Police State USA

[TorontoGold]

George Floyd?

And I agree LeBron's tweet was a big problem, and super irresponsible.

It's just interesting to see the polarity of outrage from different political sides. My largely-conservative Facebook friends list is more mad about LeBron being irresponsible on Twitter than they would ever be about a cop wrongfully killing someone.

For example, they will add context to the George Floyd thing, bringing up his problematic past and drug use, and justifying Chauvin's actions... but they won't add context to LeBron's tone-deaf social media usage by mentioning all of the good he does for kids in his community or anything like that, and they don't think about how that might affect his thoughts and actions the way they do with other people/situations.

It's (a) black and (a) white situation for them.

 

[irishff1014]

Being in KY and surrounded by conservatives, my Facebook looks much the same. Not much outrage about the cop that was on camera murdering a guy... but a LOT of anger about the LeBron James tweet.

Interesting social dynamic to me.

I stink think the drugs killed Floyd. I see this more than enough. However, I said from day one the officer didn’t handle it properly. I was ok with throwing him to the ground and controlling him. Readjusting hand cuffs even if they had to put shackles on his ankles then let him up and put him in the suv. I don’t know because it was hard to see if that vehicle was a cage car. If it wasn’t call for one.

My problem with Lebron was hit pretty much put a hit on the officer for doing his job. Lebron has been a loud mouth and wrong most of the time.

 

[drayer54]

I stink think the drugs killed Floyd. I see this more than enough. However, I said from day one the officer didn’t handle it properly. I was ok with throwing him to the ground and controlling him. Readjusting hand cuffs even if they had to put shackles on his ankles then let him up and put him in the suv. I don’t know because it was hard to see if that vehicle was a cage car. If it wasn’t call for one.

My problem with Lebron was hit pretty much put a hit on the officer for doing his job. Lebron has been a loud mouth and wrong most of the time.

I would always wonder if he would have died had he not been on drugs and the influence of drugs on his death being a contributor would seem to be relevant, at least also in his behavior and resisting arrest.

It's (a) black and (a) white situation for them.

Way to stick to the line. Everyone who doesn't agree with me is racist. You have a future with MSNBC or CNN.

George Floyd?

And I agree LeBron's tweet was a big problem, and super irresponsible.

It's just interesting to see the polarity of outrage from different political sides. My largely-conservative Facebook friends list is more mad about LeBron being irresponsible on Twitter than they would ever be about a cop wrongfully killing someone.

For example, they will add context to the George Floyd thing, bringing up his problematic past and drug use, and justifying Chauvin's actions... but they won't add context to LeBron's tone-deaf social media usage by mentioning all of the good he does for kids in his community or anything like that, and they don't think about how that might affect his thoughts and actions the way they do with other people/situations.

Ahh, I mistook that for the Columbus thing being a murder.

I think a lot of people sympathize with police officers now because they are doing a very difficult job under the microscope and people know they are dealing with tough scenarios. Hell, you can serve your country, save someone's life, and find yourself being targeted by an a-hole athlete. Some of it is also a defense of police against the very radical approach to either defund or radically "reimagine policing."

I think Chauvin got some of that benefit of the doubt because the person he was leaning on was both flawed and a mess to arrest. It doesn't defend the length of time and pressure to the neck that Chauvin applied, but that's likely why he wasn't as criticized in conservative crowds. I also don't hear much criticism of the verdict.

Lebron doesn't get slack because he's been loud and "misinformed" on multiple issues before and has used his platform to target people and politicized a game. He's also generally unlikeable and consistently and recklessly wrong on issues involving the police. His campaign on the Jacob Blake and Ferguson issues was flat-out negligent. Lebron is only pissed because the wrong person died. Had that knife made it into the cop, Lebron would give them the China work camp silent treatment.

 

[NorthDakota]

LeBron does some very good things for kids and all that, but his shitty social and political takes are consistently awful and unhelpful.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

I stink think the drugs killed Floyd. I see this more than enough. However, I said from day one the officer didn’t handle it properly. I was ok with throwing him to the ground and controlling him. Readjusting hand cuffs even if they had to put shackles on his ankles then let him up and put him in the suv. I don’t know because it was hard to see if that vehicle was a cage car. If it wasn’t call for one.

My problem with Lebron was hit pretty much put a hit on the officer for doing his job. Lebron has been a loud mouth and wrong most of the time.

If you think this... why? All medical experts testified that that was 100% not the cause of his death except the defense's hired gun who made up every reasonunder the sun other than what actally killed him (virtually his entire testimony folded under cross examination as nothing more than unfounded specualtion).

