are on to something in the second paragraph. Maybe some of the big young DTs could fall on the little Seamen and squash the hell out of them. Kinda like hockey when you send in an enforcer.

 

[IrishLax]

I tend to agree with BK when it comes to Navy. If we drop Navy there will be plenty of cries of foul, bigger than the hilarious chicken comments from Hoke that caused him to get his ass handed to him. It kind of sucks, but BK is right here. We should continue to play Navy for as long as they want to play us.

To alleviate that problem I think we need to look at a different strategy when we play them. I think we should utilize some of our lesser used talent and younger players rather than our starters. Yes, the defense won't be as tough, but the starters also won't be beat up the following week. That really only applies to the DL and maybe OLBs that play close to the line. It would be a good opportunity for our younger DL guys to get experience in one game, rather than getting experience in several games because a starter is injured. This may also warrant stocking the DL roster one or two guys heavier to allow for possible depth injuries.

I've been saying this for years. Have your second string or scout team or whatever spend time practicing to defend option football. Athleticism DOES NOT MATTER relative to Navy, because even depth pieces will be more athletic than their Naval Academy counterparts.

So you practice a junk defense with non-starters throughout the year, and this gives you an extra bye week for your defensive starters, and is likely more effective. You should be able to coach up guys like John Turner to play LB against Navy... he's fast and "big enough," and speed trumps power against Navy. An undersized DT like Tyler Stockton should be money against that kind of team. And so on and so forth. You don't need Sheldon Day getting his knees taken out.

The alternative is to play them in the first or last game of each year. That would also solve the problem in a roundabout way. If the first game, follow them with Cream Puff XYZ... if the lst game, you have tons of time to rest afterwards.

 

[IrishLax]

There isn't a single ND fan who would like this, but what coaches are wanting ND to do is sell out and play the "gauntlet" that is the ACC schedule AND play for a conference championship to be eligible for the playoffs. It'd look like this:

Wofford
Appalachian State
Louisville
BYE
Clemson
GA Tech
Boston College
Miami
NC State
FSU
Syracuse
Wake Forrest
Middle of the road Power 5 team (South Carolina?)
ACC Championship game

Then and only then would they be eligible for the playoffs. I'm sorry but that's a fucking joke of a schedule and ND would laughed off the planet after they released that. That's Clemson's schedule for 2015 btw.

ND is in a damned if they do, damned if they don't situation. Therefore I saw screw em all and keep doing what you're doing Jack.

You think that's bad? Look at the other side of the ACC...

 

[Buster Bluth]

There are two ideal situations for ND (that don't involve blowing up the entire system and forming a conference with BC, Northwestern, Stanford, Vandy, Duke, Wake Forest, etc.).

The first is joining the ACC full time and having the last team in be UCONN. ND joins the ACC North which is comprised of ND, BC, Pitt, Syracuse, UCONN, UVA, Virginia Tech, and Louisville. The ACC sticks to an 8 game conference schedule, and ND's crossover game is Miami. ND drops Stanford from the schedule, plays USC + Navy + two cream puffs. ND never wins less than 9 games again in a season, and routinely competes for the ACC championship.

The second is that we get to an 8 team playoff within the next 5 years. The playoff is set up to be 5 conference champs as AQs + 3 at-large bids. ND stays independent and continues the 5 + 3 + 4 model. The +4 includes Purdue, a Shamrock Series game, and two cream puffs.

I'm with you, only I would want to see Notre Dame pulls Navy along with it.

 

[ACamp1900]

Am I not an Notre Dame fan?! Would I not freakin love that schedule!?

 

[wizards8507]

There are two ideal situations for ND (that don't involve blowing up the entire system and forming a conference with BC, Northwestern, Stanford, Vandy, Duke, Wake Forest, etc.).

I'd be all in on that conference if it were granted AQ status.

 

[ACamp1900]

Honestly though, I would rather ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing one, while winning ten plus games and being in the title hunt every damn year than ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing a difficult one and losing 3-5 games a year bc of it...

