COVID-19

Ndaccountant

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Thanks again for everyone who sent thoughts my way. Quick update on my father. He is doing...okay I guess. Still not in the hospital, which is fantastic. But he is really feeling the brunt. Luckily, with his connection to the local medical community, he has received more than adequate treatment. He was able to borrow an finger oximeter until one arrives at home. Thankfully, his ox levels remain in range for someone with COPD, though that is lower than someone without it. His temp has been controlled, but does rise a fair bit if not treating it. Just in the past 24 hours, his appetite has left and he is in the stage where he can't really get out of bed.

Needless to say, the next 48-72 hours are going to be the most critical. My brother, who has dozens of COVID patients of his own several hundred miles away from my father, thinks if ox levels stay above 93 for the next 24 hours, he should get through this. But with his body weakening, certainly not a slam dunk.
 

Legacy

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https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.24.20075838v1

And sunlight, higher temps and humidity are worst conditions for the virus to survive. So how are closing beaches, parks, etc. defensible on any level again?

Saw a lady smoking through her mask this weekend - hopefuly we have reached peak Covidiot.

Survival of the fittest is one argument for handling a pandemic. Comfort measures only. No CPR. Vit D, hydoxychloroquine and pepcid if they want it. Let the virus rage through our society creating herd immunity for the survivors. Accept that a good portion of the most vulnerable in all families will become our cherished memories while we open schools, businesses, political rallys, gun shows and gatherings with close contact. Stop bailing out businesses and individuals who are in debt and end the exorbitant costs of healthcare. People have rights.

This would work best if we walled off the section of the country that favors these to compare mortality rates to the rest. Back to normal for those states that want to.

Excepting the meds and oxygen, that's what we did in 1918.
 
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Legacy

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Doctors Need Room to Make the Wrenching Decisions They Face
New York is granting health care providers civil and criminal immunity during the coronavirus emergency. So should other states.


Exceprt:
The virus attacks not only the lungs but also the heart, and in Britain, as of March 26, about two-thirds of Covid-19 patients on ventilators in intensive care units had suffered heart or lung failure and died. Ordinarily, when a patient’s heart or lungs stop, doctors call a “code” and perform cardiopulmonary resuscitation. Doctors and nurses crowd closely around the patient, detach the patient from the ventilator, commonly pump a breathing bag by hand over the patient’s mouth, and stick needles into arteries and veins to inject drugs and draw blood and check oxygen levels. Spit and blood can splatter around the room.

Performing CPR on a Covid-19 patient, especially with masks and other personal protective equipment now in such short supply, puts doctors and nurses at heightened risk of becoming infected themselves. The virus has already sickened medical staff members at New York hospitals at alarming rates. And despite these heroic procedures, the chances that Covid-19 patients whose hearts and lungs stop in the I.C.U. will leave the hospital alive are exceedingly unlikely. Patients’ suffering may thus only be prolonged.
 

yankeehater

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Thanks again for everyone who sent thoughts my way. Quick update on my father. He is doing...okay I guess. Still not in the hospital, which is fantastic. But he is really feeling the brunt. Luckily, with his connection to the local medical community, he has received more than adequate treatment. He was able to borrow an finger oximeter until one arrives at home. Thankfully, his ox levels remain in range for someone with COPD, though that is lower than someone without it. His temp has been controlled, but does rise a fair bit if not treating it. Just in the past 24 hours, his appetite has left and he is in the stage where he can't really get out of bed.

Needless to say, the next 48-72 hours are going to be the most critical. My brother, who has dozens of COVID patients of his own several hundred miles away from my father, thinks if ox levels stay above 93 for the next 24 hours, he should get through this. But with his body weakening, certainly not a slam dunk.

I am sure you have read this and may already be incorporating, but been hearing Covid patients placed in a prone position are getting their oxygen levels up and back to normal quickly. Easier said than done, but if not already doing might want to consider.
 

RDU Irish

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Survival of the fittest is one argument for handling a pandemic. Comfort measures only. No CPR. Vit D, hydoxychloroquine and pepcid if they want it. Let the virus rage through our society creating herd immunity for the survivors. Accept that a good portion of the most vulnerable in all families will be become our cherished memories while we open schools, businesses, political rallys, gun shows and gatherings with close contact.

This would work best if we walled off the section of the country that favors these to compare mortality rates to the rest. Back to normal for those states that want to.

Excepting the meds and oxygen, that's what we did in 1918.

I fail to see the correlation of your response to the content of my posting?

