'21 MI OL Rocco Spindler (Notre Dame Early Enrollee)

Luckylucci

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I have some strong reservations about that statement. I agree with a lot of what you’ve been saying, but to say the staff was cavalier?

The definition of cavalier is, showing a lack of proper concern.

I believe playing your RT at RG, not playing your LG (at LG) at all, and bringing in a brand new RG was showing lack of proper concern, in the Spring, for how they'd all compete and play together and/or at those positions.

Seems very appropriate to me.
 

Luckylucci

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Now that is showing itself in a full blown rotation the likes we haven't seen, in how long? When was the last time we planned to play 4-5 OG's in one game, because we had too?

And, that doesn't even address how terrible Josh Lugg is at RT. The concern level with the OL right now is as high as we've seen in a long time. And, there is no way, any reasonable person could say they were operating with this level of concern in the Spring or even as recently as 1 month ago. It's pretty much the definition of cavalier.
 

Irish#1

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The definition of cavalier is, showing a lack of proper concern.

I believe playing your RT at RG, not playing your LG (at LG) at all, and bringing in a brand new RG was showing lack of proper concern, in the Spring, for how they'd all compete and play together and/or at those positions.

Seems very appropriate to me.

Thanks for the English lesson, but it wasn't necessary. I'm always puzzled when statements like that are made and you've not been in the coaches meetings to know what they are thinking or saying. Why is Kelly talking about rotations if he has a lack of concern?
 

Luckylucci

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Thanks for the English lesson, but it wasn't necessary. I'm always puzzled when statements like that are made and you've not been in the coaches meetings to know what they are thinking or saying. Why is Kelly talking about rotations if he has a lack of concern?

You've now quoted 2 posts where I talk about them being cavalier with the OL during Spring and Fall Camp. As in, past tense. Are you intentionally ignoring that for some reason?

The bolded or what they are doing now, just further enforces that they miscalculated the situation and weren't concerned enough when they should've been.

I stand by what I said and find it very appropriate.
 

Irish#1

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Not ignoring it at all. How do you know they were being cavalier? From what I read, they were taking a hard look at everyone and they were moving people around to see what worked best. I don't see how that is cavalier. Like I said I'm always puzzled when statements like that are made and the person making the statement hasn't been in the coaches meetings to know what they are thinking or saying. You don't run a FB program like ND's with a cavalier attitude. Now if they're in this predicament because of Quinn's inability to judge and recognize the shortcomings of players, that's different. That's not being cavalier, that's lacking the necessary qualities to coach and evaluate.
 

IRISHMAN

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i was surprised to see kahanu kia name on that list of players who maybe seeing playing time in the 2nd half of the season. if gabe rubio wasn't injured early on i think he would have already seen the field and i'd be very curious to see what philip riley can do. also a little surprised not to see ryan barnes name on that list.
 

FightingIrishLover7

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Already buried in the spring practice thread, but thought I'd update here to scare people...

Per Tyler Horka (on3) Rocco started with the 1s today over Kristofic.

Thought maybe this would settle the minds of those who seemed concerned about his development...
 

Dale

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It seems odd the other sites wouldn’t have noticed that, and they didn’t present anything they watched as a viewing of the “1s” in that manner. Wondering what O’Malley and others think of that reporting once they are inevitably asked. Can’t speak for what ISD saw.
 

stpeteirish

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It seems odd the other sites wouldn’t have noticed that, and they didn’t present anything they watched as a viewing of the “1s” in that manner. Wondering what O’Malley and others think of that reporting once they are inevitably asked. Can’t speak for what ISD saw.
Maybe Tyler hung around a little longer than he was supposed to. Or peeked from behind a statue of Rockne
 

rtrn2glory

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It seems odd the other sites wouldn’t have noticed that, and they didn’t present anything they watched as a viewing of the “1s” in that manner. Wondering what O’Malley and others think of that reporting once they are inevitably asked. Can’t speak for what ISD saw.

He was still running with the 2's on Saturday. Maybe the film from the weekend moved him into the top group?
 

IrishLion

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It could also be a case of mistaken unit identity... the 247 practice report mentioned that the one live scrimmage rep they saw was a mish-mash of players on both lines.
 

IRISHMAN

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last season i kept reading about how impressive spindler was at OG and that he could push for playing time. i was really hoping that spindler could take control of the LG spot in order to keep patterson at center. has anyone heard anything about how spindler has looked this year. since HH moved patterson to OG to put the 5 best OL on the field at the same time that probably answers my question.
 

CanadalovesND

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last season i kept reading about how impressive spindler was at OG and that he could push for playing time. i was really hoping that spindler could take control of the LG spot in order to keep patterson at center. has anyone heard anything about how spindler has looked this year. since HH moved patterson to OG to put the 5 best OL on the field at the same time that probably answers my question.

