Jack Arute on Sirius

[IrishinSyria]

I'll go ahead and cast doubt that BK is going to the NFL. I just don't see the fit and with him getting approval for a JUCO, I see him doing more work behind the scenes at improving ND's roster.

You could make an argument as to a guy like Bill O'Brien and even Chip Kelly for making the jump but I just don't see that with BK. I do admit that anything is possible and weirder things have happened.

I think staff changes are inevitable though.

Chip Kelly was the last coach in the NCAA I thought would make the jump to the NFL.

 

[IrishLax]

Chip Kelly was the last coach in the NCAA I thought would make the jump to the NFL.

Sanctions. People forget he got a show-cause. He was basically forced out by the NCAA... he didn't know how good or bad it would be, so he jumped ahead of the decision. (At least I think I have that timeline right).

 

[IrishinSyria]

Sanctions. People forget he got a show-cause. He was basically forced out by the NCAA... he didn't know how good or bad it would be, so he jumped ahead of the decision. (At least I think I have that timeline right).

Good point.

 

[Crazy Balki]

Indeed.
Not to make excuses, but picture this year's team with:
Tuitt
Lynch
Vanderdoes
Ishaq
Jarrett Grace
Tee Shepherd
K Russell
Davonte Neal
Daniels
Niklas
Atkinson
Kiel

Or even with half of them.
It's tough to "reload" when you lose half of your elite guys to random fire along the way.

Most teams would be unfortunate to lose half of those guys in that span. Not only is that a ton of names to lose, but most of those made up the highest ranked players in their respective classes.

Tuitt *****
Lynch *****
Vanderdoes *****
Ishaq ***** (though you could argue that he hasn't made a 5-star impact)
Grace ***
Tee *****
Russell ****
Neal *****
Daniels ****
Niklas ****
Atkinson ****
Kiel *****

Hell, I doubt Alabama could replace that much star power without falling off at least a bit. The last 2 years seem to have more depth, athleticism and cohesiveness. However, it lacks the star power and the instant impact players previous classes had. Of 2013 and 2012, only really Jaylon was set to play from the word go.

 

[ThePiombino]

Addazio and Wittingham are my two "really easy to get, probably a great coach/fit" candidates.

Wittingham has (reportedly) actively made overtures for each open job.

The other option is to just roll the dice with Jon Gruden. At worst, you're looking at two years of awesome recruiting while you survey other candidates.

Come on, LAX. You're better than this.

 

[phork]

I wish these Jon Gruden rumours would die. He is not leaving the booth.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

I wish these Jon Gruden rumours would die. He is not leaving the booth.

Agree he won't leave the booth


Sent via tapatalk

 

[BleedBlueGold]

This thread is already derailed so I'll just add to it:

I had a convo this morning about elite programs on auto-pilot. The best of the very best, year after year, have a great coach, top 20 recruiting every year, and the attrition is minimal in regards to sending shockwaves through a program. These teams are few and far between.

A team like ND seems on the cusp, but just can't get out of it's own way. And those negative occurrences have absolutely destroyed the chances of this program being on auto-pilot in year five under BK. Elite decommits, transfers, suspensions, early departures...most programs don't seem to go through these things with the consistency that ND has recently. I'm sure there are examples, but the elite programs rarely go through this much turmoil every year. It makes it really hard to build and sustain a program that can compete in the top ten every year. Going back to 2011, I see no reason ND couldn't have been a 10+ team every year. But two turnover-plagued seasons, suspensions, major injuries, early departures, etc have gotten in the way. 2011, 2013, and now 2014 are all seasons that should have had better records, but it just didn't happen.

In my conversation this morning, I mentioned IU basketball (I grew up on Coach Knight and that program). Tom Crean will most likely not get that team to a perennial power because he can't keep guys there long enough to build any sort of maturity within his program. Coach Calipari is probably the only coach that is in the position to lose multiple difference makers every year and just reload with multiple McDonalds All-Americans the next year and not miss a beat. It's just not the norm to have a program be able to withstand that many elite departures and still maintain a level of competitive consistency. I truly feel BK is in this boat where ND just can't seem to keep the elite players from either transferring, leaving for the NFL, or getting suspended. And that's killing this program. Just like it's killing Tom Crean. MSU, Duke, Kansas, OSU, Louisville...these are a few examples of powerhouse teams that are somehow able to keep kids around for a few years. Sure, every program goes through early departures and transfers. But keeping it to a minimum and keeping it from happening every year is the key. ND needs to get out of its own way and find a way to keep more of these kids on the roster long term. The program as a whole depends on it.

 

[Irish#1]

So after taking 45 minutes of my life to get caught up, let me summarize so someone can tell me if I missed something.

