8-4

[NDOM]

Sometimes your posts just ooze ignorance. We have a win this season over a ~#10 Michigan State team that could be the Big Ten champion this time next week.

Michigan State is overrated and will get used by Wisconsin.

Oh and Michigan State won that game for us by turning the ball over 4 times and doing 3 fake field goals and a fake punt.

 

[NDOM]

ive seen improvement across the program, were headin in the right direction, i think the bcs is a real goal for next years team

Ummmmmm. NO! Dude? Have you SEEN the schedule? LOL will be another year like this year.

 

[NDOM]

Sometimes I don't think people understand what's required to build a program...

We have been building this program since 1996 when Lou Holtz was ran out of town. Shouldn't take over 16 years.

 

[phork]

Threads like this is why i am sick of this board.

Feel free to leave then.

I think its funny that every year guys like NDOM point stuff out and get tagged as negative. We are all fans here. But not all of us look through the green colored glasses or chug the kool-aid. Do not rip those of us who see things for what they are.

I predicted 10-2 and a BCS game this year. Everything was falling in to place. Year 2 in the Kellyland. The defense was starting to gel and the offense seemed to be getting it on track. That changed after the USF game.

Now you can sit here and say that we should be 10-2, shoulda beat USF, shoulda beat UM. "If bounces go our way!" is the cry. 15-12 vs Pitt, 16-14 BC, 7pt win vs Wake. We are just as close to 5-7 as we are 10-2. We have 2 wins against teams with winning records.

 

[NDOM]

Feel free to leave then.

I think its funny that every year guys like NDOM point stuff out and get tagged as negative. We are all fans here. But not all of us look through the green colored glasses or chug the kool-aid. Do not rip those of us who see things for what they are.

I predicted 10-2 and a BCS game this year. Everything was falling in to place. Year 2 in the Kellyland. The defense was starting to gel and the offense seemed to be getting it on track. That changed after the USF game.

Now you can sit here and say that we should be 10-2, shoulda beat USF, shoulda beat UM. "If bounces go our way!" is the cry. 15-12 vs Pitt, 16-14 BC, 7pt win vs Wake. We are just as close to 5-7 as we are 10-2. We have 2 wins against teams with winning records.

What Phork said!!! Agree with you 110% bro.

 

[Irish2155]

I don't quite understand where the optimism is? What is good about an 8 -4 mediocre team? Very well will be 8 - 5, as last year. And it is more than just this year, growing up as a die hard ND fan is just freaking horrible. I live on this board, but don't post much...but have to get this out. ND is average (which yes, is an improvement)...anything more is getting your hopes up for failure. That is just the way it is.

 

[Irish2155]

I'm always proud to be an ND fan, never wear anything else but ND. Make a trip atleast once a year from Indy to see the campus...always stopping by the book store to get my new hat. But being mediochre at best since '94 really sucks. Everyone around here knows I'm die hard Irish, and I'm sick of everyone talking sh-t. Michigan is 10 and fu--ing 2...going to a BCS. That is too much to ask as an ND fan...just sets your self up for disappointment. It will be the same thing next year, and the year after, etc...game 1, expecations...just to go 8 -4, 9 - 4 at best. Sorry to vent, but it is just a fact...we are and will be average at best...since '94 we've been lucky to be average. just makes me sick

 

[IrishLax]

Feel free to leave then.

I think its funny that every year guys like NDOM point stuff out and get tagged as negative. We are all fans here. But not all of us look through the green colored glasses or chug the kool-aid. Do not rip those of us who see things for what they are.

This is total BS. I'm sorry, but I was someone who predicted 8 wins with Tommy Rees... so I'm not defending the 11-1 crowd. But there is a big difference between objectively considering the strengths/weaknesses of the team and doing what NDOM does occasionally, which is posting the same tired diatribe after every loss and disappearing when he's completely wrong and ND wins. It just flat out annoys some people.

Now you can sit here and say that we should be 10-2, shoulda beat USF, shoulda beat UM. "If bounces go our way!" is the cry. 15-12 vs Pitt, 16-14 BC, 7pt win vs Wake. We are just as close to 5-7 as we are 10-2. We have 2 wins against teams with winning records.

There is a HUGE difference between having a lead with :23 seconds to play over Michigan and they have to go 80 yards and losing... a game where we also had many opportunities to close out the game but had some truly crazy bounces.... and a 16-14 win over BC where we were up 16-7 with under 2 minutes to play and dominated every statistical category for the whole game. If you can't see that, well.....

