Another Shooting

NorthDakota

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drayer54

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Walmart Discontinues Auto Part Sales To Prevent Car Accidents
https://babylonbee.com/news/walmart-discontinues-sale-of-auto-parts-to-prevent-car-accidents

BENTONVILLE, AR—In a bold move intended to curb the thousands of deaths from vehicles each and every day, Walmart has decided to stop selling auto parts, sources confirmed Tuesday.


According to shocking reports, people have purchased car parts at Walmart and then those cars have been involved in accidents, proving a direct correlation between selling auto parts and causing deaths.

"We can no longer be complicit in an industry that kills over 3,000 people a day," said a spokesperson for Walmart. "Every time we sell a muffler, steering wheel cover, or flame decal, we are potentially causing the death of a person, and we cannot support that any longer."

"It's clear that bad drivers and poor road conditions don't cause vehicular deaths---cars do."

Walmart executives said they are beating themselves with a stick to atone for the deaths they've already caused.

"Our consciences will only be clean when we've been mercilessly beaten once for each of the millions of deaths that have been caused by automobiles since Walmart began selling auto parts," said one executive before solemnly beginning to beat himself with a baseball bat.
 

Irish#1

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Mom and Pop stores will be thrilled about this. Not going to stop folks from getting ammo in any meaningful way.

Also lmao'ing at asking people to not open carry in stores. What a stupid policy decision. "A guy came in and shot pe people here. In response, we dont want people openly carrying guns here."

Probably don't want customers freaking out when someone walks in with a gun on their hip.
 

drayer54

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Probably don't want customers freaking out when someone walks in with a gun on their hip.

I've always thought open carry is obnoxious. Anyone doing it in a Wal-Mart now is completely tone-deaf. That said, I'd prefer people carry at Wal-Mart. Concealed...
 

BGIF

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Protests shut down an Interstate in MN last night over a police shooting allegedly of a 30 year old with a knife. The 30 year old was in a car chase with police for 6 minutes involving at least two jurisdictions, Edina and Richfield. The driver streamed himself live on Facebook. At the end of the self streamed video the driver is seen exiting the car and you can see his left hand on the steering wheel holding ... a knife. Not on a police cam but on the driver's own self streaming video.


Local TV News article and the streaming video at the link

https://www.fox9.com/news/man-live-streamed-police-chase-that-resulted-in-richfield-officer-involved-shooting
 

Irish#1

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While not a shooting, a story on how the news never tells the entire story. In the last week a policeman in Indy (lived across the street for me for a couple of years) has come under for for striking a teenager outside of a high school. While I don't condone him striking the kid, the news failed to report why the police were there.

Earlier this kid did something inside the HS which normally would results in an arrest. However, Indiana law was recently changed requiring kids to be released to their parents unless the broken law was a major felony. I spoke to my neighbor who is also a policeman. Evidently this kid started smarting off to the police (two were there) inside the school and continued as he and his mom were being escorted off the grounds. The kid then stepped toward the policeman which resulted in the policeman losing his cool and smacking the kid who I believe is 16.

1. Media never reported anything about why the police were called and what the kid did.
2. Someone was conveniently recording the incident.
3. Mother was all over the media blaming the police and never once mentioned how this wouldn't have happened if the kid would have not gotten into trouble.
 

Irish#1

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Legacy,
1. What impact do you think this will have on mass shootings?
2. Do you think tighter gun laws would have prevented the Odessa shootings?
3. Any reason you didn't comment on the shooting in chicago or Mobile?

Updated my post from 8-31-19.

How about my questions? You never did respond.
 

Legacy

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Let's Pass Bipartisan Gun Safety Legislation Now.
The nation’s mayors are calling on the United States Senate to return to Washington to pass bipartisan legislation to end gun violence now.
(United States Conference of Mayors, August 8, 2019)

Dear Leader McConnell and Leader Schumer:

RE: Senate Action Needed NOW on Gun Safety Legislation

On behalf of The United States Conference of Mayors, we urge you to immediately call the Senate back to Washington to take action on bipartisan gun safety legislation.

