Offensive Line Thread

[drayer54]

I'll bet all the vBucks I don't have anymore that Alt is the LT next year. Not sure how they are supposed to see over him, but yeah. Solid Tackle.

 

[dad4aa]

I'll bet all the vBucks I don't have anymore that Alt is the LT next year. Not sure how they are supposed to see over him, but yeah. Solid Tackle.

I will take that that with all of my former VBucks bc I think Fisher will be LT

 

[Dale]

I’ll bet all my vBucks one of you is right!

 

[Irish#1]

Questions for OL this winter and into spring ball:

* Is Heistand coming back? (Please sweet baby Jesus). I'm almost positive I saw Chris Watt on the sideline at the 20yd line catch a player who was running out of bounds. Isn't that the rumor, that the Heistand/Watt show was just waiting for the season to end?

* Is Patterson returning? This OL can be top 10 if he does.

* Is Lugg moving on? Only way I see him contributing in 2022 is if the staff decides he can play RG. He's been a swiss army knife for Notre Dame over the course of his career but is the talent level surpassing his ceiling? I favor veteran OL so I personally wouldn't mind him playing RG. Lots of others will want a RS-Fr Spindler to take his spot.

* Will they move Baker back to LT. If he's a real bulldozer then RT is a nice place to put a run blocking-dominant tackle. I was always under the assumption he was playing LT because he was so huge that he could stop any pass rush on the blind side. If he's a legitimate All-American OT you probably flip the line and have him at LT.

This will probably be what everyone is rooting for:

T: Fisher (RS-Fr)
G: Spindler (RS-Fr)
C: Patterson (GS)
G: Kristofic (RS-Jr)
T: Alt (SO)

HH will be here in short time.
Patterson got a return to school grade, so it's a possibility.
Have no clue on Lugg, but he would be a qualityt backup for next year.
Baker will be back to LT. Alt has a little height on Baker, but Baker is a double wide compared to Alt. No reason you can't be a fortress at LT and still be a road grader.

 

[RDU Irish]

Alt and Fisher as true sophomores holding down both ends of the line sounds great. I want Spindler to break through too - kid just looks like a mauler that is hard to keep off the field. Three sophomore's starting in the Shoe scares me on paper even if Patterson is back.

I thought Lugg was a walking injury report? I just feel like he hasn't been healthy hardly ever which makes his contribution that much more impressive. Worried he may be a medical waiting to happen.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

HH will be here in short time.
Patterson got a return to school grade, so it's a possibility.
Have no clue on Lugg, but he would be a qualityt backup for next year.
Baker will be back to LT. Alt has a little height on Baker, but Baker is a double wide compared to Alt. No reason you can't be a fortress at LT and still be a road grader.

Yikes you are giving me nightmares of the thought of Baker starting at LT or any position on the Oline for that matter next season. Baker can sit on the bench as 2nd or 3rd team please, and he greatly needs to lose a few pounds to increase his foot speed. Blake Fisher and Joe Alt starting tackles for the next 2 to 3 years please!

 

[BleedingGold]

I am encouraged by the HH rumors. I think this staff needs an old crusty hard ass and OL is the perfect place to blend the youth with his experience and age.

 

[stpeteirish]

Alt and Fisher as true sophomores holding down both ends of the line sounds great. I want Spindler to break through too - kid just looks like a mauler that is hard to keep off the field. Three sophomore's starting in the Shoe scares me on paper even if Patterson is back.

I thought Lugg was a walking injury report? I just feel like he hasn't been healthy hardly ever which makes his contribution that much more impressive. Worried he may be a medical waiting to happen.

he's already a 5th year senior so if he's medically unable to play his next move is to get a job.

 

[GoldenToTheGrave]

I've heard the rumblings about Heistand but what's the scuttlebutt on Chris Watt? And if Heistand is here what's his position going to be?

 

[ThePiombino]

Carroll out?

 

[BilboBaggins]

I've heard the rumblings about Heistand but what's the scuttlebutt on Chris Watt? And if Heistand is here what's his position going to be?

I had read *somewhere* that Watt would be an analyst. All internet rumors though, I have no connection to ND.

