'21 CA QB Tyler Buchner (ND FB -> Bama FB -> ND LAX???)

[CoachB]

"Outright dismissive of his longterm potential.""--- that commentary does NOT appear in my post.
But, to interpret my post one needs to take all the elements of it into consideration, which admittedly we're not good at here.

The post sketches the scenario where TB does not play as a starter for ND because the other QBs have the mental traits under fire that TB has not only not demonstrated yet but has spectacularly not done so. The post does not presume that TB is not sufficiently talented in lots of ways, nor that he won't go elsewhere to play, and gradually get the wild yips out of his system. NONE OF THAT IS BEING OUTRIGHT DISMISSIVE of this athlete. Notre Dame is pressured to WIN NOW, and if there are choices to not have to wait until "growing pains" subside (and games are lost) then it is the job of Coach Marcus to play the guy who will win now.

I think this is the first time I have disagreed with you, Mike. And you are absolutely entitled to your opinion. I don't see any yips at all. I see cool, calm, and composed. The ability to have a short memory is a key trait in a QB. Considering how few starts he has had, he was incredibly impressive. As previously stated, he has way fewer starts recently than the 5* Clemson kid and he looks way better. Not saying Tyler will win the job, but it did make it sound as if he isn't as good as Minchey, Carr, etc...I guess we will see.

I really, really hope Hartman comes and gives our guys some time to learn under him. Excited what this offense can do with the timing and accuracy of Sam.

 

[CoachB]

Mike, I'm not attacking you and I'll rephrase the outright dismissive phrase as a poor choice of words in my mini novel. Sometimes, one runs out of words to give without sounding repetitive! As I wrote, I really respect your opinion on all matters here.

I am not advocating for Tyler to start over Sam Hartman if/when he comes to ND. I 100% agree that win now is the prerogative and Hartman would be the clear choice.

I also couldn't say that Minchey and Carr would be definitively better than TB immediately upon arrival based solely on HS performance. I keep referencing Cole Klubnick who had all of the traits under fire you could want in HS (3x Texas State football champion) but even he does not have that poise immediately. Bryce Young sat a year before starting at Alabama. Even the most highly touted need time.

If Tyler stays around in 2024, he will be in his 4th year of the system and have lots more in-game experience. It's just my opinion that he did show enough growth in these last 3 months to think the program would still be in good hands - and maybe that's where our opinions differ and that's ok by me. I don't think we've seen the last of Tyler as QB1 in that case. He could be an excellent option and ND would be in good QB hands. A room of Kenny Minchey and CJ Carr who could develop at that point would set ND up for offensive success AND succession for years to come.

I wish I had read this post before I wrote mine. Apologies. This is what I wanted to say, but with much more eloquence.

 

[IrishLion]

His confidence (which was already much higher than I expected to start the game) grew like crazy throughout the game
(defense also got more swaggy throughout game).

TBs style of play is so "impromptu" that I think a consistent rhythm for him is important. Give that man more games and more reads and he's going to ball out. Truly looks like a backyard brawler playing out there.

He’s like if Wimbush and Golson were melded in a lab. Better runner than Golson, but not quite the runner Wimbush was. More accurate than Wimbush, but not near the arm talent that Golson had. A perfect balance of the two, but happens to turn the ball over too much like Golson did (but with INT’s instead of fumbles).

If we could get one of these QB’s with freakish physical attributes to either protect the ball or make consistently accurate throws, we’d win a natty.

Idk if TB12 can solve enough of his problems to get there. Probably not if we’re being honest. But last night made it seem like more of a possibility than it was before.

Reps reps reps. But will he get them??

 

[Grahambo]

I only remember two true mistakes him making: the late pick 6 (horrible play call doesn’t excuse his decision) and the flipped forward pass to JT that was picked.

The first pick 6 was off a tipped pass. He had some rusty throws and held the ball too long a couple of times (lack of experience) but he did get everyone involved. He also got better as the game wore on.

Seven ND players had at least 3 targets. He showed decent zip with limited range but it’s far enough. The mobility is a huge boost to his profile. He has a strong mentality as evidenced by coming back this season from his injury, not blinking when told of bringing in a transfer QB, the hits he took, and not letting the INTs ruin his day.

I still choose Hartman for next season but if Buch beats him out, look out.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

I still choose Hartman for next season but if Buch beats him out, look out.

Hartman+Buch+Steve+Minchey >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Buch+Drew+Steve

QB depth is about to explode with improvement. Should trickle down to improved play at 2nd and 3rd strings, even scout team. Improved practices all around.

 

[FWIrish4]

I don’t think we’re fully appreciating how difficult and impressive this throw is.

Some can talk about inaccuracy and his throwing motion until they’re blue in the face, but this throw right here tells me all I need to know.

The kid can sling it and has elite body control to stand in the pocket to take a hit, throw off platform, change arm angle and perfectly place the ball in stride. Obviously he’s got to be more consistent, but the deep ball to Lenzy is another example of not being able to step into it, throwing deep with ease and having touch to throw to a spot to get lenzy open.

