Final AP Poll

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

The College Football Ranking Composite is a composite of 63 computer polls. It also ranks the conferences based off these rankings and actually matches your order.

 

[IrishinTN]

With the number of injuries and the EG issue, I would think the Irish nation would be pretty happy with this season. What looked like a promising campaign got derailed early on with EG, then the injuries to key players as well. To finish where the Irish did, and to beat some pretty good teams along the way, is a success in my book. But what do I know? I am the outsider here.

Which would also require fans to be realistic. It's obvious you are still a greenhorn on this ship, Tommy.

 

[RDU Irish]

Yeah, link above sends me to the Dec 8th poll. Had to look this up quick to catch up with discussion.

2013 NCAA College Football Polls and Rankings for Week 1 - ESPN

ND behind USC is BS. I would put MSU in front of Auburn as well and judging from the point differential plenty of voters agreed.

Clemson looks low given their two losses were to FSU and SoCar. When you stack Georgia and SoCar into your non-conference schedule it is hard to rag on their otherwise weak schedule.

Only ranked team A&M beat was Duke. They suck and should be punished for having such an embarrassingly bad defense. I would put Duke at 24 and A&M at 23.

So #4 SoCar's two losses were to teams that finished the season unranked. I don't see how they get ranked ahead of Bama and Mizzou in particular based on quality of losses alone.

 

[RDU Irish]

#2 Auburn loses to #1 FSU (ACC)
#3 Bama loses to #11 Oklahoma (B12)
#8 Mizzou beats #13 OKST (B12)
#9 SoCar beats #19 Wisconsin (B1G)
#16 LSU beats NR Iowa (B1G)
#21 TAMU beats #24 Duke (ACC) 100 total points scored, only ranked team they beat all year
#22 Georgia loses to NR Nebraska (B1G)
NR Vandy beats NR Houston (AAC)
NR Miss St beats Rice (C-USA)
NR Ole Miss beats GT (ACC)

7-3 bowl record this year as a conference is pretty darn good. However, 0-2 BCS record doesn't scream of dominance, especially since those are not pre-determined match ups like regular bowls tie-ins. The only impressive win is Mizzou and they are the red-headed step child of the SEC, rewarded with not even making the pre-season (way too early) top 25 for next season?

So take those wins over Rice, Georgia Tech, Houston, Duke and Iowa and keep telling yourself that your conference is head and shoulders above the rest.

 

[T Town Tommy]

#2 Auburn loses to #1 FSU (ACC)
#3 Bama loses to #11 Oklahoma (B12)
#8 Mizzou beats #13 OKST (B12)
#9 SoCar beats #19 Wisconsin (B1G)
#16 LSU beats NR Iowa (B1G)
#21 TAMU beats #24 Duke (ACC) 100 total points scored, only ranked team they beat all year
#22 Georgia loses to NR Nebraska (B1G)
NR Vandy beats NR Houston (AAC)
NR Miss St beats Rice (C-USA)
NR Ole Miss beats GT (ACC)

7-3 bowl record this year as a conference is pretty darn good. However, 0-2 BCS record doesn't scream of dominance, especially since those are not pre-determined match ups like regular bowls tie-ins. The only impressive win is Mizzou and they are the red-headed step child of the SEC, rewarded with not even making the pre-season (way too early) top 25 for next season?

So take those wins over Rice, Georgia Tech, Houston, Duke and Iowa and keep telling yourself that your conference is head and shoulders above the rest.

OK. The SEC has won 7 of the last 8 BCS titles. There have been four different teams in the conference win the BCS title during that stretch. The SEC has a pretty stellar bowl winning percentage during that time. The SEC currently has 9-10 schools ranked in the top 20 for recruiting this year. The SEC has something like 5-6 of the top grossing revenue schools for football in the top 15. The SEC just signed a multimillion dollar contract to start the SEC network. The SEC has had 3 of the last four Heisman winners. The SEC had more players drafted into the NFL last season that almost every other conference combined. The SEC leads the number of first round draft picks almost every year.

I can see why one would think the SEC isn't a dominant conference. I mean, all the other conferences could say the same thing. Right?

 

[ACamp1900]

The SEC sounds great... do they have message boards??

