2020 Presidential Horse Race

[NorthDakota]

It was a noble idea when it was put in place. Make education available to anyone to better your life. Alas, the politicians who passed the law didn't look deep enough into the possible consequences and here we are.

Students loans will continue, but it needs revamped. Maybe students grades need to be reported back to the lender and if they get a grade below a certain level they are cut off. Or if they drop out and want to return to school they have to pay their own way until they have the grades to qualify.

I also like the idea of free education. We already have 17 states that pay. In Indiana, the student has to maintain a 2.5 GPA and have earned a 21st Century Scholars HS diploma.

That'd just cause massive grade inflation beyond what already occurs, particularly at "elite" schools. Not many professors want to be the reason a kid can't get loans to pay for school.

There'd also almost certainly be a big discussion about how grades inherently favor white kids or some nonsense.

 

[Wild Bill]

Schools underwrite the loans that become forgivable in bankruptcy - problem solved. Piles of loans available for STEM, pay your own way to study obscure, unmarketable garbage.

The beauty of Irish#1's idea of cutting off the underachiever is they are less marketable in the workplace and less likely to be able to pay off the loan. Creates quite the trap for the student with no risk to the college. Many probably weren't college material and got bad advice to even go that route in the first place. Now they hold the bag on an expensive half education? No - college eats the cost. Then they do a better job of screening out kids that don't belong or more likely to drop out. Or they provide better guidance for matching the kids' aptitude/ability to a marketable educational solution.

Also think more moderate reforms could be done to look at interest versus principle paid on loans. Say the principle gets paid first and interest is forgivable for example. The compounding can get pretty devastating.

This is especially true for people repaying their loans on an income sensitive basis. It'll be about another decade or so until income sensitive borrowers start discharging the balance owed after completing the term required.

If their minimum repayment can't cover the interest only payment, and I'm willing to bet a huge portion of them do not, the amount of debt that will be forgiven will far exceed what they actually borrowed. Most of these people have no clue what will hit them once the debt is forgiven.

For example, I have three people I hired who have in excess of $250k in student loans. I know what they make so I can estimate their repayment to an extent, and it's not enough to cover the interest only repayment. Assuming they ride this out over 25 years, they're going to forgive a half a million or so. That won't be a fun 1099 to open.

 

[RDU Irish]

This is especially true for people repaying their loans on an income sensitive basis. It'll be about another decade or so until income sensitive borrowers start discharging the balance owed after completing the term required.

If their minimum repayment can't cover the interest only payment, and I'm willing to bet a huge portion of them do not, the amount of debt that will be forgiven will far exceed what they actually borrowed. Most of these people have no clue what will hit them once the debt is forgiven.

For example, I have three people I hired who have in excess of $250k in student loans. I know what they make so I can estimate their repayment to an extent, and it's not enough to cover the interest only repayment. Assuming they ride this out over 25 years, they're going to forgive a half a million or so. That won't be a fun 1099 to open.

Yeah - they are looking at $1500/month just for interest on those $250k student loans. How many would gladly trade for a 10% garnishment for 20 years or some other proportionate repayment plan that would eliminate the debt. Make more, pay more, make less pay less - college shares in the student's success (or lack thereof).

Interest only is not repayment - it is perpetual payment! Debtors prison! Extending the loan term has diminishing impact on payment due and deferring compounds the problem. In our hand to mouth nation, most people only care about monthly cash flow.

Excellent point on the tax impact of loan forgiveness. Now the IRS will be hounding you for payment instead of Sallie Mae.

 

[Irish#1]

That'd just cause massive grade inflation beyond what already occurs, particularly at "elite" schools. Not many professors want to be the reason a kid can't get loans to pay for school.

There'd also almost certainly be a big discussion about how grades inherently favor white kids or some nonsense.

The teacher has no business knowing the students financial status or financing.

 

[Irish#1]

Yeah - they are looking at $1500/month just for interest on those $250k student loans. How many would gladly trade for a 10% garnishment for 20 years or some other proportionate repayment plan that would eliminate the debt. Make more, pay more, make less pay less - college shares in the student's success (or lack thereof).

Interest only is not repayment - it is perpetual payment! Debtors prison! Extending the loan term has diminishing impact on payment due and deferring compounds the problem. In our hand to mouth nation, most people only care about monthly cash flow.

Excellent point on the tax impact of loan forgiveness. Now the IRS will be hounding you for payment instead of Sallie Mae.

Guess who Sallie Mae is going to contract out to, to do the collecting?