1. We're vacating wins.
2. TF & GB are caught toking (For you pups on this board, that's the same smoking weed).
3. BK is fighting with JS.
4. BK is leaving for the NFL.
5. Something about the Frozen Five is going to be announced.
6. Half the board want BK gone.
7. Half the board wants BK to stay.
8. Gruden is not coming here or anywhere.
9. scUM is courting BK.
10. Kiffen is now a good coach.
11. Arute said it wasn't anything negative which made this board goes crazy with speculation again.
12. Weis and Kelly are the same coaches.
13. Alford should be CSU's next HC.
14. Alford is not ready to be HC at ND.
15. We should hire Harbaugh. (for you Harbaugh fans, you know he'd be screaming at the administration on a daily basis. Don't think that would go over very well.)
16. We should hire David Shaw.
17. We shouldn't hire David Shaw.
18. We still have Field Turf.

 

[Irish#1]

This thread is already derailed so I'll just add to it:

I had a convo this morning about elite programs on auto-pilot. The best of the very best, year after year, have a great coach, top 20 recruiting every year, and the attrition is minimal in regards to sending shockwaves through a program. These teams are few and far between.

A team like ND seems on the cusp, but just can't get out of it's own way. And those negative occurrences have absolutely destroyed the chances of this program being on auto-pilot in year five under BK. Elite decommits, transfers, suspensions, early departures...most programs don't seem to go through these things with the consistency that ND has recently. I'm sure there are examples, but the elite programs rarely go through this much turmoil every year. It makes it really hard to build and sustain a program that can compete in the top ten every year. Going back to 2011, I see no reason ND couldn't have been a 10+ team every year. But two turnover-plagued seasons, suspensions, major injuries, early departures, etc have gotten in the way. 2011, 2013, and now 2014 are all seasons that should have had better records, but it just didn't happen.

In my conversation this morning, I mentioned IU basketball (I grew up on Coach Knight and that program). Tom Crean will most likely not get that team to a perennial power because he can't keep guys there long enough to build any sort of maturity within his program. Coach Calipari is probably the only coach that is in the position to lose multiple difference makers every year and just reload with multiple McDonalds All-Americans the next year and not miss a beat. It's just not the norm to have a program be able to withstand that many elite departures and still maintain a level of competitive consistency. I truly feel BK is in this boat where ND just can't seem to keep the elite players from either transferring, leaving for the NFL, or getting suspended. And that's killing this program. Just like it's killing Tom Crean. MSU, Duke, Kansas, OSU, Louisville...these are a few examples of powerhouse teams that are somehow able to keep kids around for a few years. Sure, every program goes through early departures and transfers. But keeping it to a minimum and keeping it from happening every year is the key. ND needs to get out of its own way and find a way to keep more of these kids on the roster long term. The program as a whole depends on it.

You basically avoid what you describe by building depth on your roster.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

You basically avoid what you describe by building depth on your roster.

Yeah and depth is built by 1) recruiting 2) avoiding injuries/transfers/departures/suspensions. One is coaching controllable, the other is not. The former could obviously have been better (2011-2012) but the latter is what's killing this program. That was basically my long-winded. point.

 

[wizards8507]

So after taking 45 minutes of my life to get caught up, let me summarize so someone can tell me if I missed something.

1. We're vacating wins.
2. TF & GB are caught toking (For you pups on this board, that's the same smoking weed).
3. BK is fighting with JS.
4. BK is leaving for the NFL.
5. Something about the Frozen Five is going to be announced.
6. Half the board want BK gone.
7. Half the board wants BK to stay.
8. Gruden is not coming here or anywhere.
9. scUM is courting BK.
10. Kiffen is now a good coach.
11. Arute said it wasn't anything negative which made this board goes crazy with speculation again.
12. Weis and Kelly are the same coaches.
13. Alford should be CSU's next HC.
14. Alford is not ready to be HC at ND.
15. We should hire Harbaugh. (for you Harbaugh fans, you know he'd be screaming at the administration on a daily basis. Don't think that would go over very well.)
16. We should hire David Shaw.
17. We shouldn't hire David Shaw.
18. We still have Field Turf.

...and Manti's girlfriend is still dead.

 

[irishff1014]

Indeed.
Not to make excuses, but picture this year's team with:
Tuitt- made a bad decision should have stayed
Lynch-knucklehead
Vanderdoes-mama's boy helped by NCAA
Ishaq- shouldn't have cheated
Jarrett Grace- good player sucky injury
Tee Shepherd- blah blah would have been suspended
K Russell- shouldn't have cheated
Davonte Neal-should be on the soaps with his drama
Daniels- selfish for 2 academic suspensions
Niklas- terrible decision by him
Atkinson-wouldnt listen lack of heart
Kiel-blah blah

Or even with half of them.
It's tough to "reload" when you lose half of your elite guys to random fire along the way.

