Media Matters

NDWarrior

Well-known member
Messages
3,002
Reaction score
2,421
The Charlie Kirk I Knew by Adam Rubenstein in The Free Press:


or

______________________________________________________________________________________________-

This afternoon, the conservative activist Charlie Kirk was shot and killed while speaking onstage at an event on the campus of Utah Valley University. Kirk, 31, was one of the most influential figures on the contemporary American right. In the below essay, Adam Rubenstein remembers Charlie Kirk, the subject of his 2018 profile, Kid Trump. Here he is on “The Charlie Kirk I Knew.” We’ll be bringing you more on this story in the coming hours and days. —The Editors



In 2019, Charlie Kirk and I were, by complete coincidence, on the same flight, Denver to Chicago. I was going to visit my girlfriend in law school, and he was going home to visit his family in Lemont, a Chicago suburb. He technically still lived with his parents—for the few days a year he wasn’t on the road building his organization, Turning Point USA—and was returning home after a campus visit in Colorado.

While walking down the aisle, Charlie spotted me, sitting in a middle seat at the back of the plane, and asked the person next to me to switch seats so we could catch up. She obliged, and Charlie sat down next to me. It had been about a year since I’d seen him last. We knew each other because I had written a profile of him in The Weekly Standard, a conservative magazine that was shuttered later that year—a sign of how the conservative movement was transforming in the age of Trump. While we closed our doors, Charlie was raising millions and speaking in front of sold out audiences.

The profile I wrote ended up on the magazine’s cover in August 2018. “Kid Trump” was its headline. To deliver the story, I had spent a week with Charlie, then 24 years old, in Washington, D.C., backstage at a summit he put on for high schoolers in Turning Point USA, on George Washington University’s campus. Five members of the cabinet appeared, as did Mark Cuban, Kellyanne Conway, and Fox News’ Jesse Watters. Students traveled from across the country to attend. Parents came with their children, thrilled by the prospect of seeing Charlie up close.

In the months before publication, I’d meet him periodically at “The Trump,” as he called it—the old post office where President Trump had a hotel.

He was always mobbed. Hotel guests and Trump-adjacent figures would come up to him as we talked. They’d introduce themselves, ask for a selfie, and thank him for his work bringing conservative ideas to America’s youth.

In the profile, I described the movement Charlie was building and what motivated him. He had decided at age 18 against going to college so that he could build Turning Point, to fight back against left-wing excesses—and would tell his audience of adoring, mostly young men and women things that we used to take for granted. Things like “America is the greatest country in the history of the world.” And “The Constitution is the greatest political document ever written.” And “Free market capitalism is the most moral and proven economic system to lift the most people out of poverty into prosperity.”

It is a sign of our times that such messages are now considered radical or fringe.

His talent for public oration, and his infectiously good attitude, propelled him forward. He would say yes to—or try to make happen—any request of him that he could: a student asking him a question about Murray Rothbard (a libertarian economist), an activist asking for a photo (the answer was always yes), a reporter asking about the latest Trump tweet (that was me).

In the week I spent following him around, what I found most striking was how someone at such a young age could command the attention and respect that he did—and in such a short period.

The profile was fair, and by no means a puff piece. And while his flack reached out to me to tell me that I was a Never Trump reptile (or something like that), Charlie texted me a link to my own story and said, “Well done!”

He had a mission. It filled him with meaning. And that, above all, was why he convinced countless young people to listen to him, to change their lives for the better, to stand up for things that used to be called common sense.
That was Charlie. If I had to use a single word to capture him, it would be gracious. We could disagree about anything—and we did—but he would, without fail, engage civilly and explain his point of view. He did not do this, as many do, to make himself feel smart. He did it so he could share the other side of something he cared about. And he cared deeply.

That’s the spirit he took to the hundreds of campuses he visited. Not denunciation. Not shouting down. Never an insult. He sought to debate ideas, and did so in hostile territory. Charlie all but recreated the public town square on these campuses with a tent and an irrepressible smile in an era where many people of his generation can’t look up from their phones.

Today, upon news of Charlie’s murder at the hands of a still-unknown shooter at a university in Utah, Donald Trump said that “No one understood or had the Heart of the Youth in the United States of America better than Charlie.” It was more than that. I saw it. He had a mission. It filled him with meaning. And that, above all, was why he convinced countless young people to listen to him, to change their lives for the better, to stand up for things that used to be called common sense.

Charlie Kirk was not naive. In the video after he is shot, you can see a security team of at least half a dozen bodyguards surround him and spirit him away. Like anyone speaking their mind in public these days, he knew there was a risk.