Already in 2019, there have been over 250 mass shootings. The tragic events in El Paso and Dayton this weekend are just the latest reminders that our nation can no longer wait for our federal government to take the actions necessary to prevent people who should not have access to firearms from being able to purchase them.

In late February, the House of Representatives passed two bills that would greatly strengthen the background check system:

- H.R. 8, the Bipartisan Background Check Act of 2019
- H.R. 1112, the Enhanced Background Checks Act of 2019

H.R. 8 passed the House on February 27 on a bipartisan vote of 240-190. It would close serious loopholes in the background check system by:

-- requiring all firearm purchases to undergo a NICS background check;
-- helping to prevent dangerous individuals from obtaining deadly weapons by circumventing the laws on the books;
-- prohibiting unlicensed transfers of guns through unregulated secondary sales; and
-- increasing law enforcement’s ability to trace crime guns.
(con't)

The Socialists.

I assume that we are all grown-ups here and share a common respect for each other evidenced by our posts with both tolerance towards posts and respect to others that may differ. This is the foundation of debates and can advance discussions and strengthen our American culture across those experiences and differences that make us individuals which includes across generations. This is the strength of the civilization the generations before us established and was their ultimate goal and for which they fought and died. That's what our enemies seek to undermine and destroy. This is America. The above are what American mayors believe will make us safer and may further discussion on this board. Thoughts?
 

Irish#1

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Let's Pass Bipartisan Gun Safety Legislation Now.
The nation’s mayors are calling on the United States Senate to return to Washington to pass bipartisan legislation to end gun violence now.
(United States Conference of Mayors, August 8, 2019)

(con't)

The Socialists.

I assume that we are all grown-ups here and share a common respect for each other evidenced by our posts with both tolerance towards posts and respect to others that may differ. This is the foundation of debates and can advance discussions and strengthen our American culture across those experiences and differences that make us individuals which includes across generations. This is the strength of the civilization the generations before us established and was their ultimate goal and for which they fought and died. That's what our enemies seek to undermine and destroy. This is America. The above are what American mayors believe will make us safer and may further discussion on this board. Thoughts?

I'll be happy to share my thoughts when you answer my questions.
 

MJ12666

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Let's Pass Bipartisan Gun Safety Legislation Now.
The nation’s mayors are calling on the United States Senate to return to Washington to pass bipartisan legislation to end gun violence now.
(United States Conference of Mayors, August 8, 2019)

(con't)

The Socialists.

I assume that we are all grown-ups here and share a common respect for each other evidenced by our posts with both tolerance towards posts and respect to others that may differ. This is the foundation of debates and can advance discussions and strengthen our American culture across those experiences and differences that make us individuals which includes across generations. This is the strength of the civilization the generations before us established and was their ultimate goal and for which they fought and died. That's what our enemies seek to undermine and destroy. This is America. The above are what American mayors believe will make us safer and may further discussion on this board. Thoughts?

Well, unless I am interpreting what is being represented in the link to your post, the request is from 278 individuals who happen to be mayors, so I give it as much credence as if a guns rights organization were to send the senate a petition signed by 278 people requesting that the senate take no action on gun control. In other words, I am not particularity impressed.
 

Legacy

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Well, unless I am interpreting what is being represented in the link to your post, the request is from 278 individuals who happen to be mayors, so I give it as much credence as if a guns rights organization were to send the senate a petition signed by 278 people requesting that the senate take no action on gun control. In other words, I am not particularity impressed.

I believe that is a misinterpretation in that the U.S. Conference of Mayors has taken these positions that they wish to convey to the U.S. Congress on the bills saying:
H.R. 8 and H.R. 1112 are bipartisan, sensible gun safety bills that would make our cities and our people safer, and would in no way compromise gun owners’ rights.
They have made their positions as an organization clear to the Congress in previous resolutions and papers. This latest one is reflective of the latest tragedies and the calls for Congress to convene earlier. It's a consistent stance by an organization with a history of advocating for gun safety laws regardless of leadership that has changed over the years.

