So....What’s the point?

[Legacy]

In the last three years we have played in a game where we could’ve solidified ourselves as great but instead of doing that we showed that we aren’t even really that good. I’m the years in between we work post season games that made us smile but when the rest of the country looked at it they went “oh, that cute you think that means something.” and please spells me tell me they weren’t in the right. Right now once again we are left humiliated after a big game, on the cusp of getting put in another big game only to maybe have something even worse done to us. Why’s the point of all this? What can we do to be better because I don’t think that’s ever going to happen. Citrus and Camping World Bowls are fun but they aren’t great. We can be fun but not great.

We wanted to be in the top fifteen, the top ten, then the top eight, then the top four, then undefeated in the regular season. We did all that. If you want to bail, feel free to root for Michigan, USC, Oklahoma, Texas, or any other team that wishes they were where we are.

 

[Old Man Mike]

The point is that we are in the championship brackets.
The point is that the Committee had other choices and picked us.

 

[Rudy89]

The point is that we are in the championship brackets.
The point is that the Committee had other choices and picked us.

I guess I just fail to see how being selected only to be humiliated on the national stage makes our program better? Yeah we made it but follow it up with how bad we always look I don’t see how getting selected only to be embarrassed makes us any better off than the winning Camping World Bowl and Citrus Bowls in years past. When people think ND football outside of this fan base they think of how we never look like we belong.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Maybe that is mainly your problem rather than the staff and the team's though. I'll bet that all of them think that getting to the NC brackets is pretty good.

 

[Bishop2b5]

I’m sure boosters give these kids money, even at ND. My boss’ brother was a big time recruit and went to Ole Miss. in the 80’s. Rich guys were always giving him money after games. As far as paying players to come, I bet it happens at the wannabes more (Ole Miss under Freeze for instance). Don’t think Saban has to as everyone seems to leave there and make money in the NFL.

This is my opinion too. I'd bet everything I own that there isn't an FBS program where some of this doesn't take place, including ND and my own beloved Bama. The big money buying of players, though, is absolutely more common at the wannabe schools trying to catch up to the big boys. Boosters giving $100 handshakes, car payments occasionally being made, a few clothes, rent covered every once in awhile, groceries, free pizza, a tank of gas... happens everywhere.

 

[irishff1014]

I guess I just fail to see how being selected only to be humiliated on the national stage makes our program better? Yeah we made it but follow it up with how bad we always look I don’t see how getting selected only to be embarrassed makes us any better off than the winning Camping World Bowl and Citrus Bowls in years past. When people think ND football outside of this fan base they think of how we never look like we belong.

I agree with OMM. This is what we wanted. To be in the playoffs and to play for a championship. Are we good enough to beat Bama probably not but I sure as hell want to see. Yes it sucks to get blown out but that should be a learning experience for everyone from staff to players. Kelly ran his mouth and said we should be here so now it’s time for him to get his team ready. No excuses.

Tommy Rees better go watch some serious film. I am not sold on him as an OC. But here is his chance to prove himself. His offense wasn’t ready. Learn from it. If he has another game like Clemson maybe it’s time to figure something else out.

Also the DB’s better get ready. They are gonna have a work out coming. Go Irish.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

What’s the point? The point is 85 kids get the opportunity to Come to ND and excel on and off the field. My opinion of how well they do that isn’t contingent on anything except what I want to make it. In that instance I’m proud that we have 10 win seasons and are in the top tier/ borderline elite of football and education. Not many can say that. Congrats coach and team on making the playoffs AGAIN and I hope you give your all and your best.

In the end these are young men doing what they love and also in a challenging environment on and off the field. I think we forget that or want to overlook it.

 

[NDRock]

This is my opinion too. I'd bet everything I own that there isn't an FBS program where some of this doesn't take place, including ND and my own beloved Bama. The big money buying of players, though, is absolutely more common at the wannabe schools trying to catch up to the big boys. Boosters giving $100 handshakes, car payments occasionally being made, a few clothes, rent covered every once in awhile, groceries, free pizza, a tank of gas... happens everywhere.

