'14 WA DT Marcus Griffin

[IrishLion]

Usually there are a few "did not qualifies" late in the game, on top of a suprise flip/miss or two... let's hope Griffin not being accepted is the only "negative" suprise this year.

 

[Ironman8]

Not a big miss, and definitely not losing sleep over this one because i wasnt as big of a fan of his as others were. I'd actually like to hear more about why we didn't accept him, as I'm skeptical of it being just because of a foreign language class. There is usually more to the story, of which we rarely hear unfortunately...

He has been to three separate high schools. I am sure that played a part as well, not just the language thing.

 

[stlnd01]

Ok i'll bite (i'm from the UK).

Why are foreign language classes a pre-requisite other than the fact that that's what the rules say? Most people will only gain only a basic understanding in high school and if it is their choice to take other classes which they belive will be of more benefit to them then why should they be denied admission to an institution if their grades are otherwise good enough?

I know that they know they should know the rules but these are young people and also plans can change. It's not as if a basic understanding of a foreign language (which could be anything) will actually help them at Notre Dame.

If that's the way one looks at it, why have any core course requirements at all? I'm not a scientist, so did I really need to take biology in high school? I never aspired to a job that required high-level math, so why did I take calculus? I'm sure as shit no priest, so why did I take two theology classes at Notre Dame?
Because that's what education is. It's supposed to expose you to a variety of disciplines and ways of thinking, to help you solve problems in different ways, to help you understand how the whole world works and not just your little corner of it, to challenge you and maybe even push you outside your comfort zone. You never know what you'll learn in the process. No, a couple of high school Spanish classes isn't going to qualify a kid to be an interpreter at the U.N., but it doesn't seem unreasonable as a requirement to entry at a great university.

(I realize we're drifting afield from young Mr. Griffin here, but the "lowering admissions standards" argument crops up a lot this time of year as we go all-in for borderline recruits, and it irks me. Almost as much as the fast-spreading notion that a broad liberal arts education is essentially worthless and that college should become much more vocational. Dismounting my high horse now.)

 

[wizards8507]

If that's the way one looks at it, why have any core course requirements at all? I'm not a scientist, so did I really need to take biology in high school? I never aspired to a job that required high-level math, so why did I take calculus? I'm sure as shit no priest, so why did I take two theology classes at Notre Dame?

Because that's what education is. It's supposed to expose you to a variety of disciplines and ways of thinking, to help you solve problems in different ways, to help you understand how the whole world works and not just your little corner of it, to challenge you and maybe even push you outside your comfort zone. You never know what you'll learn in the process. No, a couple of high school Spanish classes isn't going to qualify a kid to be an interpreter at the U.N., but it doesn't seem unreasonable as a requirement to entry at a great university.

(I realize we're drifting afield from young Mr. Griffin here, but the "lowering admissions standards" argument crops up a lot this time of year as we go all-in for borderline recruits, and it irks me. Almost as much as the fast-spreading notion that a broad liberal arts education is essentially worthless and that college should become much more vocational. Dismounting my high horse now.)

And therein lies the divide. I'm guessing a majority of alumni agree with you and a majority of subway alums do not. Careful. People in these parts can get agitated when you play the "you didn't even go to ND" card. (Full disclosure: I'm an alum and I agree with you.) People who went to ND see the admissions department as gatekeepers of their institution, and they feel a strong possessive impulse over their ND degree. Those who are, for lack of a better term, "unworthy" shouldn't be admitted because it dilutes the value and perception of the degree. I see the same thing in my career with the CPA designation. People who are CPAs are outraged when proposals are put forth that make earning the designation any easier. Once you've earned something under a certain set of standards, it stings to see someone earn the same thing under different rules because an outside observer has no way of knowing which criteria you earned yours under.

Drifting even more off topic: Some colleges SHOULD become much more vocational. Society has put the four-year degree on such a pedestal that people are going to school just to go to school. They're graduating with mountains of debt and zero skills that have any value in the marketplace. Check out the program below sponsored by Mike Rowe's "Mike Rowe Works" non-profit.

Profoundly Disconnected

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Not a big miss, and definitely not losing sleep over this one because i wasnt as big of a fan of his as others were. I'd actually like to hear more about why we didn't accept him, as I'm skeptical of it being just because of a foreign language class. There is usually more to the story, of which we rarely hear unfortunately...

Agreed!

 

[gkIrish]

All I know is that sign language is a lot more practical and valuable than French for 95% of Americans.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

All I know is that sign language is a lot more practical and valuable than French for 95% of Americans.

I should dust-off the French I took. It was always remarkably effective for turning a woman's head, and getting her attention. As sex starved as I can see this site is from a couple of the threads, that might portend that French in fact could be very useful to as much as fifty percent of the population, or about 97 percent of the IE membership!!!


I am laughing.

 

[gkIrish]

I should dust-off the French I took. It was always remarkably effective for turning a woman's head, and getting her attention. As sex starved as I can see this site is from a couple of the threads, that might portend that French in fact could be very useful to as much as fifty percent of the population, or about 97 percent of the IE membership!!!


I am laughing.

Touché

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Touché

Ce n'est pas rien!

 

[Irish#1]

He has been to three separate high schools. I am sure that played a part as well, not just the language thing.

That's a huge red flag unless it was a parents job that required moving.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Because that's what a liberal arts education is.

FTFY

STEM advocates disagree, and they've been winning the argument for a long time now (see: Common Core).

 

[Grahambo]

All I know is that sign language is a lot more practical and valuable than French for 95% of Americans.

My buddy can sign so I asked him about it and he said his college required 4 semesters of a language to graduate. He decided to sign and the rest is history. We've needed him to translate sign more often then we've needed any other language aside from Spanish.

 

[ep1987]

I suppose the divide arises because in the UK you only have 'core requirements' up to the age of 16. After that you are trusted to know what you want to pursue and choose subjects accordingly (most people do 3 or 4). If you later change your mind and want to do a science degree then you can do a one year foundation course which will bring you up to the required level.

 

[GBdomer]

Off to Arizona, good luck to him and Richard