Another is from the International Association of Chiefs of Police which includes specific positions Firearms Policy Position Statement

The International Association of Chiefs of Police (IACP) has long held positions intended to reduce and
prevent firearms violence. As law enforcement professionals, it is our duty to protect and serve our
communities and display the leadership needed to ensure public safety. As such, the IACP supports
legislation and policies that seek to improve the safety of our communities, which in turn enhances the
safety of law enforcement officers.

The level of firearm-related injuries and deaths in the United States, which includes homicides,
suicides, and accidental shootings, is unacceptable and demands immediate attention. Since 2000,
over 500,000 Americans have lost their lives to firearms violence which averages to over 31,000
firearm deaths per year. While acts of terrorism and mass shootings receive the most media coverage,
gun violence claims lives every day in cities and towns throughout the United States. Acknowledging
that any death by a firearm is equally tragic, regardless of the cause, the call to action remains the
same – to safeguard the public and those who put their lives on the line each day to ensure the safety
and wellbeing of communities.

Outlined in this position paper are common sense polices that would assist in reducing gun violence,
while upholding the second amendment.

In fact, today this news:
Mayors & Police Chiefs to Hold Press Conference in U.S. Capitol Urging Action on Gun Safety Legislation
Follows Meeting with White House Officials and Letter Signed by Almost 300 Mayors – Republicans and Democrats – Calling for Senate to Address Gun Violence


Texas Gov Greg Abbott is suggesting voluntary background checks for person-to-person sales to customers the seller does not know. What world is he living in?
 
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NorthDakota

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I believe that is a misinterpretation in that the U.S. Conference of Mayors has taken these positions that they wish to convey to the U.S. Congress on the bills saying:

They have made their positions as an organization clear to the Congress in previous resolutions and papers. This latest one is reflective of the latest tragedies and the calls for Congress to convene earlier. It's a consistent stance by an organization with a history of advocating for gun safety laws regardless of leadership that has changed over the years.

Another is from the International Association of Chiefs of Police which includes specific positions Firearms Policy Position Statement



In fact, today this news:
Mayors & Police Chiefs to Hold Press Conference in U.S. Capitol Urging Action on Gun Safety Legislation
Follows Meeting with White House Officials and Letter Signed by Almost 300 Mayors – Republicans and Democrats – Calling for Senate to Address Gun Violence


Texas Gov Greg Abbott is suggesting voluntary background checks for person-to-person sales to customers the seller does not know. What world is he living in?

Cool beans that mayors like the idea. I'm not asking the govt for permission to sell/buy guns from individuals.

I'm not registering any guns either.
 

Legacy

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For some, "law-abiding" is a term of convenience buttressed by being convinced of a government not of the people exercising democratic principles but one which they perceive as tyrannical since they do not agree with those laws and the enforcement of them.


Ghost Guns Are Everywhere in California (The Trace0

Self-described "crypto-anarchist" Cody Wilson is sentenced in a child sex assault case and is required to register as a sex offender.
3D-printed gun designer Cody Wilson gets probation in child sexual assault case
 
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Legacy

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Police are encountering more and more machine guns (fully automatic) which have been modified from semi-automatic weapons through conversion kits. Mississippi, Minnesota, Cleveland, California, Michigan are some of the locations I found. They have been seized at the Southern Border and ports of entry, ordered and shipped from China where once they were sold over Amazon and now through other on-line sites. Not sure if they are sold on Armslist.com. The Admin outlawed bump stocks. They have been shipped in easily assembled parts to disguise them. They can shoot up to 1,200 rounds a minute.
 

