2014 Fall Camp Thread

[JughedJones]

As a P.S. :

I'm terribly excited about how Luatua looks!

 

[PANDFAN]

phil steele on bill king show this morning said he feels this is BK's most talented offense since being there...no reason we shouldn't be able to avg 30 ppg

 

[IrishLion]

If Luatua is as game ready as people seem to think he is practice ready, let's just hope the staff doesn't use him with spotlights, sirens, bells, and flashers for the opposition to indicate a running play, a la Daniel Smith.

Don't forget the entrance music and fireworks.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

phil steele on bill king show this morning said he feels this is BK's most talented offense since being there...no reason we shouldn't be able to avg 30 ppg

Comes down to play calling, turnovers, red zone efficiency. #CaptainObvious

One or more of those three items reared their ugly heads last season multiple times, thus limiting the offensive output. It's time the staff and the team puts it all together and has the huge coming out party that everyone has been anticipating since BK's arrival.

 

[IrishLion]

Comes down to play calling, turnovers, red zone efficiency. #CaptainObvious

One or more of those three items reared their ugly heads last season multiple times, thus limiting the offensive output. It's time the staff and the team puts it all together and has the huge coming out party that everyone has been anticipating since BK's arrival.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>ND was 100th out of 126 in TD conversions inside the red zone last year at 26%. OSU #1 at 84%. Need at least a 2X improvement to surprise.</p>— Tom Mendoza (@TomMendozaTalks) <a href="https://twitter.com/TomMendozaTalks/statuses/497438460987588608">August 7, 2014</a></blockquote>
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[SoDakDomer]

If Luatua is as game ready as people seem to think he is practice ready, let's just hope the staff doesn't use him with spotlights, sirens, bells, and flashers for the opposition to indicate a running play, a la Daniel Smith.

I feel like it can't be as obvious as it was when we put in D. Smith. A lot of times we keep the tight end back to help pass block, which would make it a little less obvious that its a run. But it would sure help if they used him occasionally as an actual pass catching threat.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>ND was 100th out of 126 in TD conversions inside the red zone last year at 26%. OSU #1 at 84%. Need at least a 2X improvement to surprise.</p>— Tom Mendoza (@TomMendozaTalks) <a href="https://twitter.com/TomMendozaTalks/statuses/497438460987588608">August 7, 2014</a></blockquote>
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Yea, I saw that yesterday. It was pathetic last year and a lot of it was because of what I listed. Play calling was at times, horrid. Turnovers occurred occasionally. The overall result was way too many FGs.

 

[Old Man Mike]

We are loaded at every position offensively other than QB. We MIGHT be loaded there, but this is a long way from being proven. Whether we average 20ppg or 50ppg is on the performance of Everettt &/or Malik. Almost any team in the country would like to field our first and second O-teams at OLine, Receivers, RBs.

C'mon Everett, be as good as that fabulous elite BBall point guard athleticism shows that you can be. Mindread Kelly, anticipate, read pre-snap, see-the-field quickly, pull the trigger, dodge and scramble their brains and legs.... we know it's "in you" somewhere --- use the "Toys" Kelly's given you... POTENT "Toys".

.... and as to redzone: Tarean can jump the pile; Cam can burrow it; Greg can rip it. And I've never seen many who can control the crowded sky and grab the ball like Robinson. .... and there's Ben ... and there's Brent/TWITCH/separate.

POTENT "Toys".

 

[woolybug25]

Yea, I saw that yesterday. It was pathetic last year and a lot of it was because of what I listed. Play calling was at times, horrid. Turnovers occurred occasionally. The overall result was way too many FGs.

A lot of people want to blame this on not having a mobile QB, but I blame it entirely on playcalling. There are tons of teams with pocket QB's that have no issues in the red zone. We had 1) Great TE 2) Great offensive line and 3) excellent RB's. There is no reason that we should have been limited to obvious running plays and back corner fades. This is something I hope our staff worked on.

