Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

[Sherm Sticky]

Honestly I started following ND football towards the end of the Holtz era. I've been through Davie, Willingham and Weis. Kelly can stay as long as he likes!


Sent via tapatalk

 

[Bluto]

He is a cursed man. From Declan Sullivan to Lennay Kekua to "Frozen Five" to injuries to turnovers... it's wild to think how different his tenure could've been if he had gotten some breaks.

You would think someone up in the Gug would have performed an exorcism by now. Get it together Jenkins. Lol.

 

[ND NYC]

You would think someone up in the Gug would have performed and exorcism by now. Get it together Jenkins. Lol.

they've never performed them in the Gug, oh wait....

 

[IrishLax]

How about Matt James, Will Mahone, Aaron Lynch, etc.


Sent via tapatalk

I completely forgot about Matt James. You could make a list a mile long.

Will Mahone, Aaron Lynch, etc. I consider typical attrition. Kids are going to be knuckleheads sometimes, every program has guys get in trouble/wash out.

Speaking of other coaches... if Swarbrick called me up tomorrow and said "I can get Gary Patterson or Chip Kelly, but only if you cut me a check for $50k" I'd do it and not think twice. I bet he could raise an insane amount of money from boosters for a truly elite coach if one was willing to come. How quickly they raised funds for this stupid stadium expansion actually surprised me... I thought they'd have harder time. For the next coach, we'll be out from under the Weis contract and it's going to be VERY interesting to see how much money they green light from internal sources and how much of the HC's contract they try to "crowd source."

 

[Bluto]

they've never performed them in the Gug, oh wait....

I might go to the Wake Forest game. I'll bring some white sage, do the four winds ceremony, build an ofrenda and off a chicken.

 

[ND NYC]

I completely forgot about Matt James. You could make a list a mile long.

Will Mahone, Aaron Lynch, etc. I consider typical attrition. Kids are going to be knuckleheads sometimes, every program has guys get in trouble/wash out.

Speaking of other coaches... if Swarbrick called me up tomorrow and said "I can get Gary Patterson or Chip Kelly, but only if you cut me a check for $50k" I'd do it and not think twice. I bet he could raise an insane amount of money from boosters for a truly elite coach if one was willing to come. How quickly they raised funds for this stupid stadium expansion actually surprised me... I thought they'd have harder time. For the next coach, we'll be out from under the Weis contract and it's going to be VERY interesting to see how much money they green light from internal sources and how much of the HC's contract they try to "crowd source."

what IS the number on the stadium expansion?

FWIW I was told ND was putting out a MUCH higher number than "actual/anticipated" in order to get as much money as possible in the early going.

 

[irishff1014]

I like Kelly overall. Most of his hires have worked out. I don't think BVG is going to work well here.

Other then the some of the playing calling kelly's offense is now what we thought it would be. Took a few years to get there. I don't want to see him gone i think he overall has done a nice job.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Idk...I wouldn't take Patterson over Brian Kelly. Kelly over Kelly I would do.


Sent via tapatalk

 

[irishff1014]

Idk...I wouldn't take Patterson over Brian Kelly. Kelly over Kelly I would do.


Sent via tapatalk

I have to agree with you.

 

[koonja]

Speaking of assistantw, I really want to like Todd Lyght, and I do... but the 2ndary which was supposed to be the strength of this team outside of the OL, is overall been disappointing. Like the poster above, I'm not sold on BVG at all. If he went HAM in recruiting I could live with a couple of the issues I have with him, but that's not the case. He looks like a BA and that's about it.

 

[Bluto]

Getting back to the luck thing. I think Koon should cram a horseshoe up his ass...you never know.

 

[Irish#1]

That isn't a list of coaches that we know are better than BK. I agree that there are only 3-4 guys on the list that I can say for sure are better coaches. You don't fire someone only if you know for a fact that there is a better alternative. CEOs get fired all the time. No one knows for sure whether the replacement will be better.

Assuming BK loses 4 games again this year, that list is the guys I would take a chance on that I think could be better. I don't know for sure, but I'm not scared of trying.



No. I want head coaching experience.

Here's the problem with your logic. There is absolutely no way you can say any coach would do better than Kelly. Those guys don't have to deal with the demands of the ND HC position and well as the academics. Put in the exact same scenario, you may find they do worse. Also as stated previously, there is a lot more parity in CFB today than there was when Lou coached. Different era today. Saban and Meyer are successful because they coach at schools that make it easier to win. I can only imagine how much better we would be if we could take kids that barely graduated.

 

[JSBusch]

This thread will always boil down to.. who's available right now that would accept the job and perform better? I don't see any options.

 

[NDohio]

I like Kelly overall. Most of his hires have worked out. I don't think BVG is going to work well here.

Other then the some of the playing calling kelly's offense is now what we thought it would be. Took a few years to get there. I don't want to see him gone i think he overall has done a nice job.

Speaking of assistantw, I really want to like Todd Lyght, and I do... but the 2ndary which was supposed to be the strength of this team outside of the OL, is overall been disappointing. Like the poster above, I'm not sold on BVG at all. If he went HAM in recruiting I could live with a couple of the issues I have with him, but that's not the case. He looks like a BA and that's about it.