 

[Rocket89]

It's (a) black and (a) white situation for them.

Racism? What no way, it can't be racism.

Also, have you considered that they don't watch the woke NBA, the ratings are terrible anyway, the game is a joke!

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

LeBron does some very good things for kids and all that, but his shitty social and political takes are consistently awful and unhelpful.

Ive seen enough from most people on SM to comfortably say 99% of peoples takes are consistently awful and unhelpful.

 

[TorontoGold]

Racism? What no way, it can't be racism.

Also, have you considered that they don't watch the woke NBA, the ratings are terrible anyway, the game is a joke!

You're telling me the people that refer to Kyle Rittenhouse, as "Kyle" and the people that refer to Adam Toledo as "Lil Homicide" aren't possibly the slightest bit racially indifferent? Hm, couldn't be.

Keep! Politics! Out! Of! Sports!

 

[GowerND11]

If you think this... why? All medical experts testified that that was 100% not the cause of his death except the defense's hired gun who made up every reasonunder the sun other than what actally killed him (virtually his entire testimony folded under cross examination as nothing more than unfounded specualtion).

Here's my issue on top of what you said about the whole OD defense people keep making. EVEN IF it was OD, then Chauvin is still responsible for his death as he continued to knee on an unconscious person, and, as a first responder, did not do what he is supposed to do and help him.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Here's my issue on top of what you said about the whole OD defense people keep making. EVEN IF it was OD, then Chauvin is still responsible for his death as he continued to knee on an unconscious person, and, as a first responder, did not do what he is supposed to do and help him.

Right. This man was "at best" negligent or with depraved mind. At a minimum his actions directly led to Floyds death. He denied any offers of assistence and the othe rofficers there kept people from approaching. He was not a threat. He was subdued. He had backup. Anything after the first 2-3 minutes was unecessary and directly contributed to his death.

 

[drayer54]

You're telling me the people that refer to Kyle Rittenhouse, as "Kyle" and the people that refer to Adam Toledo as "Lil Homicide" aren't possibly the slightest bit racially indifferent? Hm, couldn't be.

Keep! Politics! Out! Of! Sports!

People called Kyle Kyle. People didn't call Adam Toledo Adam or Kyle.

Huge difference in what these two did. The real difference led to the real result as to who is still alive today.

Libs who hate white men and in particular white men with guns lost their minds over Kyle Rittenhouse and I don't really get it. The bad takes on Kyle Rittenhouse have been surging lately.

Here's my issue on top of what you said about the whole OD defense people keep making. EVEN IF it was OD, then Chauvin is still responsible for his death as he continued to knee on an unconscious person, and, as a first responder, did not do what he is supposed to do and help him.

I think that's why people are OK with the verdict. No? Can you not wonder that maybe sober and in clean health- George Floyd would have possibly survived?

 

[GowerND11]

People called Kyle Kyle. People didn't call Adam Toledo Adam or Kyle.

Huge difference in what these two did. The real difference led to the real result as to who is still alive today.

Libs who hate white men and in particular white men with guns lost their minds over Kyle Rittenhouse and I don't really get it. The bad takes on Kyle Rittenhouse have been surging lately.



I think that's why people are OK with the verdict. No? Can you not wonder that maybe sober and in clean health- George Floyd would have possibly survived?

Sure you can wonder, but that still isn't giving a reasonable doubt though is it? Again, I think it still demonstrates the narrative though that somehow it excuses Chauvin's actions, no matter if Floyd was sober or on drugs, and that undermines the entire endeavour of reforming police training and tactics.

 

[TorontoGold]

People called Kyle Kyle. People didn't call Adam Toledo Adam or Kyle.

Huge difference in what these two did. The real difference led to the real result as to who is still alive today.

Libs who hate white men and in particular white men with guns lost their minds over Kyle Rittenhouse and I don't really get it. The bad takes on Kyle Rittenhouse have been surging lately.



I think that's why people are OK with the verdict. No? Can you not wonder that maybe sober and in clean health- George Floyd would have possibly survived?

Finally something we can agree on, although I'm guessing how and why we arrived at that conclusion is completely different.

 

[drayer54]

Sure you can wonder, but that still isn't giving a reasonable doubt though is it? Again, I think it still demonstrates the narrative though that somehow it excuses Chauvin's actions, no matter if Floyd was sober or on drugs, and that undermines the entire endeavour of reforming police training and tactics.

I think Chauvin's actions were likely defendable to a point, but he went well beyond what most people would call reasonable and I highly doubt that tactic, which apparently was too common before will be deployed again. Now that election season is over, it looks like we have a chance at some police reform.
https://news.yahoo.com/tim-scott-hopes-reintroduce-version-165404497.html

 

[drayer54]

Finally something we can agree on, although I'm guessing how and why we arrived at that conclusion is completely different.