Hartman 2023 and I like Buchner’s chances in 2024 with more development.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Again, I agree with you guys' assessments; I just wonder if TB will wait that long before transferring if Hartman plays.
And I think that Freeman and Rees will choose to play Hartman.

 

[IrishSpartan]

To me the picks weren’t the issue. What scares me is that he lacks touch on short throws. It’s one of the things I love about Minchey’s tape, that he always knows what type of speed the ball needs to be depending on the throw location. It seems Tyler lacks.

Also could the OLine issues actually be due to him? Idk if any of this has merit but it seemsd like the line really struggled this year when he was qb1. Don’t know how but could this have been the issue?

 

[Bluto]

Not really sure how you can evaluate Minchey and Carr and say with any certainty that they are not “loose cannons” when they have yet to stand in the pocket in the face of a D1 pass rush.

It’s interesting as well that one of the most common knocks against Hartman is that he had games where he threw a lot of ints.

 

[KPENN]

Again, I agree with you guys' assessments; I just wonder if TB will wait that long before transferring if Hartman plays.
And I think that Freeman and Rees will choose to play Hartman.

I think Buchner still being at ND tells me he stays and deep down I think Buchner knows there’s a good chance he’s #2 next season. A lot of the QB dominoes have already fallen, if he wanted to transfer I’m now sure where he goes. If I’m Freeman and Rees I sell him on playing next year and a change of pace guy with the chance to be a starter in 2024.

 

[Dizzyphil]

I think Buchner still being at ND tells me he stays and deep down I think Buchner knows there’s a good chance he’s #2 next season. A lot of the QB dominoes have already fallen, if he wanted to transfer I’m now sure where he goes. If I’m Freeman and Rees I sell him on playing next year and a change of pace guy with the chance to be a starter in 2024.

Have a current Irish buddy/fan stating that if the Irish pick up Hartman through the portal, the Irish should run a dual-qb system..... I'm against it IF it was to happen...

Thoughts IF it does happen???

 

[KPENN]

Have a current Irish buddy/fan stating that if the Irish pick up Hartman through the portal, the Irish should run a dual-qb system..... I'm against it IF it was to happen...

Thoughts IF it does happen???

I think 2 QB systems can work. I just think there needs to be a clear #1 and a clear #2. Zaire and Kizer was a disaster because it was still a competition.

 

[irishandy]

Have a current Irish buddy/fan stating that if the Irish pick up Hartman through the portal, the Irish should run a dual-qb system..... I'm against it IF it was to happen...

Thoughts IF it does happen???

If ND picks up Hartman I would want Buchner's role to be what it was in 2021.

 

[stlnd01]

I think Buchner still being at ND tells me he stays and deep down I think Buchner knows there’s a good chance he’s #2 next season. A lot of the QB dominoes have already fallen, if he wanted to transfer I’m now sure where he goes. If I’m Freeman and Rees I sell him on playing next year and a change of pace guy with the chance to be a starter in 2024.

Yep. The way Buchner talked about all this in some pre-bowl-game interview suggests he knows the score. They're going to bring in the best transfer possible. Buchner (unlike Pyne) will stay and compete with that guy for the job, but also knows he has three years of eligibility remaining and can learn from/wait out a one-year rental. He also knows from experience that QB2 is one play away from being QB1. And, not for nothing I suspect, he's on track to graduate this time next year, right? Lots of reasons to stay. And nowhere worth going will promise him a starting job next year anyway.

 

[benneboy]

In the portal. Didn't see that one coming

 

[CanadalovesND]

Portal.

 

[SoIll]

WOW!!!

 

[StPaul_Irish]

un real.

 

[CanadalovesND]

 

[CanadalovesND]

 

[MacIrish75]

He should transfer to Navy.

Best of luck to him…but honestly I like how this sets up. Allows us to take another grad transfer mercenary after this year to bridge the gap to Carr/Minchey.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

In the portal. Didn't see that one coming

I did. It makes sense. He needs to see if there is somewhere where he can be almost guaranteed a starting spot for the next three years.

 

[SouthSideChiDomer]

Also, note he said he might come back. He is exploring his options. He would be doing a disservice to his future if he didn't.

 

[zbikowski88]

Best of luck to him

 

[IrishSpartan]

Not upset, I will say that starting a young Qb career in a run package destroys them

 

[KPENN]

I love Notre Dame football

 

[irishff1014]

Oh shit. Ummm this ain't good.

 

[pumpdog20]

eh, not a fan of letting him shop himself then letting him come back if there's no takers. Hit the road if you must, move on to Angelli as backup.

 

[Luckylucci]

I mean, Sam Hartman is clearly the better option right now but I'll be extremely disappointed if Buch isn't around for next season to see his growth.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Dang this stings. But good luck to the young man