 

[ThePiombino]

Honestly though, I would rather ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing one, while winning ten plus games and being in the title hunt every damn year than ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing a difficult one and losing 3-5 games a year bc of it...

Yup

 

[BleedBlueGold]

You think that's bad? Look at the other side of the ACC...

I just randomly picked Clemson's schedule. They've been decent and have some hype, yet look at that schedule. ND would get killed for playing a schedule like that. I don't doubt that there are others with worse schedules.

Honestly though, I would rather ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing one, while winning ten plus games and being in the title hunt every damn year than ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing a difficult one and losing 3-5 games a year bc of it...

I actually agree with this but seriously doubt ND ever plays a schedule like this.

 

[Old Man Mike]

We need always to schedule with recruiting in mind. ND is not going to be frozen out of playoffs for schedule reasons; we are going to be frozen out of playoffs for losing games.

Being "half in" the ACC was brilliant by ND because it solves our recruiting presence along the entire east coast all the way through Florida. That "philosophy" is why we must keep USC and Stanford --- we don't need anything else on the west coast. Then we need Texas. That should be Texas home and home, and the year that we play Texas at South Bend play Navy in Houston --- there's no denser area of high school football talent on the planet than in Houston. Maybe a few of them can pass classes.

That leaves three games, none of which should be ball-busters. These games should probably firm up our presence near home, but one might be otherwise. I like a home and home with Purdue. I'd also like something like a regular game in Soldiers Field with a MAC team --- maybe Northern. For the last game, look around the country, where do we need exposure? Louisiana? How about Tulane in the New Orleans dome? ... or some other such recruiting oriented venue in a big pro stadium, or at home.

If ND goes through its ACC schedule plus USC, Stanford, Texas then there is no way we're not in the playoffs no matter who the other four are [one of which could be Navy, one Purdue].

I am very tired of a back-breaking grinder every week.

 

[Legacy]

My only rules for scheduling would be to give some weight to private universities and schedule those universities whose fans respect us. ND fans travel and we'll always have a contingent who should not have to be subjected to derogatory words or insults to their wives and others.

Start with our five rotating ACC games plus USC, Stanford and Navy. The Navy game is always great to experience, fight us to the end, give us a different offense to prepare for, and share many values.

For the other four:
1. (1 of these per year) Texas, Oklahoma, Tenn, Nebraska have great fans and would always be competitive. I don't know about Georgia's fans.

2. (every other year a B10 school) The B10 will probably go to a nine game conference schedule. Ohio State and Michigan won't play us - toughens up their schedule too much. Penn State is probably ducking us. Doubt Wisconsin wants to take us on. So, Michigan State or Northwestern. Possibly Rutgers in the Meadowlands. Purdue every once in a while.
or
(opposite the B10 game) Oregon or BYU

3. (East coast exposure if no B10 Rutgers game) Temple, UMass

4. (Texas) TCU would be my first choice, probably in Cowboys Stadium, Houston or Rice. A&M and Texas are on the schedule, so after 2016 before 2024.

I favor a 7-5 schedule model, but playing in Arlington, New Orleans, Atlanta, Jacksonville especially in November for an occasional neutral site game would be nice. And why not another game in Dublin?

Somewhat of a heavier schedule and coast-to-coast but that's my model. I just would need to balance it so that we are not playing Oklahoma, Oregon, Michigan State and TCU in the same year.

 

[Blaise]

I guess as a fan, I like ND's tough schedule, yeah it might mean we only make the playoffs 1 out of 6 years instead of 1 out of 3, but If my choice was playing Stanford, USC, MSU, or Woffard, Tenn St and Eastern Michigan, I choose the Gauntlet

 

[NCND]

Honestly though, I would rather ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing one, while winning ten plus games and being in the title hunt every damn year than ND get killed for playing a shite schedule, while actually playing a difficult one and losing 3-5 games a year bc of it...