He's part of the two deep this week, so he may see some game action this week if we have a comfortable lead.
 

Domina Nostra

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last season i kept reading about how impressive spindler was at OG and that he could push for playing time. i was really hoping that spindler could take control of the LG spot in order to keep patterson at center. has anyone heard anything about how spindler has looked this year. since HH moved patterson to OG to put the 5 best OL on the field at the same time that probably answers my question.

It doesn't necessarily answer your question. Coach's often value a known quantity over an unknown quantity. Lugg is a 6th year and they seem to overvalue his experience. He must be a great kid and a hard worker.
 

jprue24

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If the staff thought Spindler was one of the best 5 he would be playing. They don't think he is....so he isn't
 

Crazy Balki

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If the staff thought Spindler was one of the best 5 he would be playing. They don't think he is....so he isn't
The problem is that they only know this from practice and in practice, it's unlikely they legitimately gave Rocco the opportunity to get action with the ones.

As we've seen before, the staff often over-values experience and in doing so, the better talent sits on the bench. Look at last year as a perfect example. Joe Alt was the best lineman for us last week. A year ago, he was sitting behind Fisher, Baker and Carmody at LT. We probably wouldn't know how good Alt was if those injuries didn't happen.

Look back to 2014, when Christian Lombard was our starting RT and Mike McGlinchey was sitting on the bench. I'm sure they thought Lombard was one of the best 5 and if Glinch really was, he'd be playing. As we know, the coaches mis-evaluated who were the best 5 and we saw later in the year that McGlinchey should've been playing over Lombard and was CLEARLY one of the best 5.

The coaches have been wrong before and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they're wrong here. Lugg may have experience, but his experience doesn't mean anything when he can't physically play the position he's at at a high enough level.
 

irishff1014

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From reading different things about HH this is on of his downfalls. He selects experience over actual talent.
 

IRISHDODGER

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From reading different things about HH this is on of his downfalls. He selects experience over actual talent.
I heard the same thing but then heard the II guys say that Spindler just isn’t “ready” to be a starter & use Eichenberg & Chris Watt as examples of OL that didn’t start until their 3rd year. And this coming from Spindler fans as Prister notes he had Rocco rated the top recruit of his respective class & O’Malley had him rated 2nd best.
 

Dale

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We’d never expect Spindler to already be a starter if he wasn’t classmates with Fisher
 

dad4aa

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We’d never expect Spindler to already be a starter if he wasn’t classmates with Fisher
Mine is more of a hope than expect. Mostly because Correll and Lugg looked so bad last week. Maybe it was an anomaly and they will be fine moving forward. I just don’t want to see the Swiss cheese line we had against OSU when we play Clemson.
 

jprue24

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The problem is that they only know this from practice and in practice, it's unlikely they legitimately gave Rocco the opportunity to get action with the ones.

As we've seen before, the staff often over-values experience and in doing so, the better talent sits on the bench. Look at last year as a perfect example. Joe Alt was the best lineman for us last week. A year ago, he was sitting behind Fisher, Baker and Carmody at LT. We probably wouldn't know how good Alt was if those injuries didn't happen.

Look back to 2014, when Christian Lombard was our starting RT and Mike McGlinchey was sitting on the bench. I'm sure they thought Lombard was one of the best 5 and if Glinch really was, he'd be playing. As we know, the coaches mis-evaluated who were the best 5 and we saw later in the year that McGlinchey should've been playing over Lombard and was CLEARLY one of the best 5.

The coaches have been wrong before and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they're wrong here. Lugg may have experience, but his experience doesn't mean anything when he can't physically play the position he's at at a high enough level.
I hear you and don't disagree with really anything. Fisher starts with what? 6 quarter of cfb experience? I know it's not exactly apples to apples, but Fisher starts over Lugg with no cfball experience and Spindler doesn't after a full year in the program.

I still stick by what I said even if the evaluation by the staff may be flawed.
 

Crazy Balki

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And the fact that some experts were billing him as the next Q.

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On the flip side, we didn't have a Josh Lugg on roster when Q was a sophomore.

The only upperclassmen guard prospects ND had at the time were Colin McGovern and Hunter Bivin, both of which barely played at all prior to 2015. Both were essentially garbage time reservists and nothing more.
 

ulukinatme

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Big Fish is a freak. Most freshmen don't beat out upperclassmen on the OL unless there's a talent deficiency and/or they're really exceptional. I'd expect Rocco sees more time soon or should be a starter by next year.
 

irishandy

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Wasn't McGlinchey on the 2 year wait plan? I think that worked out well for him.

If this is the route that Spindler is going, I think he will take the same road as McGlinchey.
 
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