He had the courage anyway. And today he died under one of those tents where he defended freedom—his, and all of ours.

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch...86161-72bb-4eba-9dbe-d827e7c8ec54_1320x30.png
 

GATTACA!

It's about to get gross
Messages
15,104
Reaction score
12,943
I didn't get that when I listened to it, I think he pivoted to general gun deaths.

Knife guy isn't going to kill Charlie Kirk from 200 yards, he's going to stab 10 conservatives standing near him.

They took the guns in the UK. Now they have Knife Crime Awareness Week.
In 2024 there were 262 deaths via knife in the UK and Whales. Counting for the difference in population that would equal 1,308 people in the US.

In 2024 there were 16,576 deaths due to firearms in the US.

They aren't even remotely comparable.
 

TorontoGold

Mr. Dumb Moron
Messages
7,352
Reaction score
5,707
I didn't get that when I listened to it, I think he pivoted to general gun deaths.

Knife guy isn't going to kill Charlie Kirk from 200 yards, he's going to stab 10 conservatives standing near him.

They took the guns in the UK. Now they have Knife Crime Awareness Week.

But he did mention school shootings a few moments after making that claim, yes?

Let's take this line of thinking on stabbings, do you know how many mass stabbings have happened in 2025 in the UK? Well, there was one incident in which two people died, and the other was one that injured five people. There is no rational belief that 10 people would get stabbed instead of Kirk being shot.

So, I think we know what happens when the guns get taken away, the killings decrease. Take a peak at this list https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/mass-shooting and tell me with a straight face the same shit happens if someone has a knife.

Kids in schools and people like Charlie Kirk do not deserve to die. Saying someone would do the same damage with a knife is ignoring facts and being ok with trading a political commentators life for. If kids getting gunned down on a daily basis doesn't move a person, maybe someone who's on their "side" would?
 

Tejas

The Rizzard of Shiz
Messages
1,748
Reaction score
844
In 2024 there were 262 deaths via knife in the UK and Whales. Counting for the difference in population that would equal 1,308 people in the US.

In 2024 there were 16,576 deaths due to firearms in the US.

They aren't even remotely comparable.
How are you counting for the difference in population?
 

greyhammer90

the drunk piano player
Messages
16,821
Reaction score
16,085
Yeah, because y'all hide in little passive aggressive insinuations, dredging up quotes of his about the Second Amendment as if it really matters. The man was murdered.

I'll say this, as I mentioned earlier this afternoon, there is a dangerous level of political violence that's been building in this country from extremists on both sides, and I put a ton of blame at the feet of social media and political rhetoric demonizing the other side. Kirk may have been a great Christian and father, as many are saying. I have no reason to believe he wasn't. He was also a member of a group of political pundits that have become verrrry rich and very influencial by ramping up the national rhetoric to unhealthy levels. These people include left and right winger online pundits/trolls Hassan Pike, Cenk Uygar, Shapiro, Alex Jones, Laura Loomer, Destiny, Tim Pool, etc. Some of these people are genuine believers in their cause. I suspect most are grifters. None of these people, including Charlie Kirk, deserve any violence against them. But I disagree that it's the equivalent of wishing violence on someone to point out that they have been playing a dangerous game by fucking around with crazy people for profit and that there is an element of morbid inevitably that surrounds this tragedy. I'm frankly shocked it took this long. If you think that's me being passive aggressive or condoning violence, I'll just have to disagree and move on.
 

Tejas

The Rizzard of Shiz
Messages
1,748
Reaction score
844
But he did mention school shootings a few moments after making that claim, yes?

Let's take this line of thinking on stabbings, do you know how many mass stabbings have happened in 2025 in the UK? Well, there was one incident in which two people died, and the other was one that injured five people. There is no rational belief that 10 people would get stabbed instead of Kirk being shot.

So, I think we know what happens when the guns get taken away, the killings decrease. Take a peak at this list https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/mass-shooting and tell me with a straight face the same shit happens if someone has a knife.

Kids in schools and people like Charlie Kirk do not deserve to die. Saying someone would do the same damage with a knife is ignoring facts and being ok with trading a political commentators life for. If kids getting gunned down on a daily basis doesn't move a person, maybe someone who's on their "side" would?
He mentioned armed security on school grounds.

Not all them on the list but a lot could definitely be done by knife. Someone motivated could stab 10 people in close proximity I'll bet.

There's no being ok with trading a political commentators life kids lives. That's a bullshit argument.
 

TorontoGold

Mr. Dumb Moron
Messages
7,352
Reaction score
5,707
He mentioned armed security on school grounds.

