Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

Brian Kelly Revisited


  • Total voters
    382

Blaise

Well-known member
Messages
2,233
Reaction score
88
I'm Watching USC struggle against an average Stanford team.... and I am beginning to think even with the injuries we can be a playoff team... Kizer has to be better... Holding the ball that long will either get him lit up or he will turn the ball over... However, our Oline is very good and if CJ stays healthy.. we are going to be able to run on anyone...
Kelly has this team believing
 

Irish Insanity

Well-known member
Messages
9,885
Reaction score
584
Ugh...don't remind me. That game was BK at his absolute best. It is such a damn shame that game was stolen from us, such a shame. That would have easily been the best win at ND since Lou Holtz left the building. That game winning drive would have been legendary.

I think that game broke the team as much as the injuries did.
 

palinurus

New member
Messages
2,406
Reaction score
192
Yes.

I will gladly take the occasional loss to a top ranked team if we never lose to teams we should dominate. USF, Pit, NW........

I think we could be elevated to another level if BK would just allow someone full control of calling the game.

Ugh...don't remind me. That game was BK at his absolute best. It is such a damn shame that game was stolen from us, such a shame. That would have easily been the best win at ND since Lou Holtz left the building. That game winning drive would have been legendary.

True, both true.
 

mick2

JRPG's are for nerds!
Messages
2,108
Reaction score
135
bad play calls happen to everyone.

you will never have a flawlessly called game, you can wish all you want.

the rest of the issues you guys seem to always bring up are personnel based.

Kelly has recruited his butt off, AND developed, thats why we're able to win games with back ups!!!

remember this, prosise is a backup thrust into a starter position.

He's dealt with all of the issues that are unique to ND and still formed a killer team.

and unfortunately has had very very bad luck, with boneheads and injuries.

but he's never complained.

I don't know of another coach that could put up with what he's had to deal with.
 

IrishLax

Something Witty
Staff member
Messages
37,544
Reaction score
28,990
No. No we didn't. Just because the referees fuck up a call 98% of the time doesn't mean they're wrong the 2% of the time they call it correctly.

They didn't call it correctly though, as has been shown many places. FSU blew the coverage and jammed our inside receivers. They initiated the contact... therefor it can't be a "pick" and isn't pass interference. You can literally see Prosise have his jersey grabbed, and the end zone angle shoes Darby jump into Fuller.
 

Bluto

Well-known member
Messages
8,146
Reaction score
3,979
So if Kelly were to leave after this season I think there would be a bunch of coaches who would look at this roster and the potential and jump all over that.
 

ickythump1225

New member
Messages
4,036
Reaction score
323
I think that game broke the team as much as the injuries did.
I'll go to my grave wondering if we beat FSU and made it to 8-0 how different that season looks. Could have run the table? Would injuries have still caught up to us? I don't know but I'm pretty sure we wouldn't have lost 4 in a row.
 

Grahambo

Varsity Club Member
Messages
4,259
Reaction score
2,606
No. No we didn't. Just because the referees fuck up a call 98% of the time doesn't mean they're wrong the 2% of the time they call it correctly.

Yes, we did. Refs did mess up the call. They also missed the call against Jaylon last week when he was picked in the end zone. The DBs messed up on their assignments but got bailed out because of the refs.
 

mick2

JRPG's are for nerds!
Messages
2,108
Reaction score
135
So if Kelly were to leave after this season I think there would be a bunch of coaches who would look at this roster and the potential and jump all over that.

I agree and disagree here, I think strictly looking at the roster and what Kelly has built, A lot of coaches would like to coach a team with this much talent.

but coaches will also look at expectations, and limitations that are unique to ND, not to mention the schedule we play every year, and i would bet they would say no thanks.

Both of these issues point to why Kelly has succeeded as a coach. He's built this program, defended ND and what it stands for multiple times, and has not cried foul when those standards have hurt his team which wouldn't be an issue at football factory schools.
 

TheTurningPoint

New member
Messages
2,883
Reaction score
662
So it goes from talking about if BK is right for the job after the UVA "letdown" to talking about finding his replacement if he leaves the next week. lol

Got it.
 

TheTurningPoint

New member
Messages
2,883
Reaction score
662
Anyone watching Texas and Cal? I'm beginning to think that when ND is dialed in they are as good a team as there is in the country.

No. ND isn't close to a being a Top 5 team regardless of where they get ranked each week. They are getting closer, but there is a significant difference on the OL and front 7 on defense compared to some of the top teams. ND also simply doesn't have the team speed of some of the top teams.

However, they do play for each other and with each other and that cant be underestimated in college.
 

mick2

JRPG's are for nerds!
Messages
2,108
Reaction score
135
So it goes from talking about if BK is right for the job after the UVA "letdown" to talking about finding his replacement if he leaves the next week. lol

Got it.

nope, kelly is the guy, I've known that for a while now.

I was just responding to a post in thread that posed a hypothetical situation about who would come here if he left.