 

[woolybug25]

We are loaded at every position offensively other than QB. We MIGHT be loaded there, but this is a long way from being proven. Whether we average 20ppg or 50ppg is on the performance of Everettt &/or Malik. Almost any team in the country would like to field our first and second O-teams at OLine, Receivers, RBs.

C'mon Everett, be as good as that fabulous elite BBall point guard athleticism shows that you can be. Mindread Kelly, anticipate, read pre-snap, see-the-field quickly, pull the trigger, dodge and scramble their brains and legs.... we know it's "in you" somewhere --- use the "Toys" Kelly's given you... POTENT "Toys".

.... and as to redzone: Tarean can jump the pile; Cam can burrow it; Greg can rip it. And I've never seen many who can control the crowded sky and grab the ball like Robinson. .... and there's Ben ... and there's Brent/TWITCH/separate.

POTENT "Toys".

Not sure I get what you mean about "not being proven" with Golson. He has been in the system several years and was our starter in a year that we went to title game. He has played on this team at the highest levels. He is a proven guy in my book.

 

[tko]

Jughead, you fkn loser!

 

[IrishLion]

Not sure I get what you mean about "not being proven" with Golson. He has been in the system several years and was our starter in a year that we went to title game. He has played on this team at the highest levels. He is a proven guy in my book.

He's proven that he can manage efficiently when needed, and also that he can "take over" sometimes (Pittsburgh 4th quarter is still a thing of beauty). I think the spirit of OMM's post is that he hasn't been in a position where he's been let off the leash, going all-out spread-attack on defenses.

I think he can do it, but we haven't had a chance to see how he operates when he's given a chance to run the quick-strike offense. I hope he can be as effective as Tony Pike was at UC, but it hasn't been shown yet (the best indication that he was on this track was the Bama game. It was an absolute debacle, aside from Golson).

 

[JughedJones]

Jughead, you fkn loser!

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

Not sure I get what you mean about "not being proven" with Golson. He has been in the system several years and was our starter in a year that we went to title game. He has played on this team at the highest levels. He is a proven guy in my book.

I'm with you that he's proven he can win in college but he hasn't proven he can consistently win. He's proven he can throw for 12 tds, 6 int and rush for another 6 but he hasn't proven he can find the open man consistently and throw for 3+ TDs/game. He hasn't proven he can check down to his second option or read defenses really well.

I believe he's capable but so far, his numbers point to a middling QB not a top notch performer. He was a RS frosh on a title run team but he wasn't the lynchpin, the defense was. We'll see how he handles the pressure this year, I'm expecting fireworks!

If we don't avg 30 ppg, there is seriously something wrong.

 

[PerthDomer]

Everything you said about Golson could be said about our RB or TE situation

 

[IrishLion]

Everything you said about Golson could be said about our RB or TE situation

Truuuuuuuue.

But those aren't the guys that will be trying to direct traffic in what should be a more potent offense.

Golson has the potential, but he hasn't yet proven that he can be the gunslinger that BK wants.

 

[woolybug25]

I'm with you that he's proven he can win in college but he hasn't proven he can consistently win. He's proven he can throw for 12 tds, 6 int and rush for another 6 but he hasn't proven he can find the open man consistently and throw for 3+ TDs/game. He hasn't proven he can check down to his second option or read defenses really well.

I believe he's capable but so far, his numbers point to a middling QB not a top notch performer. He was a RS frosh on a title run team but he wasn't the lynchpin, the defense was. We'll see how he handles the pressure this year, I'm expecting fireworks!

If we don't avg 30 ppg, there is seriously something wrong.

Totally agree, but to the point of the OP, then the comment of "We are loaded at every position offensively other than QB" isn't true either. Nobody outside of KRuss, Day and maybe Jaylon have proven themselves on the field to be a consistent high performer. In that definition, we really aren't "loaded" at any position. Golson is just as, if not more, proven than most position groups.

 

[autry_denson]

We are loaded at every position offensively other than QB.

It's interesting, I really see the offense totally differently. QB is the one position that I'm very excited about, RB 2nd. All of the inexperience and question marks, for me, lie elsewhere.