If Adam Toledo would have greeted police like this, do you think would still be dead?

If Ma’Khia Bryant was standing like this when the police showed up, do you think she would still be dead?

If Jacob Blake had stood like this, do you think he would have been shot at?

Had Michael Brown stood like this, do you think he would have been shot?

If Daunte Wright had stood like this, do you think he would be dead?

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

People called Kyle Kyle. People didn't call Adam Toledo Adam or Kyle.

Huge difference in what these two did. The real difference led to the real result as to who is still alive today.

Libs who hate white men and in particular white men with guns lost their minds over Kyle Rittenhouse and I don't really get it. The bad takes on Kyle Rittenhouse have been surging lately.



I think that's why people are OK with the verdict. No? Can you not wonder that maybe sober and in clean health- George Floyd would have possibly survived?

You can "wonder" all you want but the medical evidence presented by medical proffessionals expressly ruled that out as contrbuting to death during the trial. Continuing to "wonder" is only harming any further discourse.

 

[Blazers46]

Sure you can wonder, but that still isn't giving a reasonable doubt though is it? Again, I think it still demonstrates the narrative though that somehow it excuses Chauvin's actions, no matter if Floyd was sober or on drugs, and that undermines the entire endeavour of reforming police training and tactics.

I think it gives reasonable doubt that Chauven killed him, but there is still no escaping Chauvins inaction still having his knee on a dead man.

 

[Blazers46]

The thing that bothers me is listening to the President and Co-President speak about racism and systemic racism... but anyone who watched the trial... did racism ever come up? I am still in the belief that if a 6ft 6in 230lb white man were in the same situation as Floyd the result would have been the same with all the same variables at play. Except Chauvin would be at home with his still married wife.

 

[NorthDakota]

You can "wonder" all you want but the medical evidence presented by medical proffessionals expressly ruled that out as contrbuting to death during the trial. Continuing to "wonder" is only harming any further discourse.

The medical examiner didn't seem to rule that out. If I recall, he expressly said drugs and medical conditions played a role. I think his main thing was there was no indication Floyd would have died If I recall, the prosecution certainly sought to downplay the impact of drugs on his death, but they didn't need to show it had no impact, they just needed to convince the jury that Chauvin acted unlawfully and that unlawful action was a substantial (i think) cause of death.

I dont think it's "harmful" for people to wonder. The medical examiner said the drugs and heart problems played a role. He examined the body after all. The prosecution got some hired guns that downplayed the drugs (whether they were right or wrong, only God knows).

I think it's safe to say he acted wrongly. I've never detained anyone, but at some point things crossed a line. But the whole "some of the doctors said drugs played no role so nobody can challenge that" seems extreme.

 

[RDU Irish]

Exactly. Even if you don't think there's enough evidence, whatever, for a murder conviction (which has been discussed ad nauseam here), this is still a criminal act that most of the public should agree is minimally manslaughter.

Again - I am no expert and did not follow the case as closely as others but how are the other cops not accessories to murder if Chauvin is guilty on all counts? Agree wholeheartedly that the manslaughter charge is a no brainer but struggle validating the murder charges. I can't get over the drugs in the system and him saying he couldn't breath for the entirety of the interaction - enough reasonable doubt in my opinion. That said, what idiot doesn't get out of that jury duty? I don't want any piece of that!

Ignored in the stabber death - the dude kicking a chick in the head as the cop runs up to shoot the girl with the knife. WTF! Chaotic situation he is running in to with multiple potential assailants to deal with.

Also appreciate Lax pointing out "hands up don't shoot" was lie, would be interesting to see how many people still believe it is true.

 

[RDU Irish]

You can "wonder" all you want but the medical evidence presented by medical proffessionals expressly ruled that out as contrbuting to death during the trial. Continuing to "wonder" is only harming any further discourse.

Cops deal with so many OD situations they should have been more sensitive to the possibility of Floyd dying, IMO. They - not just him. But to say all those drugs had no impact is about as silly as wearing two masks outside right now. Pretending only defense witnesses are biased with an agenda is absurd - the system works hard to get a "guilty" verdict.

 

[TorontoGold]

If Adam Toledo would have greeted police like this, do you think would still be dead?

If Ma’Khia Bryant was standing like this when the police showed up, do you think she would still be dead?

If Jacob Blake had stood like this, do you think he would have been shot at?

Had Michael Brown stood like this, do you think he would have been shot?

If Daunte Wright had stood like this, do you think he would be dead?