Tee,Eddie,Neal, never wanted to be here.

 

[ThePiombino]

...and Manti's girlfriend is still dead.

Or is he???

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Tee,Eddie,Neal, never wanted to be here.

Tee never wanted to be here??

Lol

I hope you're talking about his cousin.

 

[BeauBenken]

Tee,Eddie,Neal, never wanted to be here.

All three of them signed a letter of intent to play football here. To say they NEVER wanted to be here has to be a joke, right?

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

All three of them signed a letter of intent to play football here. To say they NEVER wanted to be here has to be a joke, right?

Especially tee. He wanted it so bad. He was one of the more active recruiters we had. He clearly didn't leave under his own freewill.

 

[Irish Insanity]

Tee, I still believe

 

[irishff1014]

Especially tee. He wanted it so bad. He was one of the more active recruiters we had. He clearly didn't leave under his own freewill.

If that's the case he would have put the work in the classroom to make sure he could get in. And that wasn't going to happen.

 

[mtnd15]

I literally was in a class with Tee before he was forced to leave. I can assure you he very much loved ND and wanted (probably still) to play here.

 

[blackirish]

Yeah he did... Kelly interviewing for another job?

Wouldn't supprise me at all if this is were the case.

 

[ab2cmiller]

BK leaving for the NFL would be a negative. Some people would be happy, recruiting would probably be fine but it could take a hit this year depending on who would be brought in

BK leaving for Michigan or some other college job ..... well, I think this message board would literally burn to the ground.

 

[pkt77242]

If that's the case he would have put the work in the classroom to make sure he could get in. And that wasn't going to happen.

Because life is simply that black and white.

 

[stlnd01]

Tee,Eddie,Neal, never wanted to be here.

One can talk shit about anybody, but the reality is if we have half those guys on the field this year we "reload" just find and probably win two more games at least.
As for who wanted to be here, Eddie V clearly didn't. But Tee did, and Neal certainly seemed to for the year he was. Did you mean Kiel? B/c I'd agree with that.

 

[EifertPower]

Indeed.
Not to make excuses, but picture this year's team with:
Tuitt
Lynch
Vanderdoes
Ishaq
Jarrett Grace
Tee Shepherd
K Russell
Davonte Neal
Daniels
Niklas
Atkinson
Kiel

Or even with half of them.
It's tough to "reload" when you lose half of your elite guys to random fire along the way.

Yes, but isn't it on Kelly that many of these guys still aren't here? I'm talking about Lynch, Vanderdoes, Tee, Davonte, Atkinson, and Kiel.

It's one thing if that list was composed predominantly of unlucky injuries and guys turning pro early after solid NDs careers, that's one thing.

It's another if the list is composed of guys who transferred out, were kicked out, and/or had academic integrity issues. Talk about the anti-RKGs. That's on Kelly. Stop wasting time and having classes decimated by these guys. It's one thing to sprinkle in 1 or 2 borderline players who may not make it to ND's standards, but you cannot consistently have classes decimated by this and not realize you are the problem for bringing them in in the first place.

 

[Cackalacky]

If that's the case he would have put the work in the classroom to make sure he could get in. And that wasn't going to happen.

Tee's story is a long and convoluted one but putting in effort in classes was not one of his issues. I believe he had special needs and his high school transcript was never fully validated until he was already on campus and living in the dorms. He probably should not have been allowed to enroll in the first place but he was borderline enough to get him to ND. I hope he ends up doing well. One of the more tragic stories I have encountered in recruiting.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Maybe BK is the football version of Mike Brey? Successful HC at the lower level & mid-majors but couldn't obtain similar success at the highest level. Brey averages a one & done in the NCAA tourney every year & BK average 8-9 wins and a non-BCS bowl every year. Just a thought. Too early to tell but next year will give us an indication.

 

[koonja]

I heard that Tee's effort in class was non existent. I don't blame anyone but him that he's not here. He had a great opportunity but didn't go all in on the academic part.

 

[Cackalacky]

I heard that Tee's effort in class was non existent. I don't blame anyone but him that he's not here. He had a great opportunity but didn't go all in on the academic part.

I am pretty sure you got this mixed up with someone else....Tee had a severe lack of guidance and learning disabilities on top of other administrative things that got mixed up as part of his early enrollment at ND. Prior to going to Ole Miss he passed all of his summer school classes in time to enroll at OM only to tear his tendon in his toe shortly there after ruling him out for the year.

 

[Calabrese's People]

I heard that Tee's effort in class was non existent. I don't blame anyone but him that he's not here. He had a great opportunity but didn't go all in on the academic part.

Do you realise how difficult it is to attend classes after tweeting all night, every night. They should consider moving lectures to the 1-3am slot.