Politics

Politics

  • Obama

    Votes: 4 1.1%
  • Romney

    Votes: 172 48.9%
  • Other

    Votes: 46 13.1%
  • a:3:{i:1637;a:5:{s:12:"polloptionid";i:1637;s:6:"nodeid";s:7:"2882145";s:5:"title";s:5:"Obama";s:5:"

    Votes: 130 36.9%

  • Total voters
    352

wizards8507

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The Tea Party has a similar program, funded by millions of dollars from the Koch Brothers to provide the general public with INaccurate information on health and climate change. This USC program is a good thing. They are trying to overcome nonsense about death panels and how rates are skyrocketing across the country -- the results of a propaganda campaign to scare people away from the new law.

I can only speak for my company since it's the only one of which I have direct knowledge. We have 166,000 employees and our insurance HAS skyrocketed. In 2013 I pay $33 per week for health insurance for me and my wife. In 2014 I will pay $95 for the same coverage. That's an increase of $62 per week, or 188%. That's not "Koch brothers' propaganda." That's real life and my real household budget which I, unlike the government, must balance. It basically amounts to a $3,000 paycut, which is real money to my family.
 

GoIrish41

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I can only speak for my company since it's the only one of which I have direct knowledge. We have 166,000 employees and our insurance HAS skyrocketed. In 2013 I pay $33 per week for health insurance for me and my wife. In 2014 I will pay $95 for the same coverage. That's an increase of $62 per week, or 188%. That's not "Koch brothers' propaganda." That's real life and my real household budget which I, unlike the government, must balance. It basically amounts to a $3,000 paycut, which is real money to my family.

there are tens of millions of people who will now have access to health insurance for the first time in their lives. I am truly sorry for the affect your rate increases have on you and your family, but I feel worse for people who never went to the doctor no matter how sick they got because they couldn't afford it. I'm not convinced that your rate increases are completely a product of Obamacare either. Insurance companies have been ripping people off for many years, and, IMO, are getting that one last rate increase in before someone starts watching the store.
 

MJ12666

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Disagreeing with you does not speak to the collective ignorance of the state of New Jersey. Perhaps they vote liberal because they actually believe in liberal policies.

You are assuming that I do not believe in liberal policies. All I am saying is that it makes no sense for the people in a high income state to vote for someone who will vote for high federal income tax rates especially when you are lucky to get 70 cents on the dollar back. Better to have lower federal rate and increase the state rate to pay for state and local social programs. Imagine if the missing 30 cents on the dollar can be funneled into the education system. Doesn't that make sense from the state perspective?

Thinking about it I can't remember ever voting for a Republican at the state or local level.
 
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phgreek

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because it isn't federal money that is funding this program, it is no different than what the Koch Brothers are doing.

mhmm...I would love to audit the program. See, the simple fact of the matter is...every time this happens, university resources are utilized, and cost centers for accounting are smeared

...reality is, what you suggest is really not possible...the IRS chooses the circumstances under which to "pay attention"....and by virtue of the fact it would take enormous resources at the university to ensure the program was firewalled, and to subsequently prove it...you've used resources paid for by the tax payer...reality is, they do much, much more.
 

wizards8507

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there are tens of millions of people who will now have access to health insurance for the first time in their lives.
Of those "tens of millions" of people, I think about 54,000 have signed up for ObamaCare (not an exaggeration). Paying the IRS penalty for noncompliance is cheaper than buying insurance through the exchanges so those people AREN'T buying the insurance that they have access to "for the first time in their lives." The only impact those people will see is a new tax penalty.