Sunlight is proving effective for destroying COVID19 which should have been the assumption from day one instead of the "we just don't KNOW for sure so stop insisting on killing people!!!" hysterical (not funny) response. Sunlight is the best antiseptic - as a base assumption - is logical and should need to be proven false for this variety of virus.

Sunlight is also valuable for delivering Vitamin D which has positive immune system effects - I think the study linking D deficiency to negative COVID19 outcomes was posted here previously. So getting outside regularly in warm, sunny climates should be a good thing. Hit the beach and keep a respectful distance from others - hard for me to fathom the hate thrown at even considering this activity.

I previously posited that cororaviruses by their nature are less lethal and mutations should logically be more likely to be weaker on average than stronger. Data seems to be leaning that way. Why the insistence on assuming the worst possible outcome?
 

Irishize

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Thanks again for everyone who sent thoughts my way. Quick update on my father. He is doing...okay I guess. Still not in the hospital, which is fantastic. But he is really feeling the brunt. Luckily, with his connection to the local medical community, he has received more than adequate treatment. He was able to borrow an finger oximeter until one arrives at home. Thankfully, his ox levels remain in range for someone with COPD, though that is lower than someone without it. His temp has been controlled, but does rise a fair bit if not treating it. Just in the past 24 hours, his appetite has left and he is in the stage where he can't really get out of bed.

Needless to say, the next 48-72 hours are going to be the most critical. My brother, who has dozens of COVID patients of his own several hundred miles away from my father, thinks if ox levels stay above 93 for the next 24 hours, he should get through this. But with his body weakening, certainly not a slam dunk.

Prayers that your father has a full recovery & prayers for the healthcare workers’ safety as well.
 

Irishize

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Survival of the fittest is one argument for handling a pandemic. Comfort measures only. No CPR. Vit D, hydoxychloroquine and pepcid if they want it. Let the virus rage through our society creating herd immunity for the survivors. Accept that a good portion of the most vulnerable in all families will become our cherished memories while we open schools, businesses, political rallys, gun shows and gatherings with close contact. Stop bailing out businesses and individuals who are in debt and end the exorbitant costs of healthcare. People have rights.

This would work best if we walled off the section of the country that favors these to compare mortality rates to the rest. Back to normal for those states that want to.

Excepting the meds and oxygen, that's what we did in 1918.

Similar logic...

EXWeIc-U8AATYQT
 

Legacy

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I fail to see the correlation of your response to the content of my posting?

Sunlight is proving effective for destroying COVID19 which should have been the assumption from day one instead of the "we just don't KNOW for sure so stop insisting on killing people!!!" hysterical (not funny) response. Sunlight is the best antiseptic - as a base assumption - is logical and should need to be proven false for this variety of virus.

Sunlight is also valuable for delivering Vitamin D which has positive immune system effects - I think the study linking D deficiency to negative COVID19 outcomes was posted here previously. So getting outside regularly in warm, sunny climates should be a good thing. Hit the beach and keep a respectful distance from others - hard for me to fathom the hate thrown at even considering this activity.

I previously posited that cororaviruses by their nature are less lethal and mutations should logically be more likely to be weaker on average than stronger. Data seems to be leaning that way. Why the insistence on assuming the worst possible outcome?

Perhaps we are talking by each other. I do not see why as an informal trial people should not enjoy the outdoors, forego social distancing and other mitigation measures, get some Vitamin D, eat healthy foods that boost your immune system. (Those are easily Googled.)

Normal Vitamin D levels may be associated with increased survival rates but are not necessarily causative. Perhaps normal Vit D levels occur in people who are at low risk like a younger age group without co-morbid conditions. Low Vit D levels do occur in the elderly, those who cannot get outdoors, on certain meds, poor nutrition, smokers. These are the high risk group anyway who also have conditions that increae mortality and undoubtedly are more causative of mortality. We also can't conclude that that low risk group getting plenty of Vit D sunbathing and not social distancing justifies total withdrawl of mitigation measures. "Hit the beach and keep a respectful distance.." is good advice. But I'm wearing a mask with frequent handwashing, too.

I have no problem with easing those and getting back to business in many situations and increasing employment. Give it a try. For a better analysis, wall off one or more states like Florida as we do with Canada, Mexico, China, etc. Test only those symptomatic, then when positive trace their contacts. Calculate mortality for only positive cases.