I think Bama is a combination of an all time great head coach and a school being all in on winning. Saban seems like a guy who had a plan on how to build a winning foundation and Bama was smart enough to give him everything he wanted. They have been on the forefront of optimal scheduling, roster management, analysts, S&C, etc... They built such a strong foundation of success the program has been able to continue winning even though wholesale staff changes. The culture is just phenomenal there. Hardly ever see any issues outside the program or stupid plays on the field. First program I remember being able to juggle all the egos that these 5* kids bring without it blowing up. Pete Carrol and Urban Meyer sure couldn’t do it.

That’s the view from the outside anyway.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Our main problem offensively (in my opinion) is that none of our WRs can get any separation even when they are playing "ordinary" (albeit "OK") DBs. When including the TEs, only Mayer looks like someone who gets separation (mainly by good routes and being smart.) So, we have NO passing game which can get easy throws. Except for quick crosses (or similar routes) no one will be open unless Book can buy time. And, we need to give him all props for managing to do that so many times per game.

What this means to me is that there is almost nothing Tommy Rees can do about that. I don't see that it's his fault that these guys can't get open once the plays are drawn and called --- we've had other receivers in the recent past who COULD so it's not like these plays are poorly designed.

It's also not Tommy's fault that our WR corps is so easy coverable by good DBs that the opponent can dedicate extra players vs the run and Ian's scrambling. Coach said that he had found a pattern (basically Big Boy football, with powerful lines and Big Body receivers) which would allow us to compete at the highest level. That's true and not true. The not true part is that ALL the receivers have to have Mayer like power and athleticism, and we only have one such young guy. People scream for people like Lenzy --- I've not seen the production in any form.

Our line would have been better than fine with Patterson. (also without an appendectomy for Big Tommy.) Our running game would have been fine with that plus any passing threat at all. Ian, by the way, completed almost all of his passes against Clemson with no interceptions but Clemson didn't care. Ian did all he could. Given the passing game limitations, probably so did Tommy.

Coach Kelly is going to have to create a bunch of outside-the-box stuff which fits our personnel limitations to mess with Alabama's defense.

 

[Bishop2b5]

I think Bama is a combination of an all time great head coach and a school being all in on winning. Saban seems like a guy who had a plan on how to build a winning foundation and Bama was smart enough to give him everything he wanted. They have been on the forefront of optimal scheduling, roster management, analysts, S&C, etc... They built such a strong foundation of success the program has been able to continue winning even though wholesale staff changes. The culture is just phenomenal there. Hardly ever see any issues outside the program or stupid plays on the field. First program I remember being able to juggle all the egos that these 5* kids bring without it blowing up. Pete Carrol and Urban Meyer sure couldn’t do it.

That’s the view from the outside anyway.

Excellent post and good insights. Something that usually gets overlooked is that Saban has fostered a very strong culture of brotherhood, genuine love for each other, and a "check your ego at the door" mentality with the players. Hazing of younger players has been 100% forbidden since the day he arrived. Instead, older players are encouraged to shepherd younger players, get to know them, and look out for them. There have been very few conflicts between players over the years and Saban won't tolerate any cliques. Starters respect and pull for backups. Starters are expected to put team first and teach their understudies instead of seeing them as threats. Big egos and "me first" go over like a turd in a punch bowl.

Last night when Landon Dickerson went down, Alex Leatherwood stood on the sidelines and cried, then every player on the team went out to midfield to say something to Dickerson and show support. When Jaylen Waddle broke his ankle at the beginning of the UT game, he refused to go to the hospital until after the game. He waited in the ambulance for over 3 hours so he could smoke a cigar with all the other receivers. Smith and Jones kept trying to give each other and Najee all the credit last night in post-game interviews.

All-Americans don't think they're too good to cover punts or kickoffs. Superstar WR's take pride in getting downfield and blocking for fellow players instead of crying about not getting the ball enough. There's very little showboating or "look at me!" after TD's. Everyone seems genuinely happy to celebrate teammates' success. That intense sense of team first, "I genuinely love all my teammates, we're all brothers" attitude has been a huge part of our success. It's certainly avoided all the usual big ego issues that we usually see.