+1. Not sure why alot of fans want the toughest schedule possible but complain when they lose... give me random acc schedule every year and I'll be happy.

 

[wizards8507]

I guess as a fan, I like ND's tough schedule, yeah it might mean we only make the playoffs 1 out of 6 years instead of 1 out of 3, but If my choice was playing Stanford, USC, MSU, or Woffard, Tenn St and Eastern Michigan, I choose the Gauntlet

I absolutely agree. I love waking up every week and being (at least a little) excited about who we play. If we played a single FCS team, ever, I would probably tune that week out. I don't want my college football fandom to ever have that vibe. I'd much rather see a move towards a model where everyone is playing competitive football every week. I don't have a problem with C-USA, MAC, and Mountain West teams, but no Power 5 program should ever schedule an FCS opponent.

+1. Not sure why alot of fans want the toughest schedule possible but complain when they lose... give me random acc schedule every year and I'll be happy.

Because I'd rather watch good football every week for twelve weeks and have a tough road to the playoff than watch crap football for four of those twelve weeks and have a slightly better shot at the playoff. College football is not about the destination, it's about the journey. Either way, the playoff is a mathematical long shot. I don't see the value proposition in watering down the rest of the product in the name of a slightly less long shot.

 

[Blaise]

+1. Not sure why alot of fans want the toughest schedule possible but complain when they lose... give me random acc schedule every year and I'll be happy.

When we play Umass... I won't wake up excited for the game... I will go about my day, watch it and be like eh ok...

When we play USC, or Clemson, I am pumped all day... Can't think of anything than the game... That's what I have always loved about ND... No interest in Wofford

 

[wizards8507]

When we play USC, or Clemson, I am pumped all day... Can't think of anything than the game... That's what I have always loved about ND... No interest in Wofford

Yup. When we played Florida State last year, I nearly had about ten different heart attacks.

(Remember when we thought we won for like ten seconds?)

 

[NCND]

When we play Umass... I won't wake up excited for the game... I will go about my day, watch it and be like eh ok...

When we play USC, or Clemson, I am pumped all day... Can't think of anything than the game... That's what I have always loved about ND... No interest in Wofford

True. I still would rather have random acc schedule tho.

 

[wizards8507]

True. I still would rather have random acc schedule tho.

We mostly do. Stanford is going to suck again. Navy is a cupcake whether people like to admit it or not. Then we have the likes of UMass and Temple. Everyone keeps talking about this "gauntlet" of a schedule, but we have three games this year where we should win by 30. I don't buy the argument that Temple, Navy, and UMass are something more than a cupcake just because they're not as bad as Eastern Kentucky.

 

[Cali_domer]

True. I still would rather have random acc schedule tho.

Agreed, independence is already gone. Might as well win some more games.

 

[Blaise]

True. I still would rather have random acc schedule tho.

Then you don't even have to watch... There is only 1 game a year where you need to watch... the other 11 are blah... no thanks.. I'll take 6-7 weeks of exciting games than 10 blowouts a year

 

[ACamp1900]

For those talking about excitement, how exciting is it when ND plays in the toilet bowl every year because the schedule was too hard to accomplish anything else?? Also how exciting would it be to have ND playing in the playoffs just about every year because the schedule was actually sane and allowed for the same road that just about every other college football program in the country takes on an average year... I fail to see what's exciting about 8-9 win seasons...

 

[Cali_domer]

For those talking about excitement, how exciting is it when ND plays in the toilet bowl every year because the schedule was too hard anything else?? Also how exciting would it be for ND playing in the playoffs just about every year because the schedule was actually sane and allowed for the same road that just about every other college football program in the country takes... I fail to see what's exciting about 8-9 win seasons...

exactly....Our schedules will still be tough anyways(USC and Stanford ) plus one more available game(Probably Bama because we like real difficult roads).