BGIF

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Police are encountering more and more machine guns (fully automatic) which have been modified from semi-automatic weapons through conversion kits. Mississippi, Minnesota, Cleveland, California, Michigan are some of the locations I found. They have been seized at the Southern Border and ports of entry, ordered and shipped from China where once they were sold over Amazon and now through other on-line sites. Not sure if they are sold on Armslist.com. The Admin outlawed bump stocks. They have been shipped in easily assembled parts to disguise them. They can shoot up to 1,200 rounds a minute.

No, they can't, not even on the battlefield. That's a theoretical and unattainable number quoted to skew the conversation for sensationalism ala Beto.

In real life AK-47s with wooden stocks catch on fire long, long before that. Both AKs, M16s, AR15, etc have barrel melt down in a few hundred rounds that can have catastrophic results for the shooter.

Heavy machine guns could fire longer as they were water cooled but cumbersome. Light machine guns required the barrels to be changed. In "Saving Private Ryan" (circa 75 years ago) Tom Hanks tells his guys that they'll rush the MG-42 at the radar installation in groups so they can overwhelm the machine gun crew while they are changing overheated barrels. Standard military tactic.

Then there's the problem of feed. You'd need 40, 30 round mags and have to keep changing them out. If my math is right you'd be shooting up about 50 pounds of ammo.


Beto wants to ban "weapons designed for the battlefield". There go hunting rifles, the 30-06 (ammo first manufactured in 1906, 113 years ago) is a common round and pre-dated the M-16 round. Bolt action guns would be also be illegal. They owe their technology to the Mauser brothers in the 1880s for the European market. Teddy Roosevelt was badly outgunned at San Juan Hill as the Spanish had "HIGH" capacity (5 rounds) charger fed weapons while the Americans had single shot rifles.

And let's not forget .45 caliber handguns designed for the U.S. Army and issued in 1911, 108 years ago. They continued to be government issue up until about 30 years ago.
 

NorthDakota

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No, they can't, not even on the battlefield. That's a theoretical and unattainable number quoted to skew the conversation for sensationalism ala Beto.

In real life AK-47s with wooden stocks catch on fire long, long before that. Both AKs, M16s, AR15, etc have barrel melt down in a few hundred rounds that can have catastrophic results for the shooter.

Heavy machine guns could fire longer as they were water cooled but cumbersome. Light machine guns required the barrels to be changed. In "Saving Private Ryan" (circa 75 years ago) Tom Hanks tells his guys that they'll rush the MG-42 at the radar installation in groups so they can overwhelm the machine gun crew while they are changing overheated barrels. Standard military tactic.

Then there's the problem of feed. You'd need 40, 30 round mags and have to keep changing them out. If my math is right you'd be shooting up about 50 pounds of ammo.


Beto wants to ban "weapons designed for the battlefield". There go hunting rifles, the 30-06 (ammo first manufactured in 1906, 113 years ago) is a common round and pre-dated the M-16 round. Bolt action guns would be also be illegal. They owe their technology to the Mauser brothers in the 1880s for the European market. Teddy Roosevelt was badly outgunned at San Juan Hill as the Spanish had "HIGH" capacity (5 rounds) charger fed weapons while the Americans had single shot rifles.

And let's not forget .45 caliber handguns designed for the U.S. Army and issued in 1911, 108 years ago. They continued to be government issue up until about 30 years ago.

This is why we cant budge on anymore gun crap. There is absolutely nothing wrong with owning a semi-automatic rifle, handgun, or shotgun.

Some people are assholes and abuse them. That doesnt mean I cant own one...or five...or twenty-five.
 

Legacy

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No, they can't, not even on the battlefield. That's a theoretical and unattainable number quoted to skew the conversation for sensationalism ala Beto.

In real life AK-47s with wooden stocks catch on fire long, long before that. Both AKs, M16s, AR15, etc have barrel melt down in a few hundred rounds that can have catastrophic results for the shooter.

