Democratic Primary Thread (New Poll - January)

[Irish YJ]

Warren reminding me of

 

[drayer54]

This debate sucks now.

Why did they stop attacking Racist Mike?

 

[NorthDakota]

Bloomberg and Klobuchar are so much better than the rest of these jokers and it's not remotely close lmaoooo

 

[NorthDakota]

BLOOMBERG JUST RKO'ED BERNIE.

Made bernie admit he has 3 homes...one of which is a summer home. As a lifelong government employee. Lmao. Beautiful.

 

[IrishLax]

BLOOMBERG JUST RKO'ED BERNIE.

Made bernie admit he has 3 homes...one of which is a summer home. As a lifelong government employee. Lmao. Beautiful.

Yeah Bernie is having an interesting night. Not sure if good or bad. He is certainly not winning over anyone on the fence, though... pretty transparently a dude who loves big government because it works for him and his lifestyle. Comes off as a very out of touch.

I think Warren is having a good night, and I think Biden is having a good night. Bloomberg is refreshing in that he isn't a polished politician... but that's also why he isn't doing particularly well.

Democrats are gonna cannibalize themselves and hand the nom to Bernie.

 

[IrishLax]

Bernie Bros trying to sabotage Bernie with ridiculous heckling of Biden. If he loses this primary, it will 100% be because of his supporters and their collective insanity.

 

[Wild Bill]

Bernie Bros trying to sabotage Bernie with ridiculous heckling of Biden. If he loses this primary, it will 100% be because of his supporters and their collective insanity.

That's probably what the media will tell us after they work with the dnc to fuck him.

 

[Irish#1]

From CNN

Bernie Sanders misled America. Voters aren't comfortable with a socialist President

Polling does suggest discomfort with a socialist President

It is true the Sanders was leading in the poll, conducted by the Wall Street Journal and NBC -- but only among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents when asked who they supported for the Democratic nomination. He had 27% support compared to Mike Bloomberg, Joe Biden and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, each with 14% support. And in a hypothetical matchup, he was narrowly ahead of President Donald Trump.
But two-thirds of all voters -- Democrats plus everyone else -- said they would be uncomfortable with a socialist President. Come November, it will be all Americans over the age of 18 who elect the Electoral College that picks the President.

Those results and the questions they raise about whether the country would accept a socialist are repeated in an NPR / PBS News Hour Marist poll. In that poll, Sanders had even more support -- 31% in the Democratic primary compared to Michael Bloomberg, in second place with 19%.

Take a look at the party breakdown regarding socialism. Fifty percent of Democrats have a favorable view of socialism compared to 46% who have a favorable view of capitalism. But again, socialism is far less favorable than capitalism in the country as a whole. In the NPR poll, among Americans overall, just 28% had a favorable view of socialism compared to 57% who had a favorable view of capitalism.

Among Republicans, 76% held a favorable view of capitalism compared to 7% who felt favorably about socialism. And, among independents -- who may or may not decide the next presidential election -- it was 23% who had a favorable view of socialism compared to 59% who had a favorable view of capitalism.

And while views of socialism are slightly favorable among Democrats, they're below 35% for whites (25%), minorities (33%), Gen Xers (28%), Baby Boomers (20%), and the Silent Generation (20%).

Favorable views of socialism are greatest among younger adults (38% favorable), who just happen to also be Sanders' base of support.

 

[gkIrish]

It's a shame that Bloomberg bombed on the two questions he knew were coming. I thought he handled the economic questions well and was the only person on the stage that made Bernie look bad. I really don't understand how he wasn't prepared for those questions.

Trump is going to win this election again because Dems are too busy yelling at the one guy who would actually beat Trump and letting Bernie get the nom. It's crazy.

 

[IrishLax]

It's a shame that Bloomberg bombed on the two questions he knew were coming. I thought he handled the economic questions well and was the only person on the stage that made Bernie look bad. I really don't understand how he wasn't prepared for those questions.

Trump is going to win this election again because Dems are too busy yelling at the one guy who would actually beat Trump and letting Bernie get the nom. It's crazy.