 

[Legacy]

Good post, Bishop. Recruiting sites's stars are one thing, but creating a team is the real accomplishment. He expects them to go to class. Not many don't have to transfer to JCs due to academic problems.

 

[Jimmy3Putt]

Normally when a team has this type of sustained success its followed by sanctions, scandals, off the field arrests, and other undesirable things.

Saban has managed to avoid all of these. He's really amazing.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

I think Bama is a combination of an all time great head coach and a school being all in on winning. Saban seems like a guy who had a plan on how to build a winning foundation and Bama was smart enough to give him everything he wanted. They have been on the forefront of optimal scheduling, roster management, analysts, S&C, etc... They built such a strong foundation of success the program has been able to continue winning even though wholesale staff changes. The culture is just phenomenal there. Hardly ever see any issues outside the program or stupid plays on the field. First program I remember being able to juggle all the egos that these 5* kids bring without it blowing up. Pete Carrol and Urban Meyer sure couldn’t do it.

That’s the view from the outside anyway.

This sound similar to the stories about Urban Meyer. Apparently he is the type to demand total control and expects whatever he wants done to get done. One of the stories I remember was how he wanted the trashcans changed out in the football building because they weren't flashy enough, they did nothing to improve the experience of the recruits when they visited. And without so much as a question, the athletic department got it done and quickly had them all replaced with ones with the logo and in team colors.

He was obviously willing to overlook personal issues from his players and coaches, but when it came to things that mattered to winning, nothing was too small of a detail.

 

[Bishop2b5]

Normally when a team has this type of sustained success its followed by sanctions, scandals, off the field arrests, and other undesirable things.

Saban has managed to avoid all of these. He's really amazing.

He catches flack for being a control freak and hyper-stern & strict sometimes, but it's worked at least at minimizing this sort of stuff and players acting like idiots on and off the field.

 

[Jimmy3Putt]

This sound similar to the stories about Urban Meyer. Apparently he is the type to demand total control and expects whatever he wants done to get done. One of the stories I remember was how he wanted the trashcans changed out in the football building because they weren't flashy enough, they did nothing to improve the experience of the recruits when they visited. And without so much as a question, the athletic department got it done and quickly had them all replaced with ones with the logo and in team colors.

He was obviously willing to overlook personal issues from his players and coaches, but when it came to things that mattered to winning, nothing was too small of a detail.

Meyer's career is littered with scandal, sanctions, and player arrests.
The exact thing Saban avoids. Imo, they're not even comparable.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

So....What’s the point?

So....What’s the point?

He catches flack for being a control freak and hyper-stern & strict sometimes, but it's worked at least at minimizing this sort of stuff and players acting like idiots on and off the field.

Saban has created such a wealth of depth, that no single player is above being expendable if they screw up, and the players know that.

He could remove anyone from the equation at any time and still have a team capable of winning it all.

IIRC, TJ Yeldon was having a monster game, and got flagged for excessive celebration after a TD. Saban didnt hesitate to keep him on the sidelines the rest of the game.


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[Bishop2b5]

Saban has created such a wealth of depth, that no single player is above being expendable if they screw up, and the players know that.

He could remove anyone from the equation at any time and still have a team capable of winning it all.

IIRC, TJ Yeldon was having a monster game, and got flagged for excessive celebration after a TD. Saban didnt hesitate to keep him on the sidelines the rest of the game.

Yep. I remember that. Yeldon scored a TD against A&M and made Manziel's "money sign" then the throat slash, making fun of JFF. Yeah, Nick gave him some time to sit on the bench and think about that one.

 

[WaveDomer]

Seasons for 95% of sports fans end in a loss. The point is enjoying the process. Enjoy the storylines throughout the season. Like he says in Vision Quest "It's not about the 6 minutes. It's about what happens in that 6 minutes."

Being a fan should be fun. You aren't getting paid to be a fan. If it's not fun, I'd take stock.