'14 OH QB DeShone Kizer (Notre Dame Signee)

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Bogtrotter07

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QBR takes into account everything (TD to INT ration included), which is why Kizer's QBR is so great... When I said 'it's not great', I'm talking specifically to the 215 passing yards. That doesn't blow my doors off, but his game was great, and if he played the whole thing we would have won. I'm saying nothing but positives about Kizer.

Let me know at the end of the season the number of defensive backfields we have played against that come close to the level of play Texas exhibited this past weekend.

Maybe this should be in a general thread, the Texas thread, or whatever. But I think that Kizer, EQ, et all did an incredible job in a season opener against a defensive backfield that could have all the starters (possibly) playing on Sundays.
 
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Bogtrotter07

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I'm as fervent a Kelly-defender as they come. I think he is the best option for ND among the current landscape of college football.

Having said that, his mind-boggling stubbornness really is beginning to cost the program, especially in a year where we don't have one of the "weird sh*t happens?" excuses built in. It's perplexing.

This is a good place to have a conversation about what you have with an innovator in football today. Saban isn't an innovator.

Coaches that are innovators don't seem to win a lot of championships these days. Ever notice? That stubbornness to which you speak is the mother or father of innovation. Maybe not a good parent for bringing home natty trophies. N'est-ce pas?
 
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Bogtrotter07

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Not to mention, it adjusts for how bad/good a defense is.

it's truly the best barometer of how good a QB is. At least throwing the ball

Stinky came up with an extremely good point in a DK article on NBC Chicago; just read this and think about it :

So that meant there was quite a bit of inexperience permeating Notre Dame’s offense Sunday night. But some of those greenhorns said Kizer’s composure and confidence helped them ease into a roaringly-intense evening.

“When we were down, he brought us together and said we’re going to drive and score and come back,” sophomore receiver Equanimeous St. Brown said, adding that message from Kizer gave him and the rest of the Irish offense a confidence boost in the second half.

“What young guys typically don’t understand when they go into that environment is that it’s not too much different from what you’re doing in practice,” Kizer said. “When you step in front of 100,000 people, there’s a lot of noise and that could definitely create some adrenaline. But other than that, we’re playing the same game that we’ve been playing all summer.

The plays have been made time and time again all offseason and just understanding that when they’re out there, they’re expected to make those same exact plays and all they have to do is do that and do that well. You don’t have to go out there and be someone else. We have a really good coaching staff who put you in good positions to make big plays and all you have to do is execute what they say.”

Leadership is one of those nebulous things every football player and coach will tell you is necessary, but it’s a quality that’s impossible to quantify. It’s not an end-all, be-all for an offense or defense — Notre Dame, after all, didn’t score when it got the ball back after Jarron Jones’ miraculous blocked PAT, which probably had more to do with the loss of Hunter Jr. than anything else — but it is something that can be pointed to as an asset in close games.

And with Kizer quarterbacking the offense, Notre Dame has to feel confident in its ability to hang in close games. It still needs its special teams, defense (which was primarily behind recent losses to Stanford and Texas) and coaching (behind the loss to Clemson) to come through, but the next time Notre Dame finds itself in a high-pressure, hostile situation, it can count on Kizer to keep things calm.

And that counts for something, whatever the extent of it is.

Before the game he kind of talked to us, got in front of us and told us hey, I don’t care how young you are, I know you guys can make plays,” Sanders said. “So just hearing that from him developed a comfort level to know that he can depend on us. Hearing that from him really made a big difference.”

It is one thing to walk on a four inch beam on the floor; another to walk on a four inch beam suspended 20 feet off of the ground. Kizer not only understands that, but he understands how to trick the mind in to doing what it can do when it ignores the irrelevant variables that cause the fear, the fear that causes a failure to perform.

Few actually have this, usually they are called super-stars.
 
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zelezo vlk

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He should've gotten a measuring tape and measured the height of the goalposts and length of the field Hoosier style. Maybe that would have made a difference.

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Junkhead

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What astounds me is that when MZ went down last year, I thought ND was cooked. No QB experience. Fast forward, and Kizer (who many, if not most, of us doubted due to lack of experience), is the one shining star. I feel bad for MZ, but how can you NOT have Kizer start at this point?
 

GCND

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The young man has ice in his veins.

I just hope everyone can keep in perspective just how relatively young he is.

He's going to make mistakes.

All this talk about leaving for the NFL is premature in my mind.

This isn't a dig by any means. Good things will definitely come his way.

I anticipate a great season, but he still needs time to develop.

I mean, after the Texas game last season, Zaire was the next Messiah.

I just think it's healthy to keep in mind that Kizer is still very much learning... and support the guy, with the good and bad.

That said, here's to a great game today. And hopefully Zaire can get in the game to get some reps as well.
 
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Veritate Duce Progredi

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I'm wondering if Kizer is one of those players we don't appreciate enough. We're throwing around superlatives but he really seems so composed. I wouldn't be surprised to see his skillset transfer to the NFL. He's tall, goes through his reads, has enough escapability and calls good audibles.
 