He's literally following the Trump playbook on his way to capture the nomination with his ~30% base that won't shrink. The Dems cannibalized themselves. If Warren had done what she did last night for the past two months, she would be the front runner. If the primary season started with something besides Iowa/New Hampshire, Buttigieg and Klobuchar probably wouldn't even be in the race. It is absolutely wild to watch this unfold how it is.

People are fooling themselves that Bernie's polling numbers vs. Trump are legit. The real one to look at is the two thirds of Americans who say they'd be uncomfortable with a socialist president. Once they get into the general election, Bernie is not going to be able to escape his policy positions... which will drive a lot of "Never Trumpers" to rethink how they really feel about "never".

 

[gkIrish]

He's literally following the Trump playbook on his way to capture the nomination with his ~30% base that won't shrink. The Dems cannibalized themselves. If Warren had done what she did last night for the past two months, she would be the front runner. If the primary season started with something besides Iowa/New Hampshire, Buttigieg and Klobuchar probably wouldn't even be in the race. It is absolutely wild to watch this unfold how it is.

People are fooling themselves that Bernie's polling numbers vs. Trump are legit. The real one to look at is the two thirds of Americans who say they'd be uncomfortable with a socialist president. Once they get into the general election, Bernie is not going to be able to escape his policy positions... which will drive a lot of "Never Trumpers" to rethink how they really feel about "never".

I just don't see what Bernie is going to be able to say about Trump that Hillary wasn't saying in 2016.

Bernie is in many ways an easier target than Hilary because as you said people are already hesitant to put a socialist in the oval office.

All Trump is going to have to do is 1) energize his base and 2) create a fear among the swing voters that Bernie is going to mess up the booming economy and that he is wackjob.

It's not going to be difficult to do that. I also think a lot of Democrats are going to stay home rather than vote for either candidate.

 

[Irish#1]

I just don't see what Bernie is going to be able to say about Trump that Hillary wasn't saying in 2016.

Bernie is in many ways an easier target than Hilary because as you said people are already hesitant to put a socialist in the oval office.

All Trump is going to have to do is 1) energize his base and 2) create a fear among the swing voters that Bernie is going to mess up the booming economy and that he is wackjob.

It's not going to be difficult to do that. I also think a lot of Democrats are going to stay home rather than vote for either candidate.

He'll hammer on the impeachment and how Trump is unfit to be Prez because he's not running the government the good ol' boys way. Last night Bernie tapped danced around how he would pay for medical care for everyone. In one on one debates he won't be able to do that and will get exposed.

 

[Wild Bill]

I just don't see what Bernie is going to be able to say about Trump that Hillary wasn't saying in 2016.

Bernie is in many ways an easier target than Hilary because as you said people are already hesitant to put a socialist in the oval office.

All Trump is going to have to do is 1) energize his base and 2) create a fear among the swing voters that Bernie is going to mess up the booming economy and that he is wackjob.

It's not going to be difficult to do that. I also think a lot of Democrats are going to stay home rather than vote for either candidate.

Bernie will do better with white working class voters in the rust belt. He'll actually show up to campaign for their votes which is more than Hillary can say.

Sanders is far more "likeable" than Hillary as well. Polls have Bernies's favorable rating over 70% while Hillary's was less than 40%.

I'm not voting for Bernie and I have no idea how this all shakes out but I know Bernie is the is the candidate I'd least want to run against if I was Trump b/c I think he appeals to voters in the most competitive states. He does really well in the northeast so I believe he'll lock down New Hampshire and he appeals to working class rust belt voters moreso than people realize. If he holds all the states hillary won and flips Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin we have our winner. Biden may have a similar path but I doubt the old man can make it through the primary. What's the path for Bloomberg? Florida isnt enough and I'm not sure he has an advantage over Bernie in any other state. Polls may have Bloomberg doing well in some midwest states, but I have a sneaking suspicion that the more midwest voters get to know him, the less they're going to like him.

