2023 Starting QB Discussion

[Irishdrunk]

Does having Hartman start deny TB needed reps for 2024?

Or if the belief that Hartman is best for 2023 the winning this year matters most and who knows what will happen next year anyways?

 

[BobbyMac]

Winning now always matters most in P5 football. This isn't MLB where a full teardown and rebuild is fun to watch... and acceptable.

Plus, MF didn't take over a Weis-like roster. He took over a Top 6 program over the prior 4 seasons. He needs to win now.

 

[BobbyMac]

As far as TB not getting reps... that's what practice and blowouts are for.

 

[Irishdrunk]

Interesting FWIW saw a podcast singer Hyde and Goolsby debating this.

I think w Transfer Portal here that makes all future QBs uncertain so play the best QBs each season.

 

[irishff1014]

Like Bmac said It's win now. And right now i believe Hartman gives us the better opportunity at that. I doubt Steve or Kenny will be better than Tyler next year. So he will have his time to shine. Hopefully we will have some games that Tyler gets to play most of the second half.

 

[KPENN]

You take the ACC’s all-time passing TD leader, 2nd in pass yards and figure out the rest later.

 

[Luckylucci]

I can appreciate the debate but I don’t think it’s much of a discussion really. While TB has been fun to watch at times. He’s not even remotely close to the QB Hartman is right now. He might be someday but he isn’t right now. Recruit the best roster you can for 2024 behind Hartman.

 

[Irishdrunk]

I can appreciate the debate but I don’t think it’s much of a discussion really. While TB has been fun to watch at times. He’s not even remotely close to the QB Hartman is right now. He might be someday but he isn’t right now. Recruit the best roster you can for 2024 behind Hartman.

Agreed but w loose transfers 2024 QB room might be in flux. TB could leave and WR room is not mature in 2023 so argument is give Buchner meaningful time in 2023 so 2924 can be legit run at expanded playoffs in 2024. Too many roster holes in 2923 that will be stronger in 2024.

 

[CANONIZEFATHERSORIN]

Goolsby's opinion that we should use 2023 to "prepare" TB for 2024 is beyond idiotic. He knows more about football than I do, of course, but given the nature of the game and injuries you always have to be "win now." What do we do if we go 8-4 this year behind mediocre yet improving QB play from Buchner, get all hyped up for 2024, then Buchner tears his ACL in the second drive of the 2024 season? How stupid we would look...

 

[irishog77]

If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.

As Lucky said, sure, I guess there's a philosophical discussion to be had about what is best in the here and now for a program versus what is best for in the future. But there's no actual serious discussion to be had about wether or not to play the better QB now, versus getting a guy, who may one day be good, playing time.

TB may suck in '24, TB may get in a car crash that ruins his career, Minchey or Carr may be better options in '24, MF may suck and get fired this year, ACamp's testicles may finally drop in '24, RackEm's old lady may finally drop that extra 300lbs she's been threatening to lose in '24, and the list of hypotheticals goes on and on and on.

Guys like skip bayless, who have a 3 hour void of time to fill every day, engage in these types of discussions. People who have shit to do realize that 100 times out of 100, playing the best QB in '23 is the best route to take.

 

[Irishdrunk]

Goolsby's opinion that we should use 2023 to "prepare" TB for 2024 is beyond idiotic. He knows more about football than I do, of course, but given the nature of the game and injuries you always have to be "win now." What do we do if we go 8-4 this year behind mediocre yet improving QB play from Buchner, get all hyped up for 2024, then Buchner tears his ACL in the second drive of the 2024 season? How stupid we would look...

Understood and agreed. Worth discussing thats all.

 

[irishandy]

This is easy, you win now with Hartman and it's a win/win situation for both ND and Hartman.

For ND and the future, TB needs another year with a similar role he had in 2021. I was a huge fan of Coan and Hartman will be a better Coan. I think this also benefits our WR's. TB's time will come.

For Hartman this helps his NFL future.

 

[T-Boone]

Hartman is Startman.

 

[BobbyMac]

I'll take Hartman, Alt & Fisher in '23 vs TB and I have no idea in '24.

 

[arrowryan]

I'll take Hartman, Alt & Fisher in '23 vs TB and I have no idea in '24.