IMO not many would want to deal with the unique issues that the coach of ND has to deal with.
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
On SportsCenter, this morning, Robert Smith says that ND is "a lock to make the playoffs". Mark May actually had nothing but good things to say about ND; says he thinks a healthy ND makes it into the playoffs, but wants to see if the injury bug continues before predicting they are in.
 

irishff1014

Well-known member
Messages
26,509
Reaction score
9,285
On SportsCenter, this morning, Robert Smith says that ND is "a lock to make the playoffs". Mark May actually had nothing but good things to say about ND; says he thinks a healthy ND makes it into the playoffs, but wants to see if the injury bug continues before predicting they are in.

That's a shock for May.
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
That's a shock for May.

But it probably shouldn't be. ND fans knew that the Lou Holtz that did College Football Final was a character played by the real Lou. Is it really that much of a shock to think the same might be true about Mark May?
 

BeauBenken

Shut up, Richard
Staff member
Messages
16,041
Reaction score
5,491
Anyone watching Texas and Cal? I'm beginning to think that when ND is dialed in they are as good a team as there is in the country.

Cal's defense is pretty bad. Like, really bad. You were the odd man out last season if you DIDN'T hang 30+ points on them.
 

IrishJayhawk

Rock Chalk
Messages
7,181
Reaction score
464
Do you aspire to be on the same level as Arkansas, Missouri, and Boise St.? And sure, Auburn struggled yesterday, but they don't struggle like that very often. How often do the Buckeyes, Alabama, Oregon, and the Florida Sts of the world struggle against highly inferior talent? Hardly ever.

Arizona St. playing like crap or Arkansas losing to Toledo means absolutely nothing to Notre Dame. They aren't our peers.

This was the part that I thought was incorrect. Florida State struggled pretty much all of last year with inferior teams. They did it again Friday. Ohio State did it yesterday. Bama lost to a talented team.

I tried to think about one of the most talented teams in the previous decade since we've already talked about Saban and Meyer a lot. Even Pete Carroll's best team (the Leinart/Bush national championship team) needed some late rallies and had other very close games in the 4th quarter when they went undefeated (see Va Tech, Stanford, Cal, Oregon State, UCLA...granted, none of them are Toledo or Virginia).

USC 2004 Schedule - Trojans Home and Away - ESPN

I certainly acknowledge that we seem to do it more. And no one excuses the Northwestern game. But it happens in college football pretty much every week. This week was another data point toward that conclusion.
 

IrishJayhawk

Rock Chalk
Messages
7,181
Reaction score
464
I tend to buy into the Bobby Bowden mantra...

"First you lose big, then you lose close, then you win close and then you win big."

It's not a linear path and we've been somewhat stalled. But I think that's (a) part of the nature of being at Notre Dame and (b) a function of the crazy academic and QB situations during BK's tenure. I don't think most of those issues can be placed on his shoulders. Given those situations, I think he's done a remarkable job. I don't think that's completely being a homer (I don't know that I can be anything else) and I don't think it's making excuses. It just is what it is.

I think we're on our way to the "win big" category. We may actually be really close.
 
Last edited:

ThePiombino

The OG "TP"
Messages
16,476
Reaction score
6,245
Seriously? Kizer was about as good as Malik would have been. Prosise is better than Folston. Tillery and friends have stepped in for JJ admirably.
Kizer was good, but he's not at Zaire's level yet. Not saying he can't be, but there were few times where Zaire's mobility could have resulted in a first down on an otherwise stalled drive. I'd have to rewatch the game to cite specific examples, but I remember thinking that a couple times at least during the game. Agree on Prosise/Folston. And while Cage/Tillery's efforts certainly have been admirable, they are not yet JJ. So that's a net negative any way you slice it. That said, I believe your overall sentiment to be that the cupboard isn't bare, and I couldn't agree more.
 
B

Bogtrotter07

Guest
unsupportable?

quite a word

Yes it is, I have only heard it used one other time, that when referring to my package!

Why make this post (inserting information about my package) in this thread? Is there a correlation? A logical reason? NO, you say? Not so fast my friend!

The thread BLOWS! *

* which is a favorite consideration of my package!

*******************************************************************************
And I will take it one step further. Some in this thread remind me of an acquaintance. Single, estranged from his kids, this guy always has a "hot" date on his arm. Many are jealous. But I see through that, too.

This guy can't form a long lasting relationship with anybody. He has for years constantly compared one woman to another.

Few could see the cost of not having a single meaningful relationship, in terms of spiritual and material existence. The depression over both the loneliness and the debt incurred by pumping every dime into supporting that lifestyle - you don't think that any of them were attracted to his personality, youth, or vigor, do you?

You cannot compare one person to another. Hell you can hardly ever see a person for truly who they are, let alone two. You just can't compare! There is no comparing in love, war, or football!

So comparing Kelly in his role, with his past experience, to anyone else in another position, no matter what resume stops they list just doesn't get it.

(THIS IS THE ESSENCE OF WHAT JOE PLUMERI HAD TO SAY!)

I mean everyone loves a catch phrase like "Burn the Boats." But too many people implement it like, leaving themselves stranded without having an escape plan. What it means instead is make every move with meaningful intention, and absolute core commitment. Do not blanch under withering fire (major adversity, from injuries to second doubts.)