 

[stpeteirish]

Watt's still listed as OL coach on Tulane's website. Doubt if he's leave voluntarily for an analyst's job

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Yikes you are giving me nightmares of the thought of Baker starting at LT or any position on the Oline for that matter next season. Baker can sit on the bench as 2nd or 3rd team please, and he greatly needs to lose a few pounds to increase his foot speed. Blake Fisher and Joe Alt starting tackles for the next 2 to 3 years please!

Baker
Blaker
The Blanker

 

[Dizzyphil]

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/NDonNBC/status/1478433674861424645[/TWEET]

 

[ab2cmiller]

I'm perfectly fine with HH returning but I'm dreading the overreaction when we have difficulty running the ball.

Am I the only person who can recall a fair number of posters on this board bitching and moaning about HH's offensive line struggling to open holes to run the ball as well as you would've expected with the horses we had on the line? I can remember some line of discussion where people had to defend HH and talk about how the Offensive Line blocking philosophy revolves around what blocking style that the OC wanted used. I have no idea how TR's philosophy differs from the OC's during HH's time. I'm not even close to being an expert on OL play, but I just recall some of those conversations.

It does seem like HH should be able to recruit well without a lot of difficulty when he slaps down the list of former players that he coached that are now in the NFL.

 

[Irish du Nord]

Watt's still listed as OL coach on Tulane's website. Doubt if he's leave voluntarily for an analyst's job

Word was that he isn’t being retained

 

[irishog77]

I'm perfectly fine with HH returning but I'm dreading the overreaction when we have difficulty running the ball.

Am I the only person who can recall a fair number of posters on this board bitching and moaning about HH's offensive line struggling to open holes to run the ball as well as you would've expected with the horses we had on the line? I can remember some line of discussion where people had to defend HH and talk about how the Offensive Line blocking philosophy revolves around what blocking style that the OC wanted used. I have no idea how TR's philosophy differs from the OC's during HH's time. I'm not even close to being an expert on OL play, but I just recall some of those conversations.

It does seem like HH should be able to recruit well without a lot of difficulty when he slaps down the list of former players that he coached that are now in the NFL.

I was one that bitched. Not about HH and the OL though. The sideways runs that took 11 minutes to develop never did much damage against good defenses. I blame Burnt Ends Brian for that, not HH.

 

[Giddyup]

Your memory isn’t wrong. I’m pretty surprised how gung ho people are for Hiestand. Sure he can recruit very well but we couldn’t run until his final year here. (Quinn,Kelly step in?). He got fired from Tennessee and Chicago most recently and he wasn’t fired for good performance. His pass protection is very good but we need to be able to run.

I was hoping for young blood and being able to turn the pages to fresh coaches, not looking for retreads.

 

[NDdomer2]

I'm perfectly fine with HH returning but I'm dreading the overreaction when we have difficulty running the ball.

Am I the only person who can recall a fair number of posters on this board bitching and moaning about HH's offensive line struggling to open holes to run the ball as well as you would've expected with the horses we had on the line? I can remember some line of discussion where people had to defend HH and talk about how the Offensive Line blocking philosophy revolves around what blocking style that the OC wanted used. I have no idea how TR's philosophy differs from the OC's during HH's time. I'm not even close to being an expert on OL play, but I just recall some of those conversations.

It does seem like HH should be able to recruit well without a lot of difficulty when he slaps down the list of former players that he coached that are now in the NFL.

This will happen. I did some breakdowns once upon a time. Harry's online were elite in PassPro and average in run blocking. They also were below average in stuff rate.

 

[chicago51]

Your memory isn’t wrong. I’m pretty surprised how gung ho people are for Hiestand. Sure he can recruit very well but we couldn’t run until his final year here. (Quinn,Kelly step in?). He got fired from Tennessee and Chicago most recently and he wasn’t fired for good performance. His pass protection is very good but we need to be able to run.

I was hoping for young blood and being able to turn the pages to fresh coaches, not looking for retreads.

