'13 OH QB Malik Zaire (Notre Dame Early Enrollee)

[ThePiombino]

And why didn't we block him from UNC again? SMH.

Who cares? He's a bad QB (whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?!). Yes, I said it- a BAD QB. I would LOVE to face him next year.

 

[Blaise]

Who cares? He's a bad QB (whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?!). Yes, I said it- a BAD QB. I would LOVE to face him next year.

I don't think hes a bad QB, but I am in favor of doing your people right.. He graduated, if he wants to leave let him go where is best for him.. Treat your people right

 

[tko]

I don't think hes a bad QB, but I am in favor of doing your people right.. He graduated, if he wants to leave let him go where is best for him.. Treat your people right

Amen Blaise!!!

 

[ThePiombino]

I don't think hes a bad QB, but I am in favor of doing your people right.. He graduated, if he wants to leave let him go where is best for him.. Treat your people right

Well I think he was a bad QB, at least for an offense that requires to him to ever throw a ball. That said, I agree with taking care of our guys. But I also think our guys shouldn't be pouting on the sidelines and causing locker room divides.

 

[tko]

Well I think he was a bad QB, at least for an offense that requires to him to ever throw a ball. That said, I agree with taking care of our guys. But I also think our guys shouldn't be pouting on the sidelines and causing locker room divides.

I feel the same you just said it and I didn't LOL. That piece of the puzzle really angers me because I think that was a huge factor to some of the sht storms we witnessed this season.

 

[ThePiombino]

Well I think he was a bad QB, at least for an offense that requires to him to ever throw a ball. That said, I agree with taking care of our guys. But I also think our guys shouldn't be pouting on the sidelines and causing locker room divides.

I feel the same you just said it and I didn't LOL. That piece of the puzzle really angers me because I think that was a huge factor to some of the sht storms we witnessed this season.

Cue Irish Eyes...

 

[gkIrish]

Who cares? He's a bad QB (whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?!). Yes, I said it- a BAD QB. I would LOVE to face him next year.

I agree. He is not a starting caliber P5 QB IMO. Wish him nothing but success but I do not fear him post-injury.

 

[ulukinatme]

Well I think he was a bad QB, at least for an offense that requires to him to ever throw a ball. That said, I agree with taking care of our guys. But I also think our guys shouldn't be pouting on the sidelines and causing locker room divides.

Do we know for sure he caused a divide? Have the beat writers hinted at anything? I'm looking at LA and some of the other insiders here. I mean obviously he was disappointed he lost the starting job. I don't think any one of us would have felt differently if we had been in his shoes. Do we know if he caused an actual divide though, and how far reaching was it?

 

[ThePiombino]

I agree. He is not a starting caliber P5 QB IMO. Wish him nothing but success but I do not fear him post-injury.

Did we just become best friends?

Do we know for sure he caused a divide? Have the beat writers hinted at anything? I'm looking at LA and some of the other insiders here. I mean obviously he was disappointed he lost the starting job. I don't think any one of us would have felt differently if we had been in his shoes. Do we know if he caused an actual divide though, and how far reaching was it?

I don't have any super-secret insider knowledge, but I believe it's been hinted at by multiple sources. Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I am actually.

 

[gkIrish]

Did we just become best friends?

 

[fitz_bu47]

He seemed like a kid that got dealt a sh!tty hand w/ the injury and handled it as well as he could. I'm not there everyday, and I didn't love his body language on the sideline, but put yourself in his shoes. You wait your turn, play great in the bowl game against LSU, then start out fantastic against Texas last year and then boom everything changes w/ that injury. Of course he was pressing when he came back, and disapointed when he lost the job. I think he has potential to be a very good college QB, and I hope he goes out w/ a great year next year wherever he ends up.

 

[ulukinatme]

I don't have any super-secret insider knowledge, but I believe it's been hinted at by multiple sources. Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I am actually.

I've heard it once before too, which makes me question is this is just rumors or legit. If it was legit, how big was the divide? Are we talking a few players or what? I think it's some strong accusations to throw around in any case unless we have some concrete knowledge here from someone in the know. Malik went in when his number was called, he's leaving as a graduate for understandable reasons, and he's leaving in a classy way. Given those facts, to throw negativity towards him seems harsh when we're unsure about the validity of this rumored divide, as well as the impact/reach it may or may not have had if it was legit.

