2018 Fall Camp Thread

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Yeesh...

If you pause it at the 25 second mark when his hand is up near his head you can see the ball has partially slipped out in his hand before it starts to go forward.

It's a bad grip; not bad throwing mechanics.

 

[ResLife Hero]

folks on II think Jones looked better in Spring 2017 than he does now. They also said he's lost weight possibly 10-12 lb's or so but his 40 time is still pretty pedestrian.

ISD had generally positive things to say about his practice and his willingness to run tough inside. Mentioned a time when Coney came in and smacked him at the line, but he still pushed forward for 2 yards.

 

[Luckylucci]

I'm with you but I wouldn't mind seeing Tony Jones Jr. take over the Michigan game and churn out 5+ yards a carry on 25+ touches. Jafar can get his feet wet against Ball State once ND is up a couple TDs and then do some work against Vandy and Wake.

To be clear, I don't care who busts Michigan up but I think Jones Jr. getting in a rhythm and carrying the load with Wimbush busting a couple long runs is a better option than platooning the backs.

First game of the season, under the lights, and considering Jones has more experience I understand this. I probably wouldn't put Jafar out there on the first drive or give him 10 carries in the first half.

But, from what I've read/seen on how teams beat UM's defense last year or what teams did to have success, I think Jafar can be a huge asset, provided he's ready. Don Brown is probably going to be very aggressive with his play calling and I think that'll allow some really good matchups for our RB's in space. And due to the aggressive nature of the defense, they are susceptible to big plays. I know Jones has good hands but I think Jafar would be the superior option there. I would imagine that's why they are working it so much in fall camp.

 

[koonja]

I think Tony Jones will do fine against Michigan. He's solid, he won't screw up, and he'll run hard.

He's not a game wrecker, he's not going to scare a defense, but he'll be someone who can play snap for snap without hurting you or creating a weakness.

This is why it'd be so nice to have Dexter for G1, because he is someone you worry about if you're the DC.

 

[Irish YJ]

Very few reasons to be confident in starting QB?

Dude had one of the highest first down conversion rates in the Kelly Era... Broke the school record for TD runs, most yards in Kelly era, etc.

He also maintained a great interception per attempt ratio (this is critically overlooked). I'll sacrifice some completion percentage if our qb can move the sticks with his legs and not turn it over... I'll take that 100 times over a Golson turnover machine.

In summary, Brandon had many, many electric moments last year. Literally the only thing (and it is a big one) is consistently. If he improves there, watch out.

So, in summary, to say that Brandon showed no signs of having what it takes to be "the guy" you are doing a huge disservice to him and yourself. Open your eyes.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Taking either side of the BW debate isn't crazy. There's some really good, and some really bad stats from last year. There's reports that he's improved over the off season, and reports/video that he's still struggling. He doesn't have to be a 60+% passer to be good, but he does have to be better than he was last year. Teams figured us out the second half of last season, and you can safely assume what their D's will do until BW can keep them semi honest with his arm.

For me, there's a lot of practice time left to go. I'm sitting on the fence hoping he can rock and roll. I won't be shocked however if things are rocky and there's multiple QBs playing this year.

QB Rating rank of 98th
Raw QBR of 46th
Adjusted QBR Rank of 18th
Pass EPA of 93rd
Run EPA of 11th
Sack EPA or 65th
Total EPA of 56th
Sacks - 36 most sacked
INTs - 87th most INT'd
Rushing - 90th overall / 11th among QBs
Total TD rank of 26 (57th passing)
First Downs rank of 51st
3rd Down Conversion rank of 31st
Total Offense 28th (haven't had a top 25 in BK's time)
Games with QBR below 60 - UGA, Miami, Stanford, LSU

 

[koonja]

Let me ask this simple question....

Is the general consensus that BW had a better fall camp in 2017 than 2018?

By all accounts, all reports, all videos, he was looking like a Madden-created-protege destined to light it up in fall camp last year, but we know how that unfolded in the actual season.

I don't think anyone would argue that this 2018 fall camp the reports are that he's much more up and down. Does that not worry you?

Or do you just chalk it up as people being more critical? Or both?

 

[Luckylucci]

I think Tony Jones will do fine against Michigan. He's solid, he won't screw up, and he'll run hard.

He's not a game wrecker, he's not going to scare a defense, but he'll be someone who can play snap for snap without hurting you or creating a weakness.

This is why it'd be so nice to have Dexter for G1, because he is someone you worry about if you're the DC.

I've posted this before but relevant to the RB situation. Great write up, by Jamie U at ISD on how to exploit UM's D.