States that were decided by less than 1%:
1. Michigan - I think Bernie would have the best chance to flip it.
2. New Hampshire - I think Bernie has the best chance to hold it.
3. Pennsylvania - I think Bernie has the best chance to flip it.
4. Wisconsin - I'm not sure Bernie would have the best chance to fip it but he certainly has a chance.

States decided by less than 5%
1. Florida - I think Bloomberg would have the best chance to flip it and Bernie probably has no chance.
2. Minnesota - Bernie has the best chance to hold.
3. Nevada - not sure
4. Maine - Bernie has best chance to hold.
5. Arizona - not sure. I think Trump holds regardless of dem candidate
6. North Carolina - not sure. I think Trump regardless of dem candidate
7. Colorado - Bernie would do the besat but I think most dem candidates would hold

 

[koonja]

Bernie with his medicare for all, and stealing from investors to bail out people can fuck off.

He takes the "free" out of being free in America and incentives living off of others while disincentivizing hard work and independence.

 

[Irish#1]

Bernie with his medicare for all, and stealing from investors to bail out people can fuck off.

He takes the "free" out of being free in America and incentives living off of others while disincentivizing hard work and independence.

Back in the previous election period, my youngest son mentioned he was going to vote for Bernie. I asked him why and he mentioned eliminating student loan debt and free medical amongst other little tidbits. When I asked him if was willing to give me $100 of his paycheck every pay period, he thought I was crazy. When I told him that's where Bernie was going to get the money to pay for his programs, a light bulb came on. Yes son, he wants to take the money you work hard for and give it to those that don't work as hard as you do.

 

[koonja]

I racked up $56,000 in student loans and I deserved to pay it all back. Bailouts like this, and others, are directly unfair to those who didn't benefit, and create an imbalance.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Bernie will do better with white working class voters in the rust belt. He'll actually show up to campaign for their votes which is more than Hillary can say.

Sanders is far more "likeable" than Hillary as well. Polls have Bernies's favorable rating over 70% while Hillary's was less than 40%.

I'm not voting for Bernie and I have no idea how this all shakes out but I know Bernie is the is the candidate I'd least want to run against if I was Trump b/c I think he appeals to voters in the most competitive states. He does really well in the northeast so I believe he'll lock down New Hampshire and he appeals to working class rust belt voters moreso than people realize. If he holds all the states hillary won and flips Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin we have our winner. Biden may have a similar path but I doubt the old man can make it through the primary. What's the path for Bloomberg? Florida isnt enough and I'm not sure he has an advantage over Bernie in any other state. Polls may have Bloomberg doing well in some midwest states, but I have a sneaking suspicion that the more midwest voters get to know him, the less they're going to like him.

States that were decided by less than 1%:
1. Michigan - I think Bernie would have the best chance to flip it.
2. New Hampshire - I think Bernie has the best chance to hold it.
3. Pennsylvania - I think Bernie has the best chance to flip it.
4. Wisconsin - I'm not sure Bernie would have the best chance to fip it but he certainly has a chance.

States decided by less than 5%
1. Florida - I think Bloomberg would have the best chance to flip it and Bernie probably has no chance.
2. Minnesota - Bernie has the best chance to hold.
3. Nevada - not sure
4. Maine - Bernie has best chance to hold.
5. Arizona - not sure. I think Trump holds regardless of dem candidate
6. North Carolina - not sure. I think Trump regardless of dem candidate
7. Colorado - Bernie would do the besat but I think most dem candidates would hold

I don't think Bernie does well in Pennsylvania due to his proposed fracking ban. He'd eliminate over 300,000 jobs in a the blink of an eye and when asked about that, he didn't have an answer.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I don't understand the knock on M4A from a financial standpoint. We already pay Medicare tax and it covers essentially nothing on the backend when we receive the benefits. All the while, paying out enormous amounts of money in co-pays, deductibles, premiums, etc. while leading up to that point in our lives.

Basic needs healthcare should be a human right. Beyond that, feel free to incorporate the private markets, etc Australia, Singapore just to name a couple have fantastic healthcare systems and they aren't 100% aligned with Bernie's plan, but they do offer the basic M4A coverage to their population.