On OL we could end up very good but we lost our two best, most reliable players - that almost always translates into problems as the new, very talented guys get some experience and try to come together. They will eventually be a great unit, but recovering from the loss of Martin and Watt will take time.

I know lots of people are sold on the WRs, I'm not. Daniels is solid. I'm actually hopeful that, against the odds, Brent ends up rising to be a solid #2 option b/c I don't see it in Brown (never seems comfortable catching the ball to my eyes), and I think Fuller and Robinson may become good receivers but I'm not sure they are there yet.

At the TE position we have virtually no experience, except one guy who started to play fairly well at the tail end of last year. That doesn't breed confidence for me.

When I look at this offense I don't see anything to suggest that "we're loaded" at every position other than QB. I see something closer to the opposite. Lots of potentially very good players who haven't done all that much on the field, with very few exceptions.

 

[woolybug25]

It's interesting, I really see the offense totally differently. QB is the one position that I'm very excited about, RB 2nd. All of the inexperience and question marks, for me, lie elsewhere.

On OL we could end up very good but we lost our two best, most reliable players - that almost always translates into problems as the new, very talented guys get some experience and try to come together. They will eventually be a great unit, but recovering from the loss of Martin and Watt will take time.

I know lots of people are sold on the WRs, I'm not. Daniels is solid. I'm actually hopeful that, against the odds, Brent ends up rising to be a solid #2 option b/c I don't see it in Brown (never seems comfortable catching the ball to my eyes), and I think Fuller and Robinson may become good receivers but I'm not sure they are there yet.

At the TE position we have virtually no experience, except one guy who started to play fairly well at the tail end of last year. That doesn't breed confidence for me.

When I look at this offense I don't see anything to suggest that "we're loaded" at every position other than QB. I see something closer to the opposite. Lots of potentially very good players who haven't done all that much on the field, with very few exceptions.

That's where I am too.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

I just want an uptempo offense... Please.

I've been waiting too long.

 

[Irishman77]

It's interesting, I really see the offense totally differently. QB is the one position that I'm very excited about, RB 2nd. All of the inexperience and question marks, for me, lie elsewhere.

On OL we could end up very good but we lost our two best, most reliable players - that almost always translates into problems as the new, very talented guys get some experience and try to come together. They will eventually be a great unit, but recovering from the loss of Martin and Watt will take time.

I know lots of people are sold on the WRs, I'm not. Daniels is solid. I'm actually hopeful that, against the odds, Brent ends up rising to be a solid #2 option b/c I don't see it in Brown (never seems comfortable catching the ball to my eyes), and I think Fuller and Robinson may become good receivers but I'm not sure they are there yet.

At the TE position we have virtually no experience, except one guy who started to play fairly well at the tail end of last year. That doesn't breed confidence for me.

When I look at this offense I don't see anything to suggest that "we're loaded" at every position other than QB. I see something closer to the opposite. Lots of potentially very good players who haven't done all that much on the field, with very few exceptions.

Chris Brown is going to have a phenomenal year my friend.

The we are close to being good mentality should be abolished by all! We now have a QB.

All the good teams reload every year. We are now there and are loaded on offense IMHO

 

[Veritate Duce Progredi]

It's interesting, I really see the offense totally differently. QB is the one position that I'm very excited about, RB 2nd. All of the inexperience and question marks, for me, lie elsewhere.

On OL we could end up very good but we lost our two best, most reliable players - that almost always translates into problems as the new, very talented guys get some experience and try to come together. They will eventually be a great unit, but recovering from the loss of Martin and Watt will take time.

I know lots of people are sold on the WRs, I'm not. Daniels is solid. I'm actually hopeful that, against the odds, Brent ends up rising to be a solid #2 option b/c I don't see it in Brown (never seems comfortable catching the ball to my eyes), and I think Fuller and Robinson may become good receivers but I'm not sure they are there yet.

At the TE position we have virtually no experience, except one guy who started to play fairly well at the tail end of last year. That doesn't breed confidence for me.

When I look at this offense I don't see anything to suggest that "we're loaded" at every position other than QB. I see something closer to the opposite. Lots of potentially very good players who haven't done all that much on the field, with very few exceptions.