Using the Power of Light: Preventing the Airborne Spread of Coronavirus and Influenza Virus
(Columbia University)
6 things you should know about vitamin D
 
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Irishize

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No time like the present...or maybe five months ago at least? Those subways are incubators for COVID-19. When did NYC finally shut them down?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">For the first time in 115 years, overnight subway service in New York City has been shut down to clean trains amid the pandemic <a href="https://t.co/OWHu7mhlJA">https://t.co/OWHu7mhlJA</a> <a href="https://t.co/WV2aAPYJKk">pic.twitter.com/WV2aAPYJKk</a></p>— CBS News (@CBSNews) <a href="https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/1258011200316674048?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 6, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

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Irish#1

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From CNN.com. Pretty funny.

Supreme embarrassment: The flush heard around the country

(CNN)Well, someone forgot to mute.

The Supreme Court was making history Wednesday afternoon, holding arguments over the phone because of Covid-19, when all of a sudden there was the distinct sound of a toilet flushing.
Across the country, the public that has never before this week been able to listen in real time to oral arguments held remotely was treated not only to deep questions related to the First Amendment and robocalls but also to someone's apparent bathroom break.
The errant flush from an unknown source comes as the justices, lawyers and the country are dealing with the new realities -- and hazards -- of conducting their business over teleconference lines.
The case at issue concerned the Telephone Consumer Protection Act that prohibits unwanted calls to cellphones by use of an automated system. Challengers say one provision violates the Constitution. Lawyer Roman Martinez, representing political groups challenging the law, was pressing his point when the offending flush occurred.
Martinez did not seem fazed or publicly notice the interruption.
The Supreme Court has issued guidance to lawyers who would participate in oral arguments over the phone, noting that once one lawyer's argument is completed, his or her line would be muted and the "line for the next counsel will be unmuted."
 

Old Man Mike

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Viruses that are inside the body don't care much about the outside environment. Our insides are "dark" and homeothermic. The Sunlight (etc) business is about clobbering "loose" un-currently-hosted viral particles. So --- He!l Yes go to the beach BUT He!l yes keep social distancing while there. Closing beaches has nothing to do with "beaches" but congregating in quarters where coughing, spitting, even speaking and touching will likely happen lots.

Visualize the transmission --- don't be misled by trying to simply read words and misleading yourself. . It's the "immediate contact of person to person" that's being attempted to be limited. If one can go to a beach and stay away at the same time, fine. If you want to go to an empty restaurant in Alaska, fine too.
 

Irishize

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While no state has been perfect in this pandemic, NYC seems to be leading the pack in bad decisions & bad optics this deep into COVID-19

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A tale of two parks: Enjoying the sun in wealthy Manhattan, social distancing under police scrutiny in the Bronx <a href="https://t.co/XKZceM0wyr">https://t.co/XKZceM0wyr</a> <a href="https://t.co/lkiRvLEFnv">pic.twitter.com/lkiRvLEFnv</a></p>— Yahoo News (@YahooNews) <a href="https://twitter.com/YahooNews/status/1258128186120065027?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 6, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

NDShark

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While no state has been perfect in this pandemic, NYC seems to be leading the pack in bad decisions & bad optics this deep into COVID-19

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A tale of two parks: Enjoying the sun in wealthy Manhattan, social distancing under police scrutiny in the Bronx <a href="https://t.co/XKZceM0wyr">https://t.co/XKZceM0wyr</a> <a href="https://t.co/lkiRvLEFnv">pic.twitter.com/lkiRvLEFnv</a></p>— Yahoo News (@YahooNews) <a href="https://twitter.com/YahooNews/status/1258128186120065027?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 6, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

It looks like the groups are too close, but the angle of the camera exaggerates the photo on the left. Similar to the photos you see of packed beaches...If you want to show people aren't social distancing, take a photo from ground-level. If you want to show people are, take it from the sky.
 

irishff1014

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Remember when Cuomo threatened to sue if the President placed those travel restrictions on NYer's? When is Cuomo going to be held accountable for every horrible decision during this pandemic? Majority of the cases even in the West can be attributed to NY!

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/07/us/new-york-city-coronavirus-outbreak.html

Cuomo and De Blasio are morons. And Cuomo is just like the young population he wants someone to pay for all of his stuff. And now De Blasio is talking about furlough first responders. SMH.
 

Irishize

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It looks like the groups are too close, but the angle of the camera exaggerates the photo on the left. Similar to the photos you see of packed beaches...If you want to show people aren't social distancing, take a photo from ground-level. If you want to show people are, take it from the sky.

