2019 - State of the Recruiting Class thread

[Luckylucci]

That was rather breathless and hyperbolic. When did OFD start giving ND Nation types the keys to the blog?

Business must be booming

 

[NDdomer2]

Business must be booming

 

[longliveautrydenson]

ND lost it’s leading rushing and kicked two RBs off the team this offseason.
Our remaining upperclassmen RBs haven’t shown an ability to stay on the field.
We haven’t landed a mid-4* RB recruit since Autry Denson arrived.
A trusted beat reporter, Tim O’Malley, just called our RB unit pedestrian.
We just lost a RB recruit that we supposedly led for to Clemson.

To the eternal optimists on this board, when is an appropriate time to express concern with the state of the running back position at ND?

 

[Woneone]

ND lost it’s leading rushing and kicked two RBs off the team this offseason.
Our remaining upperclassmen RBs haven’t shown an ability to stay on the field.
We haven’t landed a mid-4* RB recruit since Autry Denson arrived.
A trusted beat reporter, Tim O’Malley, just called our RB unit pedestrian.
We just lost a RB recruit that we supposedly led for to Clemson.

To the eternal optimists on this board, when is an appropriate time to express concern with the state of the running back position at ND?

It’s ironic because many of these same people who are now stating it as pedestrian was raving about both Williams and Jones this time last year. If memory serves, there were undertones that they were so good they’d steal carries from Adams.

What we did last year was amazing, and the losses on the line hurts. But, I think some of that dominance can be a bit offset by having the actual threat of a passing game.

 

[NDRock]

ND lost it’s leading rushing and kicked two RBs off the team this offseason.
Our remaining upperclassmen RBs haven’t shown an ability to stay on the field.
We haven’t landed a mid-4* RB recruit since Autry Denson arrived.
A trusted beat reporter, Tim O’Malley, just called our RB unit pedestrian.
We just lost a RB recruit that we supposedly led for to Clemson.

To the eternal optimists on this board, when is an appropriate time to express concern with the state of the running back position at ND?

I would consider CJ Holmes to be a mid level 4* RB. Though the rest of your post has merit.

 

[FDNYIrish1]

Maybe the unit looks a little pedestrian because we’re trying to replace 2 first round picks and it’s April?

 

[stlnd01]

ND lost it’s leading rushing and kicked two RBs off the team this offseason.
Our remaining upperclassmen RBs haven’t shown an ability to stay on the field.
We haven’t landed a mid-4* RB recruit since Autry Denson arrived.
A trusted beat reporter, Tim O’Malley, just called our RB unit pedestrian.
We just lost a RB recruit that we supposedly led for to Clemson.

To the eternal optimists on this board, when is an appropriate time to express concern with the state of the running back position at ND?

Of course it's a concern. No doubt, we need to land a quality RB, probably two, this cycle. And ideally one of them can walk in and contribute in 2019. But I wouldn't freak over losing Chez Mellusi. There are other fish in the sea. (Also CJ Holmes. Reeling him back in would help a lot. Anything going on there?)

 

[longliveautrydenson]

I would consider CJ Holmes to be a mid level 4* RB. Though the rest of your post has merit.

That’s how I remembered Holmes’ recruitment, but he was in fact a 0.907 composite on 247. In other words, he was around 0.015 from being a 3*. Indeed, 247 had him as a 3* and around the 630th player in the class.

 

[Irishnuke]

I don't agree that the sky is falling but it's not crazy to say that RB and RB recruiting is an area of weakness.

 

[Luckylucci]

ND lost it’s leading rushing and kicked two RBs off the team this offseason.
Our remaining upperclassmen RBs haven’t shown an ability to stay on the field.
We haven’t landed a mid-4* RB recruit since Autry Denson arrived.
A trusted beat reporter, Tim O’Malley, just called our RB unit pedestrian.
We just lost a RB recruit that we supposedly led for to Clemson.