Not all them on the list but a lot could definitely be done by knife. Someone motivated could stab 10 people in close proximity I'll bet.

There's no being ok with trading a political commentators life kids lives. That's a bullshit argument.
Yes. We know what happened at Parkland right? If we're trying to use real life examples, and not outlandish what ifs, then we have evidence.

In a nation of 69M people (UK), there was only two incidents in the past decade in which there were over 10 people stabbed. You mean to tell me, that they're just not "motivated" enough to get those numbers up? Now that's a bullshit argument.

What kind of argument would you say is making up hypotheticals of scenarios that aren't based in any sort of reality? How should I respond to someone creating these outlandish scenario's in order to avoid saying the obvious?
 

Tejas

The Rizzard of Shiz
Messages
1,748
Reaction score
844
There were 2 incidents. That is reality. What if I said 8? Are you saying mentally ill people won't kill if they don't have a gun?

A man was murdered in front of his family. He would have gladly given you a platform and debated you. You're being a dick about it. You say a lot of dumb shit that rubs people the wrong way. But I wouldn't want you murdered for it. And if you or yours were injured in some way, I'd feel pretty bad about it.

Edit: Tejas out
 

GATTACA!

It's about to get gross
Messages
15,104
Reaction score
12,943
These people include left and right winger online pundits/trolls Hassan Pike, Cenk Uygar, Shapiro, Alex Jones, Laura Loomer, Destiny, Tim Pool, etc.
Agree completely. Especially someone like Piker my reaction would be basically the same as it was to Kirk. If you've become extremely wealthy and built your entire brand around pushing violent rhetoric and sowing division what do you expect is going to happen? I feel bad for his family and think it's horrible that this is the point we are at as a society, but at a certain point FAAFO.
 

Bane

Well-known member
Messages
2,303
Reaction score
4,844
I'll say this, as I mentioned earlier this afternoon, there is a dangerous level of political violence that's been building in this country from extremists on both sides, and I put a ton of blame at the feet of social media and political rhetoric demonizing the other side. Kirk may have been a great Christian and father, as many are saying. I have no reason to believe he wasn't. He was also a member of a group of political pundits that have become verrrry rich and very influencial by ramping up the national rhetoric to unhealthy levels. These people include left and right winger online pundits/trolls Hassan Pike, Cenk Uygar, Shapiro, Alex Jones, Laura Loomer, Destiny, Tim Pool, etc. Some of these people are genuine believers in their cause. I suspect most are grifters. None of these people, including Charlie Kirk, deserve any violence against them. But I disagree that it's the equivalent of wishing violence on someone to point out that they have been playing a dangerous game by fucking around with crazy people for profit and that there is an element of morbid inevitably that surrounds this tragedy. I'm frankly shocked it took this long. If you think that's me being passive aggressive or condoning violence, I'll just have to disagree and move on.
I wasn't thinking of you. But honestly, I'm going to dip back out of the politics on this board and stick other areas of the board. This part of the forum is a shithole.
 

GATTACA!

It's about to get gross
Messages
15,104
Reaction score
12,943
Which ones?
I'm not sure what your insinuation here is but if you're a typical MAGA, London has fallen, Sharia Law is taking over type wouldn't that make your argument even weaker? Despite out of control immigration ruining the country their knife violence is still only 1/16 as bad as our gun violence per capita?
 

TorontoGold

Mr. Dumb Moron
Messages
7,352
Reaction score
5,707
There were 2 incidents. That is reality. What if I said 8? Are you saying mentally ill people won't kill if they don't have a gun?

A man was murdered in front of his family. He would have gladly given you a platform and debated you. You're being a dick about it. You say a lot of dumb shit that rubs people the wrong way. But I wouldn't want you murdered for it. And if you or yours were injured in some way, I'd feel pretty bad about it.

Edit: Tejas out

If you said 8? I don't know man, I'm live fact checking your argument that you're making on the fly. Where did I state mentally ill people won't kill? My point is that you are living in fantasy land if you think that if you switch guns with knives the violence stays at the same rate.

Can you point to what I'm being a dick about? I have quoted his own words. I say a lot of inflammatory shit, but so do a lot of others here, why don't you go run along to the RIP thread and be outraged at the "dumb shit" being said there.

I have not once had the opinion that a political commentator should be killed. I think political leaders should only be killed after a trial in which they are brought through a proper judicial system. I think no one on the Left should have a gun. I've remained consistent in these views, and even those on the Right on IE can attest that I do not seek out political violence for people I disagree with.