BGIF

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I'm wondering if Kizer is one of those players we don't appreciate enough. We're throwing around superlatives but he really seems so composed. I wouldn't be surprised to see his skillset transfer to the NFL. He's tall, goes through his reads, has enough escapability and calls good audibles.



If ... only he could throw to a TE.




Finke has as many receptions as the entire TE corps.
 

BobbyMac

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I'm wondering if Kizer is one of those players we don't appreciate enough. We're throwing around superlatives but he really seems so composed. I wouldn't be surprised to see his skillset transfer to the NFL. He's tall, goes through his reads, has enough escapability and calls good audibles.

I think he's gonna be a better pro. He won't have to waste snaps calling his own number in the run game and he'll have RB's and TE's to dump to.

If ... only he could throw to a TE.

Finke has as many receptions as the entire TE corps.

Give up on the TE position as you knew it in days gone by. It's not going to happen under Kelly. Ask Joe Staley.
 

Irish Insanity

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The young man has ice in his veins.

I just hope everyone can keep in perspective just how relatively young he is.

He's going to make mistakes.

All this talk about leaving for the NFL is premature in my mind.

This isn't a dig by any means. Good things will definitely come his way.

I anticipate a great season, but he still needs time to develop.

I mean, after the Texas game last season, Zaire was the next Messiah.

I just think it's healthy to keep in mind that Kizer is still very much learning... and support the guy, with the good and bad.

That said, here's to a great game today. And hopefully Zaire can get in the game to get some reps as well.

Still needs time to develop? The list of CFB QB's you could even put in the discussion with him this year is small.

Good things will come his way? He seems to be pretty damn good at making them happen himself.

I mean, after the Texas game last season, Zaire was the next Messiah? So basically game 2 for Zaire, Kizer has A LOT longer resume at this point than Zaire did then.

You seem oddly dismissive of Kizer......
 
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NDRock

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I'm wondering if Kizer is one of those players we don't appreciate enough. We're throwing around superlatives but he really seems so composed. I wouldn't be surprised to see his skillset transfer to the NFL. He's tall, goes through his reads, has enough escapability and calls good audibles.

Watching Winston with the Bucs right now. IMO, they're very similar players.
 

military_irish

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If he continues to ball out this year. He will easily be a 1st round pick and certainly a top 10 pick. I'd love for him to come back but how much would he really improve his stock by staying?

Hopefully he wants to get his degree and stay another year because next years offense would be scary but that's just me being selfish.
 

Veritate Duce Progredi

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I think he's gonna be a better pro. He won't have to waste snaps calling his own number in the run game and he'll have RB's and TE's to dump to.



Give up on the TE position as you knew it in days gone by. It's not going to happen under Kelly. Ask Joe Staley.

I disagree. Kelly calls plays for the best players on the field. He's a matchup guy so he's going to look for the match-up he can exploit and then keep mixing it in while testing other matches.

The 3 RBs and WR corp has been doing pretty well getting open so there's no need to call a TE-first play if the position isn't one of the best 5-6 playmaker on the field.

I thought Smythe and Luatua would've had some targets but apparently Kelly doesn't trust them or he hasn't had to tap that tree.

I bet that changes when Alize comes back. Alize with our WRs and RBs would be absolutely deadly. I hate that he was ruled ineligible. Look forward to seeing him next year .
 
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BobbyMac

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I disagree. Kelly calls plays for the best players on the field. He's a matchup guy so he's going to look for the match-up he can exploit and then keep mixing it in while testing other matches.

The 3 RBs and WR corp has been doing pretty well getting open so there's no need to call a TE-first play if the position isn't one of the best 5-6 playmaker on the field.

I thought Smythe and Luatua would've had some targets but apparently Kelly doesn't trust them or he hasn't had to tap that tree.

I bet that changes when Alize comes back. Alize with our WRs and RBs would be absolutely deadly. I hate that he was ruled ineligible. Look forward to seeing him next year .

When Alize comes back and lines up unattached... just like Eifert did the vast majority of the time, you're free to call him a TE if you want.
 

TheChosen1

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I disagree. Kelly calls plays for the best players on the field. He's a matchup guy so he's going to look for the match-up he can exploit and then keep mixing it in while testing other matches.

The 3 RBs and WR corp has been doing pretty well getting open so there's no need to call a TE-first play if the position isn't one of the best 5-6 playmaker on the field.

I thought Smythe and Luatua would've had some targets but apparently Kelly doesn't trust them or he hasn't had to tap that tree.

I bet that changes when Alize comes back. Alize with our WRs and RBs would be absolutely deadly. I hate that he was ruled ineligible. Look forward to seeing him next year .



Kelly doesn't call the plays.
 

GCND

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Still needs time to develop? The list of CFB QB's you could even put in the discussion with him this year is small.

I'm not disagreeing, especially when you consider his excellent performance last year. However, my personal view is somewhat tempered by the fact that we are on Game 3 of THIS season. Game 1 was against a decent opponent. Game 2 was a horrible one. I actually consider it respectful of his abilities to encourage a healthy perspective on what he is still continuing to learn.