To the eternal optimists on this board, when is an appropriate time to express concern with the state of the running back position at ND?

Concern is valid, I have all sorts of concerns about next years team. That was just a gross effort at journalism, with that above article.

And these have not been well thought out concerns. They read like a fan who is freaking out. Makes it incredibly difficult to engage in a reasonable conversation. Like when you list 10 things that are bad about recruiting and fail to acknowledge even a single positive, when there are a lot of them. Or saying that we are getting our ass kicked in recruiting because prospects are visiting other schools. That is just completely irrational. Because that would mean every time a recruit visits us, we are kicking every schools ass that’s recruiting them. Doesn’t work that way or make even a lick of sense.

Similarly, who’s to say Jahmir Smith won’t be a good back. Because Rivals and 247 didn’t think so. Well it certainly wouldn’t be the first time they were terribly wrong. But there is zero acknowledgment of that. It’s piss poor understanding of the big picture or purposefully trying to create a narrative, by refusing to acknowledge the other side of things.

 

[longliveautrydenson]

Concern is valid, I have all sorts of concerns about next years team. That was just a gross effort at journalism, with that above article.

And these have not been well thought out concerns. They read like a fan who is freaking out. Makes it incredibly difficult to engage in a reasonable conversation. Like when you list 10 things that are bad about recruiting and fail to acknowledge even a single positive, when there are a lot of them. Or saying that we are getting our ass kicked in recruiting because prospects are visiting other schools. That is just completely irrational. Because that would mean every time a recruit visits us, we are kicking every schools ass that’s recruiting them. Doesn’t work that way or make even a lick of sense.

Similarly, who’s to say Jahmir Smith won’t be a good back. Because Rivals and 247 didn’t think so. Well it certainly wouldn’t be the first time they were terribly wrong. But there is zero acknowledgment of that. It’s piss poor understanding of the big picture or purposefully trying to create a narrative, by refusing to acknowledge the other side of things.

I am happy to acknowledge positives in recruiting. Jeff Quinn appears to be putting together a really strong OL class. DT is in good shape, especially if we can add a swing guy like Rodas Johnson. I'm also confident that Lea will be able to land 2-3 really solid LBs.

I am very concerned, however, that it looks like we're going back to the drawing board at WDE, SDE, QB, and potentially even RB. Those are arguably our biggest positions of need this cycle, and we've lost a commitment and big recruiting leads at each position.

You accuse me of trying to create a false narrative. I have no reason to do that. I am simply highlighting some troubling trends that have arisen in ND recruiting in the past two months (and some dating back for several years) that need to be reversed sooner rather than later.

 

[BobbyMac]

That’s how I remembered Holmes’ recruitment, but he was in fact a 0.907 composite on 247. In other words, he was around 0.015 from being a 3*. Indeed, 247 had him as a 3* and around the 630th player in the class.

.8900 is where 4* begins.

Rivals / Scout / ESPN all had Holmes as a 4*

 

[longliveautrydenson]

.8900 is where 4* begins.

Rivals / Scout / ESPN all had Holmes as a 4*

My point was Holmes was a low 4*. I consider 0.90 a low 4*.

 

[BobbyMac]

My point was Holmes was a low 4*. I consider 0.90 a low 4*.

A low 4 star Josh Adams camped at ND on June 20 and committed on June 30.

Say ND gets Kyren Williams, John Bivens and Kenan Christon (all comp 3 stars). Rate that haul from 1-10.

 

[NDIrish88]

I would rate that an 8. I'd take any of them

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

A low 4 star Josh Adams camped at ND on June 20 and committed on June 30.

Say ND gets Kyren Williams, John Bivens and Kenan Christon (all comp 3 stars). Rate that haul from 1-10.

8 if we signed all 3. Kyren Williams is a Theo Riddick clone with potentially more top end, John Bivens is a complete RB and Kenan Christon is a burner. We'd have a solid, high-potential class.