 

[anarin]

OK. The SEC has won 7 of the last 8 BCS titles. There have been four different teams in the conference win the BCS title during that stretch. The SEC has a pretty stellar bowl winning percentage during that time. The SEC currently has 9-10 schools ranked in the top 20 for recruiting this year. The SEC has something like 5-6 of the top grossing revenue schools for football in the top 15. The SEC just signed a multimillion dollar contract to start the SEC network. The SEC has had 3 of the last four Heisman winners. The SEC had more players drafted into the NFL last season that almost every other conference combined. The SEC leads the number of first round draft picks almost every year.

I can see why one would think the SEC isn't a dominant conference. I mean, all the other conferences could say the same thing. Right?

It's people like you and the media that have this SEC bias.

The SEC didnt win the last 7 titles; Florida, LSU, Auburn and Alabama did. The SEC is the only conference that screams conference unity. When Florida State won I didnt see Duke fans, Virginia Tech fans or any other ACC fans scream ACC! ACC! ACC! And if they did, it was only because of this ridiculous SEC thing. Keep telling yourself SEC teams aren't overrated every single season by media and fans like you; And that the recent success of Alabama, LSU and Auburn have led to an entire conference being so much better than the others. Yes we know Alabama has been dominant, yes we know they're in the middle or towards the end of a dynasty. But this doesn't make Mississippi State, Mississippi, Tennessee, Kentucky, Florida, Arkansas, etc. a great team because they are in the same conference.

Your powerhouse LSU team (that BARELY got by a dreadful Iowa team, whose biggest win was Nebraska, who beat Georgia haha), beat Auburn in the regular season. They also didn't beat one other good team on their schedule, unless you consider Texas A&M a great team (that shouldve lost to Duke if the refs didnt hand the game to them), they finished #14. And that Auburn team they beat needed TWO miracles (against another highly overrated team in Georgia and your one true dominant team in Alabama) to get to the NCG.

I mean I can go all day long with the RIDICULOUS SEC bias by the media and fans like you. But I'll just end with this. Had Auburn not gotten the lucky bounce against Georgia, and went on to beat Alabama as they did. Don't think that Michigan State would not have gotten screwed for the NCG. The bias of the SEC would likely have put Alabama into the championship game over sparty. And thats the sick part of the BCS and this incredible bias with the SEC.

/fin

 

[ND NYC]

If people have issues with Auburn being ahead of MSU, then next year they will probably be really disappointed. All too often, we as fans justify our team or our teams ranking based off record. It should be based off a number of things. The playoff committee will end up being worse for football than the BCS system. At the end of the day, a lot of fans will think their team belongs in the four team playoff when they have no business being there.

of course there are gonna be people complaining about the NEW system. my hunch is they will be the same ones who complained about the OLD system too.
some people will bitch about nothin to bitch about. its in their DNA.

i look forward to the SOS really mattering in the future (like it does in hoops). hopefully the the days of schools playing non FBS schools/tune up cupcake games all the while sitting on their top 10 preseason rating for half the year are more than likely over for some teams. we should all see better matchups throughout the year.

we welcome our friends down in the south to head on up north for some games once in a while during the regular season.

 

[IrishLax]

anarin just dropped the mic.

No one contests that there are 1 or 2 SEC every year that are uber impressive. They contest that the other 8-10 teams that are propped up each year for being "SEC" are totally overrated and a product of propaganda.

 

[ACamp1900]

I believe I said this eariler today (or thought it) but I'll believe the SOS mattering thign when I see it... the most likely scenerio is the teams that play BS schedules will be rewarded with playoff spots...

 

[ND NYC]

I believe I said this eariler today (or thought it) but I'll believe the SOS mattering thign when I see it... the most likely scenerio is the teams that play BS schedules will be rewarded with playoff spots...

i just hope a 2 loss SEC team, whose last 5 weeks of the regualr season are all home games with a bye sprnkled in for one of those weeks and one of the games is against a team called the Chanticleers cant end up #4 in the Final AP Poll (much less the playoff) after beating the 3rd place team from the B1G in a bowl

 

[ND NYC]

anarin just dropped the mic.

No one contests that there are 1 or 2 SEC every year that are uber impressive. They contest that the other 8-10 teams that are propped up each year for being "SEC" are totally overrated and a product of propaganda.

nailed it Lax

 

[T Town Tommy]

anarin just dropped the mic.