Take it this way, if Anthony Fauci died from a vaccine reaction, would you and others be on here admonishing people for posting his public stances on vaccines?
 

sfk324

Well-known member
Messages
1,710
Reaction score
2,270
There were 2 incidents. That is reality. What if I said 8? Are you saying mentally ill people won't kill if they don't have a gun?

A man was murdered in front of his family. He would have gladly given you a platform and debated you. You're being a dick about it. You say a lot of dumb shit that rubs people the wrong way. But I wouldn't want you murdered for it. And if you or yours were injured in some way, I'd feel pretty bad about it.

Edit: Tejas out
This same man didn't have a problem with children being killed in schools. Those children would have gladly colored a picture for you or given you a hug if you said you were sad. People being mowed down in church? Or at a music festival? Meh for good ol' Charlie. Kids were shot in a church going to pray on the first day of school, they were shot in a high school today. None of them did anything to anybody. But this guy--who argued those deaths are just a cost of living in America and we just need to accept them--this guy's death is what's horrible about our society. Get fucking real. He argued that it's just rational that deaths like his are an acceptable cost of living in our society. So people not giving too many shits about it is really just the best tribute to his arguments one can have.

Like I said I feel bad for his family and friends. I'm not celebrating anything. But more sympathy and empathy are reserved for people like those kids in St Paul.
 

drayer54

Well-known member
Messages
8,379
Reaction score
5,807
2 Democratic lawmakers and their dog are gunned down in their homes by a MAGA lunatic. Trump is radio silent. Doesn't attend the funeral, make a statement about the unacceptability of the actions, call their governor, or lower the federal flags.

A MAGA political commentator is killed by a lunatic. Trump is on the phone with the Utah governor within 90 minutes, made a statement on social media, and has already ordered all federal flag be set to half mast.

Any IE MAGA members want to comment on Trumps handling of these two events?
MAGA lunatic is revisionist history at its finest.

1757556799093.png
 

Bishop2b5

SEC Exchange Student
Messages
8,929
Reaction score
6,159
Somewhat surprising, but MSNBC quickly fired Matthew Dowd for inappropriate comments about the Charlie Kirk murder. Even they found it unacceptable and quickly apologized for his comments and terminated him.

 

ulukinatme

Carr for QB 2025!
Messages
31,516
Reaction score
17,382
I'll say this, as I mentioned earlier this afternoon, there is a dangerous level of political violence that's been building in this country from extremists on both sides, and I put a ton of blame at the feet of social media and political rhetoric demonizing the other side. Kirk may have been a great Christian and father, as many are saying. I have no reason to believe he wasn't. He was also a member of a group of political pundits that have become verrrry rich and very influencial by ramping up the national rhetoric to unhealthy levels. These people include left and right winger online pundits/trolls Hassan Pike, Cenk Uygar, Shapiro, Alex Jones, Laura Loomer, Destiny, Tim Pool, etc. Some of these people are genuine believers in their cause. I suspect most are grifters. None of these people, including Charlie Kirk, deserve any violence against them. But I disagree that it's the equivalent of wishing violence on someone to point out that they have been playing a dangerous game by fucking around with crazy people for profit and that there is an element of morbid inevitably that surrounds this tragedy. I'm frankly shocked it took this long. If you think that's me being passive aggressive or condoning violence, I'll just have to disagree and move on.

Amen. Social media has given a platform to every idiot with an opinion, no matter how extreme. 30-40 years ago extremists didn't have the reach and voice they have today, it was print media and regulated television/radio only. The media has gotten worse with the propaganda too, it comes down to the rise of the internet and the 24/7 news cycle. They've got to fill time, which means creating drama and controversy where none exists. Left, right, it doesn't matter. There's been too much pain the last two weeks with the shootings and stabbings. I don't know how it gets better without stepping on free speech, and that's going to be a fight.
 

GATTACA!

It's about to get gross
Messages
15,104
Reaction score
12,943
Amen. Social media has given a platform to every idiot with an opinion, no matter how extreme. 30-40 years ago extremists didn't have the reach and voice they have today, it was print media and regulated television/radio only. The media has gotten worse with the propaganda too, it comes down to the rise of the internet and the 24/7 news cycle. They've got to fill time, which means creating drama and controversy where none exists. Left, right, it doesn't matter. There's been too much pain the last two weeks with the shootings and stabbings. I don't know how it gets better without stepping on free speech, and that's going to be a fight.
I've said for years that 24/7 news should be outlawed across the board. It's the #1 dividing force in our society.
 

greyhammer90

the drunk piano player
Messages
16,821
Reaction score
16,085
Amen. Social media has given a platform to every idiot with an opinion, no matter how extreme. 30-40 years ago extremists didn't have the reach and voice they have today, it was print media and regulated television/radio only. The media has gotten worse with the propaganda too, it comes down to the rise of the internet and the 24/7 news cycle. They've got to fill time, which means creating drama and controversy where none exists. Left, right, it doesn't matter. There's been too much pain the last two weeks with the shootings and stabbings. I don't know how it gets better without stepping on free speech, and that's going to be a fight.