I would think Fisher needs another year of college ball. Not sure he leaves early.

 

[BobbyMac]

I would think Fisher needs another year of college ball. Not sure he's physically talented enough to

I don't disagree with that take but he's physically talented enough to make the decision to do it.

 

[IAIrish]

Starting QB isn't a debate for me, but whether or not TB should have a package in '23.
I personally think an rpo based TB package adds some diversity to the offensive attack and forces opposing defenses to prepare for qb runs out of rpo looks.
Added benefit that it gets TB more experience and backs up that need to feel wanted that most qbs need. And it takes some hits off Hartman.

 

[irishog77]

I don't disagree with that take but he's physically talented enough to make the decision to do it.

Agreed. And he’ll also have 25-30 starts under his belt, and have started every possible game he was available for in his entire career.

I’m thinking having Fisher in ‘24 is entirely a 50-50 proposition.

 

[stlnd01]

Starting QB isn't a debate for me, but whether or not TB should have a package in '23.
I personally think an rpo based TB package adds some diversity to the offensive attack and forces opposing defenses to prepare for qb runs out of rpo looks.
Added benefit that it gets TB more experience and backs up that need to feel wanted that most qbs need. And it takes some hits off Hartman.

This is where I’m at. Of course Hartman starts and gets the bulk of the reps but a package approach for TB would likely be good both for our offense and for his development.

 

[NDFAN420]

All analogies break down at some point, but I think a Drew Brees/Taysom Hill thing would keep defenses on their back heels.

 

[arrowryan]

All analogies break down at some point, but I think a Drew Brees/Taysom Hill thing would keep defenses on their back heels.

Lining up Tyler Buchner at tight end. Hell yeah.

 

[Irishdrunk]

Lining up Tyler Buchner at tight end. Hell yeah.

Oh and TB isn’t injury prone….

 

[NDFAN420]

Lining up Tyler Buchner at tight end. Hell yeah.

Is that what they did with Hill? Oh man, I thought they brought him in as a running threat who could also pass.
Completely forgot about that.

 

[NDFAN2008]

Hartman is starter but they should have some packages with Buchner. 2024 Minchey and TB will be a good QB battle

 

[Jimmy3Putt]

TB should have a planned series or two every game and should be in the game if we’re up 20+ points halfway through the fourth.

 

[GoIrish41]

If we get to two losses in 23 it should be Buchner starting for the rest of the season.

 

[IrishLion]

If Rees were still around, there *might* be (but still not really) a debate about giving TB a shot, because the offense Rees called in the bowl game was dope, and it wouldn’t be crazy to extrapolate that over an entire season, as long as you have a better WR group, and get ~60% or greater completion percentage from TB all year… but that’s a lot of “ifs”

Parker walks into an OC job with a guy that has 4 years of experience playing QB, three of them at a pretty high level. It’s a no-brainer now. You just hope Hartman plays well enough to get TB plenty of garbage time reps, and that MFMF uses garbage time better than BK did.

 

[Blazers46]

If TB is starting over a healthy Hartman than TB will be a Heisman front runner. Hartman is very good.

 

[forkbeard3777]

Does having Hartman start deny TB needed reps for 2024?

Or if the belief that Hartman is best for 2023 the winning this year matters most and who knows what will happen next year anyways?

Hartman is a shoo-in. He didn’t come to Notre Dame to sit the bench, and if he can’t beat out Buchner, then that’s a testament to just how piss-poor ACC play is, collectively.

You go with Hartman. Simple. It’s just unfortunate that given the tremendous talent on the line - predominately Alt and Fisher - that they couldn’t provide him with an elite offensive coordinator.

ETA: How many years does Hartman have at ND? Does have have one or two years of eligibility? Is he a one and done?

 

[NorthDakota]

This is easy, you win now with Hartman and it's a win/win situation for both ND and Hartman.

For ND and the future, TB needs another year with a similar role he had in 2021. I was a huge fan of Coan and Hartman will be a better Coan. I think this also benefits our WR's. TB's time will come.

For Hartman this helps his NFL future.

TB needs another year of not playing? He's had plenty of that in his life already.

I hope he stays but wouldn't be shocked or mad at him if he leaves.