 

[cLaRk_JoNeS]

theres a lot of negative things to say.

There is however 1 thing that MUST be done the second the team walks off the Bowl game field. FIRE THE SPECIAL TEAMS COACH. Hire someone that will atleast say hey you see that guy infront of you, go ahead and atleast TRY TO BLOCK HIM.

 

[irishff1014]

For everyone that thought Wake Forest was good they Got smoked by a average Vandy team.

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

8 - 4 makes me want to puke. 8 - 5 in the 2nd season makes me grossly want to puke. 8-4 at this point is not progress...just yuck.

Interesting point of view. 2 and 3 years ago we struggled to play .500 football with one of, if not the most talented QB in the history of ND football from a skill standpoint. Now we are 8-5 and 8-4 in back to back seasons with no QB and people dont see improvement across the board with the team? If not, how have we managed to win more games with a less than mediocre player playing the most important position on the field? We completely outclassed USF but lost because of TO's, we completely outclassed UM for 3 quarters. This football team could easily be 10-2 right now. I get it that we could just as easily be 7-5, but the point is we won games this year we would have lost in years past, and as soon as we get a quality QB behind center, the improvement that has taken place at every other position on the field will be much more evident. Our OL was abused last night, but other than that they have been awesome for almost 2 full years. Our DL is decimated by injuries, yet the talent and development of young guys under coach kelly and crew puts them in a position to still compete last night with one of the best and most physical offenses in college football this year. Every position on this football team minus QB and punt returns have improved greatly under coach kelly. There is no way anybody can argue otherwise if they have watched ND football over the past 15 years.

 

[IrishLax]

For everyone that thought Wake Forest was good they Got smoked by a average Vandy team.

How many times doe we have to go through this? One game does not make a team.

You could easily say: For everyone that thought USC was good they got smoked by an Arizona State team with a losing record. But really they're 10-2 and ranked ~#9.

or

For everyone that thought Oklahoma State was good they got beat by an awful Iowa State team with a losing record. But really they're #3 in the BCS.

 

[JoeyGetherall]

Message boards allow endless speculation and we're good at I think LOL

We're 8-4, a little disappointing but how many teams fumble on the goal line and have them returned for touchdowns?! We were a little snake bit....

I'm actually encouraged for next year. Maybe a pretty tough schedule next year but we're better than last year. Yea the record is the same as last year to this point, but last year we beat a SC team without Barkley and we were lucky to do so. We beat a Miami team in transition that clearly was not prepared. We were a little lucky last year, that record could have been 7-6 or 6-7 very easily.

Last night gave a glimpse of the future with Hendrix and probably Golson. Kelly had to to win this year and Rees gave us the best chance. You have to remember Hendrix ran the scout team last year so his knowledge of the offense was limited, of course Golson had no experience. Starting either of those guys at the first of the year is a good way to lose games which can get you fired pretty quick. I can't criticize Kelly for his decisions on QB, he's the coach and it's his job to make the decision.

Last night's circumstances (Tommy's injury and being behind 21 points) let Kelly take the chance on Hendrix with nothing to lose. He did pretty well, at least we can see daylight with his mobility and arm strength.

Keep going forward, get the recruits in that have committed (really important) add some offensive guys, I like where we're headed. Kelly has built a good base and I bet no one is more disappointed with 8-4 than Kelly.

IMHO

EDIT: As bad as we looked last night we only lost to the #4 team by 14 on their "crappy" home field. Held them to their lowest point total of the year.

Thank you, thank you, thank you for saying this. I don't understand why this isn't common knowledge for all.

 

[domerfreak]

The biggest thing that i see and no one is talking about is consistency not by leaps and bounds, but none the less consistency. A win over a top 25 team in back to back seasons and if we win the bowl game back to back bowl wins. Pretty sure the Holtz era was the last time that happened. None the less may not be the improvement fans want,but it is improvement.

 

[IrishLax]

The other thing people should note about our 8-4 season is that we played 4 top 15 teams. I don't know who, besides LSU, played anywhere near that many.

Look at Virginia Tech who is 11-1... thanks to playing not a single ranked team this whole year except Clemson... who they lost to. Virginia Tech played no teams ranked in the top 20 this whole season and warmed up with Arkansas State, East Carolina, Appalachian State, and Marshall before their joke of an ACC schedule.