When you look at what PSU did to beat UM's defense, that just screams Jafar, to me. And, from the sounds of it, we've been working this a lot in practice. Seemingly every practice report has us working Jafar and Davis in packages like this. Kelly even mentioned that they'd like it to be more than just a package. Noting Jafar's ability to sustain a heavy workload.

https://irishsportsdaily.com/s/6616/film-dont-lie-how-to-attack-michigans-attacking-defense

I'd be pretty surprised if the staff wasn't looking at this pretty closely.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Another thing people should remember about Tony, dude is surprisingly really good in the receiving game. His versatility will be felt in many ways.

 

[koonja]

Another thing people should remember about Tony, dude is surprisingly really good in the receiving game. His versatility will be felt in many ways.

Will it? We almost always have RBs that get reports of being good receivers. But we don't throw them the ball (or can't complete it).

So what does it matter? It's like having a punter with a cannon of an arm. It's cool, but it doesn't help if it's not part of the plan.

 

[Irish YJ]

Dex by all accounts isn't getting any live reps, or very few if at all.

So even if (which I don't believe), he won't be "ready" to play 1st team reps or even 2nd team since it appears they're all going to Jones, Armstrong, and Davis.

A healthy Dex would be such a huge factor against Michigan, it'd make me feel much better have 2 legit backs with him and Jones, and Dexter being undoubtedly the most talented runner on the field that night.

I'm not buying it at all that he'll play game 1. But, if it's true, and if I were BK, I'd definitely give the others guys more reps until I was pretty sure Dex had checked whatever boxes.

I'm with you though. It would be a huge boost.

I don't think I've heard any chatter about Jones in camp this year. Is he doing well but everyone is skeptical based on his 2017 or is he not doing that well and people have moved on to Armstrong and Davis?

I've never been all that hype on Jones. I wasn't all that hype on Adams either, until I was... I don't think Jones will ever be Adams-like, but hoping he surprises me.

I really wish BW faced Ball St first and Michigan 2nd. Let him get his confidence back and then face the fire. Not jump into an inferno, Play 1

I'm actually happy we have them game 1. I think Shea in game 2 will be a lot better than Shea game 1. He's a lot bigger unknown IMO than BW.

First game of the season, under the lights, and considering Jones has more experience I understand this. I probably wouldn't put Jafar out there on the first drive or give him 10 carries in the first half.

But, from what I've read/seen on how teams beat UM's defense last year or what teams did to have success, I think Jafar can be a huge asset, provided he's ready. Don Brown is probably going to be very aggressive with his play calling and I think that'll allow some really good matchups for our RB's in space. And due to the aggressive nature of the defense, they are susceptible to big plays. I know Jones has good hands but I think Jafar would be the superior option there. I would imagine that's why they are working it so much in fall camp.

I do hope they work him in quickly, but not to quick. How is Jafar's blocking?

 

[Irish#1]

I haven't performed a study, but it appears to me those short throws BW struggles with are almost always to his right.

The ball slipping in his hand has to do with rushing to get the throw off, which goes back to the mental aspect of the game.

 

[condoms SUCk]

I haven't performed a study, but it appears to me those short throws BW struggles with are almost always to his right.

The ball slipping in his hand has to do with rushing to get the throw off, which goes back to the mental aspect of the game.

Usually those throws are harder for a RH QB since you have to open your chest more and he's rushing it, someone mentioned his grip that could be it one of many reasons too.

And let's not kid ourselves here, he knows what people are saying, he hears/sees what is being talked about. For someone who is having issues with the mental aspect of the game, him having a practice where things blow up on him and now he hears people saying the "bench the kid", "he sucks", "we're doomed", "kid can't throw" isn't going to help to someone, especially for someone who is 20/21. Heck anyone on this board that was consistently hammered like this is going to start to loose confidence.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/t2bnlEPKQKA" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Wimbush's first throw at 0:24..yikes!

He did that on purpose. He only completes short throws to players who are eligible for the upcoming game.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/t2bnlEPKQKA" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Wimbush's first throw at 0:24..yikes!

Also, you guys can say whatever you want about how weird Jurkovec's throwing motion is, but he gets the ball out quick and he's on the money. I have zero issues with his mechanics if his accuracy is that sharp in game situations.

 

[stlnd01]

And let's not kid ourselves here, he knows what people are saying, he hears/sees what is being talked about. For someone who is having issues with the mental aspect of the game, him having a practice where things blow up on him and now he hears people saying the "bench the kid", "he sucks", "we're doomed", "kid can't throw" isn't going to help to someone, especially for someone who is 20/21. Heck anyone on this board that was consistently hammered like this is going to start to loose confidence.