 

[ThePiombino]

He seemed like a kid that got dealt a sh!tty hand w/ the injury and handled it as well as he could. I'm not there everyday, and I didn't love his body language on the sideline, but put yourself in his shoes. You wait your turn, play great in the bowl game against LSU, then start out fantastic against Texas last year and then boom everything changes w/ that injury. Of course he was pressing when he came back, and disapointed when he lost the job. I think he has potential to be a very good college QB, and I hope he goes out w/ a great year next year wherever he ends up.

You forgot the part where he laid an egg against UVA...and every opportunity since then.

 

[GowerND11]

There was an article a few years back about a basketball player who graduated and transferred but never got to play at his new school because his old one didn't release him. Unless something changed in the past year graduate transfers are no exception to this rule. The control schools have over their transferring players is ridiculous, IMO.

It was at St. Joe's:

What on Earth is Phil Martelli doing? - Men's College Basketball Blog- ESPN

 

[Ndaccountant]

Frankly, I don't think either school is a good fit for him. Malik needs to be in an offense that allows him to use his legs first, then his arm. For Chryst at Wisky, we don't have much of a sample size for how he would use a skill set like Malik, but I would imagine it would still be based on pro / power set principles, which would probably limit the upside of Malik's legs.

For UNC, they will showcase his legs more, but I still think they would be too reliant on his arm. In 2015, UNC had Marquise Williams, who has a much closer skill set to Malik than with Trubisky has. During 2015, UNC ran the ball less on standard downs than the national average and just a little bit more on passing downs. For the year, MW averaged 27 passes per game against FBS teams, which is more than what MZ was on pace for during his first two games of 2015. Simply put, UNC will ask him to pass more.

 

[ulukinatme]

You forgot the part where he laid an egg against UVA...and every opportunity since then.

The whole offense laid an egg against UVA, it went far beyond Malik. We struggled to pickup the blitzes Tenuta was throwing, and because of the pressure it didn't give the receivers enough time to get open. Malik was actually getting the offense moving in the 2nd half until the injury hit. Prosise scored on the very next play I believe.

As far as "every opportunity since," are you kidding? While Malik did struggle at times as a backup, he wasn't completely at fault. He got 3 drives against Texas. Two of the drives we almost exclusively ran into the teeth of the Texas defense. Malik probably should have changed the plays at the line to avoid that, but I still question why some suggestions weren't made sooner to avoid that. The third drive Zaire led the offense most of the way down the field and then a false start by Mustipher ended up killing the drive. There were two other occasions this year where Mustipher snapped the ball way over Malik's head and killed drives. Do I blame Mustipher? No, shit happens, but I'm not going to fault Malik for those drives ending. As far as other opportunities, Malik got inserted into the NC St. game very late, I don't know what you were expecting there...probably should have been put in at halftime and get the running game going rather than throwing the ball with Kizer 39 times. He also had to spell Kizer against Virginia Tech on the final play I think...and why we didn't call to spike the ball I don't know, but he got flushed out of the pocket and ran to keep the play alive only to have time expire. That should have been a spike all the way, not sure what they were thinking there, but Malik did what he could.

 

[dublinirish]

Frankly, I don't think either school is a good fit for him. Malik needs to be in an offense that allows him to use his legs first, then his arm. For Chryst at Wisky, we don't have much of a sample size for how he would use a skill set like Malik, but I would imagine it would still be based on pro / power set principles, which would probably limit the upside of Malik's legs.

For UNC, they will showcase his legs more, but I still think they would be too reliant on his arm. In 2015, UNC had Marquise Williams, who has a much closer skill set to Malik than with Trubisky has. During 2015, UNC ran the ball less on standard downs than the national average and just a little bit more on passing downs. For the year, MW averaged 27 passes per game against FBS teams, which is more than what MZ was on pace for during his first two games of 2015. Simply put, UNC will ask him to pass more.

problem for malik is that he is terrible at the read option so realistically all he has are QB power runs which become very predictable very quickly

 

[ThePiombino]

The whole offense laid an egg against UVA, it went far beyond Malik. We struggled to pickup the blitzes Tenuta was throwing, and because of the pressure it didn't give the receivers enough time to get open. Malik was actually getting the offense moving in the 2nd half until the injury hit. Prosise scored on the very next play I believe.