 

[koonja]

Anyone who thinks more government intervention in HC is good for America should watch this, or a number of others that outline why it's not as easy as "Do what others did", who, BTW, had excellent HC before they went universal as well.

https://youtu.be/EoVb3DX85LA

 

[koonja]

I don't understand the knock on M4A from a financial standpoint. We already pay Medicare tax and it covers essentially nothing on the backend when we receive the benefits. All the while, paying out enormous amounts of money in co-pays, deductibles, premiums, etc. while leading up to that point in our lives.

Basic needs healthcare should be a human right. Beyond that, feel free to incorporate the private markets, etc Australia, Singapore just to name a couple have fantastic healthcare systems and they aren't 100% aligned with Bernie's plan, but they do offer the basic M4A coverage to their population.

It's high cost and low quality. 2 pretty big knocks when talking HC.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

It's high cost and low quality. 2 pretty big knocks when talking HC.

Please provide examples.

Because I'm happy to prove you wrong.

(Just not right now. I'm on my way out of the office. Have a nice weekend, everyone)

 

[koonja]

Please provide examples.

Because I'm happy to prove you wrong.

(Just not right now. I'm on my way out of the office. Have a nice weekend, everyone)

There are endless forecasts that show how M4A would bankrupt America and drive providers out of the practice.

But start with the short youtube video above.

 

[koonja]

You want affordable, quality healthcare? Get Govt completely out of it.

Govt doesn't touch LASIK surgery. That started at ~$20,000 an eye. Now it's ~$3,500 for both.

Why? Competition. Get government out of the way and you'd have the same result for general HC.

Name an area of HC that lowers costs once government jumps in.

 

[ulukinatme]

Bernie will do better with white working class voters in the rust belt. He'll actually show up to campaign for their votes which is more than Hillary can say.

Sanders is far more "likeable" than Hillary as well. Polls have Bernies's favorable rating over 70% while Hillary's was less than 40%.

I'm not voting for Bernie and I have no idea how this all shakes out but I know Bernie is the is the candidate I'd least want to run against if I was Trump b/c I think he appeals to voters in the most competitive states. He does really well in the northeast so I believe he'll lock down New Hampshire and he appeals to working class rust belt voters moreso than people realize. If he holds all the states hillary won and flips Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin we have our winner. Biden may have a similar path but I doubt the old man can make it through the primary. What's the path for Bloomberg? Florida isnt enough and I'm not sure he has an advantage over Bernie in any other state. Polls may have Bloomberg doing well in some midwest states, but I have a sneaking suspicion that the more midwest voters get to know him, the less they're going to like him.

States that were decided by less than 1%:
1. Michigan - I think Bernie would have the best chance to flip it.
2. New Hampshire - I think Bernie has the best chance to hold it.
3. Pennsylvania - I think Bernie has the best chance to flip it.
4. Wisconsin - I'm not sure Bernie would have the best chance to fip it but he certainly has a chance.

States decided by less than 5%
1. Florida - I think Bloomberg would have the best chance to flip it and Bernie probably has no chance.
2. Minnesota - Bernie has the best chance to hold.
3. Nevada - not sure
4. Maine - Bernie has best chance to hold.
5. Arizona - not sure. I think Trump holds regardless of dem candidate
6. North Carolina - not sure. I think Trump regardless of dem candidate
7. Colorado - Bernie would do the besat but I think most dem candidates would hold

It's supposed to be close, as always, in Ohio though. Only once since 1944 has Ohio picked the losing Presidential candidate (Picking Nixon over Kennedy). I could see Bernie doing well in the metropolitan areas, but outside of that is Trump country. Bernie is a wildcard, and he's certainly energetic. Polls say America may not be ready for a socialist President (And I hope that's true), but because he's different it makes me wonder if Bernie isn't the best chance for Democrats to steal this one.

 

[ulukinatme]

You want affordable, quality healthcare? Get Govt completely out of it.

Govt doesn't touch LASIK surgery. That started at ~$20,000 an eye. Now it's ~$3,500 for both.