No one contests that there are 1 or 2 SEC every year that are uber impressive. They contest that the other 8-10 teams that are propped up each year for being "SEC" are totally overrated and a product of propaganda.

Overrated and a product of propaganda? I could run with that one but I digress...

 

[T Town Tommy]

i just hope a 2 loss SEC team, whose last 5 weeks of the regualr season are all home games with a bye sprnkled in for one of those weeks and one of the games is against a team called the Chanticleers cant end up #4 in the Final AP Poll (much less the playoff) after beating the 3rd place team from the B1G in a bowl

Look guys... I don't need to defend the SEC. No need with the results they have shown in the better part of the last decade. For all the blabber... my team dropped their last two games and will need to get better in order to get where they need to be. And that's all that matters to me at the end of the day. Time for me to move on.

 

[gkIrish]

Overrated and a product of propaganda? I could run with that one but I digress...

How do you feel about guys like Franklin and Spurrier, for example, who have absolutely absurd rankings in their Coach's poll just to make the middling teams in the SEC look good?

 

[T Town Tommy]

How do you feel about guys like Franklin and Spurrier, for example, who have absolutely absurd rankings in their Coach's poll just to make the middling teams in the SEC look good?

I think it's total BS. As is the coaches poll anyway. Most coaches have no idea how good a team is anyway... unless they are an opponent on their schedule.

 

[gkIrish]

I think it's total BS. As is the coaches poll anyway. Most coaches have no idea how good a team is anyway... unless they are an opponent on their schedule.

So how is that not one example of those teams being "Overrated and a product of propaganda?"

 

[T Town Tommy]

So how is that not one example of those teams being "Overrated and a product of propaganda?"

Same could be said about Ohio State this season. Clemson this season. Your Irish last season. Oregon almost every year. Florida State most years. Oklahoma most years.

The results speak for themselves. And for all the hype and propaganda, the SEC has delivered in the BCS era. Over and over again with a variety of different teams leading the way. That's the facts. The middling SEC teams generally fair very well in bowl games and usually do it against teams with higher conference seeds. Again, not hype.

 

[T Town Tommy]

The SEC sounds great... do they have message boards??

Yeah... but they can't spell and I don't have the patience to try and decipher what they are trying to say. Plus, I would miss out conversing with you ACamp.

 

[IrishLax]

Same could be said about Ohio State this season. Clemson this season. Your Irish last season. Oregon almost every year. Florida State most years. Oklahoma most years.

The results speak for themselves. And for all the hype and propaganda, the SEC has delivered in the BCS era. Over and over again with a variety of different teams leading the way. That's the facts. The middling SEC teams generally fair very well in bowl games and usually do it against teams with higher conference seeds. Again, not hype.

You mean the team that was ALWAYS the lowest ranked undefeated team every single week of the season? OK bud.

You're not really getting the point. Everyone knows and accepts that Florida had some great teams under Urban, that Bama is a machine, that the Cam Newton Auburn team was good... every year there are a couple truly awesome SEC teams that are (usually) substantially better than the best from other conferences. That is absolutely proven.

What everyone outside the SEC thinks is absurd -- and anarin and Bob Stoops and the like have called out -- are the not very good teams that play easy schedules with no legit OOC competition and only beat other overrated middle tier SEC teams for "quality wins" getting propped up. There are lots of examples of this in 2013, for example Texas A&M went 9-4 with their lone victory over a ranked team being #22 Duke, who SEC people laughed at coming into that game, and Vanderbilt who is ranked 23rd directly because of the propping up which we are talking about. The Aggies ranked 18th, whereas Notre Dame who went 9-4 with victories over #3 13-1 MSU, #19 ASU, and #20 USC is ranked 24th. Why? Because SEC coaches propping up their teams. Vanderbilt finished ranked 23rd, with quality wins over... oh yeah, ZERO RANKED TEAMS. Vanderbilt played a very easy schedule by all measures and did not beat a single ranked team, yet they are slotted above Notre Dame because of the SEC circle jerk... which in turn also makes every win an SEC team has over Vandy artificially "impressive." It's all circular. They're all overrated. And everyone who isn't an SEC moron knows this.