The poor have had access to Medicaid since the 1990s so your line is pure BS. If you haven't been able to find full-time work since the 1990s, you probably have a legitimate disability, in which case you're also taken care of.
I am truly sorry for the affect your rate increases have on you and your family, but I feel worse for people who never went to the doctor no matter how sick they got because they couldn't afford it.
Those people don't exist. Hospitals are prohibited from denying care based on ability to pay. No matter who you are, rich, poor, illegal immigrant, homeless, prisoner, whatever, they have to treat you. That's just a fact and the ACA does nothing to change it.
I'm not convinced that your rate increases are completely a product of Obamacare either. Insurance companies have been ripping people off for many years, and, IMO, are getting that one last rate increase in before someone starts watching the store.
I agree with you to some extent but your assessment of the problem is inconsistent with your preferred solution. Forcing people to buy a product only increases the insurance companies' leverage to jack up rates. My solution would be to move AWAY from the insurance model and people could either choose to buy it or save their money and pay for their own care. This would force the insurance companies to drop rates because they would actually have to compete for your business. Under the ACA, people have no choice but to purchase insurance, so the insurance companies will literally be able to charge whatever they want. We've lost the legal ability to say "no thanks" when abuse and cost run amok, so they have no incentive to eliminate it.
 

GoIrish41

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Of those "tens of millions" of people, I think about 54,000 have signed up for ObamaCare (not an exaggeration). Paying the IRS penalty for noncompliance is cheaper than buying insurance through the exchanges so those people AREN'T buying the insurance that they have access to "for the first time in their lives." The only impact those people will see is a new tax penalty.

The poor have had access to Medicaid since the 1990s so your line is pure BS. If you haven't been able to find full-time work since the 1990s, you probably have a legitimate disability, in which case you're also taken care of.

The exchanges opened up 10 days ago and will remain open for six months. I would venture to say that many, many more will sign up for Obamacare as time passes. I haven't seen any actual numbers on how many people who have actually signed up already, so I'll take your word for it, but given the technical problems with the exchanges, the fact that most are probably doing their research right now, and the fact that we are only a step off the starting line in a marathon, I'd say your numbers could be looked at as encouraging.

It really depends on what your definition of poor is. There are a lot of people in this country who may not be qualified for Medicaid because they are officially poor, but they still can't afford health insurance. Why? Because healthcare costs have climbed so fast for so long that they are priced out. Obamacare aims to correct that problem.

Those people don't exist. Hospitals are prohibited from denying care based on ability to pay. No matter who you are, rich, poor, illegal immigrant, homeless, prisoner, whatever, they have to treat you. That's just a fact and the ACA does nothing to change it.
.

You are kidding yourself if you don't think those people exist. Those that do go to emergency rooms for care receive the most expensive care in the entire healthcare system. Who pays for their care? You and I do through rate increases in our own insurance premiums. This is another problem that Obamacare aims to correct because fewer and fewer people will go to the emergency room for care because they will be able to go to their own doctor -- even receive preventative care that could help them stay healthy in the first place.

I agree with you to some extent but your assessment of the problem is inconsistent with your preferred solution. Forcing people to buy a product only increases the insurance companies' leverage to jack up rates. My solution would be to move AWAY from the insurance model and people could either choose to buy it or save their money and pay for their own care. This would force the insurance companies to drop rates because they would actually have to compete for your business. Under the ACA, people have no choice but to purchase insurance, so the insurance companies will literally be able to charge whatever they want. We've lost the legal ability to say "no thanks" when abuse and cost run amok, so they have no incentive to eliminate it.

Another Obamacare aim is to control healthcare costs by expanding the pool of those insured. If you are self-employed and have to buy insurance on the open market for you and your family, the cost is insane. If you work for a company that has 1000 employees, and you buy insurance through as a group, the rates go down. The more in the pool, the cheaper the rates. Obamacare aimes to put millions into the pool to dramatically lower costs. As far as the blatant insurance company greed that is partially responsible for out of control healthcare costs; my point of view is that Obamacare doesn't go far enough. I'd like to see the Insurance companies cut out of the system altogether. Americans should have the right to healthcare and the fact that this is all being used as a political football does not say anything good about this country.
 