Heavy machine guns could fire longer as they were water cooled but cumbersome. Light machine guns required the barrels to be changed. In "Saving Private Ryan" (circa 75 years ago) Tom Hanks tells his guys that they'll rush the MG-42 at the radar installation in groups so they can overwhelm the machine gun crew while they are changing overheated barrels. Standard military tactic.

Then there's the problem of feed. You'd need 40, 30 round mags and have to keep changing them out. If my math is right you'd be shooting up about 50 pounds of ammo.


Beto wants to ban "weapons designed for the battlefield". There go hunting rifles, the 30-06 (ammo first manufactured in 1906, 113 years ago) is a common round and pre-dated the M-16 round. Bolt action guns would be also be illegal. They owe their technology to the Mauser brothers in the 1880s for the European market. Teddy Roosevelt was badly outgunned at San Juan Hill as the Spanish had "HIGH" capacity (5 rounds) charger fed weapons while the Americans had single shot rifles.

And let's not forget .45 caliber handguns designed for the U.S. Army and issued in 1911, 108 years ago. They continued to be government issue up until about 30 years ago.

Outside of the numbers, the point, as I'm sure you know, is the increasing prevalence of fully automatic weapons that police are facing with these conversion kits.

This commentator is clearly trying to sell the Glock 18 full automatic., touting 1200-1400 a minute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCbQ6O-Sihc

Everything you seem to have mentioned:
How fast can a fully automatic shoot?

I guess in some circles it's fashionable to make the Beto reference. Especially to dismiss any other changes to gun regulations.
 

NorthDakota

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Outside of the numbers, the point, as I'm sure you know, is the increasing prevalence of fully automatic weapons that police are facing with these conversion kits.

This commentator is clearly trying to sell the Glock 18 full automatic., touting 1200-1400 a minute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCbQ6O-Sihc

Everything you seem to have mentioned:
How fast can a fully automatic shoot?

I guess in some circles it's fashionable to make the Beto reference. Especially to dismiss any other changes to gun regulations.

What's your issue with the glock? What do you think you can accomplish there?

The "ghost guns" are here and I doubt any Federal effort to do much about them will be particularly effective. Seems like trying to close Pandora's box.
 

drayer54

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[/URL]
I guess in some circles it's fashionable to make the Beto reference. Especially to dismiss any other changes to gun regulations.

Get used to it, Bubba. Beto broke the rule of gun-control messaging. You’re supposed to play along with you can keep your guns, we just want to regulate them a little tighter, and a little tighter, and a little tighter, and a little tighter, and a little tighter... and so on.

Everyone knows these laws don’t prevent murders. So tighten the belt, wait for tragedy, tighten the belt, repeat. Right?

In the mean time, let’s try and isolate the people in movies, press, society, grocery stores, etc.
 

IrishLax

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Survive the school year with these must-have <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BackToSchool?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#BackToSchool</a> essentials. <a href="https://t.co/9KgxAQ0KGz">https://t.co/9KgxAQ0KGz</a><br>This PSA contains graphic content related to school shootings & may be upsetting to some viewers. If you feel this subject matter may be difficult for you, you may choose not to watch. <a href="https://t.co/5ijYMtXRTy">pic.twitter.com/5ijYMtXRTy</a></p>— Sandy Hook Promise (@sandyhook) <a href="https://twitter.com/sandyhook/status/1174291982857883653?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 18, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

Legacy

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Get used to it, Bubba. Beto broke the rule of gun-control messaging. You’re supposed to play along with you can keep your guns, we just want to regulate them a little tighter, and a little tighter, and a little tighter, and a little tighter, and a little tighter... and so on.

Everyone knows these laws don’t prevent murders. So tighten the belt, wait for tragedy, tighten the belt, repeat. Right?

In the mean time, let’s try and isolate the people in movies, press, society, grocery stores, etc.

Messaging? Not proposals. Big Government infringing on individual rights? Not being responsive to majority views. Slippery slope? Not positions that have been supported historically, nor by most gun owners nor by an informed public.

Not clear on your last line.