I'm a huge privacy guy, but after spending many hours thinking on it a potential answer would be to require an ID to create an account and real names to be publicly associated with accounts ONLY on the major social media sites (Facebook, Twitter, instagram, TikTok, reddit). There have been plenty of studies that show that sites like IE can remain anonymous without much damage. We're a small community that self regulates behavior and have a common interest that helps smooth over differences (mostly). On the other hand Twitter is a cesspool and I think part of it is the citizenry's fault, but I genuinely believe a huge part of it is that bots and trolls from Russia, China, etc. are constantly stirring the pot. I can't even read reddit threads anymore because its so obvious how many redditors are Russian AI bots making every topic into an "America Bad" circlejerk.

Unfortunately I don't think that will ever happen because I think if people knew how many "users" on these sites weren't real people the value would tank.
 

sfk324

Well-known member
Messages
1,710
Reaction score
2,270
I'm a huge privacy guy, but after spending many hours thinking on it a potential answer would be to require an ID to create an account and real names to be publicly associated with accounts ONLY on the major social media sites (Facebook, Twitter, instagram, TikTok, reddit). There have been plenty of studies that show that sites like IE can remain anonymous without much damage. We're a small community that self regulates behavior and have a common interest that helps smooth over differences (mostly). On the other hand Twitter is a cesspool and I think part of it is the citizenry's fault, but I genuinely believe a huge part of it is that bots and trolls from Russia, China, etc. are constantly stirring the pot. I can't even read reddit threads anymore because its so obvious how many redditors are Russian AI bots making every topic into an "America Bad" circlejerk.

Unfortunately I don't think that will ever happen because I think if people knew how many "users" on these sites weren't real people the value would tank.
I remember when it used to be a violation of the Facebook Terms of Service to use a name other than your actual government name or use a picture other than your actual face as the profile picture. They would suspend accounts until people fixed these issues. There is far too much money in having "unique" users for them to actually go back to that.
 

ulukinatme

Carr for QB 2025!
Messages
31,516
Reaction score
17,382
I'm a huge privacy guy, but after spending many hours thinking on it a potential answer would be to require an ID to create an account and real names to be publicly associated with accounts ONLY on the major social media sites (Facebook, Twitter, instagram, TikTok, reddit). There have been plenty of studies that show that sites like IE can remain anonymous without much damage. We're a small community that self regulates behavior and have a common interest that helps smooth over differences (mostly). On the other hand Twitter is a cesspool and I think part of it is the citizenry's fault, but I genuinely believe a huge part of it is that bots and trolls from Russia, China, etc. are constantly stirring the pot. I can't even read reddit threads anymore because its so obvious how many redditors are Russian AI bots making every topic into an "America Bad" circlejerk.

Unfortunately I don't think that will ever happen because I think if people knew how many "users" on these sites weren't real people the value would tank.
Bluesky hasn't had enough time to build the following/bots that Twitter has, but I'd add them to the list for toxic sites. It's pretty sick to see people on both platforms celebrating.
 

Tejas

The Rizzard of Shiz
Messages
1,748
Reaction score
844
If you said 8? I don't know man, I'm live fact checking your argument that you're making on the fly. Where did I state mentally ill people won't kill? My point is that you are living in fantasy land if you think that if you switch guns with knives the violence stays at the same rate.

Can you point to what I'm being a dick about? I have quoted his own words. I say a lot of inflammatory shit, but so do a lot of others here, why don't you go run along to the RIP thread and be outraged at the "dumb shit" being said there.

I have not once had the opinion that a political commentator should be killed. I think political leaders should only be killed after a trial in which they are brought through a proper judicial system. I think no one on the Left should have a gun. I've remained consistent in these views, and even those on the Right on IE can attest that I do not seek out political violence for people I disagree with.

Take it this way, if Anthony Fauci died from a vaccine reaction, would you and others be on here admonishing people for posting his public stances on vaccines?
Fair enough. I think Charlie Kirk would say his own death is the cost of living in a society with guns. I'm pretty sure I would agree with you on any gun control measures you offer, unless it's take all the guns away.

Fauci is evil and a piece of shit. But if people were hurting because of his death, I would respect the people that were hurting because of his death.
 
Top