The answer is, quite simply, to join a conference and watch the wins pile up. Same concept applies for many teams, like Michigan, who played a joke of a schedule this year. Or Florida State who is ranked #25 in the AP poll despite finishing with the same record we have and playing two ranked teams (Oklahoma and Clemson) losing to both of them.. as well as Wake Forest and UVa... but their conference voters still pump them up.

Our schedule wasn't "hard" this year because we played a lot of teams on down years. But it still hurts us immeasurably playing so many teams that we are even with in talent. You really can't expect to go more than 2-2 in those cases and this year we went 1-3 thanks to immeasurable amounts of crazy in the Michigan game. It's the same tired song, but we need to water down the schedule and join a conference if we ever want a realistic shot at a record that will meet "expectations" of this fan base. And we should do so quickly while we still have leverage with the ACC.

 

[Irish2155]

yada, yada, yada...the fact is we are 8-4, we are mediocre and based on experience don't see that changing soon. Would of, should of, could of...blah, blah. ND is average...8-4 soon to be 8-5 is average...again.

 

[Irish2155]

I hear everyone's case for "improvment"...blah, I've head them for 15 years now. It is what it is...and it sucks

 

[philipm31]

Sometimes your posts just ooze ignorance. We have a win this season over a ~#10 Michigan State team that could be the Big Ten champion this time next week.

But has ND had a win over a Top Ten team at game time? No. Has ND had a SIGNATURE win (a la ND vs. FSU in 1993, MIA in 1988), a win that tells people that ND is officially back among the elite of CFB? No.

He is right. ND has been mediocre for longer than a decade, and for those fans who have been following the Irish for more than 30 years, that sh!t is getting old hat.

Also, the situation that Lou came into was MUCH MUCH worse than anything BK did. BK already had some talent on offense (e.g., Michael Floyd) and a few good defenders (Te'o, Blanton). Lou did had a nearly empty cupboard (or a bunch of players like Tim Brown being vastly underused or out of position), but he came in and changed the attitude and culture of the team inside of two years. Sure, ND was 13-10 after two years, but everyone knew that ND was turning the corner, and the next five years proved it, as ND was in the Top 5 every year from 1988-1993, and the Top 25 every year for nearly a decade.

Kelly and the Irish had their chances but have made a lot of mental mistakes and stupid plays in the biggest games of the season that Lou's teams did not make. In fact, even the teams under Davie played well enough to win a few big games here and there, or at least showed up to play in big games (like NEB in 2000, MICH in 1998, their 8-game win streak to get them into the first ND BCS bowl game), and Ty's first year ND won on the road at FSU, beat MICH at ND, MSU at MSU and was ranked as high as #3 first year after Davie left. And Weis took us to two BCS bowl games. ND has had some success under every coach,since Lou, but nothing consistent and no real great wins since ND beat a#1 FSU at ND.

The drought has been long and maddening for every ND fan. If you feel like his post is garbage, fine, but don't tell me that BK is facing a more uphill battle than Holtz was, because he isn't. Lou had the team trending the right direction in ONE year. Kelly's team is stagnant, but I hope that changes with the insertion of Hendrix as the starting QB.

Tommy Rees should never play for ND ever again, if Kelly wants to really start winning games and get ND back among the elite, as he says he does.

 

[IrishLax]

But has ND had a win over a Top Ten team at game time? No. Has ND had a SIGNATURE win (a la ND vs. FSU in 1993, MIA in 1988), a win that tells people that ND is officially back among the elite of CFB? No.

Well they were #15 at the time so... yeah... no they weren't the #1 team... but come on how many teams have a win like that?

Virginia Tech doesn't have one. Stanford Doesn't have one. Oklahoma State doesn't have one. Alabama has one over #6 (completely overrated... see Texas A&M game) Arkansas if you count that.

LSU is the ONLY team in the top 5 with a win over an "elite" team.

 

[PatsandBostonfan1975]

This is total BS. I'm sorry, but I was someone who predicted 8 wins with Tommy Rees... so I'm not defending the 11-1 crowd. But there is a big difference between objectively considering the strengths/weaknesses of the team and doing what NDOM does occasionally, which is posting the same tired diatribe after every loss and disappearing when he's completely wrong and ND wins. It just flat out annoys some people.



