'14 AZ QB Kyle Allen (Houston Transfer)

[Grahambo]

TJ is arguably the most in touch with the program. He has got to be in the inner circle with the knowledge he has. Posters specifically pose questions to TJ/Staff.

I like II currently because they seem to have that inside connection that Sapp brought to 247 in TJ and Sampson. You can't replace an ex-player very easily, but Loy has done a good job so far IMO.

To me, II seems to reach a bit more to bring next minute stuff. BGI is more conservative, but they are usually spot on.... consequently it seems they get scooped more often than not.

I come to IE for the personalities :smilewink

Really curious to see if we still get a visit at some point from Allen. I find it hard to believe we won't.

 

[STLDomer]

TJ is arguably the most in touch with the program. He has got to be in the inner circle with the knowledge he has. Posters specifically pose questions to TJ/Staff.

I like II currently because they seem to have that inside connection that Sapp brought to 247 in TJ and Sampson. You can't replace an ex-player very easily, but Loy has done a good job so far IMO.

To me, II seems to reach a bit more to bring next minute stuff. BGI is more conservative, but they are usually spot on.... consequently it seems they get scooped more often than not.

I come to IE for the personalities :smilewink

Really curious to see if we still get a visit at some point from Allen. I find it hard to believe we won't.

TJ is definitely the best, he just likes to tease sometimes haha

 

[irishog77]

Tip only

 

[STLDomer]

So apparently A&M only started trending upwards on Saturday for Allen.

That means they weren't even his top school 3 days ago

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

No longer visiting now that he committed.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

No longer visiting now that he committed.

Would love to know how Sumlin pulled that off.

 

[NDWorld247]

Sumlin is one of the nicest, most charismatic coaches I have met. The success he's having on the recruiting trail is not surprising.

With Allen though, I think most of the credit belongs with Jake Spavital. He's 24/25 years old, which is probably the youngest OC ever at a big-time college program, and can relate to players in a way Chuck Martin can't. In Allen's case, I don't think A&M beat ND or Sumlin beat Kelly, I think Spavital beat Martin.

I was always skeptical of Allen's interest in ND due to Zaire being in the class before him. A&M makes a lot more sense from a depth chart standpoint. Still surprising he didn't wait a week though.

 

[AllGoldEverything]

Would love to know how Sumlin pulled that off.

This

 

[Luckylucci]

Would love to know how Sumlin pulled that off.

A bag of money!.

 

[STLDomer]

Would love to know how Sumlin pulled that off.

How he convinced his new commit to not take other visits? Don't think it would take much convincing, I'm sure it was Allen's idea. Allen says he is shutting down the process now.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I was always skeptical of Allen's interest in ND due to Zaire being in the class before him. A&M makes a lot more sense from a depth chart standpoint. Still surprising he didn't wait a week though.

Can you explain your reasoning behind this? See my below post from the last page:

We're projected to only have one f*cking QB on scholarship in 2014. aTm has at least 4, including a Heisman-winner behind whom Allen will have to sit for 1-3 years.

Jameill Showers - Junior - 3, 0.8620 Rating

Matt Joeckel - Junior - 3, 0.8679 Rating

Johnny Manziel - Sophomore - 3, 0.8740 Rating

Matt Davis - Freshman - 4, 0.9452 Rating

Even if Spavital convinced Allen that Showers and Joekel will be gone after 2014, Manziel could play for 2 more years beyond that. Oh, and Davis was more highly rated as a recruit than Zaire. There's no way aTm's depth chart is more inviting than ours. Allen would have had a chance to compete as a true freshman.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

How he convinced his new commit to not take other visits? Don't think it would take much convincing, I'm sure it was Allen's idea. Allen says he is shutting down the process now.

aTm apparently went from merely "in the mix" to uncontested leader in the span of about 3 days (without something big like a visit occurring in the interim). And they got Allen to cancel planned visits to the two programs that seemed to be leading for him for the last couple months.

Either the recruitniks really dropped the ball here, or Sumlin/ Spavital pulled off the perfect combo of pressure and negative recruiting.

 

[WestCoast]

Originally Posted by NDWorld247
I was always skeptical of Allen's interest in ND due to Zaire being in the class before him. A&M makes a lot more sense from a depth chart standpoint. Still surprising he didn't wait a week though.