That one isn't on Harry. Harry wanted to do things the right way and Matt Nagy wanted to do things his way.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Your memory isn’t wrong. I’m pretty surprised how gung ho people are for Hiestand. Sure he can recruit very well but we couldn’t run until his final year here. (Quinn,Kelly step in?). He got fired from Tennessee and Chicago most recently and he wasn’t fired for good performance. His pass protection is very good but we need to be able to run.

I was hoping for young blood and being able to turn the pages to fresh coaches, not looking for retreads.

I think you're selling the team short. Notre Dame had a very good run game in 2012 and a great running game in 2015 (208.3 ypg and 5.6 ypc). It was OK in 2016 when Josh Adams was carrying the ball. Certainly the production in 2013, 2014, and (overall in) 2016 was uninspiring but how much of that was the running back position? GAIII and Cam McDaniel wouldn't be seeing the field on Notre Dame's recent teams.

 

[Giddyup]

Hiestand’s run yards per carry was 28th and 29th in the Chicago his two years. I don’t think any NFL coach would have any choice but to fire him.

I think Hiestand is awesome at recruiting and pass protection but against good secondaries in college you need to be able to run.

 

[Giddyup]

Pops I’ll wish Hiestand the best if he’s back and be slow to judge if we get off to a poor start. Just was hoping for a guy that has consistency and success recently. It’s not like the guys making the hire haven’t analyzed Hiestands abilities too so I’ll be cautiously optimistic if they go back to him.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Pops I’ll wish Hiestand the best if he’s back and be slow to judge if we get off to a poor start. Just was hoping for a guy that has consistency and success recently. It’s not like the guys making the hire haven’t analyzed Hiestands abilities too so I’ll be cautiously optimistic if they go back to him.

I definitely share some of your reservations. I guess Rees knows what he's getting here so I hope he knows what he's doing.

 

[ThePiombino]

I'm perfectly fine with HH returning but I'm dreading the overreaction when we have difficulty running the ball.

Am I the only person who can recall a fair number of posters on this board bitching and moaning about HH's offensive line struggling to open holes to run the ball as well as you would've expected with the horses we had on the line? I can remember some line of discussion where people had to defend HH and talk about how the Offensive Line blocking philosophy revolves around what blocking style that the OC wanted used. I have no idea how TR's philosophy differs from the OC's during HH's time. I'm not even close to being an expert on OL play, but I just recall some of those conversations.

It does seem like HH should be able to recruit well without a lot of difficulty when he slaps down the list of former players that he coached that are now in the NFL.

Could be wrong, but I thought that was a Chip Long blocking scheme issue, not HH's choice.

 

[IrishBoognish]

Could be wrong, but I thought that was a Chip Long blocking scheme issue, not HH's choice.

This was always my understanding.

 

[OCIrish]

Hiestand’s run yards per carry was 28th and 29th in the Chicago his two years. I don’t think any NFL coach would have any choice but to fire him.

I think Hiestand is awesome at recruiting and pass protection but against good secondaries in college you need to be able to run.

You're cherry picking shit here...... Chicago's OL was brutal before HH got there and he sure as hell didn't have much to work with. Been a Bears fan all my life, the talent level was severely lacking

 

[IrishLax]

Could be wrong, but I thought that was a Chip Long blocking scheme issue, not HH's choice.

Correct, Long wanted the "pin and pull" which was great at creating explosive running plays but also got stuff blown up when teams shot gaps. Very feast or famine at times.

 

[spoonidentity]

Could be wrong, but I thought that was a Chip Long blocking scheme issue, not HH's choice.

I'm sure if there's a way to search it, you'll find a couple hundred posts on "pin and pull" vs "zone blocking" philosophies in this thread. In the lead up to the Iowa State bowl game there was a lot of talk about how run game philosophies would be split between interim OC Tommy Rees, interim Run Game Coordinator Lance Walker (he actually didn't have this title at all, but he did get it after the game), and offensive line coach Jeff Quinn. We debuted a lot of zone blocking that day.

 

[Grahambo]

I believe Matt Balis and HH overlapped just one year so it’ll be interesting to see what HH can do with the OL that have been going through the Built by Balis program the last several years.