I had completely given up on BVG after last year's nightmare finish to the season. But, he is doing better this year. There were parts of the VA game that were frustrating, but many of them weren't scheme mistakes, they were players not making plays. He seems to have dialed it back some on the all out blitz scheme he used last year and nobody has put up big numbers on this D this year. I know we haven't played good offenses yet, but bad offenses beat us up last year. I am not suddenly on the BVG bandwagon, just giving him a fair chance to improve.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Here's the problem with your logic. There is absolutely no way you can say any coach would do better than Kelly. Those guys don't have to deal with the demands of the ND HC position and well as the academics. Put in the exact same scenario, you may find they do worse. Also as stated previously, there is a lot more parity in CFB today than there was when Lou coached. Different era today. Saban and Meyer are successful because they coach at schools that make it easier to win. I can only imagine how much better we would be if we could take kids that barely graduated.

Saban and Meyer are also two of the most successful head coaches in the history of college football. Only Bear Bryant has more NCAA titles than Saban. And Meyer is one of only eight coaches with at least three.

 

[gkIrish]

Here's the problem with your logic. There is absolutely no way you can say any coach would do better than Kelly. Those guys don't have to deal with the demands of the ND HC position and well as the academics. Put in the exact same scenario, you may find they do worse. Also as stated previously, there is a lot more parity in CFB today than there was when Lou coached. Different era today. Saban and Meyer are successful because they coach at schools that make it easier to win. I can only imagine how much better we would be if we could take kids that barely graduated.

The point is that guys on that list are at schools with significantly less clout than Notre Dame. The question is not whether Kyle Whittingham's resume at Utah is better than Brian Kelly's at Notre Dame. The question is whether Kyle Whittingham could do better than Brian Kelly with the same resources, recruiting power, etc. that Brian Kelly has.

It's impossible to guarantee the next coach will be better than the current one.

And since apparently some people still don't understand, I'm not calling for a firing unless he loses 4 games this year.

 

[stlnd01]

The point is that guys on that list are at schools with significantly less clout than Notre Dame. The question is not whether Kyle Whittingham's resume at Utah is better than Brian Kelly's at Notre Dame. The question is whether Kyle Whittingham could do better than Brian Kelly with the same resources, recruiting power, etc. that Brian Kelly has.

It's impossible to guarantee the next coach will be better than the current one.

And since apparently some people still don't understand, I'm not calling for a firing unless he loses 4 games this year.

If we lose four games with this talent - and this schedule - then we will likely have lost to every good team we play. That's not cool, and should prompt a thorough re-visiting of Brian Kelly and whether he can get us over the hump.
But this thread was started after a win, and revived in the wake of a very close loss (which many people had pegged as a loss in pre-season) in which almost everything that could have gone wrong did for three quarters, and then some. We've lost one game, and so far in balance we've played better than anyone left on our schedule. Yet we're openly listing replacements just in case we lose four.
That may be what has some people confused about who's calling for what.

 

[gkIrish]

If we lose four games with this talent - and this schedule - then we will likely have lost to every good team we play. That's not cool, and should prompt a thorough re-visiting of Brian Kelly and whether he can get us over the hump.
But this thread was started after a win, and revived in the wake of a very close loss (which many people had pegged as a loss in pre-season) in which almost everything that could have gone wrong did for three quarters, and then some. We've lost one game, and so far in balance we've played better than anyone left on our schedule. Yet we're openly listing replacements just in case we lose four.
That may be what has some people confused about who's calling for what.

Every fanbase should be evaluating the performance of the coach after every game win or loss. This thread should have existed after game 1 of the 2010 season. The reason it started after Virginia is because (a) that's when it was evident to me that the areas I was concerned about from the last two seasons had not improved and (b) I didn't want people to dismiss this season just because Malik went down with an injury.

Also, there are about 15 posts in this thread demanding that I provide a list of candidates including the recent one by Koon. So that's why I did it. I don't have some agenda against Brian Kelly. I really like the guy as a person and as an ambassador for the university. However I have serious doubts about whether he can lead us to a championship and I desire to objectively discuss his performance, both past and present. Apparently people can't handle that. It's childish, really.

 

[kmoose]

Getting back to the luck thing. I think Koon should cram a horseshoe up his ass...you never know.

Careful, or you will make the list, too:

I should just create a sig of my haters so people know not to take their posts towards me seriously.

I got a list and it goes:

Kmoose
Cackalacky
Wooly
All of the mods
... I'm missing a few

 

[gkIrish]

Careful, or you will make the list, too:

Cackalacky and all the mods??

Department of Redundancy Department

 

[ThePiombino]

I had completely given up on BVG after last year's nightmare finish to the season. But, he is doing better this year. There were parts of the VA game that were frustrating, but many of them weren't scheme mistakes, they were players not making plays. He seems to have dialed it back some on the all out blitz scheme he used last year and nobody has put up big numbers on this D this year. I know we haven't played good offenses yet, but bad offenses beat us up last year. I am not suddenly on the BVG bandwagon, just giving him a fair chance to improve.