I can accept this view but just curious: How do you define loaded? Is it only based on proven stats in college? Is it based on rankings of signed prospects? Is it seasoning in a program? It sounds like "loaded" only means seasoned veterans and that is a difficult way to define this.

We have talent at every position and most are at minimum, two deep. Many of us expect our 3rd string tailback to be our returning lead rusher from last year. We are returning 4 starters on the offensive line despite losing two monsters from the left side. We have 5 WRs that have played and caught the ball for us, some in monster games (Daniels, Brown vs. Oklahoma) then Robinson, Fuller and Prosise. Then we have Carlisle who has played, Hunter who has been raved about, Brent who looks like he's really competing and was very highly ranked and Holmes who people compare to TJ Jones but with more speed and bigger frame.

Our backup QB appears to be more versatile and just as accurate as our previous starter. He hasn't proven it yet but you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone willing to trade Zaire for Rees. Our TEs will likely decrease their production but we certainly have options: we are returning a starter from a year ago who came on strong as the season concluded and a boatload of young talent behind him. Unproven, yes.

Our offensive line likely has 9-10 players the could play winning football immediately but we haven't seen if they can gel as a unit. Given Hiestand's track record here, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt and believe they will be at least serviceable to begin the season.

Not many believe in the star rankings and that's alright but every position has a highly ranked player fighting for playing time. We all believe Kelly's group are very adept talent-evaluators so we also have diamonds in the rough. For me, that's Robinson, Fuller, Smythe, (even Golson who was merely a three star).

I think it's fair to say we are loaded in that we aren't going to be completely devastated if an injury occurs at most positions. I can't remember the last time we had this many players who could make an impact or have the potential to take over a game.

Golson has done it (Pitt). Folston has done it (Navy). Cam has done it (drawing a blank, BYU maybe?). Daniels has done it (Purdue).

In the capable but unproven category we have: Bryant, Robinson, Fuller, Brown, Hunter, Carlisle, Prosise

Most of them have either the speed, leaping ability, vision or hands to destroy the opposition. This is the most complete roster I've seen. Defensively we are lacking in a few areas, we need more depth, offensively, it'd be nice to have 1 more RB and perhaps another QB but this quality depth across the board.

There is true competition, the seniors and juniors do not receive playing time by virtue of age and lack of competition. Even Daniels could be displaced if he doesn't continue to outwork the young guys.

Ultimately, if the only definition of loaded is based on proven playmakers and doesn't take into account in-coming class, recruiting rankings, coaches rave reviews and developing players then you may be right. But it's still a toss-up with a returning QB, WR, 2 RBs, TE and 4 OL who already have significant playing experience. Then 4 other WRs who have played.

2012 we had just lost Lynch, Tuitt had been unexceptional as a frosh before contracting mono and people were worried about not having any difference makers. Nix had been average at best.

You can't return a full brigade of senior starters every year so an all-encompassing view is more indicative of whether or not a team is "loaded. My 39 cents.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

Yea, I saw that yesterday. It was pathetic last year and a lot of it was because of what I listed. Play calling was at times, horrid. Turnovers occurred occasionally. The overall result was way too many FGs.

Anyone can just punch it in from the 2...A real team runs the shotgun on the goal line. Makes things competitive.

 

[autry_denson]

I can accept this view but just curious: How do you define loaded? Is it only based on proven stats in college? Is it based on rankings of signed prospects? Is it seasoning in a program? It sounds like "loaded" only means seasoned veterans and that is a difficult way to define this.

We have talent at every position and most are at minimum, two deep. Many of us expect our 3rd string tailback to be our returning lead rusher from last year. We are returning 4 starters on the offensive line despite losing two monsters from the left side. We have 5 WRs that have played and caught the ball for us, some in monster games (Daniels, Brown vs. Oklahoma) then Robinson, Fuller and Prosise. Then we have Carlisle who has played, Hunter who has been raved about, Brent who looks like he's really competing and was very highly ranked and Holmes who people compare to TJ Jones but with more speed and bigger frame.