Lmao.

Rittenhouse was allowed to go home, and turn himself in the next morning. Wouldn't want to leave out that little minor tid bit, now would we.

 

[Irish#1]

Im not arguing wiht you but all the people who answered the question on whether he was taught to do that or if it was a method they used, they all said no its not something they are trained to to use or approve. If they said otherwise I'll stand corrected.

Conspiracy theorist inside me cant help thinking he was kneeling on Floyd to simulate and subsequently demean all of the kneeling inspred by Capernick and BLM. Especially that wry smile he game made me think he knew esactly what he was doing but proving that is immposible.

No argument. Just pointing out that approved or not approved, he shouldn't have stayed on his neck once he was restrained. He should have sat him up.

To the latter, I seriously doubt it. With everything going on at the moment, lights, sirens, a lot of officers talking, police radios squawking, bystanders yelling and he thinks back to Kaepernick kneeling?

I posted before, I think the smile may have convicted him as much as anything provided by the prosecution.

 

[NorthDakota]

Lmao.

Rittenhouse was allowed to go home, and turn himself in the next morning. Wouldn't want to leave out that little minor tid bit, now would we.

My understanding there was the police weren't aware of what events had just transpired. If so, would make sense to not detain the guy.

 

[Irish#1]

Lmao.

Rittenhouse was allowed to go home, and turn himself in the next morning. Wouldn't want to leave out that little minor tid bit, now would we.

Please answer with a Yes or a No after each question.

 

[Blazers46]

My understanding there was the police weren't aware of what events had just transpired. If so, would make sense to not detain the guy.

People also forget police are told to stand down when there is protesting/rioting/looting. They did not know who homicide Kyle was until afterward.

https://www.politifact.com/factcheck...se-go-claim-g/

Kenosha Police Chief Daniel Miskinis defended his department’s actions in an Aug. 28, 2020 news conference, saying the police in the vehicles didn’t see Rittenhouse as a threat and wouldn’t have heard yelling from the crowd over other noise. He said officers were more focused on the injuries and what happened down the street.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

The medical examiner didn't seem to rule that out. If I recall, he expressly said drugs and medical conditions played a role. I think his main thing was there was no indication Floyd would have died If I recall, the prosecution certainly sought to downplay the impact of drugs on his death, but they didn't need to show it had no impact, they just needed to convince the jury that Chauvin acted unlawfully and that unlawful action was a substantial (i think) cause of death.

I dont think it's "harmful" for people to wonder. The medical examiner said the drugs and heart problems played a role. He examined the body after all. The prosecution got some hired guns that downplayed the drugs (whether they were right or wrong, only God knows).

I think it's safe to say he acted wrongly. I've never detained anyone, but at some point things crossed a line. But the whole "some of the doctors said drugs played no role so nobody can challenge that" seems extreme.

" THERE WAS NO INDICATION HE WOULD HAVE DIED" = no role in his death? If you can provide me a quote becasue I clearly missed that part of thier testimony. I know they said he had an enlarged heart and two low functioning arteries but they didn’t kill him. Chauvin direct actions stressed his body to the point of death. Putting your knee on anyone’s neck. Long enough will kill them. Lol

Also my point about continuing to wonder is it does harm the ultimate understanding of the case and any truthfully honest discussion. To the point of no reasonable doubt they proved he died from the actions of Chauvin. Anything past this is injecting a bias.

 

[drayer54]

Lmao.

Rittenhouse was allowed to go home, and turn himself in the next morning. Wouldn't want to leave out that little minor tid bit, now would we.

This is spin, misleading, and doesn't answer the questions. Please answer each question with a yes or no.


While we wait for this excellent response, an expert on stabbings and justice has weighed in- This is expert level trolling

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/TheRealOJ32/status/1385268007203602433?s=20[/TWEET]

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

This is spin, misleading, and doesn't answer the questions. Please answer each question with a yes or no.


While we wait for this excellent response, an expert on stabbings and justice has weighed in- This is expert level trolling

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/TheRealOJ32/status/1385268007203602433?s=20[/TWEET]

This is funny (sorry not sorry)

 

[TorontoGold]

This is spin, misleading, and doesn't answer the questions. Please answer each question with a yes or no.


While we wait for this excellent response, an expert on stabbings and justice has weighed in- This is expert level trolling

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/TheRealOJ32/status/1385268007203602433?s=20[/TWEET]

Multiple reports have stated that people were shouting that he was the shooter to the police and they didn't arrest him then. I can provide a references to that being reported.

Why would I respond to a series of questions that are setup in a deceptive way that leaves out the most important part.