As far as "every opportunity since," are you kidding? While Malik did struggle at times as a backup, he wasn't completely at fault. He got 3 drives against Texas. Two of the drives we almost exclusively ran into the teeth of the Texas defense. Malik probably should have changed the plays at the line to avoid that, but I still question why some suggestions weren't made sooner to avoid that. The third drive Zaire led the offense most of the way down the field and then a false start by Mustipher ended up killing the drive. There were two other occasions this year where Mustipher snapped the ball way over Malik's head and killed drives. Do I blame Mustipher? No, shit happens, but I'm not going to fault Malik for those drives ending. As far as other opportunities, Malik got inserted into the NC St. game very late, I don't know what you were expecting there...probably should have been put in at halftime and get the running game going rather than throwing the ball with Kizer 39 times. He also had to spell Kizer against Virginia Tech on the final play I think...and why we didn't call to spike the ball I don't know, but he got flushed out of the pocket and ran to keep the play alive only to have time expire. That should have been a spike all the way, not sure what they were thinking there, but Malik did what he could.

And none of this would have been as much of a factor if he had any ability whatsoever to make pre-snap adjustments. Or could ID a hot route. Or was the least bit accurate. Look, MZ - HELLUVA athlere. P5 QB, though? Nah.

 

[ulukinatme]

problem for malik is that he is terrible at the read option so realistically all he has are QB power runs which become very predictable very quickly

Whoh, since when? Are we basing it off the small sample size this year, or the small sample size last year and LSU? I don't have much comment on the read option this year, but to be honest our entire running game was up and down this year, so it's hard to say anything. Last year and in the LSU game? Malik was spot on with the read option, and the BEST quarterback Kelly has had at ND with the read. Kelly's QBs at ND have often struggled with the right read, but at least prior to this year Malik was the most consistent with it. Kizer was pretty good with it during his career too, but he had his struggles too as our running game had inconsistencies so it's hard to give a fair grade when the blocking was so up and down.

 

[GowerND11]

Can't wait for Malik to go to UNC and throw for 350 and 3TDs while rushing for 110 against us...

 

[ulukinatme]

And none of this would have been as much of a factor if he had any ability whatsoever to make pre-snap adjustments. Or could ID a hot route. Or was the least bit accurate. Look, MZ - HELLUVA athlere. P5 QB, though? Nah.

MVP of the Music City bowl against a very tough LSU defense, and dismantled a mediocre Texas team, but not good enough to be a P5 QB? Things changed when he got injured. Maybe it destroyed his confidence, I don't know. Maybe the fact they changed the offense up when Kizer went under center hurt his game. Maybe the fact our running game was very inconsistent this year hurt his production. It's likely a combination of these factors, but I think it's a stretch to say he's not a P5 QB. You're basing your judgement on limited snaps in a season where we went 4-8 as a team. I'm basing them on limited snaps from 1-2 years ago. The reality is Malik probably falls somewhere in the middle of both arguments.

 

[ThePiombino]

MVP of the Music City bowl against a very tough LSU defense, and dismantled a mediocre Texas team, but not good enough to be a P5 QB? Things changed when he got injured. Maybe it destroyed his confidence, I don't know. Maybe the fact they changed the offense up when Kizer went under center hurt his game. Maybe the fact our running game was very inconsistent this year hurt his production. It's likely a combination of these factors, but I think it's a stretch to say he's not a P5 QB. You're basing your judgement on limited snaps in a season where we went 4-8 as a team. I'm basing them on limited snaps from 1-2 years ago. The reality is Malik probably falls somewhere in the middle of both arguments.

It's probably not as bad as I think, but I think now (as I did at the time) that he was the beneficiary of an anemic Texas defense and an unmotivated LSU team. I definitely think the injury set him back, probably mentally as well as physically, but I still think he never had the tools to be a success in this offense. Just too much of it depends on the QB to make a throw every now and again. Even when the O waw dumbed down for EG and TR, they were still able to make certain throws/reads. MZ never showed that, IMO

 

[IrishLion]

Whoh, since when? Are we basing it off the small sample size this year, or the small sample size last year and LSU? I don't have much comment on the read option this year, but to be honest our entire running game was up and down this year, so it's hard to say anything. Last year and in the LSU game? Malik was spot on with the read option, and the BEST quarterback Kelly has had at ND with the read. Kelly's QBs at ND have often struggled with the right read, but at least prior to this year Malik was the most consistent with it. Kizer was pretty good with it during his career too, but he had his struggles too as our running game had inconsistencies so it's hard to give a fair grade when the blocking was so up and down.

Gotta disagree here. There were only a few times against LSU (that I remember) where he actually had the chance to make the read, and two times he made wrong choice to keep it and got himself trapped behind the LOS, and there was another play that would have been an easy 30+ yard TD for Folston had he given up the ball, even though he got what he needed on his own I believe.

Kizer didn't have as many chances to actually make a "read" this year, but he was money nearly every time he ran it last year. I think Kizer has been BK's best QB in terms of actually making the right "read," though there is an argument that 2011 Andrew Hendrix was actually the best at making the read (but he got way too few opportunities).