Ndaccountant

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There is another big Obamacare problem.....the "fine" isn't truly legally enforceable where the IRS can come after you for your money if you don't have insurance. The only thing they can do is reduce the amount of tax refund you have. Simple solution for those that want to avoid paying thousands for insurance they don't want.....make sure you don't get a refund.
 

wizards8507

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Another Obamacare aim is to control healthcare costs by expanding the pool of those insured. If you are self-employed and have to buy insurance on the open market for you and your family, the cost is insane. If you work for a company that has 1000 employees, and you buy insurance through as a group, the rates go down. The more in the pool, the cheaper the rates. Obamacare aimes to put millions into the pool to dramatically lower costs. As far as the blatant insurance company greed that is partially responsible for out of control healthcare costs; my point of view is that Obamacare doesn't go far enough. I'd like to see the Insurance companies cut out of the system altogether. Americans should have the right to healthcare and the fact that this is all being used as a political football does not say anything good about this country.

First, increased demand drives costs up, not down. You're equating the "demand for care" with the "demand for insurance" and those aren't the same thing. The "pool" theory works under the old system because it was a spontaneous creation of the free market. Now that the "pools" are legal mandates, the "pool" of 1,000 becomes the "new self-employed person." As much as you're helping the self-employed, you're hurting everyone else. Under the old system, the insurance company would say "I can get 1,000 people to sign up if I give them a break on the rates. Neat." Under the current system, the insurance company says "these 1,000 people HAVE TO sign up for insurance, so why the hell should I give them a break on the rates? I'm guaranteed their business."

Second, you're missing the point about the ability to negotiate. If you HAVE TO buy something, then the person providing you that thing can charge whatever they want. Let's say we eliminate health insurance companies and the government pays for everyone's healthcare. I assume you'd want them to make those costs reasonable so that the taxpayer can bear the burden? I'm sure you would also say that people shouldn't profit from someone's sickness / disease / injury. Poof! Profit eliminated from healthcare. Everyone will have healthcare and everyone's healthcare will suck.

Personally, I want doctors and big pharma to get filthy rich off of healthcare profits. Why? Because profit is the single greatest motivator of human behavior (outside of sex and torture). I want the best and the brightest administering my care and doing the cancer research. If you take profit out of healthcare, you take incentive out of the healthcare profession. If you take incentive out of the healthcare profession, you get lower caliber physicians. The best and the brightest either skip medicine all together, or become mercenaries for the very wealthy.
 
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wizards8507

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Yet we will still re-elect the vast majority of them... because, My guy isn't part of the problem, it's all those other guys.....

Yeah, shout out to our friends in Ohio's 8th district. Please, dear Lord, let a viable conservative emerge to challenge Boehner in the primary.
 

ACamp1900

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Haven't you guys heard?? The real stimulating debate is going on over in the Sorority Girl thread....
 
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GoIrish41

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He's not far enough to the right. He compromised with Tip. He raised taxes multiple times. He bolstered social security. He signed the law that made it mandatory for hospitals to treat people who couldn't afford to pay. By today's standards, he is a socialist traitor.
 

BobD

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Cruz is the best thing to ever happen to the democratic party. So much so, I think he might be an undercover plant.
 

Wild Bill

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Cruz is the best thing to ever happen to the democratic party. So much so, I think he might be an undercover plant.

I disagree. Public school indoctrination, union corruption, media bias and growing entitlement culture have already paid much higher dividends.
 

Ndaccountant

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Jimmy Kimmel Prank: Obamacare vs. Affordable Care Act [VIDEO]

not sure if this was posted already, but it really speaks to the lack of knowledge people have about the Affordable Care Act. The analysis in this thread far exceeds the average American's understanding of what this program is all about.

I agree 100%, but leads me to this question......why would anybody lend any credence to polling data on the ACA if the majority of the population knows nothing about it?
 

GoIrish41

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I agree 100%, but leads me to this question......why would anybody lend any credence to polling data on the ACA if the majority of the population knows nothing about it?

I could not agree more and have made that point multiple times in this thread.
 
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