I too am curious why you think this. Not only does T-A&M already have the QB's WhiskeyJack listed, they also signed 2-QBs in 2013.

T-A&M in 2014
Johnny Manziel Sr.* 3 star Eligible thru 2015
Matt Davis Jr.* 4 star Eligible thru 2016
Kenny Hill So.* 4 star Eligble thru 2017
Kohl Stewart So.* 4 star Eligible thru 2017

As of today, he would step on campus behind a 2 year starter and 2012 Heisman trophy winner with 4 QBs ahead of him. In order to win the starting job prior to 2018 when everyone ahead of him exhausts eligibility, he will have to beat out/injury/transfer 4 QBs in 2015, 3 in 2016, 2 in 2017.

ND in 2014
Andrew Hendrix 5Yr 3 star Eligible thru 2014
[Everret Golson Sr.* 3 star Eligible thru 2015]
Malik Zaire So. 4 star Eligible thru 2016/17 - depending if he plays in 2013

As of today, he would step on campus behind no clear starter with 2 QBs ahead of him (assuming Hendrix is offered a 5th year and takes it). In order to win the starting job prior to 2017/18 when everyone ahead of him exhausts eligibility, he will have to beat out/injury/transfer of 1 QB in 2015, 1 in 2016 and possibly none in 2017.

[If Everett Golson re-enrolls, he will have two years of eligibility remaining. Then Allen would have to beat out/transfer/injury 2 QBs in 2015, 1 in 2016 and possibly none in 2017.]

 

[Riddickulous]

Honestly, I think Manziel intends to bolt for the NFL as soon as possible (ie: after this year), barring something unforeseen such as an injury or a disastrous season.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I too am curious why you think this. Not only does T-A&M already have the QB's WhiskeyJack listed, they also signed 2-QBs in 2013.

Good Lord. I forgot to include the two 4 QBs they signed in February, as those guys aren't even on the roster yet. Allen will be the 6th or 7th QB on their roster when he arrives.

aTm's depth chart is murderously competitive compared to ours. Even more curious now to know what Sumlin/ Spavital said to convince him he'd be better off stepping into that meat grinder than walking into the #2 spot at ND as a true freshman.

 

[Pachuco]

The upside is that we can move on, and show love to talented QBs that actually want to visit before making a decision.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>Fumbled this earlier, but @<a href="https://twitter.com/tomlemming">tomlemming</a> reminded of <a href="https://twitter.com/search/%23NotreDame">#NotreDame</a>'s history with flipping QBs -- Everett Golson from N. Carolina and Gunner Kiel.</p>— Tyler James (@TJamesNDI) <a href="https://twitter.com/TJamesNDI/status/341661392400691200">June 3, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

The point is well made, but (1) we can't afford to gamble on flipping a committed prospect with our current QB depth; and (2) where are those two kids now?

 

[IrishLax]

So apparently A&M only started trending upwards on Saturday for Allen.

That means they weren't even his top school 3 days ago

No longer visiting now that he committed.

Would love to know how Sumlin pulled that off.

I am rarely "shocked" in recruiting. I was shocked when Deontay Geenberry left us for Houston on NSD... in tretrospect with all of the facts it's not shocking, but at the time it was.

This is a close second. I'm shocked that they could get him to cancel his visit. I'm shocked that they weren't in the picture per any analyst and now he has shut it down for them. I am shocked that it wasn't OSU/UCLA if he eschewed ND. All three fan bases were apparently pretty confident they had a good shot... where was TA&M? He never talked about them. A mere couple days ago multiple analysts started switching predictions to ND with UCLA being the long term favorite.

How does this happen? How does he decide to completely shut it down like this? If this was Clemson and someone from the hood I would think bag 'o cash. But it's not Clemson and it's not some low-character/no parental structure kid.

Just crazy. I am miffed. And very sad.

 

[NDPhilly]

Honestly, I think Manziel intends to bolt for the NFL as soon as possible (ie: after this year), barring something unforeseen such as an injury or a disastrous season.

Yup. Barring injury he's gone after this year IMO.

 

[STLDomer]

Quote from Allen:

So I wrote down those four or five things that I really really want school, and one had those by far, more than anyone.”