 

[gkIrish]

Same could be said about Ohio State this season. Clemson this season. Your Irish last season. Oregon almost every year. Florida State most years. Oklahoma most years.

The results speak for themselves. And for all the hype and propaganda, the SEC has delivered in the BCS era. Over and over again with a variety of different teams leading the way. That's the facts. The middling SEC teams generally fair very well in bowl games and usually do it against teams with higher conference seeds. Again, not hype.

What? In what world was Notre Dame's ranking last season not justified?

You're missing the point. Let's use A&M as an example. Didn't beat ANYONE all year yet they were consistently rated in the top 5-20. So the Alabamas and Auburns and LSUs of the world get a huge perceived benefit when they beat A&M because of A&Ms inflated ranking. And it's a never ending cycle.

A&M only dropped 3 spots when they lost to Alabama. Meanwhile ND beats MSU and drops a spot in the coach's poll the following week. How does that make any sense?

 

[gkIrish]

Yo lemme repeat this real quick. ND dropped a spot in the coach's poll after beating MSU.

Team that jumped them?


SEC Ole Miss.....





During their bye week.

 

[IrishLax]

Yo lemme repeat this real quick. ND dropped a spot in the coach's poll after beating MSU.

Team that jumped them?


SEC Ole Miss.....





During their bye week.

Encapsulates everything everything we're talking about. Well done. There is not an SEC apologist out there that can explain that one.

It's not about the top SEC teams that are great, it's about puffing up the middle tier and the dregs with inexplicable media and poll bias.

 

[Cali_domer]

Yo lemme repeat this real quick. ND dropped a spot in the coach's poll after beating MSU.

Team that jumped them?


SEC Ole Miss.....





During their bye week.

Ole Miss schedule during their bye week is more difficult then ND's schedule is the only answer to that. SEC Speed.

 

[philipm31]

I agree. I wondered about that!

Had Auburn been torched by FSU, like all of America thought they would have been, then you could have an argument.

Auburn proved they belonged and in fact DESERVED to be there.

MSU lost to a 4-loss Irish team, as did Stanford.

And the idea that ND ended the year on a better note than ASU or USC is not even remotely true.

ND was 3-2 in their last five games.

What was the Trojans and Aztecs record since playing ND? 6-1 and 7-1, respectively.

Yeah, that's what I thought. They ended the year better than we did, by a large margin. The rankings are arbitrary but the reason they are ranked higher is because they did better over the entire season than the Irish did.

No need to get all up in arms about the rankings when ND is just plain lucky to even be ranked, anyway.

 

[philipm31]

anarin just dropped the mic.

No one contests that there are 1 or 2 SEC every year that are uber impressive. They contest that the other 8-10 teams that are propped up each year for being "SEC" are totally overrated and a product of propaganda.

And what the basis of that SEC propaganda machine?

Oh, yeah, ESPN/ABC.

As I said earlier this year, you have 4 teams in the BCS era that won titles. The rest did not. So how can you blindly say that the SEC is the best conference when it is not the best overall, in terms of actual depth?

Because the media just assumes that it is a d spread that mantra around.

If only another group of teams, including the Irish could learn to spread those titles around and keep it out of the SEC's hands nearly every year, things might change a bit. I am guessing that the ACC should be a good bet to step up, what with the way FSU looks poised to make a comeback, MIA has finally gotten some stability, CLE seems to be winning big games consistently and even Duke has started to make a dent nationally....but who knows?

 

[philipm31]

Ole Miss schedule during their bye week is more difficult then ND's schedule is the only answer to that. SEC Speed.

Or the fact that nobody gave credence to MSU being any good, maybe.

At the end of the day, ND ended up better than Ole Miss, Miss State, Vandy, KY, TN, UGA, FLA, ARK; equal to the Aggies; and worse off than LSU, Bama, Auburn, Missouri. That should be enough for us, honestly.

I think that ND fans need to focus on the positives that came out of this season, and stop dwelling on the negatives, but hey, that's just me.

 

[irishog77]

And what the basis of that SEC propaganda machine?

Oh, yeah, ESPN/ABC.

As I said earlier this year, you have 4 teams in the BCS era that won titles. The rest did not. So how can you blindly say that the SEC is the best conference when it is not the best overall, in terms of actual depth?