If memory serves with the stats on gun violence, about 60% of homicides are with handguns, 20+% are suicides, single digits each for justified homicides, mass shootings, and unintentional deaths. The vast majority of mass shooters report their intentions prior to their acts and there are red flags families notice prior to suicides.

A mental health problem? More mental health resources? Certainly those have been cut back and need of more funding. But the process for civil commitments, the vast majority of involuntary commitments, require a judicial proceeding within 72 hours after commitment to hold someone. That would be the same process red flag laws propose for those threatening to kill themselves or others. With a judicial decision that they are a danger, how long do you keep them in a mental hospital? The vast majority do not have a mental disorder. The NRA has long fought these red flag laws in court despite demonstrated progress in decreasing gun violence in states that have adopted them.

Universal background checks. Since 1994 when federal background checks were first required on some sales, over 3 million people legally prohibited from possessing a gun have been stopped from purchasing a gun or denied a permit to purchase. More than 35% of these denials involved people convicted of felony offenses.

Slippery slope for some, I guess. Loosen the belt, loosen the belt - we'll all be safer? To most, that sounds like messaging.
 
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drayer54

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Messaging? Not proposals. Big Government infringing on individual rights? Not being responsive to majority views. Slippery slope? Not positions that have been supported historically, nor by most gun owners nor by an informed public.

Not clear on your last line.

If memory serves with the stats on gun violence, about 60% of homicides are with handguns, 20+% are suicides, single digits each for justified homicides, mass shootings, and unintentional deaths. The vast majority of mass shooters report their intentions prior to their acts and there are red flags families notice prior to suicides.

A mental health problem? More mental health resources? Certainly those have been cut back and need of more funding. But the process for civil commitments, the vast majority of involuntary commitments, require a judicial proceeding within 72 hours after commitment to hold someone. That would be the same process red flag laws propose for those threatening to kill themselves or others. With a judicial decision that they are a danger, how long do you keep them in a mental hospital? The vast majority do not have a mental disorder. The NRA has long fought these red flag laws in court despite demonstrated progress in decreasing gun violence in states that have adopted them.

Universal background checks. Since 1994 when federal background checks were first required on some sales, over 3 million people legally prohibited from possessing a gun have been stopped from purchasing a gun or denied a permit to purchase. More than 35% of these denials involved people convicted of felony offenses.

Slippery slope for some, I guess. Loosen the belt, loosen the belt - we'll all be safer? To most, that sounds like messaging.

Yes, messaging. Didn’t you know the gun grabbers spent some money doing a “say this not that” guide a few years back? The anti-gun types developed an entire messaging guide on how to use emotional appeal and which terms to use.

http://healthyinfluence.com/wordpre...2013/09/gun-violencemessaging-guide-pdf-1.pdf

Beto was supposed to stick to the plan of modest language and then keep chipping away. This guide is kept in 50 statehouses and shared every so often with the elected types in Washington. Want to understand why they message in line? Look no further. Don’t think the activists who work in the media haven’t caught on to say gun-violence and gun-safety measures.

Yes, slippery slope argument is very real. Nobody thinks the anti-gunners are going to be done once they get this or that. Look at knife control in Europe to see where this leads when gun-grabbers get their way. My right to self-defense and having access to a meaningful way to do it means something to me.
 

Irish YJ

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Irish YJ

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looks like some idiot drove and SUV through a mall in IL.....
conflicting reports of shots fired, but it sounds like a dumb ass just crashed through the sears doors and made his way out of sears and into the mall.
 

Legacy

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What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S. (Pew)

The recent mass shootings in El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio – along with a spate of shootings in Chicago – have brought renewed attention to deadly gun violence in the United States. As President Donald Trump and lawmakers on Capitol Hill contemplate policy responses, here are 10 common questions about gun deaths in the U.S., with answers based on data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the FBI and other sources. You can also explore key public opinion findings about gun violence and gun policy in the U.S. by reading our recent roundup.
 
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