 

[Irish#1]

We also need to keep in mind if the kid is a good fit for the program. Kelly changed the way they evaluate. This takes into account a number of factors above FB skills, grades (do they have the grades to get in, will they stay on top of the academics?, etc.), personality, desire to elevate themselves, team player. The coaches have probably identified several more. I suspect when one or two red flags start showing up, they either back off or take a more cautious look and start looking at someone else.

The other thing to keep in mind is while we may lead for a player, there is always the chance they change their mind and it doesn't have anything to do with ND's efforts.

It's like looking for a car. You know what you want and you're 90% sure what you're going to buy. Then you drive by a car lot and another car catches your eye and you end up buying it.

 

[koonja]

Not sure the perfect thread for this - but if you have ISD access, this member does a great job of outlining the "success" in California recruiting over the modern era for ND.

Pretty telling if you ask me.

https://irishsportsdaily.com/forums/1/topics/21772

 

[NDRock]

We also need to keep in mind if the kid is a good fit for the program. Kelly changed the way they evaluate. This takes into account a number of factors above FB skills, grades (do they have the grades to get in, will they stay on top of the academics?, etc.), personality, desire to elevate themselves, team player. The coaches have probably identified several more. I suspect when one or two red flags start showing up, they either back off or take a more cautious look and start looking at someone else.

The other thing to keep in mind is while we may lead for a player, there is always the chance they change their mind and it doesn't have anything to do with ND's efforts.

It's like looking for a car. You know what you want and you're 90% sure what you're going to buy. Then you drive by a car lot and another car catches your eye and you end up buying it.

When do you think Kelly made this change?

 

[stlnd01]

When do you think Kelly made this change?

I don’t know if it was ever officially declared, but they do seem to have focused more on fit, and less on stars, the last few classes.
They also seem to get a lot of those good fit kids ID’d, and locked down, relatively early in the cycle (i.e. the spring), which is what makes this year’s results so far kind of concerning. We’ve still got the summer to work with, but I think it’s generally best for Notre Dame to have the bulk of its recruiting class lined up before the season starts.

 

[greyhammer90]

When do you think Kelly made this change?

I would say anecdotally it appeared to me that a pretty big shift in recruiting under Kelly happened after the Shepard/Greenberry class.

 

[snoopdog]

with only Williams leaving at the RB position this year, I don't think RB is a serious position of need.

I do think Bracy is an obvious option to red shirt this season and bulk up to become an additional RB on the roster, so adding one low 4star or high 3 star will be more than okay.

 

[Valpodoc85]

wasn't Bryant a 5* with some services?

 

[Edge]

https://www.sbnation.com/platform/a...iting-florida-state-miami-receiver-cornerback

Big 7-7 tournament in Miami

 

[Fbolt]

I imagine during the BG game the Irish will be receiving some verbals. O/U at 3 (SWAG) - No?

hmmm...

 

[BobbyMac]

hmmm...

Did you take the under?

If so, winner winner, chicken dinner!

 

[Fbolt]

haha-

thought the Irish are doing better than that!

Kristofic, Olmstead, Cross, Ajavon-not including Payne

 

[Irish#1]

When do you think Kelly made this change?

Pretty sure it started with the 17 class.

 

[Luckylucci]

As I assumed a week or so back, this was going to be pretty funny, at some point. We now have players in this class that Clemson wanted. Lacey and Kristofic. OSU wanted Kristofic and Hamilton. Michigan wanted, as much as they’d say different, Olmstead and Ajavon.

 

[Luckylucci]

Wiltfong currently has us landing Carroll, Correll, Kristofic, and Olmstead. O-line is the least of our worries. Our dream D-line class has fallen apart, we may not lead for any of our top skill position players, and our best safety prospects are trending away. After spring ball is over, our coaches need to get on the freaking ball because everyone but Quinn is getting their lunch eaten by our competitors.

So we now have two of our top targets at S. Were we too early for these posts?