The ONLY way BVG is going to be successful here is if he puts athletes on the field. His system is a house of cards - effective when kicking on all cylinders, but will crumble if just one part is out of place (i.e. Joe Schmidt). IMO, if he can't get Morgan and the like on the field, his tenure is destined for failure.

 

[connor_in]

If we lose four games with this talent - and this schedule - then we will likely have lost to every good team we play. That's not cool, and should prompt a thorough re-visiting of Brian Kelly and whether he can get us over the hump.
But this thread was started after a win, and revived in the wake of a very close loss (which many people had pegged as a loss in pre-season) in which almost everything that could have gone wrong did for three quarters, and then some. We've lost one game, and so far in balance we've played better than anyone left on our schedule. Yet we're openly listing replacements just in case we lose four.
That may be what has some people confused about who's calling for what.

We just lost ONE game, on the road, in the monsoon, against a ranked opponent, by 2, with a chance to tie with 7 seconds left. Where are you getting "if we lose four games"?

If we dig a pit at the 50 yard line down to hell and start worshipping Satan...?

Neither of these things have happened and I am sure they are working to try to make sure neither happens.

 

[NDohio]

The ONLY way BVG is going to be successful here is if he puts athletes on the field. His system is a house of cards - effective when kicking on all cylinders, but will crumble if just one part is out of place (i.e. Joe Schmidt). IMO, if he can't get Morgan and the like on the field, his tenure is destined for failure.

Yeah - I don't disagree with any of this. I have just been pleasantly surprised with the D this year.

I know we have no idea how good Clemson is(probably not very), but other than three short fields, our D stopped them. And Watson is supposed to be one of the more dynamic QBs in college football this year.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Just to put this out there since there's talk of the rest of the schedule...

Through five games, ND is 4-1. Those four wins have proven to be against garbage teams. GT may turn it around, but not at the moment. The combined record of these teams is 5-13. The loss, obviously to 4-0 Clemson. Cumulative record for opponents through the first five games is 9-13.

The remaining teams have been winning. The next seven opponents are currently 23-8 collectively. ND is not up against cupcakes to finish up their schedule (with exception to probably Wake Forest).

I'm not saying ND won't win out. I'm not saying they won't be favored. I'm literally just putting out the info to show that ND's schedule, while originally thought to be front-loaded, is actually becoming more back-loaded as the season plays out. It'll be interesting to see how this team responds.

 

[gkIrish]

Just to put this out there since there's talk of the rest of the schedule...

Through four games, ND is 4-1. Those four wins have proven to be against garbage teams. GT may turn it around, but not at the moment. The combined record of these teams is 5-13. The loss, obviously to 4-0 Clemson. Cumulative record for opponents through the first five games is 9-13.

The remaining teams have been winning. The next seven opponents are currently 23-8 collectively. ND is not up against cupcakes to finish up their schedule (with exception to probably Wake Forest).

I'm not saying ND won't win out. I'm not saying they won't be favored. I'm literally just putting out the info to show that ND's schedule, while originally thought to be front-loaded, is actually becoming more back-loaded as the season plays out. It'll be interesting to see how this team responds.

Yeah I don't think we've played the two best teams on our schedule yet. And most of the other teams are significantly better than Virginia who we almost lost to. That's why I'm worried we lose at least 2 more.

 

[Irish Insanity]

This thread will always boil down to.. who's available right now that would accept the job and perform better? I don't see any options.

Have you even read this thread. Or the OP. It wasn't started to find a replacement for him. We already have a who replaces Kelly thread.

 

[gkIrish]

Have you even read this thread. Or the OP. It wasn't started to find a replacement for him. We already have a who replaces Kelly thread.

Speaking of the OP...here's my last paragraph

I used to be a huge BK supporter. Don't think I can do it anymore. Especially if we lose 4 games again this year. Obviously we are 2-0 and I hope we win every game and will gladly eat my words but I'm scouting the college football coaching landscape for new candidates.

But apparently this is the Fire Brian Kelly Thread when it's really the Fire Brian Kelly If we lose 4 games thread

 

[Irish Insanity]

Speaking of the OP...here's my last paragraph



But apparently this is the Fire Brian Kelly Thread when it's really the Fire Brian Kelly If we lose 4 games thread

But that doesn't support the narratives being pushed by the die hard Kelly supporters.

 

[kmoose]

But that doesn't support the narratives being pushed by the die hard Kelly supporters.

I don't know where people would have ever come up with the idea:

Please do as I respect your opinion. That goes for anyone who wants to have an actual conversation using facts and reason.

I know the "fire the coach" post is an unpopular one. It's easy to take the high ground and dismiss the person who suggests it as overreacting or being pessimistic.

But I think I raised some points that people are afraid to address. For example, why do we struggle with teams with comparable academics?

I don't see a lot of substantive support of criticism. "We can't do better" and "We have lots of injuries" aren't substantive responses. Tell me why he is a good coach.

 

[kmoose]

Speaking of the OP...here's my last paragraph



But apparently this is the Fire Brian Kelly Thread when it's really the Fire Brian Kelly If we lose 4 games thread

Then don't start it before we have even lost one.