 

[NorthDakota]

The teacher has no business knowing the students financial status or financing.

Every student who was at risk of losing loans is definitely sending emails and visiting office hours.

Heck I got a teacher to bump my grade a letter by telling her my sister was flying in for my graduation.

 

[Legacy]

U.S. Senator Lamar Alexander (R-TN), the chairman of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee, advocated for automatic payroll deductions for student loan repayment similar to wage garnishments. With automatic deductions from a paycheck, borrowers could lower their risk of student loan default.

10.7% are already 90 days delinquent and $31 billion of the $1.6 Trillion in student loan debt is seriously delinquent. It takes 19.4 years, on average, to pay off student loans. By 2023, 40% of student loan borrowers may default on their student loans. 32% of borrowers with a balance of $5,000 or less defaulted at least once within four years compared with 15% of borrowers who owed more than $35,000.

He would have two plans consolidating the nine current student loan repayment plans :
The first plan would be the Standard 10-year Repayment Plan. Assuming a 10-year repayment term.The increase in the interest rates will increase the monthly loan payments by about 2.8% (For most borrowers that yields an increase of a few dollars a month.)

The second would be the Revised Pay As You Earn (REPAYE) plan. Under REPAYE, student loan payments are capped at 10% of discretionary income and student loan borrowers can receive student loan forgiveness after 20 years (for undergraduate student loan debt) or 25 years (for graduate school student loan debt).

This proposal only applies to federal student loans (93%), not private student loans (7%).

Questions:
- Would student loan borrowers still be eligible for student loan forgiveness under REPAYE?
- What about public service loan forgiveness?
- Would processing by the Dept of Eduction of student loan forgiveness after 20 or 25 years be efficient? The current Education Dept is dragging their heals despite a court order.
- What if a borrower runs into financial trouble or is unable to make regular student loan payments?
- What happens for those borrowers who lose their job? Especially if they are working at a qualifying public service job or are paying their loans off in their late 30s, 40s or older.
- What about freelancers who have more variable employment and income?

 

[NorthDakota]

Lmao how the fuck is Warren polling above 1%? She sounds like an idiot.

Klobuchar sounds about 10x better than any of these other candidates. Would I vote for her? Nah. But she is chill.

This Ryan dude from Ohio sounded okay during the his first question.

They've had to give beto additional time twice.

 

[Irish YJ]

Lmao how the fuck is Warren polling above 1%? She sounds like an idiot.

Klobuchar sounds about 10x better than any of these other candidates. Would I vote for her? Nah. But she is chill.

This Ryan dude from Ohio sounded okay during the his first question.

They've had to give beto additional time twice.

I'm passing on the "who's wokest" pageant.
US is playing in the Gold Cup. Go Merica!

 

[Irish YJ]

just flipped over during HT. audio blunders galore and they had to go to break....
oops

 

[NorthDakota]

Like 5 of them asked how to get judges confirmed by mitch mcconnell and all but one used their time to talk about guns like idiots....that's not the question

 

[Irish YJ]

Like 5 of them asked how to get judges confirmed by mitch mcconnell and all but one used their time to talk about guns like idiots....that's not the question

it's not about answering the questions. it's about repeating your platform even if off topic. and whenever possible, make the others look bad, and above all else, orange man bad.

so who is the wokest so far?
BTW, Merica looking slopping after a good early start.

 

[IrishLax]

The best person for Trump to run against is -- by far -- Elizabeth Warren. And she had a really good performance tonight catering to her far left base.

Biden and Sanders both probably beat Trump handily for different reason. "Pocahontas" playing stats + far left talking points is not going to work against Trump in the general. Saying she would completely ban private healthcare, would allow fully formed babies that can be delivered to be aborted, and would go hard after guns = pissing off 60%+ of America... that might actually go hold their nose and vote for Trump.

 

[NorthDakota]

The only legit one tonight I'd be comfortable with as POTUS...as in I wouldn't even really be more than mildly irritated she won...is Klobuchar. She might even get a couple things done if Cocaine Mitch is still kicking ass in his Palpatine role.

The Maryland guy seemed okay too but he has even less of a shot than klobuchar.

Warren can do fine amongst Dems but like Lax said...she's a complete disaster if you run on her ideas in a national race lmaooo

 

[Irish YJ]

The best person for Trump to run against is -- by far -- Elizabeth Warren. And she had a really good performance tonight catering to her far left base.