Fair point but I believe the overarching point is made by Yahoo!in their tweet. Picture is worth a 1000 words in their opinion.
 

RDU Irish

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Perhaps we are talking by each other. I do not see why as an informal trial people should not enjoy the outdoors, forego social distancing and other mitigation measures, get some Vitamin D, eat healthy foods that boost your immune system. (Those are easily Googled.)

Normal Vitamin D levels may be associated with increased survival rates but are not necessarily causative. Perhaps normal Vit D levels occur in people who are at low risk like a younger age group without co-morbid conditions. Low Vit D levels do occur in the elderly, those who cannot get outdoors, on certain meds, poor nutrition, smokers. These are the high risk group anyway who also have conditions that increae mortality and undoubtedly are more causative of mortality. We also can't conclude that that low risk group getting plenty of Vit D sunbathing and not social distancing justifies total withdrawl of mitigation measures. "Hit the beach and keep a respectful distance.." is good advice. But I'm wearing a mask with frequent handwashing, too.

I have no problem with easing those and getting back to business in many situations and increasing employment. Give it a try. For a better analysis, wall off one or more states like Florida as we do with Canada, Mexico, China, etc. Test only those symptomatic, then when positive trace their contacts. Calculate mortality for only positive cases.

Using the Power of Light: Preventing the Airborne Spread of Coronavirus and Influenza Virus

6 things you should know about vitamin D

Fact - correlation does not equal causation. Also a fact that sunbathing and social distancing are not mutually exclusive - far from it. Restricting exercise and outdoor activity is arguably compromising the health of everyone who CHOOSES a healthier lifestyle. Like the infirm are hateful of the healthy and want them to be forced on the same level?

What is up with the inability to go out in public without licking each others faces and humping each others legs? JFC personal space shouldn't need a damn pandemic to be an actual thing. Hand washing is not new to anyone I know b/c I wouldn't hang around a bunch of filthy pricks - I mean really, it shows no respect for anyone including yourself to be that gross. But please wear that mask - that will save us all.
 

RDU Irish

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It looks like the groups are too close, but the angle of the camera exaggerates the photo on the left. Similar to the photos you see of packed beaches...If you want to show people aren't social distancing, take a photo from ground-level. If you want to show people are, take it from the sky.

Exactly - and then show a time lapse if you want to see how minimal interactions are. Now show the parks in suburbs versus NYC - nowhere to go to get away from people in these high density areas. Hitting a hotel on the beach versus renting a single family home are two very different experiences.
 

RDU Irish

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Viruses that are inside the body don't care much about the outside environment. Our insides are "dark" and homeothermic. The Sunlight (etc) business is about clobbering "loose" un-currently-hosted viral particles. So --- He!l Yes go to the beach BUT He!l yes keep social distancing while there. Closing beaches has nothing to do with "beaches" but congregating in quarters where coughing, spitting, even speaking and touching will likely happen lots.

Visualize the transmission --- don't be misled by trying to simply read words and misleading yourself. . It's the "immediate contact of person to person" that's being attempted to be limited. If one can go to a beach and stay away at the same time, fine. If you want to go to an empty restaurant in Alaska, fine too.

I don't think this can be stressed enough. Much bigger problem in urban settings than suburbs.
 

Legacy

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Fact - correlation does not equal causation. Also a fact that sunbathing and social distancing are not mutually exclusive - far from it. Restricting exercise and outdoor activity is arguably compromising the health of everyone who CHOOSES a healthier lifestyle. Like the infirm are hateful of the healthy and want them to be forced on the same level?

What is up with the inability to go out in public without licking each others faces and humping each others legs? JFC personal space shouldn't need a damn pandemic to be an actual thing. Hand washing is not new to anyone I know b/c I wouldn't hang around a bunch of filthy pricks - I mean really, it shows no respect for anyone including yourself to be that gross. But please wear that mask - that will save us all.