Good things will come his way? He seems to be pretty damn good at making them happen himself.

Haha, I used an expression, albeit maybe too loosely, but you put an "interesting" spin on it. Of course, he has earned it. I wasn't saying otherwise.

I mean, after the Texas game last season, Zaire was the next Messiah? So basically game 2 for Zaire, Kizer has A LOT longer resume at this point than Zaire did then.

I realize this. Like I previously said, I am not putting Kizer down. I've just been an ND fan long enough to see the setup and the dismissal when the bumps occur. I don't think Kizer will fail, far from it. I just think he will make mistakes, and at that point, I hope the support continues.

You seem oddly dismissive of Kizer......

No, I've applauded him previously, questioned Kelly's odd dismissiveness of him at times, and have high hopes for him this year. I want nothing more than to see him succeed, and am thrilled that he is our starting quarterback. I'm just not rushing him to the NFL after one season and two games.

Oddly dismissive responses above in confident bold.
 

kmoose

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I think he's gonna be a better pro. He won't have to waste snaps calling his own number in the run game and he'll have RB's and TE's to dump to.

You do realize that Kizer's running ability just might make him a VERY rich man, as opposed to a well paid man? I would hardly call that "wasting snaps" by calling his own number.
 

calvegas04

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If Kizer declares after this season, Id rather have BW get the call up than MZ (if he were to stay)
 

BobbyMac

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You do realize that Kizer's running ability just might make him a VERY rich man, as opposed to a well paid man? I would hardly call that "wasting snaps" by calling his own number.

His arm, body and brain will make him a VERY rich man. The less he runs at the next level, the better off he'll be. Leave that for Cam. Jay Cutler is 2x the athlete DK is and even that dumbazz is smart enough to know running is not what he gets paid for.

As well as Aaron Rogers runs, his running didn't make him rich.
 
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Buster Bluth

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If Kizer declares after this season, Id rather have BW get the call up than MZ (if he were to stay)

If Malik plays as much as he should this season, I think he'll be the favorite.

He should get plenty of time against Duke, Syracuse, Navy, and Army. That experience is valuable, as I doubt Kelly would want to break in a new QB when 2017 looks like the best chance at a championship since 2013's hype.

But if he's better then he's better and will play.
 

Domina Nostra

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If Malik plays as much as he should this season, I think he'll be the favorite.

He should get plenty of time against Duke, Syracuse, Navy, and Army. That experience is valuable, as I doubt Kelly would want to break in a new QB when 2017 looks like the best chance at a championship since 2013's hype.

But if he's better then he's better and will play.

He'll get a huge bump for experience if he stays-- that is Kelly's MO. I don't think it's always smart.
 

BobbyMac

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If Malik plays as much as he should this season, I think he'll be the favorite.

He should get plenty of time against Duke, Syracuse, Navy, and Army. That experience is valuable, as I doubt Kelly would want to break in a new QB when 2017 looks like the best chance at a championship since 2013's hype.

But if he's better then he's better and will play.

He'll get a huge bump for experience if he stays-- that is Kelly's MO. I don't think it's always smart.

MZ's Gone like Golson.

JMO
 

zelezo vlk

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MZ's Gone like Golson.

JMO
Can't really blame the kid either to go somewhere and be the guy. I don't see Kelly keeping Wimbush out of the QB competition next year. I'd almost prefer that anyways, because 2018 could be brutal, returning talent wise. An experienced Wimbush could be the difference between 8-4 and 10-2. But I'm getting ahead of myself.

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BobbyMac

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Can't really blame the kid either to go somewhere and be the guy. I don't see Kelly keeping Wimbush out of the QB competition next year. I'd almost prefer that anyways, because 2018 could be brutal, returning talent wise. An experienced Wimbush could be the difference between 8-4 and 10-2. But I'm getting ahead of myself.

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Don't get me wrong, what I want as an Irish fan since '73 is two QB's of MZ and BW's on my roster but the reality of the Grad Transfer in today's game is the new normal.

Success in life is about managing your variables and respecting the odds. If he does GT, the tough guys will call him a quitter just like they did Golson but it's playing by the rules and in his best interest (once again, IMO) Once again, I personally hope he stays and everyone co-exists in harmony. I just don't see how each of these fine young men maximize their personal situation by anything but DK entering the draft, MZ GTing and BW taking over.
 

zelezo vlk

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Don't get me wrong, what I want as an Irish fan since '73 is two QB's of MZ and BW's on my roster but the reality of the Grad Transfer in today's game is the new normal.

Success in life is about managing your variables and respecting the odds. If he does GT, the tough guys will call him a quitter just like they did Golson but it's playing by the rules and in his best interest (once again, IMO) Once again, I personally hope he stays and everyone co-exists in harmony. I just don't see how each of these fine young men maximize their personal situation by anything but DK entering the draft, MZ GTing and BW taking over.
Pretty much where I'm at.

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