Obviously depth chart wasn't one of those

 

[WestCoast]

Originally posted by WhiskeyJack
Good Lord. I forgot to include the two 4 QBs they signed in February, as those guys aren't even on the roster yet. Allen will be the 6th or 7th QB on their roster when he arrives.

I didn't include Joeckel or Showers on my list because in 2014, they would need to be granted a 5th year. I'm not sure how T-A&M does it compared to ND (i.e. automatic or has to be approved), but I doubt they would be retained with Manziel the presumed starter and 4 younger QBs signed.

I do agree with another poster that Manziel could leave after 2013 (b/c he redshirted and played 2 years = satisfies 3-years out of HS rule of NFL), but that still means the depth chart has 3 QBs ahead of Allen.

 

[NDWorld247]

Can you explain your reasoning behind this? See my below post from the last page:



Jameill Showers - Junior - 3, 0.8620 Rating

Matt Joeckel - Junior - 3, 0.8679 Rating

Johnny Manziel - Sophomore - 3, 0.8740 Rating

Matt Davis - Freshman - 4, 0.9452 Rating

Even if Spavital convinced Allen that Showers and Joekel will be gone after 2014, Manziel could play for 2 more years beyond that. Oh, and Davis was more highly rated as a recruit than Zaire. There's no way aTm's depth chart is more inviting than ours. Allen would have had a chance to compete as a true freshman.

My reasoning was based on knowing Manziel is not staying in College Station very long and not respecting the depth chart behind him. I also assumed Kohl Stewart would do what 99% of us would do and take the lucrative MLB contract he has coming. Zaire was rated higher than Hill.

So, looking at 2015 (assuming Allen redshirts in 2014 regardless of where he went to college), Allen would be competing with Zaire (3 yrs of eligibility - I still believe he redshirts this year) at ND, and Davis (2 yrs of eligibility) and Hill (3 years of eligibility) at A&M. Even if he doesn't beat Davis in 2015, he is a 2-year starter at A&M. I admit I made the comment without a full understanding of A&M's depth chart, but my point was, I viewed Allen as a multi-year starter in college and I never saw that for him at ND. However, you're right, he's not walking into a better situation at A&M.

Which brings me back to my other point, Spavital beat Martin. I am not surprised by this.

 

[Irishnuke]

Makes no f'ing sense. Seems to be an impulse decision. Not convinced its going to stick.

 

[Irishnuke]

Not that it matters or that Manziel gives a shits but isn't this a recruiting violation?

@JManziel2: Congrats brother welcome to the family @KyleAllen_10 #gigem

 

[KPENN]

Not that it matters or that Manziel gives a shits but isn't this a recruiting violation?

@JManziel2: Congrats brother welcome to the family @KyleAllen_10 #gigem

Pretty sure it isn't. I don't think you can comment on them visiting or what not.

 

[connect the dots]

Makes no f'ing sense. Seems to be an impulse decision. Not convinced its going to stick.

I am baffled, too. No only did he have an unofficial scheduled for Notre Dame, but Ohio State as well. And why not give Stanford a look see. That offensive line Stanford recruited in 2012 will be giving a pocket passer a whole lotta time to find receivers!

 

[FearTheBeard]

Quote from Allen:

Obviously depth chart wasn't one of those

Not trying to take any shots at Texas A&M but academics probably wasnt either. Idk much about them and they may have a good school but Stanford is the only major football program to really compare with Notre Dame academically. Thats just crazy how he passed up on many of his top schools all of a sudden and didnt even go check them out.

 

[STLDomer]

Not trying to take any shots at Texas A&M but academics probably wasnt either. Idk much about them and they may have a good school but Stanford is the only major football program to really compare with Notre Dame academically. Thats just crazy how he passed up on many of his top schools all of a sudden and didnt even go check them out.

To be fair, ND was the only school in his Top 5 he didn't visit

Will we be seeing this from Allen in a couple years?

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

Quote from Allen:

Obviously depth chart wasn't one of those

Obviously we weren't given much consideration then. How can he make a list of things for a school he hasn't even visited yet? Just seems like he was tired of the process and wanted it to end so he picked from the to schools he had visited.

 

[WestCoast]

Originally Posted by STLDomer
To be fair, ND was the only school in his Top 5 he didn't visit

Ouch. Talk about a kick in the giblets. Either that or a massive conspiracy.