With love this is the greatest advice I can give anyone. Took me a lot of painful life experience to get this through my head.

So, I don't think when Jack Swarbrick and Father Jenkins went into this thing with Brian Kelly, the idea of firing him (burning the boats) was ever a reality. And the reason that they did not leave themselves without an escape plan was the mutual dialog they developed early in the interview process. This same thing occurred and was documented with Mike Sanford, which is why I see fingerprints in addition to Kelly's all over his hiring.

It is clear, time and again, with the information all of us have available, that both sides amend their position based upon the other's needs. The assistant coaching upgrade is a perfect example of the collaborative upgrade, which is why I hope these three guys (or someone like them) stay forever!

A coach that can excel at a school like Notre Dame isn't made. He is developed. Whether it is experience prior to his time at ND, or primarily after he is on campus, you have a couple of real conditions that make coaching at ND unique. Nowhere is there more pressure to win with a higher ethical accountability. And there are places with fan bases with high expectations, but at ND the fans are all at a much higher (glue-sniffing) frenzied level! And the pressure to live up to tradition, some of which actually even occurred as remembered, is unbelievable!

For this reason I divide the past ND coaches in two groups : I tend to put Kelly on the Holtz, Leahy, Rockne, Brennan, Parseghian, and Divine side; And I put Weis, Willingham, Davies, Faust, etc., on the other.

The first group all proved they could win at a high level as a college head coach. The second never did.

Brennan is the best example of the first group. Hired as the youngest head coach in school history, he had an unlimited number of scholarships cut to about half of what Kelly deals with today! If instead, he was supported, and allowed to grow, he may have turned into one of the greatest in school history.

And that is why talking about whether Kelly should be fired or not doesn't even rate as high as a "Guy in the Diner" conversation!
 
Last edited:

FightingIrishLover7

All troll, no substance
Messages
12,703
Reaction score
7,516
Kizer was good, but he's not at Zaire's level yet. Not saying he can't be, but there were few times where Zaire's mobility could have resulted in a first down on an otherwise stalled drive. I'd have to rewatch the game to cite specific examples, but I remember thinking that a couple times at least during the game. Agree on Prosise/Folston. And while Cage/Tillery's efforts certainly have been admirable, they are not yet JJ. So that's a net negative any way you slice it. That said, I believe your overall sentiment to be that the cupboard isn't bare, and I couldn't agree more.
Wtf is "Maliks level". He started two full games, and even against lsu Everett relieved him a few times.
 

ulukinatme

Carr for QB 2025!
Messages
31,513
Reaction score
17,371
Wtf is "Maliks level". He started two full games, and even against lsu Everett relieved him a few times.

I wouldn't say Everett relieved him. Malik was the MVP of the bowl, and other than one pass he was throwing the ball pretty well. Kelly just felt like he should put Golson in on drives that called for more passing, it wasn't like Malik was stinking up the place prior to those drives. I think he wanted to give Golson just enough reps to show he still had some confidence in him and would use him even if Malik was the guy going forward. Golson decided to take his ball somewhere where he would only be asked to throw the ball about 25 times a game to mask his turnover issues.
 

IrishJayhawk

Rock Chalk
Messages
7,181
Reaction score
464
I wouldn't say Everett relieved him. Malik was the MVP of the bowl, and other than one pass he was throwing the ball pretty well. Kelly just felt like he should put Golson in on drives that called for more passing, it wasn't like Malik was stinking up the place prior to those drives. I think he wanted to give Golson just enough reps to show he still had some confidence in him and would use him even if Malik was the guy going forward. Golson decided to take his ball somewhere where he would only be asked to throw the ball about 25 times a game to mask his turnover issues.

Golson was in for about half of the winning drive. He also converted the big 3rd down and 10 that kept it alive. IIRC, Malik's helmet came off and BK only would have had to take him out for one play.
 

TheSunIsRising

New member
Messages
638
Reaction score
117
Seeing Saban's name even mentioned in this thread makes me laugh.

Great timing that the OTL piece just came out about Alabama being informed of Jonathan Taylor's sexual assault allegations (pictures, the reports, etc) before Saban decided to give him a 'second chance'. This kind of transfer-in would just never happen at ND.

Someone like Saban, who is a great college football coach, could never duplicate his Bama success at ND. Paraphrasing the words of the guy this thread is about "Saban shops in a different store"
 

ThePiombino

The OG "TP"
Messages
16,476
Reaction score
6,245
Wtf is "Maliks level". He started two full games, and even against lsu Everett relieved him a few times.
Malik's fucking level is one that is slightly higher than Kizer's at the moment - slightly higher because of his ability to make something happen on the ground more effectively than Kizer. Sorry that bothers you. Or is it just too difficult of a concept to understand and that's what's frustrating you?
 

johnnycando

Frosted Tips
Messages
3,744
Reaction score
490
This is our highest rank in the AP poll at this point in our season for a long long time.

In fact, ESPN has records back to 2002.

This is our highest spot since then.

Injuries have been a setback, and honestly that's the only thing we have to be disappointed about at this point in the season.
 
Top