 

[ulukinatme]

It's probably not as bad as I think, but I think now (as I did at the time) that he was the beneficiary of an anemic Texas defense and an unmotivated LSU team. I definitely think the injury set him back, probably mentally as well as physically, but I still think he never had the tools to be a success in this offense. Just too much of it depends on the QB to make a throw every now and again. Even when the O waw dumbed down for EG and TR, they were still able to make certain throws/reads. MZ never showed that, IMO

Yeah, I don't know what the answer is for sure. Maybe it was the injury, maybe it was the change in offense, but Malik could throw the ball at one point. He was 12/15 in the LSU game, and 19/22 in the Texas game. Whatever happened after that I can't say, but at least in a fixed point in time he showed he could throw and be accurate. Both Kizer and Zaire's completion percentages dropped this year. If I had to guess losing Fuller's speed and ability to take the top off defenses probably had the biggest impact on those numbers.

 

[ulukinatme]

Gotta disagree here. There were only a few times against LSU (that I remember) where he actually had the chance to make the read, and two times he made wrong choice to keep it and got himself trapped behind the LOS, and there was another play that would have been an easy 30+ yard TD for Folston had he given up the ball, even though he got what he needed on his own I believe.

Kizer didn't have as many chances to actually make a "read" this year, but he was money nearly every time he ran it last year. I think Kizer has been BK's best QB in terms of actually making the right "read," though there is an argument that 2011 Andrew Hendrix was actually the best at making the read (but he got way too few opportunities).

I don't know if you can put Hendrix and read option in the same sentence. I can think of a big run he picked up against Air Force in 2011, but outside of that? I still have nightmares of that 2013 USC game...over a whole career, I'm not sure Kelly has had a QB that was more indecisive with the read option.

 

[GowerND11]

Yeah, I don't know what the answer is for sure. Maybe it was the injury, maybe it was the change in offense, but Malik could throw the ball at one point. He was 12/15 in the LSU game, and 19/22 in the Texas game. Whatever happened after that I can't say, but at least in a fixed point in time he showed he could throw and be accurate. Both Kizer and Zaire's completion percentages dropped this year. If I had to guess losing Fuller's speed and ability to take the top off defenses probably had the biggest impact on those numbers.

Both the LSU and 1st Texas games he played loose. He had nothing to lose. He was excited, happy, and confident. The second Texas game he looked like a player who was nervous. He knew Kizer was right there ready to come in after him. He seemed to try to do too much. I don't think the play calling helped him either, but MZ just looked so stressed and uncomfortable.

JMHO

 

[Irish Insanity]

I think Kelly just honestly has a soft spot for Malik and that's why the restrictions were lifted.

I think he made the right decision. There's no reason after a person graduates they shouldn't have free choice.

 

[IrishLion]

I don't know if you can put Hendrix and read option in the same sentence. I can think of a big run he picked up against Air Force in 2011, but outside of that? I still have nightmares of that 2013 USC game...over a whole career, I'm not sure Kelly has had a QB that was more indecisive with the read option.

Idk, I seem to recall Hendrix killing it in the run game late in the season whenever he got his opportunities, but Kelly would always pull him off the field once they got inside the 15 (which then killed the drive nearly every time).

 

[BobbyMac]

You forgot the part where he laid an egg against UVA...and every opportunity since then.

Laid an egg? You've bought into the lazy narrative that's grown over time.

What was the score when he went out in the 3rd Q?

What happened on the next play when Kizer came in?

What were his rushing stats?

How many TO's did he have?

How many passes did AA Will Fuller drop?

Was it Texas? Nope. Was it laying an egg? Nope.

I'd take MZ's UVa performance every time over Golson's 446 yd performance at ASU in '14.

 

[GowerND11]

Laid an egg? You've bought into the lazy narrative that's grown over time.

What was the score when he went out in the 3rd Q?

What happened on the next play when Kizer came in?

What were his rushing stats?

How many TO's did he have?

How many passes did AA Will Fuller drop?

Was it Texas? Nope. Was it laying an egg? Nope.

I'd take MZ's UVa performance every time over Golson's 446 yd performance at ASU in '14.

7/18 115 yards 1TD 62 QPR (59 yards on a pass to Fuller)
10 for 87 rushing (long of 39)
it was 19-14 ND winning when he went out (26-14 Next play)

MK was stinking it up... The whole offense was for most of the game, but I would not take that performance over EG's... I wouldn't want either to be honest, but hell if we had a defense at all, EG doesn't have to throw that second pick 6...