There is a HUGE difference between having a lead with :23 seconds to play over Michigan and they have to go 80 yards and losing... a game where we also had many opportunities to close out the game but had some truly crazy bounces.... and a 16-14 win over BC where we were up 16-7 with under 2 minutes to play and dominated every statistical category for the whole game. If you can't see that, well.....

Look your a great poster and no disrespect at all . There is no difference in a loss . It's a loss I agree alot of with alot of what you said but that is a excuse and when the fans finally stop making excuses for this team . They might actually start fielding a team that earns the mega millions that their fans allow them to make .

 

[irishff1014]

Well they were #15 at the time so... yeah... no they weren't the #1 team... but come on how many teams have a win like that?

Virginia Tech doesn't have one. Stanford Doesn't have one. Oklahoma State doesn't have one. Alabama has one over #6 (completely overrated... see Texas A&M game) Arkansas if you count that.

LSU is the ONLY team in the top 5 with a win over an "elite" team.

LSU does have a win but that wins was given to them by the teerible kicker by bama

 

[IrishLax]

Look your a great poster and no disrespect at all . There is no difference in a loss . It's a loss I agree alot of with alot of what you said but that is a excuse and when the fans finally stop making excuses for this team . They might actually start fielding a team that earns the mega millions that their fans allow them to make .

Not trying to make excuses. Trying to say it's ridiculous to say we "could be" 5-7 and "could have" or "should have" lost to Boston College. I do understand people who say we "could have" beaten Michigan because you have a 99% chance of winning that game with 23 seconds left.

Personally, I agree with your train of thought. We earned 8-4. Rarely does a team win every game that they "should" (USF for us, Iowa State for Oklahoma State, Texas Tech for Oklahoma, etc.) and then we were outmatched in our games against top 10 competition (USC/Stanford) and split our evenly matched games (Michigan/Michigan State).

The bottom line is this team was exactly what it was projected to be with Tommy Rees at the helm... good enough to beat a lot of teams with defense/running game and too vanilla/turnover prone to regularly beat teams with athleticism or a potent offense.

 

[OCIrish]

Are we better off than we were? Yes, very much so. Are we as good as we should be? Hell no. That being said, where we go from here depends of the kind of HC Brian Kelly really is. No way should we be 8-4 right now. The losses were just bad, while some of the wins lackluster. They had one really good all season long (Sparty), while losing to teams they had no business losing to. The bowl game should give us more indication as to what we have to look forward to.

 

[The Polish Irishman]

I hear everyone's case for "improvment"...blah, I've head them for 15 years now. It is what it is...and it sucks

Great Post.

 

[Who'saWildManNow]

I hear everyone's case for "improvment"...blah, I've head them for 15 years now. It is what it is...and it sucks

Well, enjoy wallowing in discontent. I'd rather conjure up hope and reason for a better following year than spew negativity and hand out so-called reality checks.

There are absolute reasons to be excited for the future of ND Football.

 

[NDdomer2]

Last years regular season: 7-5. This years regular season: 8-4. I don't know th the exact definition of improvement, but, think that qualifies.

 

[BeauBenken]

Great Post.

Great post.

 

[skehiaian]

Excited

Excited

I for one am very excited about our improvement. We would be 10 and 2 if we had effective quarterback play all year long. Andrew Hendrix has much more potential than our first two quarterbacks, and I am excited to see him start in the bowl game. I have 100% faith in our coaching staff, and I for one believe we can have a stellar year next year. Our defense played much better with Hendrix in the game, and Brian Kelly will be able to play a true spread offense with Hendrix in the game.

 

[4irishnation]

Excited
I for one am very excited about our improvement. We would be 10 and 2 if we had effective quarterback play all year long. Andrew Hendrix has much more potential than our first two quarterbacks, and I am excited to see him start in the bowl game. I have 100% faith in our coaching staff, and I for one believe we can have a stellar year next year. Our defense played much better with Hendrix in the game, and Brian Kelly will be able to play a true spread offense with Hendrix in the game.

Apparently we can't have hope around here anymore because there are closet USC and Michigan fans on this site who believe that we should not be thinking positive thoughts and we should all just curl up in a ball and suck on our thumbs. I for one completely agree with you and wish all the negativity would go over to the NDNation forum where they belong!!!!!

 

[HereComeTheIrish]

Great Post.

Great post.

From one great post to yours...Great post.