1. Correlation not causation - Isn't that my point?
2. Restriction - Ready for opening gyms, eh? They better not restrict the football season, but I, for one, could understand it if they did. Nothing wrong with walking with (sun) protection (mask, distancing).
3. The "infirm" are not those with low Vitamin D levels.
4. Choice in the age of a virtually unprecedented pandemic brings personal responsibility. You've indicated that and that you would continue mitigation measures. I imagine that in taking you and your family to the beach you would take extra precautions in the bathrooms and not go to bars. Or not go? That doesn't mean that those who choice not to are rejecting "a healthier lifestyle".
5. My post on the 1918 Spanish flu showed that the same mitigation measures were instituted then. Nothing there changes in public health. The difference is only that today we have more people willing to disregard them. Overall, many are like pre-1918 mentality.
6. My post on the spread of COVID on the Roosevelt demonstrated that two weeks after the first sailor showed symptoms, sixty percent of the crew was infected. Up to twenty percent were asymptomatic. Testing was available for all in an enclosed environment.
7. It is well known that low levels of vitamin D and susceptibility to acute respiratory tract infections. Further studies need to be done on Vit D and COVID. One study found that 75% of people in institutions, such as hospitals and care homes, were severely deficient in vitamin D. Perform dedicated studies looking at vitamin D levels in COVID-19 patients with different degrees of disease severity.
8. It's established that Vit D insufficiency (VDI) and severe COVID-19 share numerous associations including hypertension, obesity, male sex, advanced age, concentration in northern climates, coagulopathy, and immune dysfunction. We hava a retrospective study and need a prospective, randomized controlled studies of VDI in COVID-19 patients are warranted.
9. Until there is confirmation of a correlation, I'll stick with what we know puts people into the high risk category and increases mortality rates. Physicians regularly check the Vit D levels in nursing home patients and may well be checking those in COVID hospitalized patients. Does a normal Vit D level protect you in any way from the virus?
10. All of us want to get back to some degree of our normal behavior, including healthy lifestyles. For some, all of this Vit D stuff is just an excuse and will increase transmission.
 
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Sea Turtle

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University of Tennessee has announced that classes will resume in the fall and that there will be football. The SEC I believe, will lead the way on this.
 

Irishize

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So to summarize: Governor Cuomo forced elderly patients (for which we can ALL agree are the most vulnerable in this pandemic) who were positive COVID-19 patients back into their respective nursing homes. While the state provided PPE for the nursing home employees, they went a step further and provided body bags for their eventual deaths (basically admitting they know this is a bad idea)

How does a “brilliant” mind like Cuomo not know that the last thing you want to do w/ the most vulnerable citizens is to introduce a vector that is guaranteed to spread the virus amongst those most vulnerable? It’s not like this happened in the first few weeks of the pandemic.

Unbelievable

https://www.businessinsider.com/nur...hen-they-accepted-coronavirus-patients-2020-4
 

Circa

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I just got through listening to a man that has thousands of employes that are located all over China and not 1 got this political virus.....


Listen at the 58:00 mark and 1:23 mark.

The 1:23.57 mark has Elon Telling the American Public; I have employees In China and not 1 got the virus.

I recommend for all to listen or watch the whole interview.
The first 58 minutes is interesting and something to account for in the future.
After 58 minutes.... It gets into an area that I shouldn't comment on. He is on the verge of sending men to Mars.... I'm not going to argue with the intellectual ability of that stature.

7,000 Tesla Employees In China and NOT 1 DIED!


<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RcYjXbSJBN8" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
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Irish#1

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So to summarize: Governor Cuomo forced elderly patients (for which we can ALL agree are the most vulnerable in this pandemic) who were positive COVID-19 patients back into their respective nursing homes. While the state provided PPE for the nursing home employees, they went a step further and provided body bags for their eventual deaths (basically admitting they know this is a bad idea)

How does a “brilliant” mind like Cuomo not know that the last thing you want to do w/ the most vulnerable citizens is to introduce a vector that is guaranteed to spread the virus amongst those most vulnerable? It’s not like this happened in the first few weeks of the pandemic.

Unbelievable

https://www.businessinsider.com/nur...hen-they-accepted-coronavirus-patients-2020-4

Maybe he isn’t brilliant!
 

Circa

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Maybe he isn’t brilliant!

Bout time....

<div style='position:relative; padding-bottom:calc(56.25% + 44px)'><iframe src='https://gfycat.com/ifr/ResponsibleFarflungCaudata' frameborder='0' scrolling='no' width='100%' height='100%' style='position:absolute;top:0;left:0;' allowfullscreen></iframe></div><p> <a href="https://gfycat.com/responsiblefarflungcaudata"



I kid. I thought Cuomo was onto something a weird time ago.....
 
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Legacy

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While the Columbia University article above is a good one on research in this field with other citations, the NY Times today came out with one on UVC in their Science secton:
Scientists Consider Indoor Ultraviolet Light to Zap Coronavirus in the Air

Imagine hospital rooms emiting UVC and killing airborne viruses as well as the other areas mentioned.
 
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