If we continue down this road of 8 win seasons eventually we will lose our "special status" anyway. The younger crowd wants a winner not 8-5 every year because we like to take on all comers.

 

[Ndaccountant]

We mostly do. Stanford is going to suck again. Navy is a cupcake whether people like to admit it or not. Then we have the likes of UMass and Temple. Everyone keeps talking about this "gauntlet" of a schedule, but we have three games this year where we should win by 30. I don't buy the argument that Temple, Navy, and UMass are something more than a cupcake just because they're not as bad as Eastern Kentucky.

Perhaps we differ on the term cupcake. I look at a cupcake as being UMASS, where there is literally no chance to lose unless something unreal happens. Cupcakes are FCS team or teams that routinely finish with 3 or 4 wins each year. That has not been Navy since 2003. Since that year, Navy has had 7 or less wins one time. Once.

Yes, their old schedules read like a C-USA team, but they won and won consistently. Additionally, when they go up against bigger name schools, they often have a punchers chance and more often than not, end up in a competitive game. That is not a cupcake to me.

Notable games since 2006 outside of ND:
2014 - Lost to OSU by 17, but the score was inflated by a last minute TD by OSU.
Lost to Rutgers by 7. Beat Temple, SDSU & SJSU
2013 - Beat Pitt, Indiana, lost to Duke in a blowout
2012 - Beat Indiana, ECU, CMU, lost in blowouts to ASU & PSU
2011 - Lost to South Carolina by 7, Rutgers by 1, ECU by 3 (this was their one losing season since 2003)
2010 - Lost to Maryland by 3, beat Wake, La Tech, CMU & ECU
2009 - Lost to Ohio State by 4, Beat La Tech, Mizzou, Wake
2008 - Beat Wake, Rutgers, Temple lost to Duke and Wake in the bowl game
2007 - Beat Wake, Pitt, Duke Temple lost to Utah by 3, lost to Rutgers and Wake
2006 - Beat Stanford, Duke, ECU, Uconn, Temple lost to BC by 1

 

[Cackalacky]

For those talking about excitement, how exciting is it when ND plays in the toilet bowl every year because the schedule was too hard to accomplish anything else?? Also how exciting would it be to have ND playing in the playoffs just about every year because the schedule was actually sane and allowed for the same road that just about every other college football program in the country takes on an average year... I fail to see what's exciting about 8-9 win seasons...

The Secret to Happiness and Compassion: Low Expectations

 

[NCND]

Then you don't even have to watch... There is only 1 game a year where you need to watch... the other 11 are blah... no thanks.. I'll take 6-7 weeks of exciting games than 10 blowouts a year

Keep settling for these awesome 8 to 9 win seasons.

 

[wizards8507]

For those talking about excitement, how exciting is it when ND plays in the toilet bowl every year because the schedule was too hard to accomplish anything else?? Also how exciting would it be to have ND playing in the playoffs just about every year because the schedule was actually sane and allowed for the same road that just about every other college football program in the country takes on an average year... I fail to see what's exciting about 8-9 win seasons...

Most teams have a nine-game conference schedule. That leaves three games that are flexible every year.

Temple.
UMass.
Navy.

What exactly do you want that's easier than Temple, UMass, and Navy? Anything less than that would be, frankly, embarrassing. Five ACC games plus USC, Stanford, and two other Power 5 teams is no more difficult than most teams' conference slate. Obviously, you're subject to the ups and downs of your opponent and it's been shit luck that Stanford has been "up" lately. Phil Steele has us at the #61 SOS this year. That's not a "gauntlet." If anything, we need to have a more difficult schedule, not less.

Think about it from the playoff committee's perspective. Most candidates for the playoff will have eleven Power 5 opponents. Nine conference games, one out-of-conference Power 5 opponent, and a conference championship game. Our schedule is pretty weak from that perspective.

Keep settling for these awesome 8 to 9 win seasons.

I'd rather lose to Stanford in a good game than beat Eastern Tennessee 60-3. I just would.