Biden and Sanders both probably beat Trump handily for different reason. "Pocahontas" playing stats + far left talking points is not going to work against Trump in the general. Saying she would completely ban private healthcare, would allow fully formed babies that can be delivered to be aborted, and would go hard after guns = pissing off 60%+ of America... that might actually go hold their nose and vote for Trump.

Honestly I might have voted for Berndog last election if he was the nomination, but couldn't do it now. His "genuineness" wore off the last couple months.

I think Biden is the only one that could beat Trump.

Watching some highlights now of the debate. Some of these folks come off as creepy, some weak as hell, but a lot of them just seem clueless. I'm not talking about policy/platform, talking about personality. Beto is just a strange dude that sets off my "strange" alert. Booker seems like he lives on a mix of coke and ecstasy. Warren is like the old lady that lived down my street growing up that nobody wanted to eat her cookies.

 

[NorthDakota]

If Klobuchar got the nomination she'd win 35 states.

 

[Irish YJ]

The only legit one tonight I'd be comfortable with as POTUS...as in I wouldn't even really be more than mildly irritated she won...is Klobuchar. She might even get a couple things done if Cocaine Mitch is still kicking ass in his Palpatine role.

I agree she seemed the best. I wouldn't want to put a fork in my eye, that is, if she were the prez.

 

[NorthDakota]

I agree she seemed the best. I wouldn't want to put a fork in my eye, that is, if she were the prez.

I'm interested in seeing how tomorrow goes. I wonder if there is any, dare I say, *collusion* amongst the candidates to go after Biden?

 

[Irish YJ]

I'm interested in seeing how tomorrow goes. I wonder if there is any, dare I say, *collusion* amongst the candidates to go after Biden?

it's going to be interesting. i can see softball shit, but i can also see folks putting a hundred knives in Biden.

like i said, i think this is the "Who's Wokest" pageant. Should be lit.

 

[Rogue219]

I saw Elizabeth Warren on stage standing with a bunch of people who think they are going to get Mitch McConnell to work with them. None of them want to fight for anything. Business as usual.

That'll be Joe Biden tonight. I'll spare you the suspense. "Hey, remember Obama? I was there."

That Delaney goof barely won his deep blue district in Maryland vs Dan Bongino and his takeaway from that experience is he can be President?

 

[Wild Bill]

I saw Elizabeth Warren on stage standing with a bunch of people who think they are going to get Mitch McConnell to work with them. None of them want to fight for anything. Business as usual.

That'll be Joe Biden tonight. I'll spare you the suspense. "Hey, remember Obama? I was there."

That Delaney goof barely won his deep blue district in Maryland vs Dan Bongino and his takeaway from that experience is he can be President?

IMO, Tulsi is attacked by the establishment of both sides and the media moreso than any other democrat and she's stood firm, for the most part.

The rest of these people are owned, and that may not be a bad thing for a committed leftist. If you want to change culture, let big business do it on your behalf. They have piles of money, communication outlets and they can do it completely unopposed b/c the American right simply refuses to regulate them.

 

[ACamp1900]

I couldn't stomach more than a couple seconds... had the GC, Locomotive on ESPN and Angels baseball... why suffer through a bunch of frauds pandering to who they feel are just useful idiots?

 

[Irish#1]

I couldn't stomach more than a couple seconds... had the GC, Locomotive on ESPN and Angels baseball... why suffer through a bunch of frauds pandering to who they feel are just useful idiots?

So what you're saying is you don't care about your country and its well being. I bet if these candidates had some recommendations on some good Mexican restaurants you'd be watching.

 

[Rogue219]

I bet if these candidates had some recommendations on some good Mexican restaurants you'd be watching.

Beto did, but he was speaking Spanish, so I couldn't make it out.

Mayor Pete is going to bust out some Norwegian tonight. Should be fun.

 

[ACamp1900]

So what you're saying is you don't care about your country and its well being.

If that's what you took from my statement then God Bless you....

 

[Wild Bill]

I couldn't stomach more than a couple seconds... had the GC, Locomotive on ESPN and Angels baseball... why suffer through a bunch of frauds pandering to who they feel are just useful idiots?

All the signs of civilizational decay were on gruesome display.

 

[Rogue219]

If that's what you took from my statement then God Bless you....

I think it's "thoughts and prayers".

 

[Rogue219]

All the signs of civilizational decay were on gruesome display.

You were watching Bravo

 

[Irish#1]

If that's what you took from my statement then God Bless you....

I guess I should have used italics.

 

[ACamp1900]

I guess I should have used italics.

Never joke about Mexican food first off... secondly,... how dare you joke about Mexican food.