Our backup QB appears to be more versatile and just as accurate as our previous starter. He hasn't proven it yet but you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone willing to trade Zaire for Rees. Our TEs will likely decrease their production but we certainly have options: we are returning a starter from a year ago who came on strong as the season concluded and a boatload of young talent behind him. Unproven, yes.

Our offensive line likely has 9-10 players the could play winning football immediately but we haven't seen if they can gel as a unit. Given Hiestand's track record here, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt and believe they will be at least serviceable to begin the season.

Not many believe in the star rankings and that's alright but every position has a highly ranked player fighting for playing time. We all believe Kelly's group are very adept talent-evaluators so we also have diamonds in the rough. For me, that's Robinson, Fuller, Smythe, (even Golson who was merely a three star).

I think it's fair to say we are loaded in that we aren't going to be completely devastated if an injury occurs at most positions. I can't remember the last time we had this many players who could make an impact or have the potential to take over a game.

Golson has done it (Pitt). Folston has done it (Navy). Cam has done it (drawing a blank, BYU maybe?). Daniels has done it (Purdue).

In the capable but unproven category we have: Bryant, Robinson, Fuller, Brown, Hunter, Carlisle, Prosise

Most of them have either the speed, leaping ability, vision or hands to destroy the opposition. This is the most complete roster I've seen. Defensively we are lacking in a few areas, we need more depth, offensively, it'd be nice to have 1 more RB and perhaps another QB but this quality depth across the board.

There is true competition, the seniors and juniors do not receive playing time by virtue of age and lack of competition. Even Daniels could be displaced if he doesn't continue to outwork the young guys.

Ultimately, if the only definition of loaded is based on proven playmakers and doesn't take into account in-coming class, recruiting rankings, coaches rave reviews and developing players then you may be right. But it's still a toss-up with a returning QB, WR, 2 RBs, TE and 4 OL who already have significant playing experience. Then 4 other WRs who have played.

2012 we had just lost Lynch, Tuitt had been unexceptional as a frosh before contracting mono and people were worried about not having any difference makers. Nix had been average at best.

You can't return a full brigade of senior starters every year so an all-encompassing view is more indicative of whether or not a team is "loaded. My 39 cents.

Experience across the lines is seriously undervalued in my mind.

That said, we're both looking at a bunch of guys who haven't played much and trying to project how they might fit together and play. I don't claim to have a comparative advantage in this type of forecasting. But I get anxious when untested players are protecting the QB and trying to open up holes, no matter how good I think they'll eventually be. I wonder whether Robinson can get open. I wonder whether Fuller is big enough, and whether he's actually an above average receiver. I cringe when I think about the ball seemingly slamming into Chris Brown's hands, or him flinching as he catches it. I have no idea whether Torii Hunter Jr. will regain his full explosiveness. I wonder whether Prosise is a threat in the passing game - maybe he will be, but I haven't seen it. I watched Carlisle all last year, and I wasn't all that encouraged. I'm hopeful that Koyack will break out as a receiver, but I don't think anyone is going to block like Troy Niklas did.

We both see a much improved QB situation. That alone might make this year's offense surpass last year's. But beyond that, we're making projections without game evidence - and your projections are more optimistic than mine. I hope you're right.

 

[koonja]

MOAR videos!

And fuck Michigan!

 

[woolybug25]

Veritate is straight slayin' with his posts today. Top notch.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Kelly showed up to camp today on a horse? Beat that, Urban Meyer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

 

[tko]

Kelly showed up to camp today on a horse? Beat that, Urban Meyer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

need video of that!

 

[woolybug25]

Kelly showed up to camp today on a horse? Beat that, Urban Meyer!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

But how did his cowboy boots look?

 

[IrishLion]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>"Why isn't he wearing proper equestrian shoes, smdh, decline of this nation illustrated" —ND Nation, right now <a href="https://t.co/GJALS0PmY4">pic.twitter.com/GJALS0PmY4</a></p>— Spencer Hall (@edsbs) <a href="https://twitter.com/edsbs/statuses/497769638466686976">August 8, 2014</a></blockquote>
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