Yep. The thing that worried me about that video the other day where he missed a bunch of throws was less the misses than his body language after he’d miss. Lots of nervous stretching and whatnot. Maybe he’s just spastic but he had the look of someone who is pressing.

 

[koonja]

Usually those throws are harder for a RH QB since you have to open your chest more and he's rushing it, someone mentioned his grip that could be it one of many reasons too.

And let's not kid ourselves here, he knows what people are saying, he hears/sees what is being talked about. For someone who is having issues with the mental aspect of the game, him having a practice where things blow up on him and now he hears people saying the "bench the kid", "he sucks", "we're doomed", "kid can't throw" isn't going to help to someone, especially for someone who is 20/21. Heck anyone on this board that was consistently hammered like this is going to start to loose confidence.

This is very true.

But if my QB1 is worried about what fans are saying, he's not my QB1. You know what I mean? It takes thick skin, and you can develop that.

But if you are too broadly focused that you get shook by outside noise, you don't have the mentality to be QB1.

 

[OhioIrish31]

He did that on purpose. He only completes short throws to players who are eligible for the upcoming game.

Maybe they are only releasing the "bad BW passes" to make shitagain believe he can't hit a bull in the ass with a snow shovel. Maybe not.

 

[dublinirish]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Will 2018 be the year Notre Dame strings together two good seasons? <a href="https://t.co/r880IFniun">https://t.co/r880IFniun</a> <a href="https://t.co/1Vqg3jJv99">pic.twitter.com/1Vqg3jJv99</a></p>— Deadspin (@Deadspin) <a href="https://twitter.com/Deadspin/status/1029437038385410049?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 14, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Cannot believe Deadspin had a preview that positive. At a loss.

 

[dublinirish]

calling out denson for his crappy daily twitter quotes was spot on. No chance in hell they impress any recruits

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Also, I think it's hilarious that Deadspin (at least this writer, who is a NCst fan) is more excited for BW than most people on this forum.

 

[dad4aa]

I will never understand the gloom and doom around BW. I could care less if he throws some passes at their feet or over their head. He isn’t going to go from 49% completion to 90%. If these throws happen occasionally and less often than last year and he can improve to 60% plus in completions we could compete for the playoffs.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

I will never understand the gloom and doom around BW. I could care less if he throws some passes at their feet or over their head. He isn’t going to go from 49% completion to 90%. If these throws happen occasionally and less often than last year and he can improve to 60% plus in completions we could compete for the playoffs.

Typical "ND fans" writing someone off, because. The backup QB will forever be the best player on the team for a certain sect of ND fans.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

Also, I think it's hilarious that Deadspin (at least this writer, who is a NCst fan) is more excited for BW than most people on this forum.

Right? Did you watch the highlights? I am 100% willing to give up a couple of awful incompletions on short routes in favor of those electric runs he had last season. He is SO athletic. Faster than fast.

And he will improve this year. Mark our words.

 

[Kingbish01]

That highlight video of BW was awesome, if his confidence is there in the passing game....Kid will be a superstar.

 

[pkt77242]

I will never understand the gloom and doom around BW. I could care less if he throws some passes at their feet or over their head. He isn’t going to go from 49% completion to 90%. If these throws happen occasionally and less often than last year and he can improve to 60% plus in completions we could compete for the playoffs.

Because raising your completion percentage 10% (or a 20% increase) is not insignificant. It is infrequent that you see that large of a jump in one year especially for someone who played most of the PY. I think that 55% is more realistic number.

 

[Kingbish01]

Because raising your completion percentage 10% (or a 20% increase) is not insignificant. It is infrequent that you see that large of a jump in one year especially for someone who played most of the PY. I think that 55% is more realistic number.

Josh Allen completed 56% of his passes last year and went #7 overall.

 

[Wild Bill]

I understand the concern regarding Wimbush's accuracy and consistency but I think it's reasonable to believe he'll improve to some extent. More importantly, it seems obvious to me that he gives ND the best chance to be a playoff contender. Top to bottom, ND's roster is not top four in the country. If it was, it makes more sense to start a QB who can give you more consistency. Wimbush, if he runs the ball like he did last year and increases his efficiency through the air, gives ND a better chance to make the playoffs and beat opponents with greater talent. Like it or not, he's the "X" factor and Book is not. Just one fan's opinion.

 

[pkt77242]

Josh Allen completed 56% of his passes last year and went #7 overall.

What does that have to do with the topic at hand? All that proves is that the Bills suck at drafting.

 

[koonja]

Per ISD, Hainsey still out with no idea what came back on MRI.

Aaron Banks practiced some 1st team reps at RT, which theoretically would allow Kramer to remain at RG.