Because the media just assumes that it is a d spread that mantra around.

If only another group of teams, including the Irish could learn to spread those titles around and keep it out of the SEC's hands nearly every year, things might change a bit. I am guessing that the ACC should be a good bet to step up, what with the way FSU looks poised to make a comeback, MIA has finally gotten some stability, CLE seems to be winning big games consistently and even Duke has started to make a dent nationally....but who knows?

Then you were wrong when you said it earlier, as well as today.

Tennessee says

 

[Redbar]

One would be hard pressed to find someone more sick of the SEC than me. There was some really good points made about how the media and the coaches inflate the overall strength of the conference, but everyone is well aware of the dominance they have displayed at the top of their conference. My opinion is that there are teams outside of that conference that can win one here and there, we saw one do it last night. But the truth is that in order to knock them off of that pedestal of dominance, and overcome the geographical advantage that they inherently have, you would have to at least mimic their "roster management" practices, their ability to accept kids that probably do not belong in college and have no desire to work to get the degree, you would probably have to pay some of them, look the other way when they get in trouble academically or otherwise, spend copious amounts of money updating facilities and paying off coaches, who claim more authority and ultimately separate the athletes from the "distractions" of actual college life. Eat, "vitamin up", sleep, train, play. If you can't do that then you might be able to beat them on a given day, but they will remain the dominant league.

The point is they are playing a different game of football. They are not professionals, but they certainly aren't student-athletes in the sense that we are. Is it any wonder that the team that was able to knock one off is essentially as bad as any of the SEC schools in exactly the things I am talking about. What non SEC team in the BCS era has won a championship, that wasn't as shady as a SEC team?
FSU 2x's, Miami, Ohio State, USC, are all just about as bad (or were when they won it). The only two teams that won a BCS era title that might not have been using all the "tricks in the book" are maybe Oklahoma and Texas, I really don't know a lot about the management of their programs, but they have the marquis name and history like Notre Dame where if the stars line up for them for a few years and they can stack a few classes (a lot easier for them) and keep them healthy then they can win one here and there. Unless someone gets serious about cleaning up college football that is about all I think we can expect.

 

[irishog77]

One would be hard pressed to find someone more sick of the SEC than me. There was some really good points made about how the media and the coaches inflate the overall strength of the conference, but everyone is well aware of the dominance they have displayed at the top of their conference. My opinion is that there are teams outside of that conference that can win one here and there, we saw one do it last night. But the truth is that in order to knock them off of that pedestal of dominance, and overcome the geographical advantage that they inherently have, you would have to at least mimic their "roster management" practices, their ability to accept kids that probably do not belong in college and have no desire to work to get the degree, you would probably have to pay some of them, look the other way when they get in trouble academically or otherwise, spend copious amounts of money updating facilities and paying off coaches, who claim more authority and ultimately separate the athletes from the "distractions" of actual college life. Eat, "vitamin up", sleep, train, play. If you can't do that then you might be able to beat them on a given day, but they will remain the dominant league.

The point is they are playing a different game of football. They are not professionals, but they certainly aren't student-athletes in the sense that we are. Is it any wonder that the team that was able to knock one off is essentially as bad as any of the SEC schools in exactly the things I am talking about. What non SEC team in the BCS era has won a championship, that wasn't as shady as a BCS team?
FSU 2x's, Miami, Ohio State, USC, are all just about as bad (or were when they won it). The only two teams that won a BCS era title that might not have been using all the "tricks in the book" are maybe Oklahoma and Texas, I really don't know a lot about the management of their programs, but they have the marquis name and history like Notre Dame where if the stars line up for them for a few years and they can stack a few classes (a lot easier for them) and keep them healthy then they can win one here and there. Unless someone gets serious about cleaning up college football that is about all I think we can expect.

Yep. Pretty much agree with every single word in here.

And also when teams like KY, Vandy, Missouri, and Miss. St. are out-recruiting upper-tier teams from other conferences...it's that much harder for, say, the 9th best team in the ACC or big 10 to stack up against the ess eee cee. At that point, the difference in those classes isn't debatable-- not like a few spots on the services...but 40, 50, 60 spots in the rankings by the services.