Why? Competition. Get government out of the way and you'd have the same result for general HC.

Name an area of HC that lowers costs once government jumps in.

I think the real problem is there's not enough competition. United, Anthem, Cigna, and Humana make up almost all of the real business in the US. There's some other companies that bring in big money, but at a very small fraction compared to the big boys. There's not enough competition across state lines. I would be okay with the Government breaking a few of them up and encourage the competition, but I would agree that Govt. has done more harm than good as far as affecting pricing.

 

[Wild Bill]

I don't think Bernie does well in Pennsylvania due to his proposed fracking ban. He'd eliminate over 300,000 jobs in a the blink of an eye and when asked about that, he didn't have an answer.

I agree, that's going to be a big issue for Bernie or whoever gets the D nomination.

It's supposed to be close, as always, in Ohio though. Only once since 1944 has Ohio picked the losing Presidential candidate (Picking Nixon over Kennedy). I could see Bernie doing well in the metropolitan areas, but outside of that is Trump country. Bernie is a wildcard, and he's certainly energetic. Polls say America may not be ready for a socialist President (And I hope that's true), but because he's different it makes me wonder if Bernie isn't the best chance for Democrats to steal this one.

Positive views on socialism polls higher among democrats than positive views on capitalism. This was a couple years ago but I'd be surpised if that has changed. In fact, I'd bet it has increased.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/240725/democrats-positive-socialism-capitalism.aspx

 

[ulukinatme]

Positive views on socialism polls higher among democrats than positive views on capitalism. This was a couple years ago but I'd be surpised if that has changed. In fact, I'd bet it has increased.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/240725/democrats-positive-socialism-capitalism.aspx

This was posted a day ago by CNN:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/20/politics/sanders-bloomberg-socialist-president/index.html

It is true the Sanders was leading in the poll, conducted by the Wall Street Journal and NBC -- but only among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents when asked who they supported for the Democratic nomination. He had 27% support compared to Mike Bloomberg, Joe Biden and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, each with 14% support. And in a hypothetical matchup, he was narrowly ahead of President Donald Trump.

But two-thirds of all voters -- Democrats plus everyone else -- said they would be uncomfortable with a socialist President.

Take a look at the party breakdown regarding socialism. Fifty percent of Democrats have a favorable view of socialism compared to 46% who have a favorable view of capitalism.
But again, socialism is far less favorable than capitalism in the country as a whole. In the NPR poll, among Americans overall, just 28% had a favorable view of socialism compared to 57% who had a favorable view of capitalism.
Among Republicans, 76% held a favorable view of capitalism compared to 7% who felt favorably about socialism.
And, among independents -- who may or may not decide the next presidential election -- it was 23% who had a favorable view of socialism compared to 59% who had a favorable view of capitalism.
And while views of socialism are slightly favorable among Democrats, they're below 35% for whites (25%), minorities (33%), Gen Xers (28%), Baby Boomers (20%), and the Silent Generation (20%).
Favorable views of socialism are greatest among younger adults (38% favorable), who just happen to also be Sanders' base of support.

Socialism may have some popularity among Democrats, but according to this it's just barely edging out capitalism among that party...and it has almost no support with conservatives. There's also twice as much support for capitalism compared to socialism when it comes to independents too.

 

[Irish YJ]

Democratic presidential contender Mike Bloomberg announced Friday that he will allow three female former employees of his media company to be released their non-disclosure agreements (NDAs) that were signed "to address complaints about comments they said I had made."

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/mike-bloomberg-ndas-women-democratic-debate

 

[Irish YJ]

There are endless forecasts that show how M4A would bankrupt America and drive providers out of the practice.

But start with the short youtube video above.

How about I don't want big gov or big corp F'ing up or making a boatload on something we pay twice as much for per capita than any other country who has national health care?

Set some basic rules and caps, cut out the middle men, cut out admin, and allow competition.

 

[Irish YJ]

Honeymoon, compliments, now in league with the Russians. We need and investigation NOW

Sanders told Russia is trying to help his campaign
https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/21/politics/bernie-sanders-russia-election-interference/index.html